Brazzil

Wow the first chapter was amazing. Makes me really want to go to Brazil, and reminds me of my home country. The second part was confusing with the sacrifice scene but I guess that's because it was a random excerpt.

That is very true about America the way the Dream can lure and consume people, especially in LA and New York. The description was completely accurate, it's everything I have noticed in my 10 years here, even the "lazy rudeness".

10 whole paragraphs before the first saudade.

Do people get saudades for America when they leave and go back to Brazil?

yes, they get saudades for America, but just litte plastic ones that they can throw away (actually made in China, sold in Wal-Mart real cheap)

That was cute!

dripping with jealousy. yeah, the american dream is an illusion and that's why so many immigrants come here. The governor of California is an immigrant. By the way California, if it was a country, has the fifth largest economy in the world. Most are jealous because americans dominate everything. Listening to the radio stations in Rio and Sao Paulo I heard as many american songs as brazilian ones, thank goodness cause BMP sucks. At the food courts in every mall I went to McDonalds was far and away the busiest restaurant. To be cool in Brazil you must have Nike Shox, an ugly but expensive shoe. Ford and Chevrolet everywhere. Britney Spears and Brad Pitt are house hold names. Nobody in america knows who Ivete Sangalo or Zeca Pagodinho is. Every Brazilian knows and hates Bush. No Americans know or care who Lula is. We Dominate The Word. Period. Brazilians are lucky that soccer is a sport for "kids" in America or we'd dominate that too. By now we'd have 10 stars instead of 5 on our soccer shirts. Reply however you like, these are facts, which makes you all even more jealous. It must really suck to be Non-American and to have jealousy eat you up from the inside. Peace out jealous bitches!

"We Dominate The Word"?????.......hope you meant to say World beacuse with your appallingly poor grammar you´ve certainly proved you don´t "dominate the word"!
Somehow, I feel that when my fellow readers have stopped laughing at your childish comments, they´re going to rip your trashy posting to pieces!

Sorry I had a type-0. Just typed it, didn't do a rough draft or spell check. Also, I don't know about your computer but this comment box is tiny on mine. Besides the type-o I noticed that you had nothing to say. Why? Because I didn't say something stupid like America is the best or safest country in the "word". I said America DOMINATES THE WORLD. And that makes people jealous. My comments may be "childish" and "trashy" but they are true. You and your "fellow readers" (many of whom are not fluent in English and make grammer mistakes when posting, but I can figure out what they are saying without becoming a grammar nazi) can say what you like but you can't deny truth any more than you could deny your belly spilling out after my Wu-Tang Sword cut your midsection. Protons Electrons Always Cause Explosions.

before you can use you Wu-Tang Sword to cut my mid-section I use my special anti-sword laser to turn it into molten metal, burning your hands horribly. And then, after giving you only 20 seconds to contemplate living the rest of your life with only raw bloody stumps where you used to have hands, I use an ancient Tupi curse to turn you into a chicken. But the whole process, while cruel and overwhelming, will also lead you to a higher state of consciousness, a better understanding of life, and eventually you will thank me for it. But your words will just sound like "baaawk puck-puck puck."

... "jealousy." You ought to have a more convincing argument then that!

Let's see: Jealousy of being hated all over the globe. Jealousy of psycotic obssession with race. Jealousy of pollution and acid rain. Jealousy of drug addiction and perverted crime. Jealousy of the polarization of minorities and immigrants. Jealousy of religion fanaticism. And on, and on, and on...

No thanks... I can travel much safer with my Brasilian passport....Thank You!

Can you convince the one million Brazilian ILLEGALS in the U.S., that have risked their lives to go there, not to mention pay $10,000 to get smuggled into the country, to get the f**k out?

If you achieve that, work on the other 15 million!

Yeah, the U.S. is a real s**thole with every frickin' country in the world having hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of illegals there.

Jealousy because the U.S. gov't. "mandars practically the entire globe, jealous because americans have money, and opportunity, and education...at least 75% of americans from the age of 17-23 are enrolled in College(university). Not less than 5% as is in brazil. America doesn't have illiteracy rates that reach the 25% range. America doesn't have programs like Fome Zero because 40 million of its citizens are threatened by hunger, Luz para todos, because we've had electicity in our homes for many decades, agua para todos, because we've had running water in 90+% of all households since the 1950's. And jealousy because so many of your own people will actually sell or borrow anything to get 10,000 dollars to risk their lives to be smuggled into a country illegally rather than stay in a place where opportunity and justice are only spoken about, but never realized!

I'm an American. This country is no big deal. For starters there are more drug abusers and users in America than any other country in the world. Americans take more anti-depressants, higher divorce rates, more racial violence and social retardation.

So what if illegals come here? That doesn't mean they love the place. It simply means that US foreign policy makes it difficult for most countries of the world to develop their own infrastructure. After all America was built on free and cheap labor. Illegals have no real choice. Stay in their own country and starve while American multinationals buy up all of their land and prevent them for earning a living or move to the States and try to eke out a living.

Nobody wants the American lifestyle. It is pushed on them. People aren't jumping up and down for a McDonalds restaurant with its f-cked up food to take over their communities. White Americans have such a "god complex" thinking they are God's gift to the world.

And furthermore it is the illegals that keeps America young and vibrant. Americans are a bunch of sour old farts dying out in their own rich prosperous countries so if an American business wants to stay afloat it damn well better start attracting Hispanic business or go belly up.

America will be only dominating the globe another 50 years or so before the old fart vanguard dies out and China steps to fill her shoes.

Oh come on now. They might have much to be jealous about but they definitely don't have to envy how uptight we are and obsessed with numbers and problems. Or stupid celebrities!! That tacky crap threatens the world's culture it doesn't enhance it. Who cares about Britney Spears or Nike Shox? Geez if you had at least said snow on Christmas or Southwest Desert. Breathed some LIFE into this country. I am not going to Brazil to hunt down Ivete Sangalo or Zeca Pagodinnho. Looking for Brazilians, their culture, weather, landscape, and food!! Positive Energy Activates Constant Elevation.

but I speak english, as well as nearly every single other country on the planet...if it's not their first language, it is indeed their second. Attracting the spanish speaking market is an attractive attribute, but your ignorant statement about it better if it wants to stay afloat shows your bias and ignorance! With a GNP of 12 TRILLION dollars, 1/3 of the worlds GNP, the hispanic market makes up a SMALL fraction of that!

WE WANT YOUR MONEY, NOT YOUR FRIENDSHIP!

I feel like hitting you....however since s**t splatters, I will contain myself!

Down with butcher Bush baby....hehehe


Yours truly,

keol

You know, I am no fan of my own home country (US) either but when you begin to present Brazil, be accurate and even-handed. For instance:

"I'm an American. This country is no big deal. For starters there are more drug abusers and users in America than any other country in the world. Americans take more anti-depressants, higher divorce rates, more racial violence and social retardation.

It is well known that Brazil consumes nearly as much marijuana and cocaine as America - ranking only 2nd in coke consumption to the US. Brazil has the highest gun homicide rate in the world and when it comes to anti-depressants, plastic surgery and body image issues, etc, Brazil is not far behind America. In fact the two countries are neck in neck in that respect. I love Brazil as much as I love my own country but I am smart enough to know that Brazil has its very own serious problems, including race that people fail to mention. People are quick to point out America's shortcomings, as if that were the subject of this thread: Brazil vs. America - sigh, then proceed to paint Brazil as if it is paradise.

While many of you here are blacks and have spent most of your time in Bahia or Ceara, many of you are here are whites and have only spent time in Rio, Floripa and Sao Paulo. So to the black reader who thinks Brazil is this wonderful, racial melting pot please visit the cities of Blumenau or Floripa and decide if all Brazilians adore blacks; and white folks who have spent most of their time in Rio or Santa Catarina, kindly make the pilgrimage to Bahia or Pernambuco and see if Brazil is all it's cut out to be.

These generalizations about the 2 countries are so absurd it's not even funny. This is what the "New World Order", or whatever you want to call it, dreams about. It's time to stop seeing this world as the US against Brazil or China vs. India but rather the Bushco's and Lula, Inc's (and please spare us that Lula is a “wonderful, humble man from the northeast” bulls**t because we all know very well he has proven himself to be a criminal, or at the very least complicit in a huge political scandal) of the world against those of us who just want to live our lives without the pressures of war, racism, conspicuous consumption, government interference and all the other negative trappings of western society.

The generalizations that are made about the "average" American or Brazilian are so appallingly inaccurate as to be shameful. Yes everyone knows that Americans are the fattest people on earth and yes everyone knows that Brazil has a surprisingly low literacy rate, but the two people on the street in their respective countries just want to take care of their families and be happy. So Americans are fat – is that a reason to hate them? Fewer Brazilians are literate than Americans – is that a reason to hate them either? There is far too much hate in this world and it is flowing from both directions in this case. Americans have an idea of Brazil as some kind of banana republic, South American backwater devoid of all merit according to our “high” standards – this is simply not true as Brazil has much to offer those looking for intellectualism, a stimulating and dynamic culture and just a nice, all-around place to relax. Brazilians have this notion that the average American has blood dripping from his chops fresh from devouring an Iraqi baby. We love war and most of us white folks carry a spare hood and sheet for those impromptu clan meetings we all love to attend regularly. Not all Americans are super-consumers who are incapable of seeing the world as anything other than our own, private sandbox. Please stop proliferating these stupid, harmful stereotypes because we all know (and Bushco is a great example of this) that a lie repeated loudly and often enough will eventually supplant the truth.

I believe this website is flooded by a bunch of people who really have nothing to add, and are so insecure that keep repeating the same lies over and over again to convince themselves I think.

This country is not even half as bad as it's painted here. I have lived here all my life and had a fairly good life.

This idea that the "whole world" envies the US is the most ridiculous one I have ever heard. It does good for ones ego but it's very far from the truth. People here couldn't care less about you, the only ones that actually risk their necks to get into US are people without hope, deluded by movies propaganda portraying US as the best place in the whole world.

The only way to fix this site would be some moderator to filter the hate messages and leave only the intelligent ones. While it doesn't happen this site will only be a Brazil bashing site.

Or a US bashing site . . . The US is not as bad as it is painted here either friend - don't forget that . . .

"WE WANT YOUR MONEY, NOT YOUR FRIENDSHIP! "


We not only WANT, but GET your brasileira bundas!! And thats ALL we want!!

"the only ones that actually risk their necks to get into US are people without hope"


REALLY?? And a large percentage of these "brasilians without hope" have came up with TEN THOUSAND U.S. DOLLARS to get them there....if you have 10K U.S. in brazil, you're certainly not "without hope". And tell me, just how many are "with hope" in brazil?? Just how much opportunity to advance from one class to another is there?? If you have the determination to work your ass off in brazil do you have better than a 70% chance of retiring in leisure?? You do in the U.S., and that's the big difference. And MILLIONS of brazilians are well aware of this. When you have 40 million "threatened by hunger", as is stated on Fome Zero's website, and tens of thousands working as "slave labor", the U.S. would certainly seem like paradise to those folks...guaranteed! But then again, any first world country would.

"if you have 10K U.S. in brazil, you're certainly not "without hope". And tell me, just how many are "with hope" in brazil?"

There's something called "insurance fund" in Brazil, every employer is obligated by law to deposit money in an account for when the employee is fired. And then the employee can get that money when he is fired or for buying a house or for medical treatment.

So, 10K is easy to a lower-middle-class-40-something-without-hope-man to have when he worked for some years!

BTW, 10K is nothing if compared to how much a family of four people need to have a decent life.

Get real, the ones that risk their necks are the people without hope and perspective in life that have nothing to lose.

What sane person would risk crossing the desert to live like an outlaw if they had anything of importance to lose? Like properties, a good life, etc.

"Just how much opportunity to advance from one class to another is there?"

Many. I worked hard all my life, nothing was given to me. I paid for my college myself and studied part of the day and worked all the rest of the time, sleeping 5 hours a day for years!

Just work, just hard work. That's the recipe for advancement.

But some prefer to go the "magical land" where everyone can go form toilet cleaner to billionaire in a small amount of time instead of doing some hard work.

This portrayal of Brazil being a land with no opportunities is just a lie, I see opportunities every day.

We will cross your borders, infiltrate your communities, inter-breed with your white women and daughters, take over your lands that are rightfully ours and before you can shout CUCARACHA !!! you will be speaking our language and serving us churasco and agua de coco, I represent the oppressed brown peoples, the Native Indians of the Americas, I call upon our darker skinned black brothers to join us in overthrowing the white mans world and rising up, as well as help rise up the flat bundas of my brown women and mixing your race with our as your women have such luscious bundas, and beat the white devil back to his lands across the atlantic. However we will keep some of your blonde blue eyed native girls to enjoy and exploit so row away white devil, row away and be gone !!!

We've crossed your borders, our culture has infiltrated your communities, we inter-breed with your lucious brown big bunda'd women...on vacation anyway, and you already speak our language!! I represent Mattel, the maker of GI Joe!! LOL! :wink:

of the titles to articles on this very site.

"90% of Brazil's Sewage Is Dumped Untreated In Rivers and Lakes" -how's that 10% of the worlds agua doce? s**t water?

"39 Million or 20% of Brazilians Live on Government Charity" -20% of the population, pelo amor de deus!

"With 7 Million Kids on the Streets Brazil Finds Final Solution" -killing kids...nice.

"Brazil's School Stipend Has Become a Vote-Buying Scheme " -more corruption, and depriving the educational system at the same time, killing 2 birds with one stone!

"In Lawless Brazil Mob Execution Has Become Part of Daily Life" -police execution

"Inequality Is As Brazilian As the Weather and the Beaches " -slave labor

"Brazil: New Ambassador of Bahia's Carnaval, a Japanese Girl, Ruffles Feathers" -racism

"Lula's Education Program for Brazil: a Grim Comedy of Errors" -another 3 stooges comedy

"In Brazil, The Law Is Never For You When You Have Friends" -no duh!

"In 3 years, Brazil Has Denied 1.5 million Children the Right to Life" -shameful

"No Consistency in Brazil's Foreign Policy" -the brazilian gov't. is just as hypocritical, if not more so, than any other.

"Brazil Recognizes There's Still a Long Way to Integrate Indians in Society" -more racism

"Chinese Ask for Less Red Tape in Their Dealings with Brazil" -get in line, and a brazilian one at that!


"16 Million Brazilian Kids Don't Go to School. Reasons: Lack of School or Interest" -the "plan" is working!

"Senate Confirms Brazil's First Woman - a Confederate Descendant - as Chief Justice" -chauvenists

Just a few of what? Brazil bashing propaganda?

Gringo, get a life. What are you doing here? This site is a shame, and it's a shame that other brazilians actually participate in it.

And there are bastards trying to be "honest" about the problems.... for what? For these gringos to hide their problems and say racist and hate messages?

Not sure if you noticed, but my intent is to make all brazilians go away from here.

propaganda???

They certainly appear to be fact-based!

of the titles to articles on this very site.

"Memories of My Good Friend, a Brazilian Whore" -not uptight, always plus

"Jesus and the African Gods of Brazil's Northeast" -cultured, don't want West influence there

"Despite Its Derelict Air, Joao Pessoa, Brazil Has Some Charm"
-people love even obscure places that annoyed them before

"Carmen: The Unhappy Hollywood Life of Brazil's Shinist Star Ever" -Money isn't everything

"Desperately in Need of Friends Bush Warms up to Brazil"
-even president trying to assimilate

"and it's a shame that other brazilians actually participate in it"


It's a shame that more DON'T participate!! The middle and upper classes need to not only admit, but that is step 1, but do something about the plight of a HUGE percentage of their population being denied education and suitable living conditions, not to mention sufficient nourishment and basics such as food and drinkable and accessible water!!

Guess you're another one of those brazilian "ostriches" that are so abundant in the middle and upper brazilian classes!!!!!!!

And I guess you are another "know it all" gringo. You have all the answers! Socrates once said the path to wisdom is to first admit you know nothing, if that's true then YOU ARE IN THE EXTREME OPPOSITE OF WISDOM.

I assure you that the first step IS NOT PARTICIPATING IN A BRAZIL BASHING SITE ALONG WITH A BUNCH OF AMERICAN NAZIS.

Why don't you focus in the problems of your country? BTW, what are you doing to fix them?

Do you know what the "sophism" means? To communicate an idea specially crafted to confuse people instead of enlighten them, to convince them instead of making them understand!? THIS IS ALL WHAT THIS SITE IS ALL ABOUT!

This may be partially based in facts but if Brazil were 10% as bad as it is painted here I would be crossing the desert from Mexico to US tomorrow!

I was irritated to see an article I had contributed to this site – “Brazil: New Ambassador of Bahia's Carnaval, a Japanese Girl, Ruffles Feathers" used by one of the indiscriminate Brazil bashers that invest these comment sections.

George Orwell, in his 1945 essay “Through a Glass, Rosily” expressed the settlement I’m looking for when writing about the use of a E.M Foster’s work by Nazi propagandists during World War II.

“Just because the book was essentially truthful, it could be made to serve the purposes of Fascist propaganda. According to Blake,
A truth that’s told with bad intent
Beats all the lies you can invent
And anyone who has seen his own statements coming back at him on the Axis radio will feel the force of this.”

The scale is smaller here, but the ideas are the same.

I enjoy this page and the discussions, but far too often what could have been an interesting exchange dissolves into a sophomoric and often racist debate on whether Brazil and Brazilians are inherently good/bad, smart/stupid, or whatever other false dualisms some idiot decides to invoke.

The blind patriots are not much better.

Immigrants, wherever they are from, and wherever they go, often fall into 1 of 2 mental traps. One, they indiscriminately adopt their new home, and detest everything (and everyone) from their past as inferior and corrupt. OR, they do the opposite, and detest everything (and everyone) in their new home, and view their native land as morally superior.

So here, we have Americans in Brazil who indiscriminately hate Brazil, then there are Brazilians in America who indiscriminately hate Brazil.

Next we have the Americans in Brazil who fell in love with the place and can’t stand BushLand, or the Brazilians in the USA who have idealized their homeland into a happy Carnaval paradise. Then toss in a few internet racists nutcases who grace us with their presence.

Not every post I read falls into one of these categories – far from it – but far too many do.

I noticed you have protectors on high above who are kind enough to shield you from your detractors so what happens when we respond - will those posts be vaporized to protect your fragile ego?

"George Orwell, in his 1945 essay “Through a Glass, Rosily” expressed the settlement I’m looking for when writing about the use of a E.M Foster’s work by Nazi propagandists during World War II.

“Just because the book was essentially truthful, it could be made to serve the purposes of Fascist propaganda. According to Blake,
A truth that’s told with bad intent
Beats all the lies you can invent
And anyone who has seen his own statements coming back at him on the Axis radio will feel the force of this.”

