Brazzil

Not much comment here!

Shoot to kill is not a policy in Brazil, it is what happens when there are no policies of regulating police behavoir. When you give a man little pay, almost no training, then send him into the street with a gang shoot to kill becomes the de facto policy. I am speaking of the Brazilian police, not favelados. My observation is that Mr. Menezes was reacting to what he knew; you see police chasing you with a gun, you run or die. Perhaps he didn't run, but it wouldn't surprise me and certainly I wouldn't blame him. Perhaps he, being from a tropical climate and not accustomed to gorgeous London weather, was wearing a large coat. Neither reason, couple with brown skin, is a reason to suspect or to kill on suspicion. Mr. Menezes thought he was making a life in a civilized place. He was wrong.

Is not the british way to have policemen running around with guns. The vast majority of policemen wear the standard uniform and do not carry guns. Within the ranks of the security services there are other non uniformed personal who do carry a weapon. We however seldom see these police. We have for a long time put our trust in these security services, they are highly trained well equiped and seldom make the news. The british have a solid history of capably dealing with terrorists. Few will forget the Iranian embassy nor the IRA nor the local bomber in londons gay districts. It has been unfortunate for the Brazillian on this occasion but we still feel safe and sure that behind the scenes an excellent securty force is still doing its job.

At the same time Mr Menezes could have been from any culture or country. Having lived in Stockwell and South London there are so many different looking people i sense that people are overlooking the fact that his address was the initial determining factor that caught him in the police radar.

...in Brazil there is a shoot to kill policy of innocent people...in the thousands per year...by brazilian police!!!!!! Even children were killed !!!!!!!

No single Brazilian citizen killed....had has much attention and insistence given....as the only Brazilian killed in England !!!!!
Not even the 30 people killed 3 months ago in one police raid. There is not a single article anymore in the brazilian press for the 30 killed....but daily articles still on Jean Charles death.

Is he so much more important...than the thousands innocent killed...by brazilian police ??????

I have no doubt....that even Jean Charles...would prefer that you give more and better justice to the thousands killed by your own police....than to his own tragedy !!!!

Each innocent person killed is important. Jean's family deserve and want justice. I am sure that the family, brother, mother, father of Jean Charles de Menezes know better than this mudering police "troll" who wrote that comment, what Jean would want. You are pathetic to say you have "no doubt" - you are stupid and a liar.

In memory of Jean Charles de Menezes
http://www.justice4jean.com
See for Campaign events

it is a tragedy that Jean Charles de Menezes died, for Jean and his family and friends. It is also a tragedy that the mass murderer (Iraq) Tony Blair, Charles Clarke, and Ian Blair want to continue a "shoot to kill" policy. "Shoot to kill" needs to be stopped or more innocent Jean Charles de Menezes will die.

JOIN THE JEAN CHARLES DE MENEZES FAMILY CAMPAIGN
Jean's mother has said "my heart has broken into a thousand pieces".


NO shoot to murder civilians, "No Shoot to Kill"
The British New Labour government have said shoot to kill is legal in the UK. Shoot to kill is not legal in Brazil, and those who are caught are punished through the legal system.

Those who murdered Jean, or gave the orders to murder Jean must be punished to prevent another innocent being killed again. The family of Jean Charles de Menezes deserve justice.


Other murders by British police:
http://www.indymedia.org.uk/en/2005/10/325163.html
Police who have murdered have not been prosecuted. Most are serving in the police, so they can murder and brutalise again.

Rememberence procession for those who have died in custody
United Families and Friends Campaign
EVENT Saturday 29th October 2005, 1pm, London
http://www.blink.org.uk/pdescription.asp?key=8063&grp=13
We will assemble at 1pm at Trafalgar Square (nearest tube: Charing Cross) for a silent march down Whitehall and a noisy protest outside of Downing Street.
Everyone who wants to show their support for families who have lost loved ones is welcome - please wear black. No placards please but bring along trade union / community organisation banners.
For further information e-mail info@uffc.org or ring 07770432 439

Support other families that were murdered by the British police.

Justice for these families

America and Britain: Rogue Nations
America: Rogue Nation

The American Government constantly says one thing and does another. It imposes standards on the rest of the world which it refuses to accept itself. It has consistently shown a disregard for international law and a contempt for human rights.

The Americans claim to be the fount of goodness but they refuse to do anything to help poor countries - indeed, over the last couple of decades they have introduced policies which have directly led to the deaths of millions of innocent people. America's idea of diplomacy is to carpet bomb countries which upset America.

