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That's How the US Likes Brazil: Docile and Underdeveloped PDF Print E-mail
Written by Ted Goertzel   
Tuesday, 28 November 2006 10:31

An outdoor restaurant in the Brazilian interiorBrazil's presidential election passed with very little notice here in the United States, where attention is focused on Iraq, Iran, North Korea, illegal immigration, and our own elections. Re-elected president Luiz Inácio Lula da Silva is viewed as an example of a "soft left" leader, the other clear example in Latin America being Chile's Michelle Bachelet.

The "hard left" is represented by Venezuela's Hugo Chavez and Bolivia's Evo Morales.

Even the hard left has a hard time getting Washington's attention. So long as Chavez sells us oil, he only makes himself look silly by calling George Bush a devil, as he did recently at the United Nations' General Assembly in New York. He also makes Lula look great by comparison.

Lula and Bush get along famously on the rare occasions when they meet. But Bush really has very little interest in Latin America beyond Mexico, which is a priority because of the tremendous flow of illegal immigrants into the United States. Beefing up the Mexican economy is a priority in the hope that more Mexicans will find good jobs at home.

The Mexicans, in fact, are not so secretly relieved that Brazil has not pressed for entry into the proposed FTAA, the Free Trade Area of the Americas. They have enough trouble competing with Chinese imports. The Florida orange growers and Ohio valley steel producers are also grateful for any delay in having to compete with more efficient producers in Brazil.

Economists who follow the global software industry have a hard time understanding why Brazil has not developed a major outsourcing industry to compete with India and other places. Brazil is in the right time zone and has the skills to compete, and yet for some reason Brazilians have taken very little initiative.

Corruption and high tax barriers are cited as possible explanations, and stories about the many corruption scandals that plagued the Lula administration reinforce this image.

Brazil has received some attention in my home state of New Jersey because of the flow of illegal immigrants, many of whom have settled in the old industrial town of Riverside on the Delaware River. Most of them seem to be carpenters from the state of Minas Gerais and they are hard working and well behaved.

They have revived a dying town, but there are so many of them that local residents are feeling displaced. The general feeling seems to be that Brazilian immigrants are welcome, but only in modest numbers. And we know Brazil is a very big country.

Washington appreciates Brazil's lead role as a peacekeeper in Haiti, because that took the Haiti problem off Washington's hands. The U.S. is glad that Evo Morales is Brazil's problem. Americans hope Brazil's economy does well enough that most Brazilians are content to remain at home.

Brazilian leadership in South America is welcomed, especially as a counterweight to Hugo Chavez. Right now the United States has more foreign policy problems than it can handle, and it is happy that Brazil takes care of its own problems.

Commentators do not expect Lula to change much in his second term. A claim by Lula's predecessor, Fernando Henrique Cardoso, who stated shortly after Lula's victory that Brazil is tired of impunity for corruption, has been reported.

But so was the fact that Lula's main opponent in this year's presidential race, the former São Paulo State governor and member of Cardoso's social-democratic PSDB party, Geraldo Alckmin, was unable to make corruption charges stick to Lula during the second round of the elections.

The consensus in the United States seems to be that Brazil is not likely to cause much trouble in the next for years, either by turning to the hard left or by really asserting itself as an economic power.

Ted Goertzel, Ph.D. is Professor of Sociology at Rutgers University in Camden, New Jersey. He is the author of a biography of Fernando Henrique Cardoso, available in English and in Portuguese. He can be contacted at This e-mail address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it and his WEB page can be found at http://goertzel.org/ted.

This article appeared originally at InfoBrazil - www.infobrazil.com.



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Comments (44)Add Comment
...
written by Andy Murphy, November 28, 2006
Sure,Ted.The Brazilians have a famous saying "Ele não cheira nem fede".This proverb is applicable to both FHC and Lula.The honest Brazilians are not going to cause any trouble to anybody,because they do not have any voice.But, beware of the Chinese hegemony,not only in Brazil,but also other countries in Latin America during the next few years.
The United States is the...
written by Costinha, November 28, 2006
BIGGEST THREAT TO WORLD PEACE. Be it in Latin America, Africa, Asia or even Europe.

Nothing will stop these crusaders until most of their blood is spilled along the innocent. Their adventurism may be unrestricted, not so their blood!