Please spare us this kind of psuedo-intellectuallism in the future. I have been reading your junior journalist drivel and it is doubtful you can begin to entertain any idea what that random regurgitation really encapsulates. Quit taking yourself so seriously. This site is a joke and your writing generally falls into that category as well. Relax and join the Brazil/America bashing. Ain't it great??

the next time you get "tough with a brazilian politician", you may want to prepare a little more than to ask one question then "dummy-up". A queston that every single reporter in the U.S. would be asking an american politician in the same circumstances and at every turn, and it would be necessary that a viable explanation be given unless he wanted to be subject to a senate investigation. I mean, there are enough facts that are known, or misterious disappearances of huge amounts of cash that you should be able to nail some of these guys to the wall publicly. But I understand, you are a gringo in brazil, and if you got too tough it wouldn't be out of the question for your face to show up on milk cartons back home.

Jared, if you've been in brazil a while then you're quite familiar with the mind-set of huge numbers of brazilians, and even brazilian companies, that have an ideology to absolutely attempt and deflect blame at any and all costs. Look for the most viable scapegoat and point your finger. Anything but to accept responsibility for your own plight. Afterall, if others have control of your destiny then your admitting defeat, and have no reason to even attempt a try at change. It's much more convenient, not to mention painless, to say, it's the americans, the europeans, the portuguese and how our country was settled half of a millenium ago. The first step in solving ANY problem, is the recognition and acceptance that one exists, after that you only have to take action. Unfortunately, there are a helluva lot of brazilian middle and upper-class brazilian ostriches!

And the comment about your article on the Japanese girl at carnaval in bahia was a classic example of how racism does exist in brazil, which is contrary to what MANY brazilians would like people to believe. Like this is one big happy melting pot.

Jared, what kind of things do you expect to hear in such place? Every forum on the internet that is not moderated will get full of a*****es and hate messages.

I'm always amazed by "good intentions" of some of saying "the truth". You need to know who needs to hear it, and who deserves to hear it. And I am sure that no one here needs it.

Isn't the path to hell paved with "good intentions"? This place is full of nazis, if you contribute to it then you are contibuting with nazis therefore you're a nazi too. Do you want to have your name associated with this filth?

I'm speaking in the name of reason! Problem need to be solved! BUT WHAT'S THE POINT OF CONTRIBUTING TO A SITE LIKE THIS? Do you expect any "contructive criticism"?

Now, thank you for feeding the bashers. Now, please go write articles somewhere else.

First of all, you wish there were racism here so you could live in peace, you nazi.

I'm not saying that this country 100% racism free, but it's FAR LESS than in the US and of a different kind. The black culture is everywhere and not confined to a guetto!! And our integration is not limited to "white rappers", but it happens in a DNA level.

Now, you ignorant, shut up, would you?

Now about the brazilians, where did you get that load of crap you have written!! You are the perfect example of Brazil basher attending this website with the sole purpose of pissing as much people off as you can, trying to make them feel as miserable as you do.

"First of all, you wish there were racism here so you could live in peace, you nazi."


No idiot, read the post, you can read can't you?? There IS racism in Brazil...you certainly don't have to WISH for it!!

At least in the first world you don't have people dying from their working conditions....aka, slave labor. And of course those folks are white brazilians huh numbnutz?

And if you think that brazil has far less racism than the U.S., well, you're a white or moreno brazilian aren't ya?? Ask a negro brazilian if he's been discriminated against because of his color!!

Jared I agree with what you said. So dualistic! And I love the apocryphal statistics don't you, with only 5% of them being nice and such?

Now we have some real combat. I’m not sure how best to deal with this logistically, so I’ll go in order of appearance.

First, to my detractor at “Jared –give it up”

IT is hard to debate you, because as usually, you fail to make a single argument, but just peddle in lazy insults and direct commands. At least this time you did not wish for my death or “disappearance” at the hands of local thugs – wishing for the murder of your opponents is out of line in any semi-moderated debate.

My quote of Orwell was “random regurgitation” ? Really, how so then? Or are you just having fun with labels and intellectual sounding words? (your snobbish “really encapsulates” in lue of “means” for instance)

Take yourself more seriously, at least to the point where you bother to have something to say when you write.

My writing fails in many categories -- that much I freely assume – but yours fails in all of them. You are mean spirited jerk who specializes in nasty quips and spends his time reading and responding to a site he considers a joke. Why do you bother to read it?

--

Next—

I only had time for one question with Paulo Souto, as there was no press conference or “collectivo”. I asked the question acting under a “what if” pretense, as in, “what if politicians around here actually had to answer unfriendly questions at project inaugurations?” There was no news at the event (and I made it clear I was unimportant) so I wrote the narrative around the question itself.

As for not being better prepared—that was actually part of what I was writing about – the fact that I couldn’t get the ahold of the detailed article before he came because all the copies were “sold out”

There are ostriches, as you call them, in every country. But, the journalists who wrote the articles and did the investigation revealing the latest charge of corruptions against ACM and the PFL in Bahia were not among them. Neither was the editor of Jornal da Bahia, who I mentioned in the comments section. I could go on citing names, but what I’m getting at is that there is a national debate in Brazil, and there are scores of Brazilans who are willing to recognize problems, ask difficult questions, and confront them. Brazil is not a nation of ostriches and you would be wrong to say so.

--
Now, to the “What the point of contributing” person

I disagree with your premise – that this site is anti-Brazilian – so of course I disagree with your conclusion.

It’s the internet in general that’s full of Nazi’s, and you are correct to say that any forum that is not moderated will attract them.

But the contributors are not the bashers you portray them to be – it’s a group of volunteers who, for whatever reason, decided to write about Brazil. Is there a better site allowing people to do so? Not that I know of.

Response to:

"Now about the brazilians, where did you get that load of crap you have written!!"

Really? Ever had a problem....sorry about that, when you've had problems with Telemar, Intelig, Embratel, Vivo, the power company, your computer, your car, etc., etc., etc. How many times have you heard this, "sorry sir, we've recognized we have a problem, and we're correcting it as soon as possible, and for your inconvenience we're going to give you a 25 reais credit on your next bill and the problem will be resolved within 24 hours"

Answer: NEVER!

Brazilian Reality: Problem with Telemar and telemars response; "who's do you use for long distance?? Ohhh Embratel, then it's Embratel, a problem in their system".

Problem with Embratel: Response: "Who's your local carrier? Ohhh Telemar, then you need to open up a reclamçao with them".

Computer Store: The black market mother board you sold me from Paraguay is toast! Response: "it's the power company, these power surges here are terrible. Our customers have this problem all the time, you need to make a complaint with the power company.

Power Company: Your power surges burnt up my motherboard. Response: "They buy those motherboards in Paraguay ya know, it's not our fault.

Car: Problem with whatever. Response: Your warranty doesn't cover that, and if you've ever even so much as taken your car to get the oil changed at any other place than one of our authorized service centers....well, you're f**ked!

Lula and the PT scandal..."Não foi eu!! Sabia NADA, NADA(doing his best Schultz imitation from Hogan's Heros!)

Hahahaha

You have gone too low. That shows that you got really pissed off with what I said. So, are you enjoying it, american nazi?

What slave labor are you talking about!? You speak as if at every corner there people enslaved, that shows that:

- Either you are an idiot and believes blindly in the bashing propaganda in this site;
- Or you are a nazi deliberately trying to piss other people off;

This is the art of picking one thing, that's a minor thing considering the fact that Brazil has continental dimensions and a population of almost 200 million, and use just as an excuse for bashing this country.

There are many problems here but slave labor is not one of them.

And about the blacks. THEIR CULTURE IS PART OF THE BASE OF WHAT BRAZIL IS!!

ARE YOU TRYING TO ARGUE THAT EVERYTHING NOT ONLY MUSIC, BUT FOOD, CUSTOMS, RELIGIONS, NAMES, EVEN A MARTIAL ART, etc, is less than in US!? What!?

They don't need to be accepted here, THIS IS THEIR COUNTRY! This is not a white country where a bunch of nazis like yourself allow them to live as inferiors like in US, but their contribution WAS MAJOR, and I am proud to have this blood.

Now that you mentioned, YOU SHOULD ASK THOSE BLACKS SURVIVORS FROM KATRINA IF THEY FEEL DISCRIMINATED AGAINST BECAUSE OF THEIR COLOR!!! Hahahahhaah

If anyone saw me now would think I'm nuts because I AM LAUGHING SO HARD IN FRONT OF THE COMPUTER!!! Hahahahaha

Thank you for the good time, have a nice day!

That's not what the other guy meant. The "finger pointing" he mentioned was of a bigger kind, not trying to assume the bad situation you are in, and it has nothing to do with bad service.

I believe you misunderstood everything.

"There are many problems here but slave labor is not one of them."

Slave labor isn't a problem in brazil??? Well tell that to those that are working as slave laborers!!! Do you want the U.N. reports or the reports from here within Brazil itself!! Pretty f**king terrible that you would attempt and diminish an outright shameful situation such as this. The state of Mato Grosso is one of the biggest culprits, and how ironic that the judge from that very state made the following comments in regards to brazilians getting fingerprinted and photographed, along with peoples from 140+ other countries when entering the U.S.


"absolutely brutal, threatening to human rights, violating human dignity, xenophobic and worthy of the worst horrors committed by the Nazis."

Those comments are MUCH more appropriate to the slave labor situation that exists in his very own state!!!

Read this numbnutz, and if you want U.N. reports, I can give you those url's too!


http://www.brazzilmag.com/content/view/5741/


Now, go feel ashamed about yourself and the people in your country for allowing this s**t to continue in the year 2006! How does it feel to take your head out of your ass?

"That's not what the other guy meant. The "finger pointing" he mentioned was of a bigger kind, not trying to assume the bad situation you are in, and it has nothing to do with bad service. "

I knew exactly what he was saying, my examples are a prime example of this, it happens and infiltrates everything and everywhere, from the highest levels of politics, down to mainstreet. It's an ideology, a mindset. It infiltrates politics, businesses and the average joe on the street. Ever notice how it's like a trip to the dentist getting a "desculpa" from a brazilian?? Same thing, just at a lower level. Whatever you do, don't admit your wrong, don't admit there is a problem, or worst case scenario, let out an "ohhh-pa!"

To the Brazilian: Yes, slave labor in a problem in Brazil, especially in remote ares, and there are more then enough stats, reports, and investigations to prove it. No, it is not Brazil’s most pressing issue, but the mere fact that salve labor exists, even if it is on a small scale, is morally repugnant, and deserves action.

The situation is much worse when you consider other labor abuses…

To the Non-Brazilian: Yes, there are many things wrong in Brazil and salve labor is one of them. But why should every Brazilian, as you seem to believe “go feel ashamed” about
themselves and their country?

I am an American, and I believe that there is a lot wrong in my country, and that my country has done a lot of wrong in other parts of the world. I don’t feel guilty about any of it.

It would be pointless to get into a debate about the United States right now, but my point is this – there is no such thing as collective guilt. One can only be judged by one’s actions, not by your nationality.

--
I’m going to sleep. I had hoped from a response from Mr. Nasty if just for the chance to thrash him some more, but it seems I am not so lucky.

that last post should have had the subject, On Slave Labor

excuse the type-os, it is a bad tendency of mine.

I just stumbled across this site, as I'm planning my first trip to brazil this July. After reading this article and the responses, I have to say that I'm more than shocked about some of the things that people have said. Apparently there are some non-brazilians making many negative posts about brazil, and apparently the same from brazilians in respect to the U.S.

The comment that "threw" me off the most was the poster who commented about slave labor existing in brazil today, because I sincerely thought he was just talking out the side of his mouth. So I did a little research on my own, and it didn't take me long to find that he indeed was stating fact.

To the poster who appears to be brazilian, and his responses to that statement;

"What slave labor are you talking about!? You speak as if at every corner there people enslaved" -Does this problem have to exist in epidemic proportions to admit not only it's existance, but to be downright angry that your government, and your people, are allowing and perpetrating this travesty to exist?

"This is the art of picking one thing, that's a MINOR thing considering the fact that Brazil has continental dimensions and a population of almost 200 million, and use just as an excuse for bashing this country."

Slave labor exiting in the year 2006 is a MINOR thing? I would have never dreamt that such a thing existed in brazil in this day and age. Your justifying the existance of SLAVE LABOR because you have a big country?


"There are many problems here but slave labor is not one of them."


If you're going to totally misrepresent the reality that exists, you would be better off keeping quiet, because you're doing nothing but confirming other negative statements that have been made such as brazilians aren't willing to admit and accept their problems. It doesn't matter if this situation exists for 100 people, or 100 million, it's surprising, distigusting, and shameful that it exists at all!

This is unbelievable!!! For the last 30 minutes I've been sitting here in shock! It's certainly contrary to everything I've seen or read about brazil up to this point.

"Bad money drives out good" in economics. There is something like that here and on most Brazzil article discussions: there are some good people with interesting contributions to make to a discussion. And then there are the Brazil-bashers and the American-bashers, some foul-mouthed, some racist, taking over any conversation and driving it down to the lowest and crudest levels and destroying whatever chance there is for rewarding discussion. The only real answer to this, I think, is just to maybe hire some off-duty Rio cops to take these guys out, and no, I don't mean for dinner and drinks. Then decent people will be able to use these discussion boards again.

It's one thing for them to say it doesn't exist. That's unawareness. It's another thing for them to say it doesn't when they know it does. That's horrible. BUT at the same time, I can see that they feel that outsiders hear one bad thing and think a place is a complete nightmare. What they're saying is that you can't use one problem that exists to cast dispersions on an entire country and its lay people. Especially one that is bigger and has 50 million more people. Some of them were not aware of that existing there. Just like many are not aware that 20,000 men, women, and children are imported into the US annually against their will. Should we be ashamed of ourselves. Will anger and shock actually end it, or just awareness? And there are definitely organizations in Brazil working to put a stop to it, they're not all shrugging and pointing randomly at other people. 4,000 slave laborers were freed two years ago and recompensated for their time. Also it's interesting to note that many slave laborers HAVE NO IDEA that they're slave laborers, (think they will eventually be getting paid) or have no intention of leaving, because they figure that any form of work beats unemployment. Also that it's not unique to this one country, there are 27 million slaves around the world and 700 million sex slaves. What is unique is that people expected this place to be idyllic and separate from the rest of the developing world.

700 million sex slaves? lets see there are 6 billion people in the world so you are saying less than 1 in 9 people is a sex slave. Did you mean 700 thousand? I hope, because there is no way you could actually believe that stat. Unless you are saying every housewife by defenition is a sex slave or some other crazy logic people put forward to further thier own agenda.

I meant more than 1 in 9 people.

"4,000 slave laborers were freed two years ago and recompensated for their time"

Does that make it allright? What about the ones that died because of their working conditions, how did they compensate them?

As far as 20,000 people being smuggled into the states against their will, I would like to see those statistics, as most are dying(literally) to get there. But I am aware that Asian gangs exist and do this activity, locating some in "sweatshops". Which has been known for quite some time, and the garment district in NY is closely scrutinized for this very activity. When caught, those responsible are jailed. I found in my searches that a brazilian politician, possibly a senator, was caught with 500+ "slave laborers". Is he in prison?

It's impossible to argue with mindless Brazil bashers. Their only intent is to spread lies about my country! Could you use your rational mind for a few seconds?

I repeat, if Brazil were 10% as bad as it is pictured here I would move to somewhere else, anywhere, in the first chance I got.

The fact that I still live here and believe that I can make a good living here tells enough.

SLAVE LABOR IS NOT A PROBLEM HERE. Ok, there are a few in some remote areas. But that's like saying that ALL AMERICANS ARE GENOCIDAL PSYCHOPATHS WHOSE FAVORITE PASSTIME IS TO TORTURE MEN IN SOME PRISON IN A REMOTE AREA ONLY BECAUSE SOME MORONS DID IT IN ABU GHARIB!

Are you happy that such thing exist in 2006, IN YOUR COUNTRY!? It looks like medieval to me!

Are you just as sick as they are? ARE YOU?

Do you feel ashamed? What did you do change that? Did you vote for Bush?

Is the best description of the US is that woman giving an OK to a camera and holding a leash of a prisoner naked!? Is it?

You see, that makes absolutely no sense!! IF YOU CONTINUE TO INSIST IN SLAVE PROBLEMS WE WILL HAVE TO CONCLUDE THAT ALL GRINGOS, NO EXCEPTIONS, AS JUST AS SICK AS THOSE FROM IRAQ, is it correct?

Now, what about the gang that traffic people to Europe to make them to work as sex slaves? Why those europeans that promise work in a rich country and then put the woman in a whorehouse with no chance of coming back before "she pays the costs of her trip and living" are never talked about?

I believe the reason of this site is simple and clear: Brazil bashing. For whatever reason, it doesn' matter, what matters is Brazil bashing for you.

I really hope after this message that those stupid gringos once and for all give on bashing my country. Or at least find something else to talk.

stat is that??


"I meant more than 1 in 9 people."

Well, more than 1 in 9 people have been to the moon. That tells me nothing.

"Are you happy that such thing exist in 2006, IN YOUR COUNTRY"

Last time I checked, Cuba wasn't the U.S. Not defending what happened, terrible, and those that are being blamed are being tried and held accountable, some have already received prison sentences. And, it is a time of WAR, these aren't American citizens, these are alleged, in all fairness, people that are believed to have ties with terrorists organizations. A little different than enslaving your own people, wouldn't you say? Your comparing actions taking by a military, in a time of war, to "peacetime" here in Brazil.

As far as those nasty Italians and taking brazilian women and others to work as sex slaves, they should hang those bastards!

That was caused by your people!! Committing abuses everywhere they can!!

What lame excuse of yours. If the army of the US commit such crimes they should be attributed to ALL AMERICANS, that supported that war.

Of course, that's following the same logic as you do for the "slave problem".

Now, admit that the whole purpose of this site is to bash Brazil, not to produce rational thought.

to hear brazilians justify their murder rate in their country of peaceful song-birds, samba-dancing, racial melting pot, to the WAR in Iraq.

Justifying the existance of slavery because, "it's not only us, it happens in other countries too!!"

I'd stop with these so-called "negative" posts if when people bash the states they would do so factually. There is a lot to bash there which can be done so factually. But let's put it into some perspective. The fundamental problems that exist in a country like brazil, today, are difficult to compare with the U.S. if not impossible. Your comparing apples to oranges. The U.S. gov't. does invest in it's people, access to education for all, infrastructure, legislation that is actually enforced, a system of justice that is not based on "who you know" or "how much money you have". A system where the normal citizen actually sees some return on his tax dollars. None of the above can be said about brazil with a straight-face.

The problems that face brazil are much more basic fundamental problems of human survival. When you have close to 25% of your entire population that are "threatened by hunger", and millions upon millions of citizens without access to potable water, yet your country is full of these resources, there are basic, fundamental problems that exist and one would think would be a MAIN priority in solving.

"Now, admit that the whole purpose of this site is to bash Brazil, not to produce rational thought."

Nope, this site is great, it helps ignorant people like the one poster "discover" for the first time some of the s**t that goes on here as he sits at his churrasco drinking a brahma thinking "wow, what a great place..... oi, empragada, traga-me outra cerveja!!" LOL! It's those kinds of attitudes that allow slavery to exist here. I have to say, on my visits to the northeast of brazil, I was embarrassed at seeing the treatment that some families I met gave to their maids.

You know about the atrocities in Guatanomo Bay because the press there will climb up your ass with a microscope at the smell of impropriety. I mean, we almost impeached a president for getting a blow job, because it was done in the "peoples house". Here in brazil, they would throw a churrasco for Lula in commemoration!