The Americans deny basic human rights to whole countries and then arrogantly claim that they know best. They insist that price stability within America is more important than the future of the planet; they continue to destroy our environment (as well as their own) and to wage war against innocents all around the world.

Virtually every day there are reports of American hypocrisy. The American president claims that his country leads the world in justice and yet his is the one of the few countries which routinely executes children. American presidents wage war to distract attention from their sexual peccadilloes. They insist that developing countries have properly supervised elections and yet they themselves conduct a presidential election which is decided when the so-called Supreme Court arbitrarily decides not to recount votes which would almost certainly have changed the result of the election.

A headline in an American newspaper ran: 'All Nations on Earth Sign Global Warming Agreement. USA Refuses.' And still they wonder why everyone loathes and despises them.

Americans know little or nothing about other countries. Even their leading politicians have no idea where other countries are or who leads them. The Americans expect the rest of the world to worship their flag, but they seem unable to understand that respect has to be earned and cannot simply be demanded. The Americans believe that their definitions are the only ones that count; they believe that if they say that someone is a terrorist then the rest of the world must regard him as a terrorist. The Americans fund terrorists in Ireland but think that the English are being unreasonable if they complain. Within days of the September 11th attack, the American Government decided to continue supporting Irish terroists who were bombing innocent English targets.

The Americans believe that the only form of justice that matters is American justice - even though to the rest of the world American justice doesn't look, sound or smell much like justice at all.

The Americans have a commercial view of human rights. They change their views according to the combatants. The Americans regard China as an important trading partner so they put up with human rights violations there. The Americans need Saudi oil so they turn a blind eye to human rights violations in that country too. But they will carpet bomb Afghanistan and Iraq to force regime changes in those countries.

The Americans claim to respect the freedom of the press and the individual's freedom of speech but they will close down websites which are critical of America. When Americans closed down my website, the American FBI refused to cooperate with the British police to arrest the criminal involved. But when a British citizen interfered with American websites the Americans insisted that the British authorities deal with him.

In February 2003, at the same time that they were begging for British support for their latest war on Iraq, the Americans told the South Africans to arrest an innocent British pensioner but then left him in prison for ten days before even bothering to go and interview him.

There is, in American hearts and minds, one rule for Americans and one rule for the rest of the world. The Americans are widely loathed. And the loathing will get worse, much worse, before it gets better.

Americans claim to offer freedom on religious matters but insist that the world convert to Christianity - preferably of the right variety. The Americans regard themselves as missionaries - chosen by God to lead the world. And still they wonder why the world dislikes them.

To Americans, history started just after they stole their nation from the natives. There is no equality of opportunity in the USA but they pretend there is. The American revolution started with the battle-cry 'No taxation without representation'. But the Americans now tax the world - and refuse to allow any representation.

The Americans have handed power to the lobbyists and the public relations specialists. He who has the biggest bank balance has the most power. That is the American version of freedom. Frankly, it stinks.

It is hardly surprising that around the world people distrust America and Americans. It is hardly surprising that very few non-Americans have much confidence or faith in America.

The Americans steal, corrupt and pollute without a thought for the rest of the world. They are contemptuous and condescending, greedy and uncaring. They refuse to accept international laws on how to deal with prisoners of war. They demand immunity from the war crimes court for their own soldiers. They are by far the world's biggest polluter but they refuse to ratify the Kyoto Treaty because it may damage their own internal economy. They steal and patent seeds and plants and then sell those seeds and plants back to starving people in developing countries. They foist genetically engineered products on a world which doesn't want them. They claim to worship capitalism and freedom and yet the American government owns nearly 40% of all land in the USA.

The greed and dishonesty of corporate employees in America has been a primary factor in helping to push the world economy into recession. And still they wonder why the rest of the world dislikes them.

The Americans think they are disliked because they are rich. They are wrong. Very wrong. They are disliked, in part, because of the way they got rich and because of the way they now behave.

But it is the belligerence and imperialsim of successive American goverments which has really created world-wide hatred for America.

In recent years, America seems to have been forever invading, bombing or encouraging guerrillas - as long as they were right wing, of course. The Americans often manage to kill more of the wrong people or their allies (or both) than of the alleged enemy. Millions of innocents have died at the hands of the ruthless Americans. (Corporate America, however, invariably makes a profit out of war. Before attacking Iraq in 2003, the USA awarded American companies lucrative contracts to rebuild the country.)

A growing - and not inconsiderable - number of people around the world now sincerely believe that even if the American Government didn't actually plan the September 11th attack then they certainly knew about it beforehand. Why would they do such a terrible thing? The argument is a simple one. The September 11th attack has given the American Government an excellent excuse for removing freedom from its own people and for beginning an eternal war against the rest of the world.

