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Let Brazilians Sort Out the Problems of the Amazon PDF Print E-mail
Written by John Fitzpatrick   
Sunday, 10 February 2008 20:39

Page of a supposed US history book saying Amazon is international territory The destruction of the Amazon forest is a subject dear to the heart of the foreign media and environmental organizations but of virtually no interest to the majority of Brazilians. The foreigners seem to think that by causing a fuss every time the statistics on the latest deforestation are published they will save this vast area.

I believe they are wrong and should change their tactics or look around for another cause to adopt. The Amazon region is doomed and will end up as barren and bleak as my native Scottish Highlands where the original forest was chopped down centuries ago. Foreigners tend to see the Amazon problem the way George Bush saw Iraq i.e. a situation in which the good guys should take over from the bad guys and educate the locals over the errors of their ways.

A recent example of this approach appeared in "The Independent" newspaper of London under the naïve headline "There is a way to save the rainforests.." by a columnist called Johann Hari who claimed the solution lay in the developed countries setting up a fund "as ambitious as the Marshall Plan - to preserve the remaining rainforests, and thereby prevent drastic destabilisation of our climate."

As I read the article I wondered why Mr Hari's unconvincing views on the rainforest deserved so much space in The Independent. He was very vague about Brazil and trotted out decades-old clichés like an "area the size of Belgium..was destroyed in the past year alone" and unproven statements like "So when you eat a burger, chances are you are effectively eating part of the Amazon".

I suspected that most of Mr. Hari's conclusions came from the Internet rather than any personal knowledge of the situation on the ground so I sent him an e-mail and asked if he had been to Brazil and the Amazon region.

He was kind enough to reply and informed me that he had indeed been to Brazil but not to the Amazon and had interviewed "several leading experts on the region, who have spent decades there, and read the reports compiled by all the leading environmental organisations, whose work is first-hand."

I wrote back and asked if these experts had been Brazilian and whether he had raised his suggestion of the developed countries creating a "fund" to preserve the rainforest with them. I also expressed my view that his idea was a non-starter. At the time of writing I have heard no more from him but would like to make a few points about his article and try and put it into context.

There is a kind of foreigner, generally well-meaning, who thinks he knows better than Brazilians what is good for them and their country. Remember 20 years ago when Sting was constantly preaching the importance of saving the rainforest? Well (most of) the rainforest is still standing and it is Sting who has disappeared. 

This may seem a bit unkind as Sting was probably serious at the time - although if you read his autobiography you will see he shows no real understanding of Brazil. Compare his hectoring approach with the hands-on attitude of Led Zeppelin's Jimmy Page who is married to a Brazilian and set up an orphanage in Rio de Janeiro.

Even that decidedly non-Green rock star, Mick Jagger, has done more in practical terms for the Brazilian economy, thanks to the hefty alimony payments he makes to the mother of one of his children who lives in São Paulo.

If Mr. Hari knew Brazilians a bit better then he would know that they would be insulted by any attempt to set up a fund to preserve what they regard as an integral part of their territory. The idea of gringos giving them money with lots of conditions attached in a bid to save the Amazon would be anathema.

You only have to see how much a respectable organization like the International Monetary Fund is hated by a large section of society even though the IMF came to the rescue of the government of Fernando Henrique Cardoso three times.

The Catholic Church aside, Brazilians do not take to foreign (and even domestic) NGOs which they suspect as having hidden agendas or being front operations for corrupt politicians and public employees.

Brazilians of all political colors are also extremely defensive about the Amazon. The fuss caused by the posting on the Internet some years ago of what was purported to be a textbook for US schoolchildren showing the Amazon region under the control of the United States and the United Nations highlighted this. Although this was an obvious hoax many people believed it was true and there is still a widespread belief that the Americans are intent on grabbing the Amazon region some day.  

One of the reasons for this hostility is Brazil's unwillingness to be compared with Third World countries which rely on hand-outs from international aid organizations and NGOs. Brazilians see their country as a powerhouse, blessed with more natural resources than probably any other place on earth, not some banana republic or African basket case that needs a push from rich foreigners to get it moving. The constant (if not somewhat obsessive) desire for Brazil to have a permanent seat on the UN Security Council shows this is where Brazilians see their rightful position in the world.          

Even, if by some amazing twist, this fund was set up no Brazilian would have any faith in it. Nor would it halt the destruction of the rainforest. Why? Because it would be seen as just another opportunity for Brazil's corrupt politicians to get their hands on the money and siphon it off.

The do-gooding nations which had subscribed to the fund would see their money disappear into air along with the smoke from the latest tract of the Amazon forest to be torched.

John Fitzpatrick is a Scottish writer and consultant with long experience of Brazil. He is based in São Paulo and runs his own company Celtic Comunicações. This article originally appeared on his site www.brazilpoliticalcomment.com.br. He can be contacted at This e-mail address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it .

© John Fitzpatrick 2008



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Comments (58)Add Comment
"Let Brazilians Sort Out the Problems of the Amazon"
written by ..., February 11, 2008
and let's keep it that way!