Jared, if you look carefully you will see that I indeed make several points. In the previous thread to which you referred I simply stated that you were a bitch, and secondly, I simply hoped for your disappearance; whether I was referring to a cinderblock ankle bracelet or just hoping you would disappear from this site - well I guess I'll just leave you in suspense.

In the previous post I also make points, and just because they are not the points you had hoped for, and more to the point, were critical of you (and do you have a gay editor who zaps unfavorable posts by the way?) doesn't mean that I failed to make points. They were twofold:

1.You have protectors who are indeed shielding you from the bite of your public's rebuttals (I'm sorry Jared, does "rebuttal" fall into that realm of “intellectual sounding words” and furthermore, does that intimidate the burgeoning writer? - oops did it again - sorry). We can't all drag this site down with sloppy writing and a less than admirable command of the English language now can we . . . ?

2. Please spare us the pseudo-intellectualism. I think that says it all. You will notice that you said this: “George Orwell, in his 1945 essay “Through a Glass, Rosily” expressed the settlement I’m looking for when writing about the use of a E.M Foster’s work by Nazi propagandists during World War II.”

Jared, surely you can see what I meant by pseudo-intellectualism. That means employing the word “settlement” where surely you meant to write “sentiment”. That is obnoxious, contrived intellectualism at its best Jared. I know you’re a lightweight but “getting strong now” since your hard hitting interview with Sousa, so I expect as much. You probably remembered reading that essay in some History class back in college and it stuck with you ever since right? You have probably been dying to make reference to that essay for years but couldn’t think of another famous quote regarding “lies” (except maybe the ubiquitous “a lie spoken loudly and often enough will eventually supplant the truth”) to save your life. The truth is you have no idea how that Orwellian essay relates to the use of your “Japanese Carnaval Girl” headline to demonstrate racism. More to the point you appear foolish and sophomoric quoting something so heavy to defend this lightweight tripe you call journalism. Yes Jared, it’s nazi Germany here on Brazzil.com and the SS propaganda police are waiting in the wings to rip you limb from limb. You are a pseudo-intellectual at best. Here is something else you said:

“I was irritated to see an article I had contributed to this site – “Brazil: New Ambassador of Bahia's Carnaval, a Japanese Girl, Ruffles Feathers" used by one of the indiscriminate Brazil bashers that invest these comment sections.

For the love of god Jared!! You want to be taken seriously as a writer but you are constantly f**king up the language be it grammatically, syntactically and your spelling is less than laudable – INVEST? Come on now!!

Mr. Nasty? Now you've confirmed it - you are gay. Thanks for shattering any doubt I may have had. OH and if you honestly think you are thrashing anyone or anything, other than the English language, think again. I see you for the mental pygmie that you are. Because you write for some hack website with the likes of Robin Sparks does not a George Orwell make. You're just a punk bitch!!

One can only wonder how you got this gig Jared . . . Spit or swallow?

No problem justify LIES. What happen in this site is half truth augmented so you can feel a little better about yourself.

I just showed that US is full of s**t and you want to come and tell us "what is right" ?

Who do you think you are? You piece of s**t gringo.

I don't need to justify anything, I'm just throwing at your face that your country has problems too. So all the self-righteous talk of all those gringos turns into simple bashing because of the barbarities caused by other americans just like you!

This site is a shame, and any self respeting person should not contribute to this stupidity.

You speak so much of brazilians justifying this or that, BUT WE DON'T HAVE ANY MAGAZINE IN PORTUGUESE LANGUAGE SPECIALLY MADE FOR US BASHING.

You do have one specially made for Brazil bashing in english, so you are the haters here.

So much stated here is false. To say that the "American Dream" is phony or to state that Brazil is not a lovely country is just false. Since I'm not a graduate of the Michael Moore School of Truth I'm only interested in facts. FACT, no country in the world is more immigrant friendly than America. If the American Dream is phony then the world has indeed become dark and I wish I could set sail and find the straight road to Valinor. But it isn't phony and I still have hope. Now, a few words for some statements above that are quite dumb. To the writer who says this is a site where "gringos" can say "racist" things, how can you call someone a gringo and then complain about them being racist? This is just dumb and I need not say more. Another writer uses the term "American Nazi". We destroyed the Nazis at a great cost to us. Calling the average amercian a nazi is just dumb. The American writer of "Se habla Espanol" seems to think America has the worst drug problem in the world. This is not just false but dumb. You cannot fool me because I have brazilian television and I have been to Brazil 4 times. The favelas of Rio are under the control of drug dealers. Violent drug dealers. Just last week the brazilian army had to invade one to reclaim their own rifles that were sold to them by a soldier. Have you ever heard of Colombia or Escobar. The american drug market is mostly non-violent and hurts the individual not the whole. To the statement above. Yes, both of our countries have problems and there is no perfect place on earth. However, I do not believe that the whole purpose of this site is to bash Brazil. Many articles on this site are pro-Brazil but Brazil does have many problems that non-portuguese speakers would never know or care about if it wasn't presented here in English.

Obviously that one hit home!! Hard to face the difficult realities that most like to hide in closets, especially when being presented with them by a "gringo"! Buck up son, the U.S. has people all over the world calling us on our s**t...what's a matta meu filho??? Can only dish it out in Brazil but can't take any criticism??

quote:

"This site is a shame, and any self respeting person should not contribute to this stupidity."

Well, you're contributing...that about says it all!!! So if you're self-respecting, according to you, I guess we've seen the last of your ass???

"no country in the world is more immigrant friendly than America"

Repeat it continuously until you start believing in it.

The only thing immigrants are good in US is for gaining low wages and to work on jobs that native americas would like to do.

"To the writer who says this is a site where "gringos" can say "racist" things, how can you call someone a gringo and then complain about them being racist?"

Gringo is a generic term to anyone that's from outside. IT HAS NO RACIST CONOTATION WHATSOEVER. An american black will be a gringo here!

"Another writer uses the term "American Nazi". We destroyed the Nazis at a great cost to us."

Haha, have you taken a look at your own home? KKK? Neo nazi groups?

Wake up please.

"I just showed that US is full of s**t and you want to come and tell us "what is right" ? "

How and where did the hard to discombulate dribble you wrote PROVE anything?


"Who do you think you are? You piece of s**t gringo."

So I guess that would make you a "macaco"??


"BUT WE DON'T HAVE ANY MAGAZINE IN PORTUGUESE LANGUAGE SPECIALLY MADE FOR US BASHING."

Waaaahaaahaaaaa!!! You cry more than a 2 year old.Let me dry my eyes.

One can only be grateful that most Brazilians are not such f**king idiots eh? You can almost see this kid in front of his black market Commodore 64 computer taking breaks from his bloody, gore computer game and/or porn site to hit his joint and call someone a gringo piece of s**t like the half-breed, nappy haired, skinny garden troll that he is. That is right after he called his Mae and asked her to bring him a nice bowl of feijao. Does that sound about right sonny boy? Are you momma's little boy. You do still live at home don't you? We got your ass you dwarfish, speedo wearing wanne be surfer bitch ass trick. . . We know who you are!

Haha, you have given up every single bashing you were doing until now and are using direct attacks!

That's good because it's a sign that you are really pissed off, and lost focus in the Brazil bashing game.

This place is a shame and I hope to open the eyes of any thinking person to get away from here and stop contributing to it, so they won't be get dirty with this nazi filth.

Are you momma's little boy? Bet you are!! Yeah and you're a real thinking person - hilarious!!

Brazil is a wonderful country with great people and an interesting set of problems and challenges. So is the US. Now stfu, both of you.

Dear Afflicted Brazilian,

You are being reducionalist when you use a few posters’ stance to define “the purpose” of this site. In the same sense that an individual American can not be blamed for Abu Grab, or an individual Brazilian blamed for the existence of slave labor in remote parts of the country, this website cannot be judged by a few Brazil-haters that frequent its comment section. Is any of this so hard to understand?

No offense but is English your first language? Like "reducionalist".... "a few posters' stance(s)"..."Abu Grab?"

Maybe you're just typing fast, since you said "can not" then "cannot".

too many open windows and a brain killing job. Still, don't you have more things to be curious about?

Oh I see. So is this what you do?

No, but my source of income does obligate me to stay in front of a computer and read/research for long periods of time.

I have an organic tendency toward type-Os, word switches, misspellings, and the like, so I should be more considerate and put my posts in Word before sending them. It’s not full proof, but it would help.

I write occasionally for this site (with much more care then I post,)– the flag article is mine. Anyone can contribute; the writers are collection of random volunteers.

We’re way of the original topic-- the book that was the subject of the above article. I hesitate to criticize it though (and that’s all I could do), as I write for this site and have much to improve upon myself.

ha, way off, of course, not of.

Such a dufus!! Jared kindly remove yourself from the volunteer list . . . it's for the greater good. You give English speakers a bad name and your articles suck ass!

quote:

"There's something called "insurance fund" in Brazil, every employer is obligated by law...."

I stopped the quote right then and there, for after that, it's all a joke!

I've maybe had in the neighborhood of 10 different maids in my years here in brazil, and have met their husbands, children, families, etc. I can GUARANTEE you, that NOT ONE of them has access to TEN THOUSAN DOLLARS U.S.!

"What sane person would risk crossing the desert to live like an outlaw if they had anything of importance to lose? Like properties, a good life, etc."

That's the point my friend, MOST brazilians DON'T have PROPERTIES....or a GOOD LIFE!


"Just how much opportunity to advance from one class to another is there?"

"Many. I worked hard all my life, nothing was given to me. I paid for my college myself and studied part of the day and worked all the rest of the time, sleeping 5 hours a day for years!"

DO YOU THINK YOU ARE IN THE MINORITY, OR THE MAJORITY?



"This portrayal of Brazil being a land with no opportunities is just a LIE, I see opportunities every day."

No one said that there are not opportunities, just that there ARE NOT OPPORTUNITIES FOR ALL! And without question, the VAST majority!

research and...

"It's impossible to argue with mindless Brazil bashers. Their only intent is to spread lies about my country! Could you use your rational mind for a few seconds?"

It DOES NOT appear that anyone is Brazil Bashing here, it appears that they are speaking not only from personal experience, but from DOCUMENTED situations and problems that unfortunately EXIST in brazil TODAY!

What is unfortunate is the attitude of those, like the poster that I quoted, to attempt and negate or minimize these problems as though they do not exist!

Can you elaborate about the 10 different maids? I'm interested in getting a maid. Why did you switch so much? Were they live-in?

How the hell do they get 10,000 dollars if they're so desperate?

"I've maybe had in the neighborhood of 10 different maids in my years here in brazil, and have met their husbands, children, families, etc. I can GUARANTEE you, that NOT ONE of them has access to TEN THOUSAN DOLLARS U.S.!"

I assure you that any lower middle class man in his mid thirties has this quantity in the insurance fund.

Unless he is a complete vagabond and never worked or is a starving person, he will have this quantity.

You KNOW NOTHING about Brazil, and about your 10 maids, so what? Is that ALL OF Brazil there's to know about?

GRINGOS ARE THE MOST IGNORANT SON OF A BITCHES IN THE WORLD.

YOU CAN'T ADMIT FOR A SECOND THAT YOU DON'T HAVE ALL THE ANSWERS, AND KEEP AFIRMING THINGS YOU DON'T KNOW. IS THIS THE LYING SOUL OF A GRINGO? WAS THE BUSH BEHAVIOR OF LYING ABOUT WEAPONS OF MASS DESTRUCTION A STANDARD BEHAVIOR OF ALL GRINGOS?

"That's the point my friend, MOST brazilians DON'T have PROPERTIES....or a GOOD LIFE! "

You completely missed the CONTEXT. I said that ONLY THE PEOPLE WITHOUT HOPE WOULD TRY TO GO TO US.

BTW, you have absolutely no data to say data.

MOST americans DON'T have PROPERTIES... or a GOOD LIFE!

Now we are even.

"It DOES NOT appear that anyone is Brazil Bashing here, it appears that they are speaking not only from personal experience, but from DOCUMENTED situations and problems that unfortunately EXIST in brazil TODAY!"

YES, THERE'S NOT A SINGLE WEBSITE IN PORTUGUESE SPECIALIZED IN US PROBLEMS, CORRUPTION, POVERTY, WAR ON IRAQ (TORTURES, ILLEGAL ARRESTS, GENOCIDES) ON THE INTERNET!

WHY AMERICANS ARE SO HAPPY TO TALK ABOUT OTHER PEOPLE'S PROBLEMS BUT SWEEP THEIR OWN PROBLEMS UNDER THE CARPET?

f**k YOU!

Could you gringos actually READ what is written?

Do you know what "insurance fund" is? If not, scroll up and read it. There is your answer.

of a LOST brazilian!!!


You must live in Sao Paulo...or possibly Rio..am I right? 10,000 dollars U.S. in their insurance fund??? I DONT KNOW BRAZIL??? What a f**king ignorant fool!! You can't be brazilian, because you wouldnt be making such ridiculous claims uless you are some "mommy's boy", as most are, protected by mommy and daddy at 35 years of age and think all of brazil is your reality!

Sorry to bust your bubble sonny, but the VAST majority in the NORTHEAST of brazil DO NOT have ACCESS to TEN THOUSAND DOLLARS U.S.!! Now please, if you try and debate that then you are ONLY SHOWING YOUR IGNORANCE....ONCE AGAIN!

QUOTE:

"ONLY THE PEOPLE WITHOUT HOPE WOULD TRY TO GO TO US. "

Well then riddle me this batman, in my 10 years here, I've had THREE UPPER MIDDLE CLASS WOMEN, I would actually classify ONE as UPPER CLASS, offer me TEN THOUSAND DOLLARS to MARRY them so they could get a f**king american GREEN CARD!!!!


Get the f**k out of here jackass....you know your s**t for reality, and so do I. You're not fooling anyone here numbnutz!! And anyone human that asks me what it's like in brazil......I tell them exactly how it is....the REALITY, and not through some rose colored, tropical paradise, colored-blind glasses!!!!


What a f**king MORON you are!

let me get this straight....

QUOTE:


"I assure you that any lower middle class man in his mid thirties has this quantity in the insurance fund. "


MY GOD YOUR IGNORANT!!! Tell me this Einstein...HOW MANY lower and middle-class people are there in brazil?? Do you think that the majority of LOWER middle class brazilians have access to 10K U.S.???

You don't even have to respond...ALL and EVERY human being that even slightly knows BRAZIL knows that you are an absolute IDIOT in attempting to make that statement!!!

And DICKWEED....more than 50% of 28 year old americans OWN their own HOME!!!!


While the VAST majority of Brazilians at 28 YEARS OLD are STILL LIVING AT HOME WITH "MÃE MÃE"!!!!

NO WONDER THERE'S SO MANY FAGGOT BRAZILIANS!!! THE ONES THAT ARENT STARVING TO DEATH OR LIVING IN HEFTY TRASH BAGS ARE BEING SPOON-FED AND THEIR UNDERWEAR WASHED FOR THEM INTO THEIR 30'S BY MÃE MÃE.....no go get pissed off and show your mommy!

Well, it's obvious that the gringo posters here are quite correct, albeit a wee tad too caustic and beligerent for the thined skinned or weak of heart. However, the Brazilian (?) in this debate is kinda asking for a intellectual pummelling especially with mindnumbingly retarded comments such as:

"I assure you that any lower middle class man in his mid thirties has this quantity in the insurance fund."

This comment alone leads me to think that this "brazilian" is in fact actually some form of troll having his kicks and jollies taking this piss. I have come across some serious mentally challenged Brasilians in my 8 years living in this country, however, even most stubborn, nationalistic "all gringos are evil" simpletons would have an issue trying to defend such a proposterous position.

Um norte americano, morando há pouquíssimo tempo no
Brasil, e falando "BEM" o português faz a sua lista de
compras e vai ao supermercado para tentar abastecer a sua despensa
e geladeira. Tendo feito a lista, a seu modo, e com o carrinho à
frente, vai lembrando do que precisa:

PAY SHE
MAC CAR ON
MY ONE EASY
PAUL ME TOO
ALL FACE
CAR NEED BOY ( MAIL KILO ) (esta é genial...)
AS PAR GOES
KEY JOE (PARM ZOOM)
PIER MEN TOM
BETTER HAB
LEE MOON
ALL ME ROOM
BEER IN GEL
THREE GO
PAY TO THE PIER YOU (sensacional...)

Ao final ainda dá um tapa na testa,dizendo:
PUTZ GRILL LOW ! IS KEY SEE O TOO MUCH...PUT A
KEEP ARE YOU!!Entendeu???

"Can you elaborate about the 10 different maids? I'm interested in getting a maid. Why did you switch so much? Were they live-in?"

Here's the situation with maids here, at least my experience, and the experiences of brazilians that I know here who have maids, which is nearly all.

Firstly, it's extrememly difficult to get a good maid, naturally, most do not have a high level of education, most are poor. They're only making a minimum salary which is 300 reais per month, plus you pay for their transportation, plus after 3 months you need to sign their card and pay a monthly tax, which is around 40 reais per month. So a maid making a minimum salary costs around 440 reais per month total.

The "problems" with maids seem to be fairly universal here. Many miss work often without even calling to let you know their not coming. But the big thing is that they ALL steal, even if it's only food or cleaning supplies, ALL of them, not only in my experience but from what every brazilian I know has told me about their experiences, that at a MINIMUM they all take items of food, cleaning supplies, etc. from time to time.

The BEST maid I had here worked for me for nearly 3 years, my wife didn't treat her very well, imo, and we had numerous disagreements over the treatment of the maid. I treated her like I would treat any other human being, but not my wife, she treated her the way I see MANY brazilians treat their maids, which is not good, but I've came to understand their mind-set in doing so.

Shortly before this maid quit my house was robbed, they took all electronics, tv's, stereos, computer, CD's, DVD's, microwave, quite a bit of stuff. Not ONE lock was broken to the main gate of the house nor the house itself.

When I arrived home that night on a saturday, around 3 am, I noticed that the neighborhood security guard which ALWAYS sat on a chair on the opposite side of the street from my house, was gone, and so was his chair, so he was GONE for the night. He normally didn't leave until 5 am. I screamed for my maid who stayed in an apartment in the back, it appeared that she just awoke and I showed her what happened, she said she heard nothing. I called the police, they arrived a week later, in that time I started asking the neighbors questions about the security guard since he did not show back up for work for the following 3 days, eventually my maid ending up telling me that she actually "saw the thieves breaking into the house". She said one guy was short and the other tall, two men, according to her. I had a wall that surrounded my house, it is 8 feet tall. I'm 6 feet tall and when I raise up my arms they don't quite reach the top of the wall, let alone have the capability of lifting things over the wall to someone else waiting on the other side, but this was her story, she said she was hidden in the stairwell outside of her apartment that is elevated from the ground, and watched a short guy and a tall guy lift televisions, computers, microwaves, over this wall to one another, absolutely IMPOSSIBLE unless the two thieves were Shaquille O'Neil and Wilt Chamberlain.