A Little Angel Costinha?
written by KYRS, November 28, 2006
Well, I have been reading discussions on this site for about a week now and I have read some very idiotic, un-intellectual crap. From what you are saying, I can easily conclude that you are definitely an MST loving, Mulla loving petist. Come on now. Can't you people find some other crap to talk about.

According to you petists, we americans are worse than the devil. Thank God for Rio Grande do Sul and Santa Catarina. When my wife and I visit our family there, I do not have to listen to such crap. I guess that most Gauchos are smart enough to not fall for that idiotic Marxist propaganda of the PT. Why don't most Gauchos ramble on about such stupid crap? They don't do it because they are INTELLIGENT, HARD WORKING PEOPLE. That is why the south of Brasil is the most developed part of the country.

Come on now, there is no american conspiracy to turn the Amazon into a Super Wal-Mart parking lot. Get off of this crap and use your american-bashing energy to help the poor people in the favelas or something.
Mrs. KYRS
written by Costinha, November 28, 2006
I just felt an instantaneous and unstoppable urge to inform you that you don't just suck like a supersonic jet engine on high-octane fuel; no, you are the singularity and event horizon of Suck: The Supermassive Black Hole of Suck. Yes, your Suck is so powerful that nothing - nothing - escapes its pull. Oh, did I mention that you suck? Have a nice day, cheers.

Here is my kick upon your (.....o.....)

hehehe
MUITO PRAZER SENHOR COSTINHA
written by KYRS, November 28, 2006
Estou feliz em saber que tu e' um membro da Igreja Petista de Sao Lula. I would like to know if the bible you use in this church is the Communist Manifesto by Karl Marx. You just confirmed my thought that you are jsut a big, lazy PETISTA. You have got big red stars all over you.

Anyway Meu Cumpanhero (this is in Lulaguese- the Petist portuguese), where is your argument? Anyone can repeat the word SUCK 20,000 times. You have to do better than that. You dirty PETISTAS just can't handle a little criticism. In fact, you dirty, low-life PETISTS try to crush free speach. Why are you not countering my arguments with your own arguments? Are you stuck, buddy? Can't handle anyone having an opinion different from the normal dirty PETIST fanaticism. If you want to be fanatical, Al-Qaeda needs members.

Your response is so stupid that you make Mulla look intelligent. Try again MY PETIST FRIEND. TCHAU!!!
Joke for Costinha
written by KYRS, November 28, 2006
I have a joke for you. Pope John Paul II went to Brasil to meet FHCwhen he was president. He asked FHC whyhe needed so many ministers in the government. FHC replied that Jesus had 12 apostles. Anyway, Benedict just got back from Brasil where he met Mulla. He asked O Burro the same question and Mulla replied, "Well Cumpanhero Benedict, Alibaba had 40 (thieves)." That is what you Petistas are- just THIEVES.
Judgement Day
written by RSS, November 29, 2006
No one can escape it nor avoid it, neither can America.
... and then brazilians get mad because of a movie and a Simpsons cartoon
written by Brazilian expat, November 29, 2006
Take a look at this Costinha guy. He's kind of one-of-a-kind in this forum, but the fact is that there are simply too many brazilians, mainly to the north as KYRS mentioned (hails to Southern Brazil, the only slight exception to all of this mess), who can't discuss beyond that level. Don't expect much from them. They are what brazilians call "analfabeto funcional", a kind of analphabet who does not know how to deal with numbers, interpret texts or formulate valid arguments in the first place. As such, their rhetoric is only that of "we vs. them", and if you disagree with such an individual, you are one of the "them", not the "we". He's a funny individual in this forum, but can you imagine how is it to deal with this kind of people in the unions, companies and government-owned monopolies and offices?

The fact is, many of our people and specially our authorities make a joke of our country in the first place, something that would be laughable if it was not for the tragedy that's our politics, economy and security these days. And they get mad because of a movie like "Turistas" or a Simpsons episode...
...
written by Brazilian expat, November 29, 2006
Economists who follow the global software industry have a hard time understanding why Brazil has not developed a major outsourcing industry to compete with India and other places. Brazil is in the right time zone and has the skills to compete, and yet for some reason Brazilians have taken very little initiative.