Costinha
A FEW YEARS AGO LULA ASK FOR THE SAME DEAL
written by forrest allen brown, February 11, 2008
But brasilians were to be in charge of the whole world fund and there say so was finial

it started with a $750.000.000 donation from the US over a 5 year term

other moneys from the 8 other first world nations were not as large but very high

with brasil giving the least amount along with the other countries that have part of the rain forest .

yet again brasil would have the finial word on the hole deal would be done and spent

it did not float then and it wont float now.

costinha
brasil will sort out the problem like it does ever thing else
clear cut burn and then point the finger at some one else
Well, Let the Brazilians Sort it Out
written by Ric, February 11, 2008
So who´s stopping them? Go to it.
...
written by jon, February 11, 2008
..and here's how:
Brazil's government plans to curb financing for illegal loggers and farmers and boost penalties to pare deforestation of the Amazon, Environment Minister Marina Silva told reporters in Brasilia.

Brazilian President Luiz Inacio Lula da Silva and executives of state-controlled banks today will discuss ways to restrict financing to individuals and companies damaging the Amazon, the minister said in Brasilia. Devastation in the Brazilian portion of the Amazon basin accelerated in the last five months of 2007, the ministry said last month.

``There's no intention, at this point, to either give amnesty to deforestation offenders or to make the reserve limits more flexible,'' Silva said at the ministry's headquarters in Brasilia. ``What is needed is better enforcement, not an easing in the current policies to protect the Amazon.''

Preliminary figures show destruction between August and December may have reached as many as 7,000 square kilometers, or the equivalent of 60 percent of the deforestation in the 12 months through July 2007, partly because of increased logging and cattle-raising.

Landowners in the Amazon will have to show that at least half their property remains untouched and that there has been no destruction to the forest on their estates in the past 12 years, Deputy Environment Minister Joao Paulo Capobianco said today. Those who fail to prove that will be forced to replant, he said.

The government expects deforestation of the Amazon to ease this year, Silva said, without elaborating.

To contact the reporter on this story: Guillermo Parra-Bernal in Brasilia at \n This e-mail address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it '> This e-mail address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it

Last Updated: February 11, 2008 12:36 EST
...
written by Ric, February 12, 2008
Those with the get-up-and-go got up and left Scotland because forest or no forest, the land couldn´t support a growing population. Probably could support less with the forests intact than with them out of the way.

The Amazon, by contrast, has few people, fewer hills and fewer still rocky crags. When the forest is cut down it is replaced by hardy pasture grass, dendê palms, coconut trees, manioc, reflorestation, fruit trees, açaí, etc. The stupid greenies assume that it all turns to red, eroded soil or that the aforementioned vegetation somehow all escapes turning see-oh-two into 02.

Let Brasil sort it out indeed. Only Brazil has police, military, banks, and ag schools on its own territory. Who else would sort it out? The Ibama is Brazilian, the Brazilian Amazon is subject only to legislation made in Brasilia, all transportation is subject only to Brazilian regs.

Out of the stupid titles occasionally seen on this site, this one ranks right up there.

One more for Hector!

Shelly finally allowed me to take pictures…
written by ..., February 12, 2008
Here she is enjoying her lattest bubble bath..

http://www.voyeurweb.com/contris/PrivateShots/ps200802/20080207-56164/index.html

FUGLY!

Costa
Too late for Brazil
written by sayno, February 13, 2008
I fear it is too late to turn back the destruction.
Clearing the forest will result in Brtazil looking more like the Sahara.
All for the sake of a few landholders.
Eat the rich!
Hmmmmm !
written by ch.c., February 13, 2008
Then why is Bin Lula begging that developed nations should bear the costs for the Amazon protection ????

Another of his cheating practices......as usual !

Yesss part of the Amazon (not all of it) is on your territory. Therefore YOU are responsible either for the destruction or the preservation of it !
But asking and begging for money....knowing that you will anyway continue furiously to deforest it......is a scam for which Brazil excels !

Is Brazil participating or requested to do so, for the preservation of the remaining forests in developed countries ?
Laugh....laugh....laugh !
Just guess what the answer would be from Brazilians !

Worse yet :
TheBrazilian Amazon deforestation produces 300 millions tons of carbon dioxide...annually.
But Brazil is begging to receive billions of US$ in.....carbon CREDITS from the developed nations!
Your sugarcane bagasse burning produces tens of millions of tons of carbon dioxide...and you expect to receive....carbon CREDITS from the developed nations !
Most of your mines (iron ore or whatever) are open pits, and you expect to receive....carbon CREDITS from the developed nations !
Most of your private and corporations garbages go to OPEN dumpsites.....and you expect to receive carbon credits from the developed nations.
You have 160 millions cattles, each one polluting more than a car, and you expect to receive....carbon CREDITS from the developed nations !!!
Most of your private and industrial sewage goes untreated straight to the ocean or the rivers....but you expect again to receive carbon CREDITS from the developed nations !

Stupid question :
When will you stop begging, lying, cheating and hiding ?
Never, because it is in your genes and blood !