After she quit my wife heard from neighbors and maids that worked for them that she opened the front gate and the side door for the security guard and one of his "partners in crime". Up until that incident she was the best maid I had, but obviously she was just setting me up for the right moment to make a big score, f**k stealing bags of rice and some cleaning supplies from time to time, she/they got away with thousands of dollars in electronic equipment!!!

"Up until that incident she was the best maid I had, but obviously she was just setting me up for the right moment to make a big score, f**k stealing bags of rice and some cleaning supplies from time to time, she/they got away with thousands of dollars in electronic equipment!!!"

Your story is all to common in Brazil.We have specifically avoided using maids for just this very reason. Actually, we're leery of just about anyone we let near our home. I hope you had insurance, and if yes, did that work out for you? We've been paying home/property insurance for over 3 years (thankfully there has been no need to use it) and I am interested to here experiences from those that have had to file claims. I hear it is ANOTHER horror story.

I didn't have insurance. But I hear what you're saying, I've been paying for medical insurance for years here, and have heard horror stories about that as well, I hope to god that I never need to use it, but if I do, I sure as hell hope they don't screw me after I've been paying for years, and its not cheap.

Here's a funny statement made about the above robbery story by the police, once they got to my house, 5 days after the robbery took place.

"Did you see which way they went?"

LOL! I told him, no, I didn't, I wasn't here, but I think they're already in Argentina by now!

That is incredible. It makes it impossible to really feel sorry for maids. I can imagine you being congenial and equal to her, friendly, talking American. Probably paying more than mininum wage. And she just could have cared less. Makes it understandable why rich Brazilians are like that, pompous or uninvolved. Geez, I don't see how either could stop coming across like this if it's now a cycle. Seems like a stain from slavery, with the (mostly black) underclass rebelling, stealing, being irresponsible, the (white) upper class being heavy handed and paranoid.

But obviously not slavery, or else the upper class would be brutal killers and you as the employer would have to fear death. She would have poisoned you in your sleep or snuck up behind you. Yeah I would definitely not get a maid. Sweet dreams eh?

I always "treated" them as I would anyone else, until the last couple years, now I keep my distance a little, so to speak, until the last couple years I treated them as a "part of the family", but it gets difficult when things like that happen, and then you discover with the other ones they're taking food, cleaning supplies, etc., from time to time. And all the while I'm paying them more than what is necessary. Even an extra 50 reais a month is a big deal to someone who is only making 300 reais in a month. It's an uncomfortable situation for me, I don't have "sleep-in" maids anymore, they leave at the end of the day, and unfortunately, you have to keep an eye open for when they arrive and see what they've brought with them, and see what they're taking with them upon their daily exit.

Unfortunately I can understand, although I don't like it, the attitudes I see numerous brazilians have in respect to their maids.

When I first arrived in brazil I thought exactly what you mentioned, "empregadas" here are not much different than slavery, imo. It's like you have a child that you take care of, feed them, pay for their transportation, scold them when they've done something wrong. I'll say this, there is NOT ONE american that would accept being treated in their work, or by anyone, as a large percentage of maids are treated here by their employers.

Can someone translate that joke, because I understood the first paragraph, some of the items on the list, but I didn't get the overall punchline.

they are nice to have. Houses and apartments here aren't like in the states. I've never been in a house or apt. here with central air. Normally you put a split A/C in the bedrooms, or window unit. So in the other rooms the windows are open. You would be surprised how much dirt and dust accumlates over the course of a day. Many don't have washing machines as well, although I do have one, many people don't, hence still wash clothes by hand.

For the little bit of money you have to pay, it definitely compensates, if you can keep them from stealing you blind!

You still HAVE NO IDEA of what "insurance fund" is. It's so true you don't even touch in this subject.

WHAT A GRINGO RETARD!

I seriously doubt that ANY upper level person would ask you to marry them. If they did ask they weren't as UPPER as you said yourself.

An upper middle class makes around R$ 17000 or US$ 8000.00 a month. A lower middle class makes around R$ 2000 or US$1000.00 a month.

Obviously your "friends" belonged to lower part.

An upper middle class would be probably a doctor or have a well stablished life, and travel occasionaly to many parts of the world.

They are NOT HOPELESS, AND WOULD NOT RISK THEIR NECKS FOR LIVING LIKE ILLEGALS IN US.

YOU ARE A RETARTED GRINGO.

I have lived my all life here and you still want to discuss with me!? It's unbelievable, only a GRINGO would dare.

BTW, the state that most brazilians leave for US illegally is not in the northeas, IT'S MINAS GERAIS IN SOUTHEAST!!!! Not only an american nazi, but also pretty stupid.

Direct attacks. Hahahahahaha

That means I'm reaching my goal, the gringo retards don't know what lies to tell anymore!

"Well, it's obvious that the gringo posters here are quite correct, albeit a wee tad too caustic and beligerent for the thined skinned or weak of heart. However, the Brazilian (?) in this debate is kinda asking for a intellectual pummelling especially with mindnumbingly retarded comments such as:"

Well, could you point out how did you get to this conclusion?

The region where most people leave to try to cross to US is not the northeast.

I'm sure that in the depths of your ignorance you believe that this country is a big sertão, with nothing beyond cactus trees. But let me tell you something, the most advanced region, southeast, is where some people leave to something else sometimes.

Usually lower middle class or even poor with borrowed money. People that see no way of getting a good life, that run the risk of losing their job tomorrow and fall into poverty overnight.

People that are too lazy to study, or study is not "their thing", think that in the US everyone is rich without the need to work hard.

For what I have seen from US the times I have been there, the main difference is that losers in US can have a decent life, not a good life, but a decent one.

So they may work their entire life in some crappy work, doing repetitive tasks, and still be relativly happy.

This new Brazilian-owned food store opened up in my neighborhood, thought I'd give it a try. I walk in and the guys says "Posh now?"

I said, "hey, it's none of your business how I dress. Just give me a pound o' cashews."

Guy gave me some cheese bread. What a weirdo.

responding!! You're only making yourself look more stupid, if that's possible. NO ONE SAID THE MAJORITY OF BRAZILIANS IMMIGRATING TO THE U.S., AND MOSTLY ILLEGALLY BY THE WAY, ARE FROM THE NORTHEAST!

What YOU said was that a normal lower middle class person has access to at least 10K U.S. in his "insurance fund". I know quite well what the insurance fund is, afterall, in the company we own here we currently employ more than 20 brazilians here in Brazil!! And a lower middle class person makes anywhere from 700 reais per month to 1,800 or so.

First of all, 2,000 reais IS NOT CONSIDERED LOWER MIDDLE CLASS....at least not in the entire northeast of Brazil. 2,000 reais per month in the northeast is smack-dab MIDDLE CLASS!

If one makes 17,000 per month, he is certainly considered UPPER CLASS and RICH to boot!

And for your information, 2 of the 3 women that made me the offer of "buying" a marriage with me have at least 500,000 reais in assets, and make in the neighborhood of 5,000 reais per month! The other one is RICH, she has well over TWO MILLION REAIS in apartments, houses, land, etc.....she is a RICH person here.

I know all about Governador do Valadares bonehead, but that still does not negate the fact that brazilian immigrants are from ALL OVER Brazil. And MANY of them that pay to get smuggled into the U.S. paying 10K U.S. to do so, have leveraged assets they have in order to pay!

Did you know there are MORE than 800 "COYOTE" companies in Governador do Valadares?? And there are approximately 150 people PER DAY applying for passports and VISAS to Mexico in governador do valadares???!!!! I bet that just eats your ass, lol!

Yeah, what a great f**king land of opportunity and wonderful paradise when your people by the tens of thousands every week or month are trying everything and anything to get the f**k out!!

Simple logic tells you that any country that has a high number of illegals in other countries obviously doesn't have a good situation in their own country. You DO NOT SEE a problem with ILLEGAL AMERICANS in other countries, wonder why that is Einstein? Your obviously one of the FEW middle class or upper middle class brazilians that have it decent here. But it doesn't matter how much money you make in brazil, you're still surrounded by s**t! People looking to rob you blind at every corner, your imprisoned in your own home!! Funny one day in my house as I gazed out the bar-covered windows, through the iron gate of my "portão", surrounded by 8 foot high walls, thinking, "f**k, it's like I'm in prison!"

What a great reality! If you continue to chant the mantra, "it's great here, what a great country", over and over again, it will soon become a reality, at least in that little pea brain of yours!

Like the lady with 500k reais in assets even WANT to relocate to Brazil when she could have an awesome life in Brazil? Why would she take a chance on marrying some unknown gringo and possibly ending up in a trailer park in America?

With that type of money she could have a huge mansion full of maids. If Brazilians paid their maids more and treated them nicer maybe they wouldn't steal so much. Can't expect loyalty from a person who you treat like a slave.

I don't believe that most Brazilian illegals even use coyotes. It appears to me that they simply buy an airplane ticket and overstay their visas in America. A one way ticket is only several hundred dollars. I personally do not believe that coyotes even charge 10k. If a Brazilian has that type of money he would be a fool to risk that much cash coming to a place where he will be scrubbing toilets and washing dishes while dodging immigration. If a Brazilian can come up with that type of cash he doesnt need to leave the country. He could get someone to scrub HIS toilet and HIS dishes instead of the other way around!!!

think so!! But you only have to do a google seach for governador do valadares, there are HUNDREDS if not THOUSANDS of articles about the coyote companies in this country, and specifically in governador do valadares, search this very site, you'll see articles about illegal immigration to the U.S. from governador do valadares, the use of the coyote companies, and them charging 10K U.S. to smuggle them in. You notice that the brazilian making himself look like a fool in this thread saying the majority of lower-middle class brazilians have access to 10K U.S. didn't even debate that fact. And if you want to know the truth, they're even starting to charge more since the weakening of the dollar! They WERE charging 10K U.S. when the dollar was 3-1 to the real! It's now 2.1 to 1.

If you don't believe they charge that price, do some research, it won't take you long, especially if you read portuguese, to find out every word I've said is indeed reality.

Why would a "rich" women, or upper-middle class women want to go to the U.S.? First of all, to live in a "different reality", for a middle aged or older single women here in brazil is not much fun. The vast majority are not going to find a husband, because the vast majority of middle aged or older brazilians, especially if they have a couple dollars, have 20-30 year old wives. If your even in your late 30's here in brazil, a woman, and single, it's not going to be easy finding a mate. That is a brazilian reality.

Also, as I mentioned above, it doesn't matter how much money you make here, you're still surrounded with vast numbers of uneducated, poor people, and even the ones that are not, are unscrupulous to say the least. The percentage of MORAL, HONEST people in this country is MINISCULE.

You are correct in one of your assumptions, the majority of illegal brazilians in the U.S. are ones that arrived on a tourist visa, and decided to stay, whether that was while they were there, or their plan all along, it's not pertinent. Although, there are MANY THOUSANDS of brazlians arriving EVERY MONTH via the texas, arizona, and california border via Mexico, via COYOTE companies.

Did you know that just last month, in February, the texas police and border patrol caught SIX groups of brazlians within a 4 hour time period that totalled 400+ brazilian illegals trying to "enrolar" their way into the U.S.?

I'll look for some url's for you, from brazilian as well as american reports, and you can see for yourself about brazilian illegal immigration, and the use of "coyotes". If there wasnt a big demand, there wouldn't be 800+ coyote companies in governador do valadares alone!

treating the maid better, I can attest to this, I did treat them good, like I would a "friend" in the U.S., afterall, they are a "worker" that is personally involved in your life, washing your clothes, cooking your meals, taking care of your children, etc, etc. I did treat them much differently than the normal brazilian does, to the surprise and protest of my brazilian friends saying, "listen, you can't do that", but I did, and at the end of the day I was taken to "the cleaners".

I see what you mean but where are they getting the money? I guess they find a way. Do you think that maybe the coyote companies finance their way and they pay them back when they get to the states?

I remember reading a book about Brazilian transgendered (travestis) working in Italy and how they could get the financing up front to go there but that they had to pay the money back with exorbitant interest. This is probably what is happening. They get the financing up front from the coyote company and then work their butts off in America paying it back plus high interest. These companies are probably mob-controlled too so an ass kicking is guaranteed if the money is not repaid.

I can see why a woman would want to leave. I considered buying a condo in Rio but now I don't know. It's not exactly a place for a woman under age 35. Its a man's paradise. An American man can easily move there and ogle 17 year old girls but for the "mature" woman no such luck. Even my Brazilian male friends who are all middleaged only date girls between 17-28. A 40-year old woman in Brazil is practically a great grandmother. I can see why an older Brazilian woman would want to leave this "Lolita" mentality behind. I am reconsidering purchasing a place because do I really want to live in a place where a woman over 35 is a sexless invisible granny?

I see what you mean but when you have a history of people being abused I think that even if a person shows kindness to that person it is too late to really change the mindset.

I encountered a similar experience in Jamaica. A friend of mine who is a well off Jamaican has a beautiful home with a lovely swimming pool but is too afraid to use the pool for fear that the maid and other help may sneak friends onto the property to rob and harm those using the pool. Even if you treat the help nice you are not exempt from this treatment.

I guess when you have situations in which one set of people have abused another for centuries the abused develops a form of mental illness which makes it difficult to distinguish a "good" employer from a "bad" one so whenever they encounter a good employer they take that kindness for weakness and use it against the person.

Why would a well off person pay $10,000 to get into the US when she could just get a round trip plane ticket for a few hundred to a couple thousand dollars?

YEAH and why would a poor person bother leaving if he already had 10K? Why use it to get smuggled, what job can you get without ID, speaking or reading skills?

I think many poor Brazilians just want what many of them want, which is to retire in the countryside and get a farmhouse.

Why would $8000 a month be rich there if people there who have millions of dollars in assets?

And if it's so bad there why are you there?

http://newsfromrussia.com/worl...65852.html

It states the the prices they charge, and also that 27,000 Brazilians were caught at the Mexican-U.S. border from october 2004 to July 2005!

on the head!

"makes it difficult to distinguish a "good" employer from a "bad" one so whenever they encounter a good employer they take that kindness for WEAKNESS and use it against the person."

weakness or stupidity!

Who cares? Isn't it like that all over the world? Either get married or screw.

first of all, you can't just "buy a plane ticket" to go to america if you're brazilian...you NEED a visa!! Since 9-11, and especially since the numbers of illegal brazilians that exist, and the numbers trying to cross the borders illegally have increased 50 fold since the early 90's, the U.S. gov't. is making it very difficult in approving any type of visa for a brazilian....it's an all too common problem. Last week I met a niece of a buddy of mine that is an EXCELLENT student and has excelled in her area of studies here in brazil, she is wanting to go to the U.S. to study more and also work in her field, her visa has been denied. Unfortunately, the actions of her countrymen have caused this situation that exists here today in respect to brazilians acquiring an american visa.

As far as $8,000 per month being rich and millions of dollars in assets, that's not what I said, I said millions of REAIS in assets, and 17,000 reais per month here is considered RICH. You know that one real here is just like one dollar in the states. Would you say that someone making 17,000 dollars a month in the U.S. is rich?? Of course you would, that's over 200,000 dollars a year. Now what would you call someone that's making 200,000 reais a year when the vast majority here make 2,000 reais a MONTH or less?? And a minimum wage of 300 reais per month??? They would be considered much richer than an american making 200,000 dollar per year since the average american makes 35,000 dollars per year!

You don't have to take my word for it, read the article on the url I posted above, do some research on brazilian illegal immigration and the brazilian economy, GNP, or PIB, poverty in brazil, look at the numbers....you'll see!

quote:

" I considered buying a condo in Rio but now I don't know. It's not exactly a place for a woman under age 35."

Bud, if you're looking for a middle-aged women, you'll be in absolute f**king paradise here...there are MILLIONS dying to meet a nice guy of whatever age to hook up with!

some 30-40 something women that are absolute "hard-bodies", stunning, a definite prize for any middle-aged man, hell, a prize for any man period. They may have a kid or two, but wtf, there are MANY GORGEOUS middle-aged women here.

I'm pretty sure the person who said that about middle aged women was a chick. What you said made it worse.

I say, WHO CARES? It's ALWAYS like that. When you're in college once you're not a freshman you're old shoes. SO??

LOL, didn't pick up on that! If you're a single middle-aged woman wanting to move to brazil, LOL, bad move!

"And a lower middle class person makes anywhere from 700 reais per month to 1,800 or so"

So you know what that is then. And still ignored it.

As other people said and it's a know thing, the money may be paid later with a percentage of the worker (low) salary.

So the idea that "everyone" wants to go to US is a plain lie. Only screwed up people do, that don't mind cleaning toilets and washing dishes, because they have nothing to lose to begin with, not even their dignity.

Maybe in northeast 700 is much, in Sao Paulo this much money is a ticket to poverty where you won't even be able to afford a car.

A lower middle class is from 2000 and up.

"First of all, 2,000 reais IS NOT CONSIDERED LOWER MIDDLE CLASS....at least not in the entire northeast of Brazil. 2,000 reais per month in the northeast is smack-dab MIDDLE CLASS! "

Hahahahahahahhahaha

A middle class? 700 reais is poor. 2000 is lower middle class.

That's the GRINGO ARROGANCE WE ALL SEE HERE. YOU KNOW A LITTLE BIT OF THINGS FROM THE SMALL WINDOW OF YOUR LITTLE WORLD AND STILL INSIST IN TELLING "YOU KNOW EVERYTHING ABOUT IT".

YOU LIVE IN ONE PLACE, HAVE YOU EVER THOUGHT THAT BRAZIL IS MUCH BIGGER THAN THAT!?!?!?!?!

"And for your information, 2 of the 3 women that made me the offer of "buying" a marriage with me have at least 500,000 reais in assets, and make in the neighborhood of 5,000 reais per month! The other one is RICH, she has well over TWO MILLION REAIS in apartments, houses, land, etc.....she is a RICH person here. "

OH MY GOD! YOU ARE A SHAME FOR ALL GRINGOS.

Aren't you ashamed of lying? Why would a person with such assets want to risk their necks?

You're another idiot spreading the idea this country is a big favela! A person with enough money can live very well, and not be surronded by s**t.

If all you know is s**t, I suggest you pick a better place to live then.

And I really doubt those old ladies would find an old man willing to have them as wives in US either.

Don't american men enjoy young woman?

"Simple logic tells you that any country that has a high number of illegals in other countries obviously doesn't have a good situation in their own country. "

Hard work man. That's the magical recipe. That gives you anything here in Brazil.

In US an immigrant will forever be a second (or third?) class citizen (until it's deported), only someone with very little to lose, no self love, and the limit of survival would accept that.

I know people that went to the US and lived the "american dream" lie. Now they came back and are doing pretty well here. BTW, we all saw the "dream" floating in the Katrina disaster. The US image is forever damaged, the mask has fallen.

This country has a future but not with parasites like you. If it's so bad, WHAT ARE YOU DOING HERE?

I'm not sure if US is paradise, since it has millions living below the line of poverty and RACISM.

I hope this shameful sequence of idiotic statements of yours are done. What's your point anyway? Are you trying to prove that highly capable people want to live in the US, no matter what, even for washing your dishes?

WAKE UP! Only the screwed up do, in a mix of ignorance and lack of hope, trying to find a perfect place that obviously is not from this earth.