Of course, the brazilian government created one of the worst environments to send money to Brazil, by taxing heavily the financial operations; the taxes for a software company, which can not be an "Empresa Simples", a kind of less bureaucratized company that also pays a little bit less taxes, are even higher than for other sectors. It's easy for a software company that pays its everything correctly be taxed with 50% to 80% of the income; intellectual property in Brazil? Don't make me laugh; SLAs? SLAs (Service Level Agreements), the foundation to IT outsourcing is based on contracts. In a country where the justice takes 10 years to decide on a subject, the outcome is hard to predict and the contracts are frequently disconsidered by judges because of some lost law or regultion lost among the more than 3 million that were produced since 1988, there is little possibility for establishing SLAs.
True !!!!
written by ch.c., November 29, 2006
But what can Brazil really produce except basic commodities ? Just look at the detail of their exports ! Even their cars/trucks exports are 95 % from foreign manufacturers with their own technology.
Or look at their mobile phone production, mostly in Manaus. It is assembly lines....ONLY !

This is all due to government policies with very high taxes but nothing in return because taxes are used to maintain the
innefective but costly bureaucracy and payment of interests, the largest in the world after inflation, and high pensions to civil servants.Thus not enough is left for healthcare, basic and high education, R&D spending, infrastructure.
Out of Reais 455 billions budget, The Bolsa Familia provides reais 8 billions, or 1,8 % of the federal budget, to 45 millions of people (23 % of the population) , BUT spend 110 billion (24 % of the population) for the 2 millions (1,1 % of the population) federal governments salaries and perks. This doesnt include yet the 40 billions (9 % of the budget) for the country social security deficit !
Meaning that education, healthcare, infrastructure will have the residues of the budget or.....NOT MUCH !

THEREFORE LULA STATEMENTS AND PROMISES THAT HE CARES FOR HIS CITIZENS.....HE MEANS.....YESSSSSSSS THE
GOVERNMENT EMPLOYEES.......BUT NOT THE 99 % OF THE POPULATION !


AND TO RSS : But Lula escaped of all his corruptions involvments....so far ! Do you believe that finally he will be....impeached ?
Hopefully you are right ! smile
Again...
written by sertanejo, November 29, 2006
Costinha keeps drawing a picture of her face: (.....o.....)
To Mr. KYRS
written by A brazilian, November 29, 2006
They don't do it because they are INTELLIGENT, HARD WORKING PEOPLE.


Ok Mr. Know-it-all, if they are the intelligent and the most hard working why then São Paulo is the richest state of Brazil? I extend this question to any gringo willing to respond.
...
written by hmm, November 29, 2006
"Ok Mr. Know-it-all, if they are the intelligent and the most hard working why then São Paulo is the richest state of Brazil? I extend this question to any gringo willing to respond."

I´ll bite, maybe because there is over 30 MILLION people there?
Mr. KYRS Responds
written by KYRS, November 29, 2006
Hello boys,

First, I am just a quasi-GRINGO. Second, I do not only applaud Gauchos, but also those from Sao Paulo, Parana, Santa Catarina and Matto Groso do Sul. I applaud the South of Brasil for their hard work. Please read my other posts throughout this site and you will see. Lula hates Paulistas, as he has said before. Therefore, I love them more than ever.

So please don't be colonos and start name calling before you know what I am all about. That is what a petist would do. We all know how those radical bums act and surely you want to differentiate yourselves from those burros.

I admit that I should have been more clear about what I was saying in my previous post and, being a rational man and not unreasonable like those MST loing petist dogs, I admit when I make a mistake. So don't go off until you see the whole picture.

To Brazilian expat:

You mentioned how hard it is to try and deal with those kind of people in the unions, companies and government-owned monopolies and offices. My friend, I know how hard it is. My company has operations in Brasil and my wife is an export directir- Latin America for a vey large logistics company. We have to deal with those bums all of the time. Some of those unions are the worst. Thank God that 7 of my wife's sisters and brthers are lawyers. They make my business life a lot easier because Brasil is very business UNFRIENDLY.
For hmm
written by Stephen White, November 29, 2006
I live and work in Santa Catarina. My Brazilian daughter is a Paulisita, graduate of UNIP law. Sao Paulo is in reality a poor city with millions of starving useless people, that don't want to work, crime is the easy way. SC has little crime wih a policy of 30% tolerance, unlike SP with a 90 % tolerance. We work smart not hard and take care of our employees, a counter girl in a bakery here makes twice as much as the useless ones in SP. $R 750,oo per month but they produce and don't cause problems.The PT lost badly because the people here are educated and woke up and smelled the coffee. A very happy gringo making the bucks!! KYRS, I'll have a cool chopp for you ..Cheers Mate !!
US Likes Brazil: Docile and Underdeveloped? Maybe me too....
written by sks, November 29, 2006
Been to Brazil this past August (Rio, Sao Paulo, Aguas de Lindoia). Nice quaint country, great people/food, and I do like your beautiful "docile" women.....not sure about the underdeveloped part.