SAD REALITY PROVEN DAILY...for the last several centuries.

smilies/cheesy.gif smilies/grin.gif smilies/cheesy.gif smilies/grin.gif smilies/cheesy.gif smilies/grin.gif smilies/cheesy.gif smilies/grin.gif
Ch.c
written by João da Silva, February 13, 2008
Stupid question


As usual!

When will you stop begging, lying, cheating and hiding ?


When my brother-in-law stops doing it (Man, I am seriously thinking of sending him to Switzerland-financed by the Swiss government,of course). I am counting on you, needless to say, to receive him at the airport and drown the idiot in Lake Geneva.

SAD REALITY PROVEN DAILY


You don't have to be sad about the reality. Cheer up. We all know that you have a tender heart.But there again, Tender hearts never destroyed forests!!

Remember the title of this article:

Let Brazilians Sort Out the Problems of the Amazon


When the author wrote this article, he was thinking of my brother-in-law!!! smilies/wink.gif
"let Brazilians sort out the Amazon problem"
written by jakob, February 13, 2008
I must confess, I am sceptical about letting Brazilians sort out the Amazon problem.

I've been in Brazil for enough time now to know that, no many how many agents IBAMA (or any other state agency) sends to Amazon, a "coronel" there with 10-20 men armed with rifles will ALWAYS be "more right" than this agent. And no matter what this agent does, most probably this "coronel" will send someone to stick a gun into his ribs as a warning what will happen if he tries to stop him in chopping down the trees.

The fact is, Brazilians are a people accustomed to "jeitinho", and this jeitinho will always prevail over rules and laws... There is no point in denying this. Also, many (too many!) folks here are accustomed to resolving open issues with violence.

Therefore, my take is: chopping down of trees will continue!
Jakob
written by João da Silva, February 13, 2008
I must confess, I am sceptical about letting Brazilians sort out the Amazon problem.


It is so obvious that your confession was obtained under duress. Therefore, your opinion does not count!
João da Silva
written by jakob, February 13, 2008
Ei cara, exatamente... Under duress. Living in Brazil in so many respect is like living under compulsory threat. ('Cause you never you if a ladrão will get you on the next esquina.)
...
written by bo, February 14, 2008



“Geographical manuals in US schools show an amp**ated Brazil, without the Amazon and the Pantanal. This is how students are taught that these are ‘international’ areas, in other words: this is how the North American public is prepared for the ‘internationalisation’ of these areas.”


LOL...what some ignorant extremists won't do to confuse gullible brazilians....it doesn't take much! smilies/grin.gif
http://strangemaps.wordpress.c...on-forest/
written by bo, February 14, 2008
“Since 2000, a forgery has circulated falsely claiming that the United States and the United Nations have assumed control of the Amazon rainforest in order to safeguard its treasures for all mankind.”

“The forgery purports to be page 76 of a U.S. sixth grade textbook titled An Introduction to Geography by David Norman. There is no indication that such a book exists. The U.S. Library of Congress, with more than 29 million books and other printed materials, has no record of it. The Online Computer Learning Center’s WorldCat database, the world’s largest database of bibliographic information with more than 47 million books, has no record of the book. Nor can such a book be found in Internet searches on amazon.com or Google.”

“To a native English speaker, the accompanying text’s many errors of spelling, grammar, and inappropriate tone and language are clear, although these would not necessarily be obvious to non-native English speakers. The words that are misspelled and some of the other most obvious errors are indicated in boldface. They are:”



* 3.000 should be 3,000; Americans use a comma, not a period to separate thousands from hundreds in numbers
* INT’L should be INTERNATIONAL; informal contractions would not be used in a textbook
* responsability should be spelled responsibility
* irresponsable should be spelled irresponsible
* authoritary should be authoritarian
* the “a” before “unintelligent” should be “an”
* destroying should be destruction
* vegetals should be vegetables
* calcule should be calculate
* cert should be certain
* explorate should be exploit.



“In addition, the text uses an inappropriate tone and contains many other grammatical and word usage errors. Some of the spelling errors in the forgery indicate that the forger was a native Portuguese speaker. In Portuguese, the word for calculate is calcule, and a word for vegetable is vegetal. On June 8, 2000, the then-Brazilian ambassador to the United States, Rubens Antonio Barbosa, characterised the forgery as ‘disinformation made in Brazil by sectors still unidentified’.”

“Ambassador Barbosa added, ‘The initial source of the supposed news was a website associated with the slogan Brasil, Ame-o ou Deixe-o [Brazil: love it or leave it], but with no identification of those responsible for the website.’ The Minister-Counselor of the Brazilian embassy at the time, Paulo Roberto de Almeida, stated that the forgery was linked to Brazilian ‘right-wing sectors that specialize in transmitting news of supposed attacks against our sovereignty in a manner that is not merely paranoid, but also irresponsible’.”

“The Brazilian embassy in the United States has this statement on the forgery, in Portuguese, on its website. Although the textbook page has long been identified as a forgery, it continues to circulate widely via e-mail, and is often believed.”