Ever since September 11th, the Americans, followed faithfully by the British and the rest of the EU, have been making new laws faster than even the lawyers can keep up with them. There are now laws that even lawyers don't know about. In tomorrow's new world everyone will be a criminal. It will be all too easy for a Government to arrest any citizen who is regarded as a troublemaker.

It is hardly surprising that the world now hates America.



Vernon Coleman's latest book 'Rogue Nation' (published April 2003 at £8.99 by Blue Books) is now available. For further information on how you can get hold of this book, contact us at 'Publishing House'. Our address and telephone number can be accessed by clicking on the 'Contact' button on the left hand side.



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jean, to stupid to live....thats life...and in his case death

british police are the envy of the world...highly educated, well trained, unarmed... Jean was shot by highly specialist anti terrorist officers, if lessons can be learnt, i am sure they will come out in the investigation.... Brazilians, look at your police force, little education, poorly trained and all armed... corruption, stupidity, well, it is Brazil, what do you expect...losers

Events leading to the death of Jean shows that the British Police had bungled. This would have been excuasable if not for the catalogue of lies and dissipation of misinformation by the authorities to shift the blame on to the victim. Their behavior following the shooting, shows that the British Police are no better than thier conterparts in third world countries.

You don't need good qualifications to join the police, and the crime rate is so high, and the solved crimes rate so low in the UK. And many British police harass the innocent through Blair's racist racial profiling, and arrest people for peaceful political protest. If they were educated, that would mean they're bullies, and they're helping Tony Blair and Blair's New Labour Party with a new world order police state.

And the evil uneducated idiot "Written by Guest on 2005-10-20 22:01:18", it's "too" - But you are a moron and a loser! You think they're educated because you're not. We deserve protecting from shoot to kill.
You are evil and have not even shown care for Jean losing his life, or his family's grief. But you are abnormal which normal people here can see. There are a lot of stupid English people like you who are part of English yob culture, but I haven't met a stupid Brazilian. - I'm British and very well educated. I know you've never been to Brazil because you're talking rubbish.


Jean Charles de Menezes did not deserve young, or to be murdered by police. Jean and his family and friends deserve justice.

1) However botched the Police's action, ranking it as a hate crime is just plain wrong; and

2) The Menezes family, despite all the rebels without a cause clinging to them, also has high expectations of the Scotland Yard.

"Plain wrong" - such an americanism. Is that why you're plain stupid, because you're plain uneducated? Maybe one of those brainwashed uneducated cops.

There was a Metropolitan Police shoot to kill policy, but that the British public were not told of this until Jean Charles de Menezes, an innocent, was murdered on his way to work, in cold blood and executed by the Tony Blair, and the New Labour Party police state. Shoot to kill state execution has NEVER been approved through a vote in Parliament.

It is hate and a hate crime, to shoot a total stranger at point blank range, and fire 11 bullets, 7 to the BACK OF JEAN'S HEAD, AND ONE IN THE SHOULDER in 30 seconds. The killer had to have no regard for Jean as a human being, and to shoot him in the head when you know this will kill. Jean was held pinned down, and immobilized, only a hateful psychopath could do this.

There was no reason at all to shoot Jean because he was immobilized. Men in uniform are not above the rule of law, everyone should be equal before the law.

You seem to think we should have low expectations of the police, that we know aren't really highly educated, but brainwashed drones of a Tony Blair's police state, supported by Ian the other Blair.

We like the Menezes family deserve expectations of the police who paid from taxpayers money and are supposed to protect us. The police who murdered Jean acted as police do in dictator states.

"two fingers" You're so patronizing and you're clinging to corruption. Whereas we have a cause, and cling to the truth and justice. We support each other in the Menezes Family Campaign for Justice for Jean.

I support the Menezes family.
I am against shoot-to-kill, shoot to murder and state execution without judicial process.
I have a cause. I would rather spend my time doing other things, but I am supporting this cause, because I oppose a police state and police oppression. I have a cause and we will not stop campaigning until there is justice for victims of police brutality and corruption of the police, and JUSTICE FOR JEAN CHARLES DE MENEZES.

JUSTICE4JEAN JEAN CHARLES DE MENEZES FAMILY CAMPAIGN
http://www.justice4jean.com justice4jean@hotmail.co.uk

Resign Ian Blair. Jean's murderers must go to jail.

They sent a UK cop to help with the crime in Jamaica. He couldnt do a thing. Third world cops have a much tougher job. Send some Uk cops to brazil I don't think they could solve much..