BTW this discussion site is quite interesting. LOL.
Response: For hmm
written by KYRS, November 29, 2006
Stephen,

I take it by your english that you are British or learned British english. You guys are great, except for my British brother in law who lives in RS. He is just upset that my portuguese is better than his and he has lived in Brasil for over 20 years and I am only there a fraction of the time. I had some of the best times of my life studying at the LSE. You are right... A very happy gringo makes the4 bucks. Such people are happy because they work hard. That is something that the petist nordestinos don't understand. I am very familiar with the SC culture. I just love Florianopolis. It makes me happy to go there.

Anyway, you stated that you all in SC work SMART. That is vey true. I have noticed that businesses in the south are managed much better that those up north (with the exception of VARIG because now I can't use all my Smiles Miles). And then we have those happy-ass petists who scream not to privatize Brasil's state companies. They say that the dirty gringos want to steal them. That is crap. Everyone knows that state companies are the worst ran companies in the world. they are like bottomless its where tons of money fall into and gains are never realized. Look at CVRD and Gerdau. If they were state companies, they would not be worth a SH#@. Hoever, I own CVRD stock and it has made me money because it is a damn good company. Why? It is not a state company. However, we will never be able to get those poor blinded petists to understand this. I truly pity them and truly feel sorry for them for being so blind as to the true realities compared to what they believe.

Well, instead of having a cool chopp for me, have a Polar Export for me. I have been craving one for about a week. Do they have Polar in SC, or only in RS. I have never really paid attention. Tchau!
Whether "Mrs. KYRS", "sertanejo" or "ch.c."…
written by Costinha, November 29, 2006
… is one of the same, frustrated since their spouses were butt f**ked in Brasil.

But it doesn't matter. Either way, he/she beast ladies are some inconsequential quantum-stupid amoeba and should be f**king quarantined!

Cheers, yours truly Costinha!

hehehe
Re: Whether "Mrs. KYRS", "sertanejo" or "ch.c."…
written by KYRS, November 29, 2006
Costinha,

Such an angry little piranha. Chomp, chomp chomp...Truly witten by a filthy petist. You pitiful things cannot make an intellectual argument, let alone defend your views in a dignified way. You know, you people are mad at the world. I have never seen a good looking petist in Brasil. They are all damn ugly and have the Liberty Bell disease, which means that they start out small on top and expand exponentially all the way to the ground. They look like thcould not get laid even if they were an egg.

Would you prefer to have me write to you in portuguese, the language you sort of speak correctly or can you understand my english? BTW, someone accused you of being a beaner. Are you?

Please share your opinions with us in a reasonable, EDUCATED way or just do not waste our time. No, wait a minute. If you are an MST loving petist, then yu are NOT educated. Tchau!
My Oh My....Dear Mrs. KYRS Honey
written by Costinha, November 29, 2006
What we got here is a failure to communicate... So you are the self-appointed intellectual keyboard commando, ay?

Now then, Mr. f***********a, the only filth in the world today is called the United States and the Washington Nazi gang. Did you say languages? Pick: English, Portuguese, Spanish, French and/or German...

Before you bark again, Travesti Asanhada, it seems to me that your mouth is getting too big for your muzzle. Can you eat a banana sideways? Hehehe

Lastly, talk to someone who cares you old fart. This is very important, don't you EVA, I mean EVA, bite your tongue because you'll die from acid poisoning. Now, place the following words in a famous english phrase: OFF f**k.

Cheers
...
written by Marcelo Leal, November 29, 2006
Brazil is becoming irrelevant thanks to the lack of leadership. Most of our politicians are still trapped in the XIXth Century. Marxism, socialism, comunism are still taken seriously by by many people such as academics, congressmen, journalists... The last election's results shows two countries. One works hard yoand keep the country running despite corruption, incompetence kept alive by Lula and PT while the other can vote for Lula and receive handouts as Bolsa-Familia.
For Stephen
written by A brazilian, November 30, 2006
Sao Paulo is in reality a poor city with millions of starving useless people, that don't want to work, crime is the easy way. SC has little crime wih a policy of 30% tolerance, unlike SP with a 90 % tolerance. We work smart not hard and take care of our employees, a counter girl in a bakery here makes twice as much as the useless ones in SP. $R 750,oo per month but they produce and don't cause problems.The PT lost badly because the people here are educated and woke up and smelled the coffee. A very happy gringo making the bucks!! KYRS, I'll have a cool chopp for you ..Cheers Mate !!