Which is how it ended up in my mailbox…
http://usinfo.state.gov/media/...97081.html
written by bo, February 14, 2008


The "U.S. Takeover of the Amazon Forest" Myth
Forged textbook page helps to spread false story



Brazilian forging documents?????


Who woulda thunk it? smilies/grin.gif
Why Are Americans Obsessed With Stereotypes???
written by Catia, February 14, 2008
I've traveled all around the world and met many people of different races as well as culture. Whenever I come to America I'm bombarded with stereotypes about race, religion, and culture. This is the only country that seems so obsessed with stereotypes. There could be a person that has never eaten with an asian family and instantly believes they eat cat. What is wrong with you people? I realized that it was your television that sends you with nothing but useless information on celebrities, slutty girls, and racial/cultural stereotypes. Most of you not knowing a person, culture or race you instantly assume things about them. I don't understand your reasoning, could you please explain it? Thank you.
Catia
written by João da Silva, February 14, 2008
I don't understand your reasoning, could you please explain it? Thank you.


Who could explain this is our distinguished blogger Forrest who has also traveled all around the world and met many people of different races as well as culture, just like you. He is the right person to answer your thought provoking questions.
Bobão…
written by ..., February 14, 2008
The wooden spoon is ready…. Just tell me when ready for your enema!

Costinha
...
written by bo, February 15, 2008
Why Are Americans Obsessed With Stereotypes???
written by Catia, 2008-02-14 20:01:50



Now just exactly who's stereotyping who here Catia? The following is the ramblings of paranoid brazilian schiztoids that only try and paint the U.S. as a country that is trying to take over the world...and in particular the amazon through lies and deception!

“The following text is taken from a US high school geography manual, signalling the United States (jointly with the United Nations) can take over the Amazon to protect the water and air quality of the world.”

“The manual discusses how this area is in South America, a region with the worst poverty on the planet and divided among eight nations with a weird, irresponsible, cruel and authoritarian population – savages, drugs dealers, illiterates, etc… It is these peoples that could cause the death and destruction of the world, in a mere few years’ time.”

“Going into detail, page 76 of the manual ‘Introduction to Geography’ by David Norman (used at junior high school level), describes ‘Operation Columbia’:”

“North American troops (80.000 strong in Surinam and Guyana) will take over Brazilian airspace and launch rockets from Alcantara. The US will open a CIA office at the Foz de Iguazu tripoint (Argentina/Paraguay/Brazil) and implant two military bases in Argentina – one in Patagonia and one closer to Buenos Aires.”

“Legend below the map: ‘Here we see the International Reserve, consisting of territory of eight South American countries: Brazil, Bolivia, Peru, Colombia, Venezuela, Guyana, Surinam, French Guyana… Some of the most miserable countries of the world.”

“Since the middle of the 1980s, the most important nature area in the world became the responsibility of the US and the UN. The fund that was set up for this purpose is FIRAF (the ‘First International Reserve of the Amazon Forestal Fund’). This foundation has taken responsibility for the Amazon region, located in South America, a region among the poorest in the world and ruled by irresponsible, cruel and authoritarian governments. The area is part of eight different countries, the populations of which consist of violent types, drugs traffickers and ignorants, illiterates and primitives.”

“The foundation of FIRAF was approved and supported by the nations of the G-23 and it is a genuine challenge to our country and a gift to the whole world, as the ownership of this valuable global asset was in the hands of primitive peoples and countries without responsibility for these ‘lungs of the world’, which under their stewardship would disappear in a few years’ time.”

“We can say that this region has the greatest biodiversity on the planet, both in animal and plant species. The value of this region is incalculable, but the Earth can rest assured that the USA will not allow the Latin American countries to further exploit and destroy this heritage of all mankind. The FIRAF will be administered as any other US National Park, with strict rules regarding exploitation.”

“Please send this mail onto as many people as possible, to inform all of these insidious plans. Gracias, obrigado, thank you!”

This is the verbatim transcription of a rambling, repetitive chain mail (often but not always in Spanish or Portuguese) purporting to show a US scheme for taking over the Amazon basin, under the pretext of saving its globally vital resources from the clutches of the savage locals. It’s not hard to find some things wrong with it.

The "things" wrong are listed in my posts above! And there are numerous!! Even the brazilian embassador to the U.S. admitted that it was a "paranoid and irresponsible group" from Brazil!

...
written by Mr X, February 15, 2008
No, the federal government won't save the rainforest. The reason for this is a combination of corruption, insecure land rights, insufficient funding of controll agencies and powerful land holders. When it comes to the local government they won't stop the destruction as well. The local governments benefits economically from the destruction. Moreover, it´s controlled by powerful families (oligarchs) that will oppose change. Regarding foreigners they won't be able to do much either. Any involvement will be misinterpreted as imperialism. US and US associated organizations as IMF has bad rep**ation in Brazil. Initially all these constrainsts seem to leave little hope for the rainforest, however, this is to some extent wrong. Huge areas of the forests will be preserved since it lies within Indian reserves, and it's very hard for settlers to enter these areas. The best thing that can be done in order save the forest is to increase the legal, economic and technological power of the reserves.