I REALLY HOPE THIS SITE ONE DAY ENDS AND I WILL BE HERE TO OPEN THE EYES OF ANY THINKING PERSON THAT SERIOUSLY WANT TO KNOW ABOUT BRAZIL AND NOT PARTICIPATE IN THIS FORUM OF NAZIS.

how it could've made it worse, she would've been informed abut the multitudes of middle-aged women here that are HOT but neglected because the men here opt for 18-28 year olds!

"You don't have to take my word for it, read the article on the url I posted above, do some research on brazilian illegal immigration and the brazilian economy, GNP, or PIB, poverty in brazil, look at the numbers....you'll see!"

See what you idiot? That a person with half million in assets would want to move to US illegally?

And not only US, a person could go anywhere, including Europe.

Numbers can be used in many ways to prove anything you want, and I don't do that for you regarding US because:

- It's stupid;
- I have more important things to do;

So please, research any bad numbers about US and put it here.

are showing your ignorance ONCE AGAIN!!

Let me quote you!

"YOU LIVE IN ONE PLACE, HAVE YOU EVER THOUGHT THAT BRAZIL IS MUCH BIGGER THAN THAT!?!?!?!?! "


EXACTLY DICK-WAD!! YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT SAO PAULO!!! SAO PAULO IS NOT f**kING BRAZIL!!! ITS A STATE AND CITY IN BRAZIL!!!

BY THE WAY DICKHEAD...IF YOU DON'T HAVE A COLLEGE DEGREE YOU DONT EVEN MAKE 700 REAIS A MONTH!! Do you think these people go to college, university, to be poor?

This idiot obviously lives in Sao Paulo, which is MUCH more expensive than the rest of brazil, and also has a FEW people that make decent money, but also has MULTITUDES OF DIRT POOR!! That's why they sell more bullet-proof glass in Sao Paulo than ANY OTHER CITY IN THE WORLD...because of the gross discrepancies in distrubution of wealth!! You have a few guys making millions, then you have the masses making a few hundred reais a month!

This idiot is obviously an idiot Paulista that thinks Sao Paulo is BRAZIL!!! Wake the f**k up sonny, ONE CITY does not a country make!! And especially a country the size of Brazil!

But people must consider the facts that the south of brazil, like sao paulo, florianopolis, rio grande do sul, actually discussed years ago in SEPERATING AND FORMING THEIR OWN COUNTRY!!!!

They don't want to foot the bill for the rest of this huge monolithic poverty ridden country!!

Now you guys tell me, do you think that 2,000 reais a month here would not be considered middle-class when you have 20% OF THE POPULATION THREATENED BY HUNGER!!?? 2,000 reais a month is SEVEN minimum salaries......SEVEN!

is this guy on some heavy drugs or what? Does his posts have ANY coherencia or am I tripping on acid?

quote:

"A lower middle class is from 2000 and up"

and up?? so 10,000 reais a month is lower middle class?

3,000 reais a month is lower middle class?

Buddy, I know the northeast of this country WELL....and ANY BRAZILIAN will readily admit, in the northeast anyway, that 2,000 reais a month is smack-dab middle class!

It hurts to hear the TRUTH about your country doesn't it??? Obviously!

Sorry to inform you mommy's boy, but middle-aged and older american men look for people in their age group. You don't have young good looking girls looking for a MEAL TICKET as you do here, because in the states a young good looking girl has a college degree, she makes her own money, she doesn't need to marry an older guy to "take care of her", here in brazil there are MILLIONS that do exactly this!

A women in her 40's, 50's, and definitely 30's has MANY options in the states....here in brazil THEY ARE f**kED!! And I don't mean that LITERALLY!

And once again, a brazilian turning a "blind eye" to statistics that HIS OWN COUNTRY" produces...not to mention NGO's, organizations like the United Nations and others!!!

Sit there at your internet cafe in Sao Paulo, go home to mommy's house for some churrasco or mommy's feijoada, have her clean your underwear and invite your "girlfriend", or "boyfriend" over, whichever the case may be, try and move out of the house before your f**king 40 years old, that would be a good goal for you, and when/if you can, make a few visits to the northeast of your own country, you'll see IT'S NOT LIKE SAO PAULO!!

I know your country MUCH BETTER than you do you f**king blind, 30's something, living at mommy's house ainda jackass!

"BY THE WAY DICKHEAD...IF YOU DON'T HAVE A COLLEGE DEGREE YOU DONT EVEN MAKE 700 REAIS A MONTH!! Do you think these people go to college, university, to be poor?"

REALLY? WHY DO MANY PEOPLE MAKE MORE THAN 3000 A MONTH AND DON'T HAVE A COLLEGE DEGREE THEN?

Could you just shut up? Man, you are pathetic.

I knew many people that make more than 700 and HAVE NO COLLEGE. And before finishing college I already made more than that.

"But people must consider the facts that the south of brazil, like sao paulo, florianopolis, rio grande do sul, actually discussed years ago in SEPERATING AND FORMING THEIR OWN COUNTRY!!!! "

Hahahahahahhahahahahahahah

That's what your gringo mind would love to see.

This is ONE COUNTRY, and unlike US that's formed by a bunch of "ethnicities" that live segregated this is ONE PEOPLE.

This "separation" is a gross exaggeration since the south would be a third world country without SAO PAULO.

How would they survive, selling soy beans? Do soy beans hold weapons? What armies to they have?

I believe this is a international sabotage for the destruction and dismemberment of Brazil, conducted by GRINGOS.

People don't mix in your country and you come to tell BRAZILIANS, who wants to separate from who?

Wake up. I'm sure your white cape wearing friends would be very happy to get rid of blacks in US!

"Now you guys tell me, do you think that 2,000 reais a month here would not be considered middle-class when you have 20% OF THE POPULATION THREATENED BY HUNGER!!?? 2,000 reais a month is SEVEN minimum salaries......SEVEN!"

Simple, 2000 reais is lower middle class. You can live decently but you won't have any luxury.

You can't afford a car, you can't afford to live in excellent places, you can't afford to have many electronic gadgets, etc.

But you can live decently.

THAT'S WHY IT'S CALLED "LOWER MIDDLE CLASS".

Other people going hungry doesn't affect your acquisitive power. The katrina victims could tell.

THIS SITE IS A SHAME.

two things you are really wrong about:

people who go to wash dishess and clean toilets abroad are screwed up people without dignity.

hard work is a magical recipe

"and up?? so 10,000 reais a month is lower middle class?

3,000 reais a month is lower middle class?

Buddy, I know the northeast of this country WELL....and ANY BRAZILIAN will readily admit, in the northeast anyway, that 2,000 reais a month is smack-dab middle class!"

If you actually could read you would understand what I meant.

"two things you are really wrong about:

people who go to wash dishess and clean toilets abroad are screwed up people without dignity. "

So what do you think they are? Really intelligent people that figured that washing dishes would make them billionaire?

"hard work is a magical recipe "

How do you get something you want? Stealing? Killing?

I only know one way, work.

and anybody married to american is not going there illegaly and risking their neck.
as for reason , here is one . safety.

and washing dishes is not a work?

lol, lol, lol, lol. Bud, I don't have to DO A THING TO MAKE YOU LOOK LIKE THE IDIOT YOU ARE....you do quite a nice job all by yourself. ANY human that reads this is thinking...
"what is this guy talking about, his writing is incoherent, and he's making statements that are so far from the brazilian reality!"

I can't believe your brazilian...well, yes, I can, lol.

2,000 reais a month and you can't buy a car??? Really???? Give me a call dickhead, I'll put you in touch with 50 brazilians that I know here that make 2K or LESS and purchased a car AND they have an apartment!

You need to get your head out of your Sao Paulo ass and look at the rest of your country for what it is!! By the way, it is common knowledge that Santa Catarina, Rio Grande do Sul, and Parana were talking about succeeding from brazil!! This is common knowlege and can be found with any research whatsoever!! It's no gringo conspiracy bozo!

If you're living in sao paulo you're living in the engine that makes this entire country run! If it wasnt for sao paulo this place would be worse than afghanistan! Here is an idiot thats comparing his country to the city in which he lives, and far and away the richest city.

Imagine if an american made statements about the U.S. only in respect to the conditions in Naples Florida!!! LMAO!!! Get a life you idiot, or better yet, get an education!! Learn about YOUR COUNTRY!!

"If you actually could read you would understand what I meant."

Know what you meant?? I can only go by what you are writing...and it's incoherent, unintelligable, false dribble! Don't count on people to "read" what you write, but understand "something else"!! MORON!

quote:

"This is ONE COUNTRY, and unlike US that's formed by a bunch of "ethnicities" that live segregated this is ONE PEOPLE."


Really? Like this is a country full of patriots huh?? Tell me why that NINETY PLUS percent of ALL BRAZILIANS when asked would NEVER go to war for their country???

One country? One people?? The VAST majority here do NOTHING BUT ARE OUT FOR THEMSELVES...f**k OTHERS, f**k THE LAW, f**k BRAZIL, f**k ANYONE AND ANYTHING, AS LONG AS THEY GET PAID!

One country? One people? Ask any brazilian or my mulata brazilian girlfriend if she thinks this is one country, one people, like there's no racism here....bud, you're living in one helluva Alice in Wonderland fairytale!

Where's mãe mãe?? Can't believe she hasn't pulled you off the comp. yet to go and watch the bimbos shaking their ass on Faustão yet!

"An upper middle class makes around R$ 17000 or US$ 8000.00 a month. A lower middle class makes around R$ 2000 or US$1000.00 a month."

Whoever posted this - I just had to come straight down here and mock you!!! This is about the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard. Upper-middle class Brazilians making $96,000 US before taxes?? LMFAO!!!! You must be lying about your country of origin. My wife is Brazilian and she is laughing her ass off too.

My sister and brother-in-law have Masters degrees from 2 of the best universities in America and they make just about that maybe a little more - call it $105,000. Go splash some water on your face and get back in touch with reality!! Guess those new jobs in soy and beef are attracting Wharton Business School grads eh?

quote:

"Aren't you ashamed of lying? Why would a person with such assets want to risk their necks? "

You're not risking your neck in America when you have a GREEN CARD idiot!

And on top of that they have CASH!! So what were they wanting?? A better f**king life! Something other than leaving their nice apartments or homes and within 100 meters have the bums on the street attacking their cars for coins! Or a chance at meeting a nice middle-aged man to settle down with, somethig VERY difficult here if you're a woman over 35 years of age. Or going to a place where things work! Where you don't have to constantly battle with the telephone companies, energy companies, etc, etc, etc, in vain. Possibly to go to a place where people have RESPECT for others, for property, and for the very place they live....something that is NON-EXISTANT here!

"Upper-middle class Brazilians making $96,000 US before taxes?? LMFAO!!!!"

No bud, its WORSE than that, in the U.S. we talk about our salaries PRE-TAX...here in BRAZIL you talk about your salaries POST-TAX!!!

So he's saying that a upper middle class brazilian makes 96,000 DOLLARS AFTER TAXES!! As we both know, anyone here making 17,000 reais a month is UPPER CLASS, and considered RICH!

an AMERICAN is considered upper class if he makes six figures, 100,000 dollars or more. And as I stated before, there the median salary is 35,000/year. Imagine here, where the minimum salary is 300 reais per month, and the vast majority makes below 2,000 REAIS per month!

This guy is a retard.

Southern Brazil, a predominantly white region wanted to form their own separate state. This is well-known and I am an American. The whites of Southern Brazil wanted their own white nation and did not want to be bothered with the poor of color in the Northeast.

The persons in Brazil making the lowest salaries are black or mulatto. Few whites make this type of low income salary. There is no future for blacks in Brazil short of sex work for the women and drug dealing and even sex work for the men.

When Brazil says there is no segregation or racism that is bullsh-t! It is as segregated as America. "Integration" is only due to the fact that white families have a black live in maid. This is what the Brazilian white middle and upper class mean when they say there is no segregation in Brazil. As long as the maid lives in the house they consider this integration. Black Brazilians who are not live in help live in segregated favela communities far away from the affluent white sections of the country.

you know what you're talking about. I know black brazilians here, and it's truly a shame when you see idiots like the one here posting that make statements like racism doesn't exist here.

I'll say this, being a white male, foreigner, here in brazil, and dating a black brazilian from bahia, we get looks the majority of the time as if we were in a small town in Mississsippi!

mommy pulled him off the computer or you were right, he was some euro-nazi impersonating a brazilian!

But I read a book about the experiences of black Americans visiting Brazil from the early part of the 20th century to the 1980s thinking it was a racial paradise and finding out otherwise.

A black male musician went to a concert in Southern Brazil with a blonde Brazilian of German heritage and the many stares they got from the other members of the audience. When the house lights came on for intermission the people would resume staring. Now this was Southern Brazil in the 1960s. The same gentleman visited Rio and learned early on that Brazilians (I don't know if they were white at least white by American standards) don't date black men or its a crime for a black man to be seen together with a white woman in public.

Now between black women and white men. I get the impression that it is alright to sleep with the women as long as you are not seen out in public with them. Brazil is definitely not a racial paradise. On the surface it may appear to be but when you really sit back and observe racial relations it is obvious that racism does play a big part in Brazilian society.

Strange thing - there are a lot of Euro-freaks here pretending to be Americans to make points. I have caught several on other threads . . . Losers eh?

I dated a black woman from Sao Paulo for awhile and we received looks on the subway that were nothing less than hateful. . . She said herself that Brazilians are some of the most racist people on earth. She also lived in New York for a year and said IT was a racial paradise compared to Brazil. She also said that she knows very few BLACK men who want to date black women. She has personally never dated a black man in her life. Funny that black Brazilian men appear to be the most discriminatory in that respect. I know other black Brazilian women who confirm this - it's blondes or nothing.

how many is lot for you than?
and if somebody from europe lives half of their life in usa, what is their nationality?

Yes but I think it's a middle ground. I definitely don't think it's racism-free. He should go to the restaurants, social clubs, and the University of Sao Paolo and count the non-white heads. Or just look at his family and neighbors! He won't have to because without having gone there I can tell you he won't find any. Also look at the cabinet and the TV screen. How could he possibly think the place was not segregated? How much money to bet his family is all white? That's not just with class or would his whole family be white? You see how there was a fuss over the all black channel? Dr. Rodolpho the only black doctor in Vasalia was almost fired when they had budget cuts, instead of just cutting all their salaries, until the community wrote in the stop it because he was their best doctor. Ever since he NEVER lets anyone from the south go near his house or car, he just goes to work and goes to the NorthEast EVERY weekend. At the social clubs no mulattoes or blacks, they get ignored and stop going. Same with some restaurants. Ronaldo's family was STOPPED on the way to a $100,000 a month condominium by a resident and "mistaken" for slumdwellers. Ronaldo who calls himself white. Ronaldinho, their golden child. Ronaldo, slamming $100,000 a month for that room. A black girl was accosted at a university by a mom. WHEN would that EVER happen in the US. It just so happens this girl happened to be a politician's daughter, that's why it became world news. Bahia has never elected a black mayor! Whole state is run by whites like ACM and Souto. That's why there's a Movimento Negro. Why else would they have done that if there was no racism?? 93% of cariocas polled believe there is racism in Brazil.

But I don't think it's as racist as people make it sound, like it's a "hell-hole" to be black there.

In Latin America and other areas in the world including India, South Africa, and SouthEast Asia, there is a pigmentocracy, where the richest are the lightest so this is not unique to Brazil. Also the middle east you have Ashkenaz Jews at the top, then Sephardic Jews, and then Arabs. Also there are Indians, poor whites and morenos.

There is a black middle class in Brazil, they are one third of the middle class sector. There is a quota system that provides 20% of universities as black.

There are also rich blacks who are exorbitant, not just athletes. rappers, musicians or celebrities but business persons, spokespersons, people who work for the Canal da Gente which is based in Sao Paolo.

I don't see how black Brazilian men can attract white women seeing as most of them are poor and without means. I gather that white Brazilian women are very spoiled and expect to be taken care of in style. How are black Brazilian men outside of Pele able to accomplish this feat?

In Bahia I noticed most black men were with black women. I noticed a few black women with white male gringoes but no black Bahian men with white women, Brazilian or any other nationality. The only black man I met with a white wife was a black American. Other than that I witnessed no interracial couples involving white female/black male.

L

My Brazilian wife's best friend (black) is marrying a white Frenchman. On the flip side she has only dated one black man in all her 32 years. . . As regards Bahia I would say that black/black relationships are more common there, and the entire northeast, whereas in other parts of Brazil, primarily the south, you will see more black men with white women.

LOL..here is the brazil-impersonating euro-trash!!!

"how many is lot for you than?
and if somebody from europe lives half of their life in usa, what is their nationality"

Ones nationality is the country in which they were born. Now you can migrate to other countries, get the proper documents, become a "citizen" ot that country, but ones NATIONALITY is where he was BORN!!

Brazil sound like one of the world's most racist countries.

that these obvious european idiots in defense of brazil would know better. They're doing more harm than good, as they don't know s**t about this country, they know the little they read and come here speaking as if they're brazilian, making comments that no brazilian who is not mentally challenged would never make, because they know it's simply not the reality that exists!

You're not helping the cause of brasileiros euro-nazi's.....you're f**king them worse than people that you think are "slamming" them, but at least speaking about the reality that exists!

you are wrong. i have never pretended to be brazilian.
and i guess those mexicans protesting in LA can never hope to be accepted as americans than.
and 1 person does not make lots,

"you all are making Brazil sound like one of the world's most racist countries."

No, don't think we are, but are rebutting the statements from some pro-brazilian idiot that it attempting to make brazil appear as some racial-harmonic wonderland...which is FAR from the truth!

quote;

"you are wrong. i have never pretended to be brazilian."

So, you're sitting in europe, and are going to tell us gringos that have been living in brazil for YEARS...in my case, TEN YEARS, about this country???


Now I'm laughing!!! What a moron you are.

"2,000 reais a month and you can't buy a car??? Really???? Give me a call dickhead, I'll put you in touch with 50 brazilians that I know here that make 2K or LESS and purchased a car AND they have an apartment!"

Depends what you call a car. Anyone can have a Fiat 147 1985 and live in the favela with 2000 and still there would be a of cash left.

Gringo, learn a little about this country before posting crap in here.

"You need to get your head out of your Sao Paulo ass and look at the rest of your country for what it is!! By the way, it is common knowledge that Santa Catarina, Rio Grande do Sul, and Parana were talking about succeeding from brazil!! This is common knowlege and can be found with any research whatsoever!! It's no gringo conspiracy bozo!"

No bozo, the only people that talk about it ARE GRINGOS!!!

THERE'S NOT A SINGLE WORD ANYWHERE ABOUT ANY PLANS OF SEPARATION. WHAT ARE YOU DRINKING? ARE YOU ON DRUGS?

Your "common knowledge" IS A JOKE, A NOT FUNNY ONE.

Get some information, idiot. This site is made up for this, to DISINFORM everyone. I really hope this site cease to exist one day, because it's maintainers have NO ETHICS.

I wasted this much time with this idiot....LOL! Well, you got me there buddy!

you must have confused me with somebody than. i have not told you anything regarding brazil.