1 - First, Santa Catarina, a state, is no match to São Paulo, A STATE. Comparing cities with states is geographically incorrect.
2 - São Paulo de capital is full of poverty, yes. Would I like to live there? No.
3 - I think you have absolutely no grounds on reality to evaluate "working smart" or "working hard", especially if compared to Sao Paulo. São Paulo is responsible for 1/3 or Brazil produces, paulistas literally carry this country in their backs. Santa Catarina is not even close.
4 - R$ 700,00 !!!! That salary is too small, but the cost of life in Santa Catarina is probably lower so probably it's possible to live with this little.

Insults on this blog
written by sks, November 30, 2006
"Insults are the weak man's imitation of strength" --- Dr. Henry Kissinger
Re: My Oh My....Dear Mrs. KYRS Honey
written by KYRS, November 30, 2006
Costinha,

Minha Amiga Petista! Sua cabeca esta tao funda dentro de sua bunda que voce nao consegue ver a luz do sol. My father-in-law in Brasil always says that people who are blinded by stupidity and conduct themselves in such a manner in public are nothing more than LIXO BRANCO. We use this phrase in Kentucky as well. We call this type of person WHITE TRASH. It seems, as one may conclude from your extremely intellectual posts here, that you are acting in such a manner.

Really, can you kiss your mother with those lips after acting in such a way, or are all of you petist dogs simply SEM VERGONHA? I mean, someone truly needs to wash your little petist mouth out with soap and clorox bleach. Bleach is supposed to kill almost anything filthy and unclean,but I am having doubts about your dirty mouth and the filthy PETIST diseae that lives within you.

People like you can never discuss your positions like adults, only in an adolescent manner. You petists cannot stand to be told that you are wrong, nor can you admit that you are proven wrong. I truly pray to God Almighty that you people will one day see the light. I truly pity people such as you. I also pray for Brasil because people like you are the root of the problem for Brazilian society. You, along with every other PETISTA e Cia Ltda, are condemning Brasil to economic delay. If you people do not stop, Brasil will srely suffer an Africanization.

On another note, I doubt that you are fluent in all of those languages. I will make a bet with you. If you want to display your proficiency in these languages, please do so because I do speak each very well. My uncle is French. My wife and her family are German-Brazilian. Lastly, my business partner is Argentinian. I have to speak each of these languages almost every day. Let us all see what you got in that little, dirty petist mind of yours. Demonstrieren sie bitte Ihre sprachenfähigkeiten, Fraulein Schweinhund.

The world is waiting. Tchau!
Insults on this blog
written by Costinha, November 30, 2006
sks - KYRS... "May Your Hairy a*****e Be A “Penis Dartboard” For A Thousand Years" --- Costinha

KYRS - A True FDP!
written by Costinha, November 30, 2006
Did you mention Bleach? In fact, your gene pool could use a little bleach and don’t breed dogs**t, I mean, Mrs. KYRS.

Geh fick deine Mutter, Analfixiert Du fauler Sack, Scheißkerl. Abhanden kommen. Va te faire enculer et me faut retourner à la pute qui m'a accouchée!

Last but not least… Act Your Age, Not Your Dick Size!

Cheers

Hehehe
"Economists" - WTF?
written by me, November 30, 2006
Economists who follow the global software industry have a hard time understanding why Brazil has not developed a major outsourcing industry to compete with India and other places. Brazil is in the right time zone and has the skills to compete, and yet for some reason Brazilians have taken very little initiative.


They have a hard time? What frikking "economists" are those? Brazilians haven't developed any outsourcing industry because so few of them speak English. No less, no more.
To Costinha
written by KYRS, November 30, 2006
Bravo, Bravo, Bravo! Well, now I am sure that many people are srprised. I have made a very exciting scientific discovery in the animal kingdom- a dirty petist that actually has the capability to SORT OF speak another language besides Lulaguese. Hell, I might get invited to the Royal Society in London to present my findings and posibly even get knighted by the Queen for this. OH MY GOD, a quasi-educated petist. I would like to know more about this new, exciting species of petists. I think I will name this species PETISTUS ACEPHALUS , PETISTUS LULAS WORSHIPUS, or PETISTUS FELLATIOUS MAXIMUS (if I want a little latin in the name).