Mr X
Bobão – The Wife Beater/Child m******r
written by ..., February 15, 2008
Be glad you are in Brasil. If you were in the US you’d be locked-up for life.

Don’t forget to take your medicine so that you won’t snap!

Yours truly,

Costinha

...
written by bo, February 15, 2008
Bobão – The Wife Beater/Child m******r
written by ..., 2008-02-15 15:08:03
Be glad you are in Brasil. If you were in the US you’d be locked-up for life.

Don’t forget to take your medicine so that you won’t snap!

Yours truly,

Costinha



and take that grain of salt from someone with experience!!! smilies/shocked.gif
Bobão… Not worth much of anything.
written by ..., February 16, 2008
Here is my grain of salt: (…..o…..) Puuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuufffffffffffffff to you!

Costa
bo
written by Eduardo C., February 17, 2008
Vai aprender geografia seu burro!! Pantanal esta bem longe desta área. Cretinos como você, não deveriam dar palpites,pois não sabem nada.
Bo knows Brazil
written by Gringo, February 17, 2008
Vai aprender geografia seu burro!! Pantanal esta bem longe desta área.


Comprehension is not your strong suit, eh Eduardo? smilies/grin.gif Re read it, and if you still have problems with it come to me and I'll re educate you on the use of quotation marks and sarcasm, mkkkk.
Brazzil.com's comment section worse than youtubes?
written by gringo perdido, February 17, 2008
this place really needs an admin.
Geographical manuals in US schools show an amp**ated Brazil, without the Amazon and the Pantanal
written by Eduardo C., February 17, 2008
É isso que eu quis dizer!!
Geographical manuals in US schools show an amp**ated Brazil, without the Amazon and the Pantanal.
written by Eduardo C., February 17, 2008
Esse é o ponto!
“Geographical manuals in US schools show an amp**ated Brazil, without the Amazon and the Pantanal
written by Eduardo C., February 17, 2008
Esse é o ponto! Não o comentário.
Bo knows Brazil
written by Eduardo C., February 17, 2008
Será???????? smilies/cry.gif
MR Mx
written by Shelly1, February 18, 2008
You gave a good opinion. I agree 100% with you. Deforestation won't stop, but we should increase penalties and recruit local people to get involved in protecting the forests. However, as a Brazilian, there will always be a "jeitinho" because Brazil is the land of corruption. Rapid Assessment Programs have worked in Congo, but in Brazil the people are actually less inclined to follow the rules. Brazil is a joke when it comes to protecting its natural resources.
Catia
written by Forrest Allen Brown, February 18, 2008
Look at your avarage person from any where .
most beleive all people from the US are rich !!! and are fools when it comes to money .
then there is the ugly tourits from the US about 1% may be bad but they get the news .
most of all sterotypes come from people that want to paint people of somewhat different countries
in a dim light , mostley because they have never been realy hungry , or had never had to load up the barrel on the donkey cart to get todays water .

then there is that alfred zimmer show called strange foods that is like the crockadile man but of food from around the world .
they go looking for the most out landish food you can find and show it on TV for all sofa world experts to asume it is what every one from thet country eats
kind of like most people think people from the US are like the ones you see on the JERRY SPRINGER show

HO and by the way roast cat and string bean with rice is very good meal , got to have to plum sauce

remember when Sir Peter Blake was killed in Brazil Amazon some beleive it was the land owners , and ileagle loggers that had it done .
as there was a long sepical on the rain forest taken from his boat and crew by police in brasil as evedence but never returned
as it showed peoples faces and what was going on .
go to his web site

Brazil and the US are not much different led by bad goverment voted in by the people .
who have to see whith one will not steal from them the most .
if i sent you to the air port and said pick up the brasilian what would you look for that person to be like ?????
now the same from the US , what would you look for ????

as far as setting penilitys for thoes whom break the law dont fine them take away the land ,houses ,business ,of the compines they work for ,

cut off the head
Eduardo....
written by bo, February 18, 2008
and the hunt for hidden treasure! Eduardo, my friend, Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak out and remove all doubt!! smilies/cheesy.gif
...
written by CT, February 18, 2008
"Why Are Americans Obsessed With Stereotypes???
written by Catia, 2008-02-14 20:01:50
I've traveled all around the world and met many people of different races as well as culture. Whenever I come to America I'm bombarded with stereotypes about race, religion, and culture. This is the only country that seems so obsessed with stereotypes. There could be a person that has never eaten with an asian family and instantly believes they eat cat. What is wrong with you people? I realized that it was your television that sends you with nothing but useless information on celebrities, slutty girls, and racial/cultural stereotypes. Most of you not knowing a person, culture or race you instantly assume things about them. I don't understand your reasoning, could you please explain it? Thank you".