By the level of the arguments you look like a 18 years old.

"Really? Like this is a country full of patriots huh?? Tell me why that NINETY PLUS percent of ALL BRAZILIANS when asked would NEVER go to war for their country???"

Have you gone to Iraq? If so, have you tortured anyone while in there?

Ok, give up, get your KKK white cape and move on. I know it's unconceivable for you to understand miscigenation, so don't come here, we don't need types like you here.

To all of you speaking about this subject. I'll say it again. THIS IS BULLs**t!!!

I can't believe how gringos can lie so much. If you don't like here don't come, I couldn't care less.Leave us alone.

What kind of inadequacy make people waste so much time in front of a computer to type crap like that?

I have whites, blacks and indians in my family, the integration is at DNA level. The guy that said about "maids are the brazilian integration" CAN ONLY BE DRUNK. And I know a lot more people like this.

I have seen people dating, marrying, etc, others in all colors combination you can't even imagine. That's why a brazilian don't know his color, because it's pretty hard to figure out when your mother is blond, your father is black but you look indian because your grandfather was indian!

I LIVED IT, AND MET A LOT OF PEOPLE WHO DID!

Brazilians are the most relaxed when it comes to "color", this IS A VERY BIG ISSUE anywhere else.

YOU KNOW s**t ABOUT BRAZIL. So basically for the much said here I don't exist because according to the "ALL WISE GRINGOS" such a thing doesn't exist!

Now, about the low income... THIS IS THE STUPIDEST THING I HAVE EVER HEARD.

LOW INCOME HAS TO DO WITH LOW EDUCATION. Give those people:

- a decent education (so they don't use those horrible slangs);
- a decent job;
- a safe environment to live (favelas are the most horrible places, full of all bad things);

And I am sure that the "racism" gringo see is gone.

Now, about the
SO YOU THINK THERE AREN'T "WHITE POORS"?

IF YOU GO TO BAHIA YOU WILL SEE A LOT OF BLACK POORS, BECAUSE THE POPULATION IS BLACK DESCENDENT IN THE VAST MAJORITY, come a little south and start seeing some blond maids.

Oh, I see. You want to feel better about yourselves. This gringo color complexity is aggravating. They are not happy in discriminating among themselves but they want to spread RACISM all over the world.

QUOTE:

" I really hope this site cease to exist one day, because it's maintainers have NO ETHICS."

Buddy, you have this site confused with BRAZIL.....BRAZIL HAS NO ETHICS!!! LOL!

Thank god for this site, and if I hear they're going to take it off the air I'll pay for the son-of-a-bitch to stay up! To keep idiots like you from MISINFORMING people about brazil. People need to know the reality of a place, and not through some rose-colored, papaya-eating, maracaja-juice drinking glasses!!

YOU YOURSELF need to wake the f**k up! You talk about people in the favellas as if your minimizing their existance!! I'll let you in on something, THERE ARE MORE PEOPLE IN POVERTY IN BRAZIL THAN MIDDLE CLASS OR UPPER MIDDLE CLASS!!!

YOU ARE IN THE MINORITY DICKWEED!!! YOUR REALITY IS NOT THE REALITY OF MOST IN YOUR COUNTRY CAPTAIN KANGAROO!

MISINFORMATION???

ENTÃO, debate these stats of "misinformation".

More people die in brazil every year from gunshots than the U.S.'s wars with afghanistan and Iraq COMBINED....STATISTICAL FACT!

Brazil has 40 MILLION people that are THREATENED BY HUNGER....STATISTICAL FACT!

16 MILLION brazilian children are NOT IN SCHOOL!....STATISTICAL FACT!


Brazil is a WORLD LEADER in political corruption....STATISTICAL FACT!

Brazil has one of the largest discrepancies in distrubution of wealth on the planet....STATISTICAL FACT!

There are more than 8 MILLION brazilian WOMEN that get paid to have sex, in other words, WHORES....STATISTICAL FACT!

Brazil is a world leader in the FALSIFICATION OF DOCUMENTS....STATISTICAL FACT!

90% of RAW SEWERAGE is dumped in rivers, lakes, and the ocean untreated....STATISTICAL FACT!

Brazil is a RACIST country...why would so many insist on be called "moreno" when they're BLACK! Look at your football god Ronaldo!! Ronaldo SAYS HE'S WHITE!!!! LMAO!!!! WHAT THE f**k IS THAT???? WHERE IS THAT ATTITUDE FROM???? WHY ISN'T HE PROUD OF HIS BLACK HERITAGE???? IT'S BECAUSE IT'S WHAT HE LEARNED.....IT'S NOT GOOD TO BE BLACK IN BRAZIL....NO ONE WANTS TO BE BLACK IN BRAZIL....."I'M MORENO, MORENO CLARA, MORENA ESCURO, ETC, ETC, ETC.....NO, YOU'RE NOT, YOUR f**kING BLACK, WAKE THE f**k UP....AND WHAT'S WRONG WITH BEING BLACK??

OMG, that in the beginning of the century!!!! A LAW???? WTF!!!

RACISM IS A CRIME IN BRAZIL!!! YOU GET ARRESTED YOU KNOW!!! The other day a guy was arrested because he had pictures of Hitler in his home.

Basically you are saying that everything I know, what I have seen in my life and see every day is a lie?

Are you sure you want to continue to say such crap? I AM COMING TO THE CONCLUSION THAT THIS SITE IS INTENDED TO DESTROY BRAZIL.

"Now between black women and white men. I get the impression that it is alright to sleep with the women as long as you are not seen out in public with them. Brazil is definitely not a racial paradise. On the surface it may appear to be but when you really sit back and observe racial relations it is obvious that racism does play a big part in Brazilian society."

No, I can't believe I read this! People walk freely, blacks and whites and date the way they want with the person they want. THIS WAS THE STUPIDEST PARAGRAPH I HAVE READ ON THE INTERNET.

We always believe we have seen everything in this site, all the insults, all the racist gringos, but this was the WORST of all.

If there were a prize for stupidity this guy would be a favorite.

Want to know? Get out of Bahia!

Surprise, NOT ALL BLACKS ARE POOR. Is this too much for your gringo head?

QUOTE:

"LOW INCOME HAS TO DO WITH LOW EDUCATION. Give those people:

- a decent education (so they don't use those horrible slangs);
- a decent job;
- a safe environment to live (favelas are the most horrible places, full of all bad things); "


Well give it to them Lula! Brazil doesn't invest in education..if you haven't noticed! It's not in the best interest of those in power numb-nutz!

It's much easier to manipulate and control the masses that are as dumb as barnyard animals than to educate them and get them thinking...."hey, why is this like this, and that like that", and start to question things as well as the system and demand change!!! Those in power would eventually lose their power! Don't you realize this Pedrinho??

From the quote you made above....THAT'S EXACTLY WHY HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS OF BRAZILIANS PER YEAR TRY AND "FUGIR" TO THE UNITED STATES!!! THEY WANT AN EDUCATION, THEY WANT A DECENT JOB WITH A DECENT WAGE, AND THEY WANT SECURITY!!!

Tell the truth, your some 14 year old punk from sao paulo whose daddy is pulling down 15K reais a month and think that's pretty much the reality for everyone else here huh?

You have lost it. You are changing subjects all the time and repeating yourself.

How old are you? 15? You don't behave like an adult.Adults would be more mature than you.

I tried to communicate with all of you about the truth of Brazil, but it seems the gringos in this forum are not intelligent enough for typing two lines without cursing, and for actually reading text, comprehend and generate an idea. All is HATE for you, and if you find something that goes against your HATE you just get mad.

I'll be around to clear the disinformation that the bunch of nazis do on this site.

I believe you need professional help. And the maintainers of this site have NO ETHICS, because the forums are not moderated so it makes them as nazi as you.

" From the quote you made above....THAT'S EXACTLY WHY HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS OF BRAZILIANS PER YEAR TRY AND "FUGIR" TO THE UNITED STATES!!! THEY WANT AN EDUCATION, THEY WANT A DECENT JOB WITH A DECENT WAGE, AND THEY WANT SECURITY!!!

Tell the truth, your some 14 year old punk from sao paulo whose daddy is pulling down 15K reais a month and think that's pretty much the reality for everyone else here huh?"

I'm a 28 year old man that worked hard and studied hard all my life to have a decente life, a decent job, and a decent home.

All those things I could find here. You are all kids probably, I don't think adults would waste so much time on the internet typing crap.

"Whoever posted this - I just had to come straight down here and mock you!!! This is about the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard. Upper-middle class Brazilians making $96,000 US before taxes?? LMFAO!!!! You must be lying about your country of origin. My wife is Brazilian and she is laughing her ass off too. "

Probably she was a poor loser that married you "to get rich" in the US.

This is not ridiculous, lower middle class is 2000 and above, upper middle class 17000.

Usually the ones that make R$ 17.000 are doctors, lawyers, some engineers, politicians, and entrepreneurs that are somewhat successful.

A lower middls class would be a person that just finished college and get his first job. That would be around R$ 2.000.

BTW, your "statistical fact"s have no date to back them up.

good for you! But it's not typical here in brazil! You do know what "typical" means don't you?

I'm a 40 year old man, and spent 8 years studying in college in the U.S., had over 750,000 dollars in assets and investments before I was 32 years old. Came to brazil around 10 years ago, and have MILLIONS of dollars invested here along with my friends/partners.

So you can think whatever you like, but I refuse to let people "slide" when I hear this fairytale s**t about brazil being a racial paradise and opportunity for all. I see on a weekly basis the THOUSANDS of homeless people on the side of the road here in northeast brazil that are living in huts made from sticks and trash bags, the pregnant mothers with baby in arm, it's a f**king shame, people here with money and the means to do something should be ashamed of themselves. Especially these politicians who do nothing more than benefit their own bank accounts while seeing their people literally starve to death, or die of non-access to potable water, or no access to suitable healthcare.....it's a f**king crime, and the 15-20% of brazilians that have an education and have the means to complain and make their voices here should do so....but they don't! They just think, "thank god it isn't me", and kiss their children goodnight and go to bed!

it's no use even answering your dribble anymore!!

quote:

"A lower middls class would be a person that just finished college and get his first job. That would be around R$ 2.000."

DICKHEAD, COME TO THE NORTHEAST OF YOUR COUNTRY....THOSE STRAIGHT OUT OF COLLEGE ARE FIGHTING FOR JOBS MAKING 700 REAIS A MONTH!!!!

MANY ARE ACCEPTING JOBS STRAIGHT OUT OF COLLEGE FOR 500 REAIS A MONTH.....THAT IS REALITY!

So your point is...?

I never said there weren't poverty in here, but it's not hell on earth as the Nazis around say. There's poverty in US too, and I don't talk about it to justify bashing, and I didn't bash US so far for it.

As a matter of fact, there's poverty IN A LOT OF PLACES, but I'm not bashing them either.

In comparison to US, THIS THE RACIAL PARADISE. People here are much different from americans that can't get away with racial classification and racial explanations for everything.

It's a pitty that you live here and still didn't learn anything. I suggest you to walk across the country a little so you see the different realities here, and you'll see a lot more miscigenation than you would ever see in US, even if US were 10 times bigger than it is today.

That doesn't change their acquisitive power. If they need to accept it, sorry, but they aren't middle class.

I'll attempt to leave you with this food for thought.

What is the percentage of people that you are considering lower-middle class, middle class, and upper middle class??

Since you're considering 17,000 reais per month UPPER MIDDLE CLASS, then brazil has LESS THAN 2% of their population that are considered UPPER MIDDLE CLASS!

Let's put it in some perspective...I just got back from in front of the TV, you know what I saw?? A commercial with a women saying, as if she were writing a letter to her son, "Oi filho, 'se lembra quando voce 'tava uma criança e queria jogo bola a noite mas não tinha luz....."

There is a LARGE portion of places in this country that doesn't f**king have ELECTRICITY YET!!!

There is a LARGE portion of this country that doesn't have access to potable water yet!!!

There is a LARGE portion of this country that doesn't have access to the proper nutrition yet!!!

In your attempt to defend your country your defending the dreadful conditions that exist for MILLIONS of your own people!!! Those without electricity, water, proper nutrition....BASIC NEEDS!!!

You are right about one thing...it's NOT hell on earth if you have MONEY, but if you're poor YOU ARE f**kED! There is little to no opportunity to advance your social situation, and very little to advance the social situation of your children!

Brazil is NOT the land of opportunity.....ITS THE LAND OF THE STATUS QUO!

middle class in general is close to 30% of population. The upper middle class must be 2 or 3%.

That data I got from Jornal da Cultura, from TV Cultura.

Guess what? I sit in front of my TV and saw an reportage on indians, and the indians had electricity!!! In the middle of the Amazon, using solar power!

I'm defending my country from nazis, that's all.

As I said poverty is EVERYWHERE in the planet. If you feel like a knight of the round table, fighting for "justice" (gringo justice) then you should pack your stuff and start walking through the WHOLE EARTH, denouncing the bad conditions all the peoples face!

You could start by your own home country BTW. I'm sure that not all poors were killed by Katrina. There must be lots of people without hope in there still for you to help.

One thing about my country my man, if you're poor in America it's because you're f**king lazy, plain and simple. Not everyone is going to be a millionaire, but did you know that 1 out of every 102 americans are! All you need is the DESIRE and ABILITY to work, and you will live at least a decent life, that's not the case here in brazil, so I don't have much empathy for the poor in the U.S., whether they be black, white, hispanic, japanese or chinese, I KNOW the U.S., my mother's family arrived there when it was a british colony!

Why do you consistantly bring up hurricane Katrina?? There is no doubt that the federal gov't. wasn't prepared for a disaster of that magnitude, and have responded dreadfully, but they are, and people are asking questions, and people will be held accountable for their actions or lack thereof. What does hurricane Katrina have to do with anything? I won't even get into hurricane katrina and the blacks that have been displaced there, it's an entirely different issue, and a topic all its own that thousands upon thousands of words could be written.

When you speak of poverty in brazil, or the "favelas", you minimize their importance, signicance, and existance! It's a HUGE percentage of your population that are living in these conditions! The favelas make these people "sem terra" look like they're living in the Beverly Hilton!

You come here and write as if it's "normal" for brazilians to make 2,000 reais and above, and only upper-middle class for someone to make 204,000 reais per year!!!! Dickweek, if someone in AMERICA, the richest country on the face of this planet, a country that has 33% of the WORLDS PIB, or GNP, if an American makes 100,000 dollars per year, which today is basically you're 17,000 reais per month, THEY ARE CONSIDERED UPPER CLASS IN AMERICA!!! But if they came to BRAZIL with all the poverty that exists here they'll drop in social-status!!!

Give us a break would ya.....the people that know their ass from a hole in the ground are laughing!

First:

Do you know Brazil? So you know that favelas are concentrated around big cities such as Sao Paulo and Rio de Janeiro because of the migration from people from other parts of the country?

You speak of favela as if 80% of Brazilian soil is covered with favelas. That's not true.

The physical space occupied by favelas is negligible is compared to the total space of Brazil territory. They are mainly concentrated around capitals.

Second:

17.000 a month is not enough to be considered rich. This data was got from TV Cultura, Jornal da Cultura, where they were talking about the middle class situation in Brazil.

The range used was 2000 - 17000.

Third:

There's poverty in US, but that is not publicized. I cite the Katrina because that was an example that you would like to hide. You have been sweeping the dust below the carpet for too long.

The people there were poor. You just excused yourself, to make it appear as if that was an "authorities mishandling", of course there was! But the problem is that most of those people were poor.

I already heard gringos excusing themselves saying that that region "is known for not being progressive". Are there other non-progressive areas in US?

Also, Is the influx of immigrants lowering the standard of living? What about those dish washers that share an one-room-apartment with six other men? I knew some of them.

I'm saying this not to bash US, but to show that you have problems to take care. So, good luck!

No one is saying anything about concentration of people/land dips**t, that has nothing to do with nothing. But population certainly does matter. If you have 10% of your people living in favelas that's signifcant, wouldn't you say?

And there are favelas all over this country, even in relatively small cities, with populations of 200,000 or less, there are favelas. Would you once again diminish the importance and existance of the favelas in Salvador, Recife, Maceio, Fortaleza, and the list goes on and on.

So with 17,000 reais per month you would be considered upper-class in america, the richest country on the planet, but not in brazil...a third world country?...interesting indeed!

As far as immigrants lowering the standard of living, the vasts numbers of illegals, imo, are lowering the standard of living. We have TERRIBLE laws in the U.S. that afford healthcare, education, and even taxpayers dollars to ILLEGALS in the U.S. People that don't have the f**king right to be there, yet american taxpayers are paying for services afforded them! It's horses**t and its wrong, plain and simple! We need to start sending these illegal criminals back home, matter of fact there is a bill trying to be passed in Arizona at this moment that will make it a FELONY to have an illegal status in the U.S. I hope they do it, and I hope they do it in the rest of the U.S. Sorry if this sounds crude, but I hope soon the Minutemen organization, groups of private american citizens patrolling our borders that are literally being over-run with illegals start sending some home in wooden boxes! These people are causing damage to america, they have no respect for the law, and they need to start throwing the americans that are employing these illegals in prison! Once people know that they run the risk of getting a bullet through the head if trying to run across the border, maybe they'll think twice.

I've never stated that the U.S. doesn't have problems, all countries do, especially large countries, and the U.S. is larger than brazil you know, and has 30+% more people as well, and that's LEGAL citizens, we have an estimated 20 MILLION illegals!

But the problems that face brazil, and the problems that face the U.S. couldn't be more different. In Brazil you have major problems of BASIC NEEDS, you don't have MAJOR problems of basic needs in the U.S.

No, the favelas are concentrated around capitals mostly, and other bigger populated areas, because the people from other parts of the country come in search for jobs and better opportunities.

You should start sending US employers in wooden boxes instead. People don't go there to starve, they go because they know the will have jobs.The people that use them are the guilty ones.

This is exploitation. They pay 1/4 or less of what they would pay to an american worker. Capitalism is beautiful, isn't it?

There it is, a new cause for the knight of the round table to fight for.

there it is...

the brazilian "desculpa", the brazilian isn't to blame for going to the U.S. illegally, it's the american that employs him that is to blame!

Well, if the ILLEGAL immigrant wasn't there, there wouldn't be any to employ now would there numb-nutz?

Same thing for drugs, the brazilian desculpa...

"well, if so many americans weren't drug addicts they wouldn't send cocaine there".

Riddle me this mister green jeans, which do you think arrived first in america, cocaine, or the cocaine addict?

Answer: COCAINE, cocaine isn't grown in the U.S., it's grown in columbia and Peru and Bolivia, and sent to the U.S.

Why? Because the U.S. is the richest, largest, market in the world! So whatever product you have, whether it be steel, tires, cocaine, or illegal human beings, the "target" is America! When you can sell a "product" in ONE country that accounts for 33% of the worlds wealth, well, obviously, that's where you focus your efforts!

will be to start a company in texas, arizona and california, hiring any and all illegals that apply....when I get several thousand, I'll call the INS!

quote:

"You should start sending US employers in wooden boxes instead"

Sounds good to me, let's start putting a bullet in the heads of the pieces of s**t americans employing these criminals, and the 20 million illegal criminals there today. As well as the hundreds of thousands pouring in monthly!!!