Why don't you ever answer my questions? You have never answered anything. Are you a nordestino petist? Are you a beaner molhado? Please answer some of these qustions. Also, why do you love Mulla so much? Why do you love the MST so much even though they do not respect private property? This group should be considered a terrorist group instead of a social movement. Well, maybe you cannot answer these questions because you are a BRAINWASHED PETISTA.
RE: "Economists" - WTF?
written by KYRS, November 30, 2006
You are absolutely correct. All of those damn petists and closet socialists in Brazil are preventing any such growth, such as a substantial outsourcing industry, in the country. Their remarkably supid policies are so business un-friendly that no company wants to set up shop down there. Moreover, many economists are sobrainwashed wih the socialist, petista mentailty that they cannot predict when they have a bowel movement.

However, there are also a great deal of very good economists in the country as well and I applaud them. It is just a very bad situation and needs to be resolved with a change in political party control. The only problem is that we have people like Costinha the "Mouth of the South" and her dirty petist friends who think tha Lula and his petist government is the way to make progress in Brasil. They are wrong.
Why does the USA
written by MKS, November 30, 2006
hates arab and developing nations so much? What did they ever do to the Americans? Sad really.
RE: Why does the USA
written by KYRS, November 30, 2006
Hello Sr. MKS,

Americans do not HATE arabs, nor developing countries. We HATE crazy ass radical arabs who are terrorists. Two of my best friends are Jordanian. We hate nut jobs that fly airplanes into buildings. We also do not HATE developing countries. My wife is Brazilian and my business partner is Argentinian. Please get your opinions straight because THAT is really sad. Thanks for your input, but I feel it is wrong.
??
written by bo, December 01, 2006
The Florida orange growers and Ohio valley steel producers are also grateful for any delay in having to compete with more efficient producers in Brazil.


More efficient?? That couldn't be further off-base. Cheaper? Yes...definitely. But then again, how can one compete when paying employees $10/hour and another paying $5/day.

Right now the United States has more foreign policy problems than it can handle, and it is happy that Brazil takes care of its own problems.


Brazil takes care of its own problems?? Really?? Wonder why there are millions upon millions of brazilians living legally, or the vast majority, illegally, in europe and the U.S.?

One of the highest taxed countries on planet earth, where is the return? Where is the infrastructure? Ever travel brazil by car? Where is the education? Where is the opportunity? Where are the fair wages? One of the lowest minimum salaries on the planet yet the 13th largest economy. Brazilian gov't. largest nightmare is when a majority of the population get educated, it's certainly NOT in their best, self, or financial interest.
...
written by Will Pickering, December 01, 2006
Another reason Brazil probably doesn't create outsourcing jobs is because of the "worker rights" system that was started by Getulio Vargas and is a sacred cow in this country. Brazilians have a constitutional right to a month-long vacation, an extra month's salary at the end of the year, paid transportation to and from work, and a lot of other European style benefits (known on the left as "conquistas sociais"). It is also really expensive to fire someone. The unintended effect of all this is to discourage businesses from hiring people on the books. In practice, very few Brazilians actually have these "rights". A few years ago, Lula talked about "flexibilizing" these laws, but he seems to have dropped the theme.
My wife is a (Brazilian) labor lawyer and thinks these "rights" are a good thing, because Brazilian employers tend to be so exploitative people would be worse off without them. I think the bosses would exploit less if the government enforced the laws in the first place with regard to the basics - like paying your employees what you owe them, and paying it on time. It amazes me how may Brazilians tell me they go two or three monts "sem receber" (without being paid) and say it as if it were the most natural thing in the world. The bosses know the governement will probably do nothing, and that if they get sued it will take years for the case to be resolved.
As far a being behind in computer jobs, huge tariffs on importing computers before 1992 probably didn't help things.
P.S. The title of this article was a bit contentious, wouldn't you say?
My Opinion
written by carioCAO, December 01, 2006
The input of some on this board exemplifies how obnoxious some Americans can really be! The proverbial ugly American attitude that “we know it all… we are better then anyone… we know what is better for your country more then you do…” and the like. Frankly, a typical narrow American point-of-view of the world that has proven to be very counter-productive to the United States, and its image overseas.