-Catia, you need not leave brazil to come to the conclusions that you stated above, you talk about obssesion, don't brasilians obsess & judge constantly without even knowing anythingaobut those that they criticize, lets see where do they goet theri info from, tv, novelas, disinformed news, sterotypes from the history books, etc. And you a brazilian are talking, what a laugh-
The current trend is disturbing
written by Pinto, February 19, 2008
Tards...
Rainforests dissappearing at increasing rates is very worrisome for all. smilies/angry.gif And since little or nothing is being done in Brazil....well, there must be another alternative. Brazilian pride is that last thing that the world cares about. Brazil must seriously do something now! Thats the bottom f**king line.
Pinto
written by A Brazilian, February 19, 2008
Brazilian pride is that last thing that the world cares about.


They don't need to care about anything at all. The Amazon is ours, period. There are more than 20 million Brazilian living there and they need roads and infrastructure.

Foreigners tend to romantisize the forest as some untouchable garden. It is not. It must be explored. The only difference is that it should be done rationally instead of how it is done right now. And if we don't, someone else will. The first thing Europeans or Americans would do is to create a consortium of companies and divide it in parts for them to explore under the pretext that "it is the only way to be sure it is being protected" and promising to be "environmentally friend" while doing it.

Those who don't know this horses**t that buy it. We aren't interested.
brazilian
written by Forrest Allen Brown, February 19, 2008
that has been done by brasilians
but they use slash and burn too see what they can get out of the forest .

20 million who counted them ?????
you have 2 major citys there and booth came about by exploiting the rain forest .

and who is we you got a mouse in your pocket .

i know several brasilians that have a very active life trying to protect the forest but are cut off at the knees by your own
leaders by giving them word of mouth premision to do what they want and never have to worrie about going to jail

look at the govoner of amazoina in the late 90 he nows lives in florida and has his own island off ilah bella in SP state
where do you think he got that money
Forrest
written by A Brazilian, February 19, 2008
If you had studied geography you would know it. There are many cities there, from which one is an Industrial center.
Forrest
written by João da Silva, February 19, 2008
In case you are not aware, you better read the following link and stay clear of the area where the debris from that satellite is likely to fall:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/23240631/
...
written by CT, February 19, 2008
"written by A Brazilian, 2008-02-19 02:29:01
Brazilian pride is that last thing that the world cares about.
They don't need to care about anything at all. The Amazon is ours, period.

-The amazon is your's who gave it to you? You sound just like a colonizer all for the taking no matter who's inthe way, eh-

The only difference is that it should be done rationally instead of how it is done right now.

-done rationally, by brazilians, what a laugh-
brazilian
written by forrest allen brown, February 19, 2008
been there only two city are over the 1 million mark
breves in the water way from belem to amapa is a logging city that dumps tons of old tree bark and saw dust in the river whitch adds to the tanic acid .
as you move up river you find all sorts of so called settlements that are there just to take from the river and the forest .
now manous well with its floating cattle barge dump all sorts of cow s**t along with the not so luckey dead ones float down the river . the bike plant dumping old paint and oil in the river .
the brick plant , rubber mills , car plant .

and as far as i know i did not see not one sewer plant at any city on the river treating the millions of gallons of raw sewage , and industrial waste,

lets talk about all the boats that the people run up and down the river dumping all sorts of garbage, oil and hauling animals , birds ,teeth , hides , wood , stolen property up and down the river with no one there to stop them or they just pay someone off .

the gold miners using mercury to clean there gold , assorted other nasty things they use .

other places up and down the rivers are townships built up by the locals from any where , from 450years ago to last december gold rush
...
written by A Brazilian, February 20, 2008
The amazon is your's who gave it to you?


It is in our territory, so it belong to us. The same way the oil found in the US belongs to the US, and the oil found in Arabia belongs to the Arabians.
the amazon is brazils to do with it what they want
written by forrest allen brown, February 20, 2008
JUST QUIT TRYING TO BLAM THE REST OF THE WORLD FOR YOUR COUNTRIES FALTS

yes we buy oil from all countries as does brasil .

you should take a trip with out your rose colored glasses as see the river and the lands it drains .

then you will see it is not just the grate first world countries killing off the river and its forests
over 90% of the damage is done by brasilians and there
instant self gratafaction . and me me me .

Joao an in the suamatra channel looking for pirates have some new guns and want to try them out
so boat is bate and we are the trap
There she goes again… Florist A$$ Brown
written by ..., February 20, 2008
Madam… I'm Not Criticizing You Are Gay… But Why Do You Call Your butthole "Timothy"?

You mint-flavored suppository hole!

Costinha
C
written by forrest allen brown, February 20, 2008
AGAIN TRUTH HURT .

you resort to the only thing a person of your mental mass can come up with

some half witted slur sent to try to offend me

too me you are that scum that builds in the lower side of my shower drain
to be cleaned with bleach and flushed out
...
written by CT, February 20, 2008
"written by A Brazilian, 2008-02-20 13:19:41
The amazon is your's who gave it to you?
It is in our territory, so it belong to us."

-Did you have anything to do with that, fighting for the territory, or were your ancestors "bandeirantes"-
...
written by CT, February 20, 2008
"written by A Brazilian, 2008-02-20 13:19:41
The amazon is your's who gave it to you?
It is in our territory, so it belong to us."