I'm all for it!

You would have to put a bullet in the head of just about every farmer, restaurant owner, ect. in the entire country. Illegal immigration sucks, but we do need to have these low wage workers somehow, it would be great if we could to it in a more orderly fashion.

debate heating up in the Senate! -article from 40 minutes ago.

"Among the election-year proposals that President Bush and members of Congress are considering:

_Erecting a fence on the Mexico border to deter illegal immigration.

_Treating people who sneak across the border as felons to be deported.

_Allowing foreigners to stay in the country legally as custodians, dish washers, construction workers and other low-paid employees.

_Allowing those working in the U.S. a path to citizenship.

_Requiring them to get in line behind everyone else back in their home countries who want to become Americans."


"Bush is going to Mexico this week for a meeting with the leaders of Mexico and Canada. Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice said Sunday it's important that Mexico "recognize the importance of defense of the borders and of American laws."

"Senate Majority Leader Bill Frist, R-Tenn., has said that whether or not a bill gets out of the Judiciary Committee, he is opening two weeks of debate on the issue Tuesday. He has offered a plan that would tighten borders, add Border Patrol agents and punish employers who hire illegal immigrants because he says the most important concern is improving national security in an age of terrorism"


Critics like Rep. Tom Tancredo, R-Colo., say that would give amnesty to people who have broken the law by entering the country without permission.

"It's a slap in the face to every single person who has done it the right way, and to everybody who's waiting out there to do it the right way," Tancredo said. "It's bad policy. And it's also, I think, for the Republican Party especially, bad policy."


Hear, hear for Tom Tancredo!! It's good to know we have representatives that actually represent the sentiments of large percentages of our own people! The american people are fed-up, and it's way overdue. Many attempt and justify the presence of illegals by saying they provide a service that americans aren't willing to do therfore are beneficial to the american economy. There have already been numerous studies on this very issue. And the benefits provided by illegals DOES NOT OUTWEIGH the costs caused by the presence of them. They're have dramatic detrimental effects on our educational and healthcare systems, not to mention other social systems where illegals actually receive money from the american gov't.!

"The House passed a bill last year that increases penalties for illegal immigration activities, requires employers to verify the legal status of their employees and provides $2.2 billion for a 700-mile fence across the border."


They also need to include in the bill making it a FELONY for the americans that employ these illegals! We're getting there, it won't be long!

i also think it wont be long , but if you expect things to get better you must know something i dont.
put tariffs on chinas imports, deport all immigrants, and you will find that you have just replaced these problems for the others.

it will cause other problems, but problems that can be resolved legally. And not the deportation of all immigrants, only ILLEGAL ones! We then can have a legitimate process of letting people into america legally. This will not only be good for the U.S., but will be good for the immigrant, since he won't have to worry about being taken advantage of because of his immigration status.

America can then increase the numbers of immigrants allowed into the country, at least for the next 10 years or so.

These farm owners and others that hire illegals are going to have to face the fact that their bottom line is going to be affected, they're going to make less, it's not as if they're poor. Americans have to be ready for the challenges this type of legislation will bring. Americans have never been afraid of hard work, look at the mining industry, steel industry, and many others in the U.S. Those people do difficult and dangerous jobs, but they get compensated, they have unions. This ideology of these "employers" that "hey, the illegals are exploiting us, so we'll exploit them", has to change, and it will if their actions become felonies with punishment of imprisonment!

well, all i can say is good luck.
i just dont like when people start talking about putting bullets through somebody for trying to escape poverty through going to work at the bottom of the chain.

but, the illegal immigrant situation is beyond the point of ridiculous. Our gov't. is finally aware that the american people have had enough. The entire situation with illegal immigration is extremely dangerous, to say the least. Reports are not uncommon here in brazil where groups of people that pay 10K U.S. to be smuggled over the mexico-texas border never even make it there, or the "coyotes" in mexico rape and even murder their "clients". Our pourous borders allow for this situation to exist. Here we are, the american gov't. and military in 2 wars on the other side of the globe in the name of terrorism and protecting our country, and our own borders are so pourous that in many areas you can just walk right through. Doesn't make much sense now does it? Spending TRILLIONS of dollars in the name of terrorism for 2 wars, passing legislation in the patriot act that is unconstitutional, but in the name of protecting us from terrorist attacks, and we don't even bother to secure our borders?

Both Mexico and Brazil need to step it up, with the threat of economic sanctions if they don't, in the pursuance and imprisonment of these coyote companies. I mean for god's sake, there are 800+ in goverador do valadares alone! And the federal police know they exist, if they wanted to put them in jail they would have NO PROBLEMS in catching them....but they don't.

Wonder why that is?? Could it be that the 3rd largest economy here in brazil, and I'm certain in the the top 5 in Mexico, is people sending money back to their prospective countries and the number 1 origin of this money is the U.S. These illegals aren't "investing" in america, they're exploiting it, every single extra dollar is sent back home to their families. That's not how america was built, the immigrants hundreds of years ago went there to start a "new life", and make america their home. That's not the case with a huge percentage of the illegals there today.

Did you know that there is an area on the border of Argentina, Paraguay, and Brazil called "Ciudad del Este"? This area has the largest number of muslims outside of the middle east. That it is a KNOWN area for activities from groups such as Hezbollah and Osama bin Laden was there in the early 90's. It is believed that the bombing of the Israeli embassy in the early 90's was hezbollah stationed in Ciudad del Este. It is a known haven for drug trafficking, arms smuggling, counterfeiting, and many other illegal activities.

If we have another 9-11, you can bet that it's a damn good chance it will be more devasting than before, possibly with a nuclear device, and very probable they'll enter the U.S. through our pourous borders illegally.

And the government here in brazil was appalled and insulted that the U.S. would make them conform to our new security procedures of identification when entering the country, as was in place for over 140 countries and today is in force for ALL foreign visitors. Calling it " "absolutely brutal, threatening to human rights, violating human dignity, xenophobic and worthy of the worst horrors committed by the Nazis."

A little over the top, wouldn't you say? Especially when one is informed about the activities that are taking place right on their borders, and the fact that the brazilian passport is one of the easiest in the world to duplicate, not to mention brazil is a world leader in the falsification of documents! Not to mention the fact that the judge that made this very statement is from a state that perpetrates the largest number of "slave laborers" in this country! And brazil has an estimated one million illegals in the U.S., second only to Mexico.

It's time to stop f**king around with these people, and I'm not only talking about the illegals, but the americans that are employing them as well.

Read this!

http://meib.org/articles/0201_l2.htm

Agents from the department of Homeland Security are arriving here in Brazil in the next 2 months, and will be stationed in this very region!!

Shame that the brazilian authorities can't handle this themselves, as their certainly have the ability to do so. But it's a dangerous situation, and they khnow that, so let's let the americans come in and do it.

again, good luck.

"Did you know that there is an area on the border of Argentina, Paraguay, and Brazil called "Ciudad del Este"? This area has the largest number of muslims outside of the middle east. That it is a KNOWN area for activities from groups such as Hezbollah and Osama bin Laden was there in the early 90's. It is believed that the bombing of the Israeli embassy in the early 90's was hezbollah stationed in Ciudad del Este. It is a known haven for drug trafficking, arms smuggling, counterfeiting, and many other illegal activities."

There's no limits for idiocy in this forum.

This is known to who? To you? How? Do you have any evidence?

The only evidence for this people is that the place is full of muslim immigrants.

Do US intelligence has evidence on it? Hahahahahahhaha The same way they had on WMD on Iraq?

That must be the most dumb "intelligence" on earth, or just spread lie deliberately to follow some agenda.

Thank god I live in a country where people are not persecuted for having this or that religion.

"A little over the top, wouldn't you say? Especially when one is informed about the activities that are taking place right on their borders, and the fact that the brazilian passport is one of the easiest in the world to duplicate, not to mention brazil is a world leader in the falsification of documents! Not to mention the fact that the judge that made this very statement is from a state that perpetrates the largest number of "slave laborers" in this country! And brazil has an estimated one million illegals in the U.S., second only to Mexico. "

You are lying. I come to the conclusion that you have never been in Brazil, you must be an man employed by some US company to make bad marketing about Brazil, on behalf on some interested party.

That would explain your obstinate goal of "telling the truth" and the several ridiculous claims one after the other, specially of a woman with half million in assets wanting to marry you to go to US.

I believe you are following a script of things to tell about Brazil.

The "slave laborers" is the most ridiculous one I have ever heard.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Astroturfing

"Astroturfing techniques usually consist of a few people discreetly posing as mass numbers of activists advocating a specific cause. Supporters or employees will manipulate the degree of interest through letters to the editor, e-mails, blog posts, crossposts, trackbacks, etc. They are instructed on what to say, how to say it, where to send it, and how to make it appear that their indignation, appreciation, joy, or hate is entirely spontaneous and independent; thus being "real" emotions and concerns rather than the product of an orchestrated campaign. Local newspapers are often victims of astroturfing, by publishing letters that are identical to letters other newspapers have received."

This is what is all about.

that ignorance knows no bounds!!

At least I'm willing to accept and acknowledge the pitfalls that exist in my country!

But you keep it up with your denial, because it's people exactly like you that WILL NEVER allow brazil to step forward and become any type of world power. You negate the very reports and statistics that THE BRAZILIAN GOVERNMENT PROVIDES!!!

As far as Iguazu Falls and Ciudad del Este, it was and is the Argentinian goverment that has stated from their investigations that the responsible party is Hezbollah in that region!

DO YOU KNOW HOW TO READ?? Read the reports idiot, do some research, this isn't american propoganda, it's reports FROM BRAZIL, ARGENTINA, AND PARAGUAY!!

Now why do you think that Brazil would allow agents from Homeland Security in the U.S. come to brazil within the next 2 months and be stationed in this very region???

The brazilian government is WELL AWARE of this situation....

QUOTE:

"Brazil has also implemented important security measures since the September 11 attacks, though officials have been careful to state that these measures target potential Al-Qa'ida activities in the region, NOT HEZBOLLAH. According to the BRAZILIAN MINISTER OF JUSTICE, Jose Gregori, an anti-terrorist squad was deployed near Iguazu Falls in the Triple Frontier to "ensure that Islamic radicals have not used Brazilian territory to seek shelter." However, most Brazilian officials have discarded the possibility that Brazilian citizens of Arab descent have been involved in terrorist activity and TEND TO POINT FINGERS (love that one, how brazilian!) at Paraguay.

Walter Maierovitch, EX-SECRETARY of the BRAZILIAN anti-drug department and an expert in money-laundering and international mafias, recently said that Paraguay does not appear "to have the means of controlling transnational organizations like the mafia and terrorism"AND EVEN SUGGESTED that BIN LADEN intended to transfer his base of operations to Paraguay after Hezbollah "lost its international strength."

LIES HUH??? YOU'RE REALLY A STUPID PERSON, NO, IGNORANT!

Keep those blinders on pal, we're counting on you!!! Recruit as many blind-idiots as you can, you'll ensure that Brazil never gets out of the poverty-ridden situation that it's in!

go through this??

You shoot yourself in the ass denying slave labor exists in brazil!!! It's a KNOWN FACT!

quote:

"The "slave laborers" is the most ridiculous one I have ever heard."

Read bozo, if you can read, or get mommy to read it to you:

http://www.brazzilmag.com/content/view/5741/53/

"One thing about my country my man, if you're poor in America it's because you're f**king lazy, plain and simple".

For someone who has all the facts about Brazil, you sound VERY naive about America. There are 37 million poor Americans. They do the work that no one is willing to do and they are invisible as the favelados. It takes money to make money, where would they get the investment money? Especially when the cost of living here is so high? There is also a lot of competition here. 1 million immigrants come a year, most of them naive too, unless they are escaping violence. It's probably harder to make money here because of the competition. Why would they want to be poor AND on top of that be hated as lazy? The barefoot Appalachian hitchhiker is lazy? The coal miner? The Vietnam Veteran?

"if an American makes 100,000 dollars per year, which today is basically you're 17,000 reais per month, THEY CONSIDERED UPPER CLASS IN AMERICA!!!"

No an American making 100,000 per year is considered Upper Middle Class. As in a doctor, lawyer, or entrepreneur. Upper Class is a celebrity (Lower Upper Class or Nouveau Riche) and heir to a well known industry (Upper Upper Class or Old Money).

Also if you're just quick to deride illegal immigrants, what do you expect of people in those countries who ignore their slumdwellers?

That proves nothing! There isn't a single piece of evidence assuring there're wrong things there.

And your link about brazzilmag on slave labor is laughable. How about getting some "evidence" on some Nazi journal about the differences of races? An idiot like you would consider that "trustworthy" information.

ANYONE READING THIS, THIS GUY IS MAKING ASTROTURFING. READ THE LINK I POSTED IN THE OTHER POST TO UNDERSTAND WHAT IT IS. HE IS PROBABLY BEING PAID BY SOMEONE TO DO THIS.

Upper class is a celebrity???? You're talking about celebrity status, we're talking about income social class!

a SIX FIGURE income is considered UPPER CLASS my friend!

quote:

"The coal miner?"

Are you saying that coal miners are poor??? What an uninformed idiot you are!! I'm from a family with a history of coal miners!! Do you know that the majority of coal miners make in excess of $40,000 per year! Do you know that if your just the "boss" in a mine you make anywhere from 80,000 to 130,000 dollars per year!!

You don't know jack-s**t about america.

And about those 37 million poor...well there are 20 million illegals, starting to make sense?

And if you want to compare the poor of countries like brazil, india, guatemala, to the poor in the U.S., well, it's a COMPLETELY DIFFERENT REALITY MY FRIEND!

Most poor in the states have better living conditions that many lower-middle class or even middle class citizens in third world countries, like brazil!

Well people, anyone who doubts anything I've said here only has to do his own research!

DO YOU WANT THE REPORTS FROM THE UNITED NATIONS ON SLAVE LABOR IN BRAZIL!!!

Google it, you'll find them!! I guess they're lying huh?

If anyone is "astroturfing" here, it's you my friend. Denying the reality that exists here.

Do you think that GLOBO makes FALSE and NEGATIVE reports about its own people and their situations??? Obviously you do! Go to GLOBO, go to Folha de Sao Paulo Newspaper....I guess they're all lying huh??? They're in my scheme of "astroturfing", LMAO!

What a bafoon you are!

All coal miners, eh? And living the American Dream, no less. Meanwhile, in Realityville, USA:

"One of eight children born to Ted Webb (Levon Helm), a coal miner raising a family despite GRINDING POVERTY in Butcher Hollow, KY, Loretta married Dolittle "Mooney" Lynn (Tommy Lee Jones) when she was only 13 years old."

None of which includes sheer laziness, take note:
"There are numerous perceived direct and indirect causes of poverty in the United States. They include:

Unfavorable economic conditions
Mental illness
Substance abuse
Poor education
Institutional racism: The gross disparities among impoverished people in the United States along racial lines have led many to believe that historic and/or ongoing institutional racism is responsible for much of the poverty in the United States today.
Genetic Disadvantages
Limited job opportunities appear to exist for significant subgroups of some races and ethnic groups. This is reflected by the low-income nature of large sections of the economy, as divided along racial/ethnic lines: 21 % of all children in the United States live in poverty, but 46 % of African American children and 40 % of Latino children live in poverty. (Center for the Future of Children, The Future of Children. Vo. 7, No 2, 1997). "

100,000 is Upper Class? Well then I guess an illegal immigrant is a middle American then.

Warnerian Economic Model:
"Upper-upper class. "Old money." People who have been born into and raised with wealth.
Lower-upper class. "New money." Individuals who have become rich within their own lifetimes.
Upper-middle class. High-salaried professionals (i.e., doctors, lawyers, corporate executives).
True-middle class. Professional with salaries and educational attainment higher than those found among lower-middle class workers (i.e.. professors, managerial office workers, architects) "

A Professor makes about 100,000. A doctor makes about 250,000. True middle class, upper middle class.

Also 20 million illegals?? Hello, if they're illegal they're not documented as part of the 37 million recorded poor, and would not be an American concern as far as the "war on poverty".

http://meib.org/articles/0201_l2.htm

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=44636

quote:

In March, FBI Director Robert Mueller told a congressional panel that illegal aliens from countries with ties to al-Qaida have crossed into the U.S. from Mexico using false identities.

Mueller said one route takes Middle Easterners to Brazil, where they assume false identities before entering Mexico and then crossing into the U.S. Bush administration officials have previously said al-Qaida could try to infiltrate the United States through the Mexican border.

Hezbollah and the terrorist Islamic Resistance Movement (Hamas) are operating in the tri-border region of Paraguay, Argentina and Brazil. The suspected activities of these groups include counterfeiting U.S. currency and drug smuggling, with the area in which they function described as a "haven for Islamic extremists" by the administrator of the Drug Enforcement Administration, Asa Hutchinson, in testimony before the House International Relations Committee."


Your urls about brazilian slave labor from NGO's like amnesty international, and the United Nations!


http://web.amnesty.org/report2005/bra-summary-eng

http://www.antislavery.org/archive/submission/submission2005-brazil.htm

And answer this question for us Ray Charles...

Why is there a brazilian organization called CONATRAE!!!

It's the National Commission for the Eradication of Slave Labour!! Now why would they need such a commission if slave labor doesn't exist??

QUOTE:

"The Government also set up the National Commission for the Eradication of Slave Labour (CONATRAE) which is a permanent forum bringing together different government departments, the federal police and NGOs to facilitate co-operation between these bodies and to discuss practical solutions to the problem of slave labour. On 11 March 2003, President Lula da Silva launched the National Plan for the Eradication of Slavery. "

ON THE 11TH OF MARCH 2003 LULA LAUNCHED THE NATIONAL PLAN FOR THE ERADICATION OF SLAVE LABOR????

JESUS CHRIST, 'BOUT TIME WOULDN'T YOU SAY?? Brazil only outlawed slavery 100+ years ago, but just getting around in forming an organization to actually eradicate it!!

Do the searches, you'll find more than enough evidence to find the statements I made are indeed factual!










"

if you think that 250,000 dollars a year is upper middle class you don't know what the f**k your talking about...ANY and ALL americans know that 250,000 dollars is UPPER CLASS!

You mention lawyers, doctors, corporate executives!!! So, my buddy's old man, the head of radiology of a hospital, pulling down 750,000/year, is upper middle class?

The corporate execustives that have million dollar salaries?? Upper middle class??

Once again, you can try and paint the U.S. as having masses of poor, only shows your ignorance and bias! That's why millions every month are fleeing there right? To be poor? Like where they're from?

Poor in america and poor in brazil are TWO different realities....any human being that has ever been to america and brazil knows that much!

You are basically trying to paint Brazil as if it had slaves at every corner, similiarly to illegals in US, and this is a country covered with favelas, and that in the south there are terrorists.



As I said previouly all countries have their own problems, and you seem very decided to deny any problem in US, but USING HALF TRUTHS TO PROMOTE YOUR CAMPAIGN IS SIMPLY LIE.

ASTROTURFING. AN ADULT WOULDN'T WASTE THIS MUCH TIME ON THE INTERNET WRITING CRAP SO OBSTINATELY.