Some Americans (not all) perpetuate and augment such negative feelings by adopting the stance that their government is benevolent which of course, it is not. Quite on the contrary, the US as a nation has pursued a rogue foreign policy of control and/or destruction since World War 2. Look at how many wars they have been involved the last 50 years, always meddling in other nations internal affairs, usually poor developing countries. A disastrous approach to say the least!

Anti-American sentiments is in no way, shape or form, unique to Brasil. In fact, it is quite common all over the world spanning across every continent. More so in the developing world. I ask Americans on this board who usually bashes Brasil without knowledge much less understanding of our culture, to consider what their country, the United States, has done the last few decades to many poor nations around the world. In my humble opinion, nothing to be proud of! Remember the old saying “where there is smoke there is a fire.”

I have many good decent American friends who do not deserve such rep**ation because I know personally that they truly are people of good will. Unfortunately, I cannot say the same for their government.

Peace
The real reason outsourcing to Brazil isn't happening.
written by me, December 02, 2006
Brasilian programmers either can't or won't follow a written specification.

Here's how it goes:
1) Deliver written specification for software.
2) Receive software program that doesn't follow the specification and doesn't work.
3) Either put so much effort into trying to get the program corrected so that it follows the specification and actually works reliably that it would have been quicker and easier to do it yourself, or give up and stop trying to outsource.

At first I thought it was just the programmers that were doing the work that were the problem, but after changing programmers four times, I have come to the conclusion that it's a shortcoming of Brazilian technical education.
To: My Opinion
written by wmhark, December 02, 2006
I am an American who is married to a wonderful Brazilain woman. I have not seen any Brazil bashing on this site and while you can find ugly people everywhere and America is certainly no exception, most Americans think fondly of Brazil. What puzzles most people is that Brazil is a vast country with vast resources and yet have failed to become the powerhouse that they should be. My wife (a nordestino) blames corruption as the primary reason. If you visit the north you will find wonderful hard working people. I have been there many times and met many people and lived amoung them for short periods of time. I didn't find any anti-american sentiment, quite the opposite. My experience is that Brazilians are the type of people who will let you prove whether you are a good person or bad person.

As for the situation with the economy, I can only speak about what I have seen first hand. In the north the infastructure is very poor. What there is, is poorly maintained especially as you move away from the coast. The farther you go toward the interior the worse the roads get. I have seen pot-hole big enough to swallow a car. It is really quite unbelievable. But the people persist and do the best they can under less than idea condtions. I think my wife is correct when she says that corruption plays a primary roll in the lack of developement in the country. But, in reading many of the comments posted here, I can only conclude that other factors contribute to the problem. Several comment have been made by business people siting taxes and tarrifs and, in general, regulation that stifle business. I can only take their word for that. But, I have seen signs that leed me to believe that it is true.

I, for one, love Brazil. My wife and I have discussed many times about possibly retiring there, but the steadily rising crime has become a factor that we must consider. Our hearts go out to Brazil and we wish there was some way we could help. But the best we can do is to help my wife's family from time to time to insure they can afford medication and other things. It isn't much, but we do what we can.

Some of the people posting here seem to have a lot of anger and for some reason they want to blame the Americans for the problems in Brazil. Of coruse, this is non-sense. In fact, if the business invironment was favorable, you can bet your ass that Americans and others would be hot to invest in Brazil. They have a large hard working population with a desent education level (some inprovement needs to be made here). The climate is one of the best in the world. But, of course, if the business climate is not good or if regulations make it too difficult and companies have to deal with large amounts of corruption, well... they are not going to do it.

Do have a wonderful life and keep an open mind. Feliz Natal
Tchau
Re: The real reason outsourcing to Brazil isn't happening.
written by A brazilian, December 04, 2006
At first I thought it was just the programmers that were doing the work that were the problem, but after changing programmers four times, I have come to the conclusion that it's a shortcoming of Brazilian technical education.


Another idiot.
To: The real reason outsourcing to Brazil isn't happening.
written by bug, December 04, 2006
"Me", I'm afraid I disagree with your arguments about why Brazil's outsourcing is not happening. I'm a software architecture having worked several years in Europe, US and Brazil. There is hardly any technical difference between software programmers and designers in Brazil, US and Europe. There are bad and good software professionals in Brazil, US or India (I had the opportunity to work with many Indians in the US).