-Did you have anything to do with obtaining that territory, fighting for it, or were your ancestors "bandeirantes"-
costinha
written by forrest allen brown, February 20, 2008
this may help you express yourself
just copy and past just about any
3 year old can do that

Well, how about some "ASSICONS?"
Here goes:


(_!_) a regular ass



(__!__) a fat ass



(!) a tight ass



(_*_) a sore ass



{_!_} a swishy ass

(_o_) an ass that's been around





(_x_) kiss my ass



(_X_) leave my ass alone



(_zzz_) a tired ass



(_E=mc2_) a smart ass



(_$_) Money coming out of his ass



(_?_) Dumb Ass


Florist A$$ Brown… The Last One Suits You Very Well!
written by ..., February 21, 2008
Did you say bleach? I was going to suggest you a little bit of bleach to be added to your gene pool!

You really are a pothole on life's highway.

Yours truly,

Costinha
Pay attention Brazil.....
written by bo, February 21, 2008
as this is how it's done without blowing your hand off!!! smilies/grin.gif smilies/grin.gif



USS Lake Erie launches a Standard Missile-3 at a non-functioning National Reconnaissance Office satellite as it traveled in space at more than 17,000 mph over the Pacific Ocean, 20 Feb 2008


The Navy modified three missiles for the shoot-down, and defense officials say the first successfully hit the target about 0330 UTC Thursday. The Pentagon says that land, air, sea and space-based sensors confirmed the intercept.
Bo
written by João da Silva, February 21, 2008
Breaking news, Breaking news..................

No need to fear. Forrest had long ago instructed his ex-subordinates to launch the missile at a correct angle, so that the frozen Hydroxyzine tank will fall right on top of the head of Ch.c in Geneva! He had the decency to warn Ch.c to take cover!!

You should thank Forrest for having spared your apartment complex in Aracaju. Lately he has been trigger happy and I don't know why smilies/wink.gif
...
written by bo, February 22, 2008
written by João da Silva, 2008-02-21 21:25:09
Breaking news, Breaking news..................

No need to fear. Forrest had long ago instructed his ex-subordinates to launch the missile at a correct angle, so that the frozen Hydroxyzine tank will fall right on top of the head of Ch.c in Geneva! He had the decency to warn Ch.c to take cover!!

You should thank Forrest for having spared your apartment complex in Aracaju. Lately he has been trigger happy and I don't know why smilies/wink.gif



smilies/cheesy.gif smilies/grin.gif smilies/cheesy.gif smilies/grin.gif
Bobão
written by ..., February 22, 2008
When you press that button to launch missiles in the golden sky to kill others, is when they burn your embassies, kidnap your citizens, blow your ships and send jets into your buildings. Sad, really!

Are you ever going to learn?

Costinha
Costinha
written by forrest allen brown, February 23, 2008
when will you ever learn ????

we could set on our butts like most of europ and south amercia an let less than 10% the world
population set the way of life .

can you live like this

NO LIQUER
FACING MECA 5 TIMES A DAY TO PRAY .
NO WOMEN IN THONGS ON BEACH MUCH LESS ANY OTHER TYPE OF SHORT PANTS
MINI SKIRTS , LOW CUT TOPS
CERTIN TYPES OF FOODS ARE BAND .
WOMEN CANT LEAVE THE HOUSE WITHOUT A MALE ESCORT .
YOU PARENTS TELLING YOU WHOM TO MARRY .
WOMEN CANT DRIVE CARS
you are held responsable if any member of your family leaves the church

you rob some one they cut off your hand
you have sex out of wed lock you can be stoned to death

than you may have at it i will buy your plane ticket
E a biodiversidade?
written by André, March 07, 2008
I think one threat to Amazonia is the lack of knowledge, among Brazilains, of its biodiversity. One way to intall some respect and get the attention of Brazilians on the issue would be to make them aware of what they stand to lose. Amazonia is not just a functional resource providing "ecosystem services" to an internationalized world (in fact research show that its role as a carbon sink may not be that significant, with algal blooms in the oceans soaking up most of the problem), it's home to a unique variaty of wired and wonderful things, which Brazilians should value for their own sake, like they value a song by Chico Buarque or a painting by Tarsila do Amaral.

We need to develop a culture which admires and strives to understand all the riches contained, not only in Amazonia, but also the Cerrado and all other great Brazilian biomes. Obvisously, this in not the "answer" but it at least mey be part of suite of solutions needed.
...
written by bo, March 15, 2008
ÉPOCA – Os EUA são constantemente citados como parte possivelmente interessada na internacionalização da Amazônia. Isso é verdade?
Condoleezza – Mentira. O Brasil é um país abençoado com esses recursos naturais grandiosos. Qualquer pessoa no mundo quer vê-lo protegido, e todos querem vê-lo desenvolvido. Nós trabalharemos com o Brasil de todas as formas. Essa história de internacionalizar a Amazônia é um falso rumor. Os EUA não defendem a internacionalização da Amazônia.
For ABE Part 1
written by Shely, March 16, 2008
They don't need to care about anything at all. The Amazon is ours, period. There are more than 20 million Brazilian living there and they need roads and infrastructure.