I'm sure you are being paid to write those things.

they speak for themselves. I gave you the Warnerian Economic model and you try to challenge it by talking about one of your buddy's dads.

Yes there are 37 million people living below the threshold of poverty here in the US. Who do you think lives in Appalachia, the Ozarks, Trailer Parks, Reservations, on Welfare, in Ghettos, in alleys, on the streets, in prison? Rugged Outdoorsmen? That's assuming any of these people are even part of the 37 million.

Some of those fleeing are incredibly naive. I have received letters from immigrants over the years telling me that they want to send me poetry to "have published" and things of that nature, as if you can just "have stuff published" at the drop of a hat, when it takes years of sweat to even have something considered for publishing. Read the topic of the article. The guy left Brazil and became an LA tour bus driver. As if he would become a movie star from that!
Obviously others of them are desperate, and yes being as it is a developed country they will have a better standard of living, but they will still struggle and be assumed lazy.

quote:

"You are basically trying to paint Brazil as if it had slaves at every corner, similiarly to illegals in US"

What an idiot!! I'm not trying to paint brazil as if it has slaves at every corner!! I'm only saying that IT EXISTS!!! YOU ARE SAYING AND HAVE SAID THAT IT DOESNT EXIST!!!

YOU ARE A f**kING LIAR!!

READ THE REPORTS FROM AMNESTY INTERNATIONAL, THE UNITED NATIONS, AND FROM YOUR OWN COUNTRY'S GOVERNMENT....BRAZIL!

As far as upper middle class, upper class definitions in AMERICA...

"A net worth, what a person's total material assets are worth, minus their debt. MOST ECONOMISTS DEFINE "middle-class" citizens in AMERICA as those with net worths of between $25,000 (low middle class) to $250,000. Those with net worths between $250,000 and $500,000 typically are categorized as UPPER MIDDLE CLASS "

Now that's NET WORTH, nearly every american that has owned a home for at least 10 years, and is not in the LOWER CLASS, which only accounts for 20% of americans, has 250,000 dollars worth of capital in his NET WORTH! Equity in his home, 401K, any other investments. And the AVERAGE doctor in the U.S., making 250,000 dollars per year, within 5 years he has A MINIMUM OF 500,000 dollars in NET WORTH!

Now, you want to talk about the poor?? And how are we defining poor shnitznits??

Because the DEFINITION OF POOR IN AMERICA AND THE REST OF THE WORLD ARE NOT THE SAME!!

LET'S TALK, AND SHOW REAL STATISTICS!

YOU CAN GO TO THIS URL FOR MORE!

http://www.heritage.org/Research/Welfare/bg1713.cfm

1."For most Americans, the word "poverty" suggests destitution: an inability to provide a family with nutritious food, clothing, and reasonable shelter. But only a small number of the 35 million persons classified as "poor" by the Census Bureau fit that description."

2.The following are FACTS about persons defined as "poor" by the Census Bureau, taken from VARIOUS GOVERNMENT REPORTS:

A)FOURTY-SIX percent of all poor households actually OWN THEIR OWN HOMES. The average home owned by persons classified as poor by the Census Bureau is a THREE BEDROOM HOUSE WITH ONE AND A HALF BATHS, a garage, and a porch or patio.

B)Seventy-six percent of poor households have air conditioning. By contrast, 30 years ago, only 36 percent of the entire U.S. population enjoyed air conditioning.

C)Only 6 percent of poor households are overcrowded. More than two-thirds have more than two rooms per person.


D)The average poor American has MORE living space than the AVERAGE individual living in PARIS, LONDON, VIENNA, ATHENS, and other cities throughout Europe. (These comparisons are to the AVERAGE citizens in foreign countries, not to those classified as POOR.!)

E)Nearly three-quarters of poor households own a car; 30 percent own two or more cars!

F)Ninety-seven percent of poor households have a color television; over half own two or more color televisions.
Seventy-eight percent have a VCR or DVD player; 62 percent have cable or satellite TV reception.


G)Seventy-three percent own microwave ovens, more than half have a stereo, and a third have an automatic dishwasher.


Sounds similiar to the poor in brazil eh Frankel? As I stated...two different realities, TWO DIFFERENT DEFINITIONS OF POOR!

Let's go on to understand some MORE about the POOR in AMERICA!

As a group, America's poor are far from being chronically undernourished. The average consumption of protein, vitamins, and minerals is virtually THE SAME for poor and middle-class children and, in most cases, is well above recommended norms. Poor children actually consume more meat than do higher-income children and have average protein intakes 100 percent above recommended levels. Most poor children today are, in fact SUPERNOURISHED and grow up to be, on average, one inch taller and 10 pounds heavier that the GIs who stormed the beaches of Normandy in World War II!

"Overall, the typical American defined as poor by the government has a car, air conditioning, a refrigerator, a stove, a clothes washer and dryer, and a microwave. He has two color televisions, cable or satellite TV reception, a VCR or DVD player, and a stereo. He is able to obtain medical care. His home is in good repair and is not overcrowded. By his own report, his family is not hungry and he had sufficient funds in the past year to meet his family's essential needs. While this individual's life is not opulent, it is equally far from the popular images of dire poverty conveyed by the press, liberal activists, and politicians."

"For most Americans, the word "poverty" suggests destitution: an inability to provide a family with nutritious food, clothing, and reasonable shelter"

"But if poverty means lacking nutritious food, adequate warm housing, and clothing for a family, relatively few of the 35 million people identified as being "in poverty" by the Census Bureau could be characterized as poor. While material hardship does exist in the United States, it is quite restricted in scope and severity. The average "poor" person, as defined by the government, has a living standard far higher than the public imagines."

CONCLUSION:

The living conditions of persons defined as poor by the government bear little resemblance to notions of "poverty" held by the general public. If poverty is defined as lacking adequate nutritious food for one's family, a reasonably warm and dry apartment to live in, or a car with which to get to work when one is needed, then THERE ARE RELATIVELY FEW POOR PERSONS REMAING in the United States. Real material hardship does occur, but it is limited in scope and severity.

The typical American defined as "poor" by the government has a CAR, AIR CONDITIONING, a REFRIGERATOR, a STOVE, a CLOTHES WASHER AND DRYER, and a MICROWAVE. He has TWO COLOR TELEVISIONS, CABLE OR SATELLITE TV reception, a VCR or DVD player, and a STEREO. He is able to obtain medical care. His home is in good repair and is not overcrowded. By his own report, his family is not hungry and he had sufficient funds in the past year to meet his family's essential needs. While this individual's life is not opulent, it is equally far from the popular images of dire poverty conveyed by the press, liberal activists, and politicians.



NOW, the characteristics for the POOR in AMERICA and the POOR in BRAZIL are the same eh doutor???

you're obviously an idiot for even trying to attempt and make a comparison about the situation of peoples realities in the U.S. and here in Brazil. Does the POOR in brazil own their own homes? That have a median value of 87,000 dollars nonetheless! Do they have cars? Televisions? Telephones? DVD's? VCR's? I'm seriously LMAO at your naivity and stupidity!

The poor in brazil, many have to walk kilometers to get water that won't make them sick! 40 MILLION BRAZILIANS are THREATENED BY HUNGER according to Fome Zero's website! Many live in drug-controlled gang areas and more people die from gunshots every year than in the U.S.'s war with afghanistan and Iraq COMBINED!

http://www.fomezero.gov.br/


Wake the f**k up princess!

Obviously the poor have a lower standard of living in Brazil, but there at 37 million Americans living BELOW the threshold of poverty. You are defining POOR, which is WITHIN the threshold of poverty. Back to drawing board.

Your average American does not know what the hell you mean by Net Worth, that I guarantee you.

If you are so frustrated with Brazil then why are you living there. It doesn't sound like humanitarian reasons, so I don't know why you live there. In fact you have a business. If America is so great why not start a business in the US?

And if women are so desperate to leave as to try to pay you to marry you, why would you have your wife living there?

quote:

"Who do you think lives in Appalachia, the Ozarks, Trailer Parks, Reservations, on Welfare, in Ghettos, in alleys, on the streets, in prison? Rugged Outdoorsmen? That's assuming any of these people are even part of the 37 million"

LOL...oh, they're definitely part of the 37 million, and obviously have tv's, cars, homes, cable tv, microwaves and the like according to NUMEROUS gov't. reports.

I'm from the Appalachian region homer, and although it is a POOR region FOR THE UNITED STATES, it is NOTHING compared to the POOR here in BRAZIL!!! Would you not agree? Are you seriously going to attempt and equivalate the poor in 3rd world countries to the poor in the United States?? The richest country on this planet? With a median gross income of 35,000 dollars per year??? And Brazil that has a minimum salary of 1,500 dollar PER YEAR!!!

And people in PRISON??? LOL...you don't count statistics on economy on prisoners ass-wipe!! And in case you didnt know, the average cost that a prisoner makes for the american taxpayer is 35,000 dollars per year per prisoner!!!

People in PRISON in the U.S. are MUCH better off than the POOR in brazil!!! At least they get 3 squares a day, and don't have to live in conditions that are life-threatening!!! Now debate those apples!

very interesting.
off course being poor in usa is not close to being poor in brazil.
however since 46 % of poor owns their household arent they middle class ?

"Your average American does not know what the hell you mean by Net Worth, that I guarantee you."

Really Melvin?? Hate to inform you of this but since the mid 1970's 70% of ALL americans have a UNIVERSITY EDUCATION, OR AT LEAST ATTENDED UNIVERSITY.....YOU THINK THEY DON'T KNOW THE MEANING OF "NET WORTH!"?

ONCE AGAIN, YOU SAY BELOW THE POVERTY THRESHOLD!!! WHAT IS THE POVERTY THRESHOLD FOR AN AMERICAN?

WOULD YOU SAY ITS THE SAME FOR A BRAZILIAN, OR ANY OTHER 3RD WORLD COUNTRY?

THESE PEOPLE OWN THEIR HOMES, HAVE CARS, TV'S, ELECTRONIC APPLIANCES!!!!

THEIR NOT CARRYING WATER ON THEIR HEADS WALKING DOWN 1-75 TO WASH THEIR FRICK'IN CLOTHES!

OF THE POOR IN AMERICA OWN A 3 BEDROOM HOME WITH 1.5 BATHS!!!!

AND OF COURSE, AIR-CONDITIONING AND HOT WATER....HOT WATER IS NOT "NORMAL" HERE IN BRAZIL!

THAT ABOUT SUMS IT UP!

that is not poor at all really.

and now even lula has joined debate. look out for some great comments there.

If you don't like my countrie, pleased to be leaving now, amigo. obrigados

I'm an American who is living in Buenos Aires and I think I would like to weigh in on the state of the US economy too.

Firstly the US economy is on a crash course with complete insolvency. The dollar is going to be worth less and less as we have effectively created a fiat currency that will be fit to wipe your ass with in the coming decade – or less. I believe America had a good think going at one point in time but pure capitalism is proving to be a failure, albeit not as great a failure as pure socialism/communism.

We have a national debt that is financed, incredulously, by the rest of the world including China, South Korea, Japan and others. The only reason that China doesn't pull the plug on the dollar is because they are holding so much in reserve that dumping it and adopting another (fiat) currency like the Euro, they threaten to send their own booming economy into a deep, unrecoverable recession. They are caught between a rock and a hard place. So they continue to grudgingly buy into the myth of the ever-booming American economy. For the first time since the Great Depression Americans actually spent more than they earned last year!! That marks the turning point in American capitalism as far as I am concerned.

Here are the facts. America continues to borrow like it does because it has no intention of ever paying that money back. What will become of the world when its most vaunted currency completely collapses? The whole global economy will collapse along with it and the only method that will remain by which to procure what one needs will be through force. This is exactly what Bushco is doing right now – deliberately attempting to wastebasket the dollar in order to precipitate a global economic meltdown. It’s much easier to invade countries that are malnourished and poorly educated now isn’t it? Bu$hco is spending 6 billion a week to fight the “war” in Iraq and even then our troops don’t have adequate armor or provisions. Meanwhile they can justify further massive weapons development expenditures because we are at war.

When all is said and done our up to now bruised and battered military will be left mostly intact but with the latest generation of killer Drone and Hypersonic, satellite launched missiles tested and ready to fight our coming wars, not on the ground but from a bunker in Langley. We are setting the stage for a petro-grab (as well as water and arable land) that will make our previous forays look like a walk in the park. It's amazing that we can spend a trillion dollars on a war, which might have otherwise made social security solvent for the next 75 years. Has that occurred to any Americans? We debate and scratch our heads as to where to come up with the money for SS and Medicaid but when we need to invade an oil-rich foreign country it is appropriated as if from thin air. Our primary and secondary schools are a joke and our universities exist at the behest of the US government if only to assist in creating hypersonic weapons and new, ingenious ways to spy on its citizenry. I am far from convinced that $35,000 salaries or our $12 trillion GDP mean a thing as long as the average American idio-sumer continues to bury his head in the sand (or People, US and Entertainment Weekly magazine) in regards to human rights, the environment and terrorism (which will only worsen) opting instead to buy Kate Spade bags and jerk off over the exploits of Brad Pitt and Angelina Jolie. Americans are generally brain-dead but don’t get me wrong so are most Brits, Belgians and Brazilians for that matter. Ours is the beaten generation. We are fed a steady diet of lies and propaganda that we are buying hook, line and sinker. Meanwhile the Bus$hcos and Blair Inc’s will continue f**king us right up until the end. The US economy is not the powerhouse it is made out to be and unfortunately all other economies are equally fragile but with one exception: No other country is assembling a death machine that will ultimately rival the US. Be afraid!

i am afraid you are correct .
and to brazilian above, i like your country ,just generally dont like politicians, lula included.

I agree; Lula is a canker sore

shouldn't you be busy stealing from someone's pension fund or from one of your gov't. programs such as Fome Zero, Agua para Todos, or Luz para Todos??

And by the responses on this board I have to congratulate you with your smash success with your secret gov't. program "estupidez para todos"!

You are not normal. You wasted a lot of time to type all that stuff. Do you work or spend all your time in front of the computer? How old are you? Have you actually been to Brazil?

I think you are not as old as you say you are, your behavior is not pondered, and I think you have a script of things to say, since you much quickly got all those "statistics" to lie about my country.

I never said there wasn't poverty here, but I will say once again, every country has its own problems, including the US, so why don't you spend your energy trying to fix your country?

Brazil is not the hell you are trying to make it look like.

Your "obsession" only proves that you are doing astroturfing on behalf of some interested party.

To the American living in Argentina I know that you are glad that you are no longer living in America. Its even worse now with the country taking a nosedive into bankruptcy behind this war.

I cannot believe that the poor of the US own their own homes and have all of these luxuries. That may be true for the poor in the other 48 states but in hawaii and California you need HUGE sized bucks to even begin to make it out of poverty. Try a minimum annual salary of $300,000.

45 million Americans without health care and a good number without adequate health care. What quality of health care does an insured person actually receive if the CEO of the hospital is over his treatment plan and not a physician?

Poverty in America is NO joke either and it is not due to laziness on the part of the poor either. Yes some people are lazy and don't have but the American system of capitalism is designed to keep a certain segment of the population at below poverty level. Not everyone is going to be rich or even close to it. There has never been and will never be opportunities for all. Race and gender still play a huge role in determining wealth just as it does in every other nation on earth.

It is true that most Americans have access to clean water and electricity and a television set but in California there is still a sizeable population that is homeless and again this is not due to poverty but to a coldhearted capitalistic mentality that doesnt give a sh-t about the poor. California real estate is among the most lucrative in the world so the govt is not going to waste precious space with low income housing. If a person is not able to come up with at least $800,000 big ones for a home he has no other choice but to move to another state or walk the streets of Cali with a blanket over his head.

Poverty sucks wherever you are but the American poor must also bear the psychological burden of hearing that his poverty is due to laziness. In some cases that is true but lets not oversimplify the reasons for poverty , a lot of them having their roots in the historical and social realities of American society.

Astroturfer"


LOL, not normal eh? How old am I? I answered that question, and I believe in this very column. I'm 40 years old, and I LIVE in Brazil, and have been for 10 years now.

As far as how I got those statistics so quickly, all you have to do is use a "search engine"! You are familiar with search engines aren't you?


I've told lies huh? Your statement begs the question, HAVE YOU BEEN TO BRAZIL? HAVE YOU LIVED THERE FOR AT LEAST 5 YEARS? Because ANY human that has spent at least 5 years in this country, and has left their upper-middle class apartment building in Sao Paulo KNOWS that every single statement that I made here is indeed FACT! And, YOU don't have to take MY word for it, take the government of BRAZIL's word for it....THESE ARE DOCUMENTED REALITIES AND STATISTICS provided by NGO's, AMNESTY INTERNATIONAL, the BRAZILIAN GOVERNMENT, and organizations such as the UNITED NATIONS!

QUOTE:

"Your "obsession" only proves that you are doing astroturfing on behalf of some interested party."

Once again, you couldn't be more WRONG! I WISH I was getting paid for spending my time here writing this, but unfortunately I'm not! I have NO axe to grind, nor any alterior motives nor agendas.

BUT, I will not excuse those, such as yourself, to make statements in the attempt to mislead others! As you see from the one idiots statements, NEGATING the very fact that slave labor exists in this country! This is a KNOWN fact, it is admitted by your government, there is a federal government organization for this very problem CONATRAE (National Commission for the Eradication of Slave Labour) and in 2003 ON THE 11TH OF MARCH 2003 LULA LAUNCHED THE NATIONAL PLAN FOR THE ERADICATION OF SLAVE LABOR!!!

Now, let's look at this thread, the statements made. If it wasn't you that negated the fact that slave labor exists, it was your other partner in crime, who is ABSOLUTELY BLIND AND IN DENIAL ABOUT BRAZILIAN REALITY. Then when DOCUMENTED PROOF is shown, from the United Nations, NGO's such as AMNESTY INTERNATIONAL, and the most incriminating and indicting of all, THE BRAZILIAN GOVERNMENT ITSELF, then you guys come and make statements, "well, ok, it exists, but you're trying to make it appear as if it's on every corner!"

You lie and try and make it as if it doesn't exist, then when proven that it does you try and diminish the importance of it. That is SHAMEFUL! With those types of attitudes this country will never get out of the 18th century. How could one diminish the shameful existance of slave labor in 2006?! It doesn't matter if it pertains to 1,000 people, or 1,000,000, the very existance of it in this day and age is outrageous, and it's truly a shame that someone like yourself would attempt and deny it's reality of diminish it's existance as if it's "no big deal". That in itself tells a lot about the both of your attitudes and bias'.

Then you come on here and start to throw "rip it out of the ass factoids" such as the poor in the U.S. Getting a statistical number from the U.S. Census bereau which IT has classified as poor. Well, once again, one needs to ask the question, "what is considered poor in the U.S., and if you're comparing it to another country, what is considered poor in that country".

When one talks about the "poverty line" in the U.S., he's talking about a household income of $18,000 per year for a family of four. Do you know how many "salario minimos" that is here in Brazil? ONE HUNDRED AND TWENTY SEVEN! That's right, 127 minimum salaries equals the poverty level for a family o