Differences between Brazil and India may be explained by the language advantage (although many Americans have a hard time understanding Indian coworkers) and the India labor cost along with availability of massive labor force. Besides, India had a big edge on other countries when it seized the opportunity to do a lot of "cheap", repetitive outsourcing work during the year 2000 bug. That allowed India to have a successful case and exploit it later to get more outsourcing business. In the case of china, its advantage is cost. Brazil labor cost, bureaucracy and its own internal demand for software development are in my opinion better suited reasons to explain its relative poor outsourcing performance.


>Brasilian programmers either can't or won't follow a written specification.
>
>Here's how it goes:
RE: My Opinion
written by USA Expat, December 04, 2006
CarioCAO
I think your way off base. The main reason America was involved in so many wars was the fact that we are always ready to help those in need. During the Korean war the North Korean and Chinese armies invaded the peaseful south, and we came to ther rescue. It hasn't always turned out favorably, but atleast we were there to help. And you can bet that if anyyone ever threatened Brasil, we would be first in line to back you up! The problem arises when we repeatedly have to bail countries out because they don't know how to behave. In such cases we have to instill a little of our democrocy. It's never welcome but sorely needed!

And as for "meddling in other peoples affairs", maybe if someone would have "meddled" into Germany's affairs in 1939, we could have saved 6 million lives! We ALWAYS come to the aid of those who are in need. Thats one of the responsibilities of being a superpower. Unfortunately we are in the position of "your damned if you do , and your damned if you don't."
I'm sorry you feel the way you do. Maybe we can shed a little light on the reality of the USA.
This is hillarious
written by A brazilian, December 05, 2006
The main reason America was involved in so many wars was the fact that we are always ready to help those in need.


No, the main reason is that the US (not America) power is founded in a system that has the military industry as one of the main components. Wars sell weapons, fund researches, improve technology and that benefits other areas as well.

No wars, no money.

That's the main reasons for the US so promptly jump in a war. Americans die for a lie and some others get even richer than they already are with it.

Is it something that they put in the water americans drink, or a massive propaganda program of some sort? You seem to be very naive.

And as for "meddling in other peoples affairs", maybe if someone would have "meddled" into Germany's affairs in 1939, we could have saved 6 million lives.


A completely different case. And BTW, the US is one of the main sources of Nazi propaganda so they didn't finish with them in WWII.
USA EXPACT
written by Costinha, December 05, 2006
HEHEHE... Uhu… I see, you get your warped information from CNN, Fox or CBS right, like most idiot americans???

Get your facts straight (AND AN EDUCATION) you god damned peckerwood!
...
written by Polo in USA, December 07, 2006
Hot damn, Costinha/Putinha and A Brazilian...

You two monkeys are still at it with your rants and rewriting of history?
Sorry fools, for all your campaigning you couldn't even get a merda-wiping job with Lula's fat socialist ministers....
[LOL]
Whatsup Polo, The Mexican American wannabe!
written by Costinha, December 08, 2006
Still kicking???

I thought "Justice" had humiliated you to a pulp and then, you come back for more. Just like a hooker and her pimp! I bet you have a Ph.D. (Pimpin Hoes Degree), Am I Right? Hehehehe...

Polo, a man without identity, pretends to speak Pork&Cheese, and then some. The world traveler...hehehehe

Polo, the mexican monmkey, an agitated gibbering banana-shaped dildo-sucking cum-farting babbling butthead.
I am so sorry!
written by costinha, December 27, 2006
I know that most people believe that I am not capable of rational thought. I guess that they are usually right, but today I came to realize how wrong and stupid I have been. I am so sorry!

Starting today, I am going to stop parroting crackbrained ideas and conspiracy theories. I just got those ideas from someone else anyway. I know that I have needlessly insulted a lot of people. It's just that I haven't gotten laid in such a long time that I have gotten kind of bitchy. So, I want to do something to make it up to all of you.

American men are so hot and sexy, and they come in all colors and sizes, just like Brazilian men. I want you all to ram your stiff, throbbing man-poles deep up insude my eager cuzinho until I scream with joy. Then I want to lick the sweat and stinking juices from your balls, and swallow everything that you have. Swallowing a bucketful would not be enough to show you how sorry I am!

Please forgive my stupidity!

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