Foreigners tend to romantisize the forest as some untouchable garden. It is not. It must be explored. The only difference is that it should be done rationally instead of how it is done right now. And if we don't, someone else will. The first thing Europeans or Americans would do is to create a consortium of companies and divide it in parts for them to explore under the pretext that "it is the only way to be sure it is being protected" and promising to be "environmentally friend" while doing it.

Those who don't know this horses**t that buy it. We aren't interested.



Abe, the megaprojects in the 70's have we learned anything about them? Infrastructure and agriculture are currently the two issues causing the deforestation of the Amazon. By the way, if you read any scholarly paper on this issue (Conservation Biology has a whole issue dedicated to the conservation history in Brazil, volume 19 issue 3 2005), Brazilian scientists are against megadevelopment in the the Amazon. The Landless movement together with private owners are responsible for 70% of the deforestation in Brazil (figure given by Marina Silva head of IBAMA).
Abe, you see the Amazon as a pure anthropocentric value. However you forget its biological value to all mankind and the animals that are part of this interconnected biome. To you the Manatee is not worth saving if it means putting $$$ in bank accounts. You are not much different from some American-which you like to bash as capitalists animals. SUSTAINABLE DEVELOPMENT is not possible in the Amazon. This has to do with SOIL composition and stratification, nothing to do with foreigners wanting to "invade" Brazil. Your fear could be solved by the Brazilian government, they could impede foreigners from purchasing land in Brazil-it won't happen, in the end money talks! Who is at fault here the Brazilian Gov or the people you despise?

Go and learn about soil composition, in the end to increase productivity more fertilizers will be needed and further incursion into other parts of the forest will occur. Much like in Africa, after 8 years or so, the soil won't give the same yields. Sustainable development can only be accomplished if a set of strict guidelines are followed. In Brazil, I can only think of one place where it has been a success and it is around the Poco das Antas Biological Reserve. There are other out there, but NGOs are spending a lot of money educating the farmers on this issue. You should ask yourself, what will I leave to the next generation? Will I leave a Biome for all to enjoy or do I want all? I am all for the Evolutionary Land Ethics, but not your pure economic value of the Amazon because our forest represents more than just a cash opportunity.

An article:http://www.ipsterraviva.net/tv/wsf2005/viewstory.asp?idnews=146

MARINA SILVA :
ENVIRONMENT - THE FRAGILE BALANCE OF A MINISTRY
By Adalberto Wodianer Marcondes

The development agenda of the Lula government for the next two years is the biggest challenge confronting Brazil's Environment Minister Marina da Silva. In her first two years at the helm of the ministry, she faced strong criticism from the business sector and some economists because of the delays by Ibama, an environmental agency, in releasing permits for many projects. In the hallways of the meetings between government and the private sector, the word was that the Ministry of Environment was standing in the way of Brazil's economic growth.

Part 2
written by Shely, March 16, 2008
A woman born in the Amazon, accustomed to confronting and overcoming challenges, Marina da Silva does not crumble when faced with a reality in which transgenic seeds are being smuggled into the country, almost 24,000 hectares of Amazon forest are destroyed each year, and the government itself invests in infrastructure works like diverting the São Francisco River and building the BR 163 highway that is connect Brasília to Santarém, crossing indigenous lands and sensitive ecosystems. "I don't admit defeat, just challenges that must be overcome," she says with confidence.

Community Oversight

Da Silva has laid out four guidelines for the Ministry's activities over the next two years. Social participation, through community involvement in formulating local environmental policies; sustainable development, with practical changes in the productive process; the National Environmental System, which will be created by hiring new teams for Ibama and other agencies; and carrying out an Integrated Environmental Policy, coordinating actions with other ministries and state and local governments. "Our ministry is new. It's only 13 years old, and it needs to be rebuilt," she says.

The main cards played by the Ministry of Environment in confronting the powerful economic interests behind the big infrastructure projects is prior licensing -- in which environmental permits must be obtained before any work begins -- and the incorporation of sustainability clauses, from the beginning of the project to the financing to project completion. "The financing agents, whether international institutions or Brazilian development banks, should be verifying the environmental impacts of what their money is paying for," says the minister.

She believes structural polices in the environmental arena could open the way to a more sustainable economy. One example is the two million hectares of tropical forest certified during her term. Da Silva says her ministry, along with the federal police, army, and federal highway police, conducted 32 investigative operations of activities in forested areas. The officials seized machinery and 170,000 square metres of illegal lumber in two years, she says.

However, some of the ministry's claims are being challenged by the coordinator of Greenpeace Brazil's Amazonian campaign, Paulo Adário, who says only one such operation had taken place as of October 2004. "We can't say anything about what happened in November and December, because we didn't monitor the activity then. But before we were tracking their work and we found only one major operation, in the municipality of Itaituba, in Pará," said Adário. He stressed that even the ministry had carried out the 32 operations, it would be half of what was called for under the National Plan to Combat Deforestation.

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