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White Lie: Poverty in Brazil Has No Color PDF Print E-mail
2005 - April 2005
Written by Dayanne Mikevis and Matthew Flynn   
Monday, 18 April 2005 16:52

Brazilian family living in a favela - shantytownA little more than a century after the abolition of black slavery in the Americas, economic and other forms of racial discrimination remain its dismal legacy. In Brazil , the black civil rights movement barely began to get underway in the 1990s.

Its delay is due to repression of anyone who rejected the carefully nurtured myth of the existence of racial justice. But with a long history of black resistance and with global solidarity, activists have broken the institutional barrier to achieving affirmative action measures and agencies in a matter of years.

Nongovernmental organizations are pointing the way toward better access for black constituents in health care, housing, crime protection, education, and career fields. As black equality proponents impact policy, their agenda strengthens the broader platform supporting social equity in the hemisphere, but they have a lot more work cut out for them.

March 21, 2005: It was just another day for Brazilian media. The local papers published their usual articles on crimes, corruption, human interest, and political rhetoric, all as if it were really news. An article mentioned that this was the Day for Elimination of All Forms of Segregation.

The lack of fanfare for the unique commemoration that was widely publicized when it was proclaimed exactly two years earlier demonstrated the gaping fissure separating present reality from the noble cause of the proclamation. Sparse coverage reflected under-representation of blacks in newsrooms.

The absence of speeches and marches belied officialdom's commitment to desegregation. Yet it was a landmark occasion when on that date in 2003, Brazilian President Luiz Inácio Lula da Silva solemnly declared the creation of the Secretariat for Racial Equality.

That meant Brazil's Black African Movement had gained a place within the country's political administration for the first time ever. Its minister, Matilde Ribeiro, is militant, black, and feminist.

What's more, she is not the only activist in the secretariat; other members come from organizations, such as Geledes and Fala Preta!, that fight against prolonging historical racism and marginalization.

History of Oppression, Resistance

Slavery in Brazil, like in other parts of the Americas, was horrendous and brutal. As an act of resistance to forced labor and mistreatment, slaves who fled plantations and mines established liberated communities, known as quilombos.

"Afro-Brazilians have a strong tradition of political mobilization that dates back to colonial times, which has helped them develop their own identity and craft strategies to combat white oppression and discrimination," explains Raquel de Souza, an Afro-Brazilian researcher at the University of Texas, Austin, who is an activist affiliated with the Race and Democracy in the Americas project.

Blacks no longer had to flee from forced labor after Brazil legally ended race slavery in 1888, the last country in the Americas to do so. But society shunned them, and official policies subsidized European immigration to hinder their economic integration. These policies aimed at diluting the strength of the African and Afro-Brazilian majority.

Instead of paying newly freed blacks and stimulating their inclusion in the labor market, coffee plantation owners encouraged migrant workers from Europe to receive wages.

"Here blacks were the last workers employed in the labor market, which forced them to create ways to survive outside the system," says political scientist João Batista Pereira from the University of São Paulo. "That's the case of favelas (shantytowns) in Rio de Janeiro , for example."

Although black slaves formally regained their freedom over a century ago, their descendants have been condemned to the bottom of the wage hierarchy.

Most of the employed are domestic servants in the homes of Brazil's wealthy, middle class and even working class, or they suffer as poor farmers and manual laborers in the countryside.

The largest concentrations of blacks are in northeast and northern Brazil, the poorest area of the country and the very same one where colonial exploitation of slave labor was the most severe.

While many Brazilians attempt to disassociate racism from poverty, government statistics fail them. Almost one third of the population is living under the official poverty line, and blacks account for 70% of the poor, according to the federal research institute IPEA.

Work by economist Marcelo Paixão reveals that the Human Development Index for blacks is 20% lower than it is for whites.

"Poverty has a color in Brazil , and that is our color," says Wania Sant'Anna, a professor at the Federal University of Rio de Janeiro and ex-secretary of state in Rio de Janeiro.

Myth of Racial Democracy

Many factors help explain why the struggle for racial equality in Brazil has lagged behind other countries that also have multiracial populations and histories of slavery, such as the United States.

Historian Thomas Skidmore says belief in the "myth of racial democracy" held by whites also has been assimilated by African descendants in Brazil. The myth undercuts arguments that blame discrimination for inequality.

The first element in the belief is that class weighs heavier than race in determining one's life chances.

Second, believers think the nature of the patrimonial state and patron-client relationships are what vitiate attempts to mobilize for social parity.

Third, the absence of specific laws mandating segregation, such as the so-called Jim Crow laws enforced in the United States until the 1960s, has rendered the race problem more difficult to address.

The invisible rules subtly mitigate against solidarity for the cause of equal opportunities for blacks that otherwise would come from Brazilians of mixed race.

Brazilian sociologist Gilberto Freire was at the forefront of developing the concept of racial democracy in the past century. Despite Brazil's racial inequities, rooted in vile slavery, Freire romanticized Brazil's colonial past and portrayed a harmonious coexistence between masters and slaves.

He depicted Brazil as a land of racial harmony in which different races and cultures fused through extensive miscegenation, allegedly eliminating racial tensions and prejudice over time.

When white elites adopted this ideology back in the 1930s, Brazil was neither democratic nor a racial utopia. But by embracing the myth that no racial problem existed, elites could avoid the potentially explosive issue of de facto apartheid.

Another reason why racial issues barely have been addressed is that authoritarian regimes have repressed civil society. Getúlio Vargas, the strongman of Brazil from 1930 to 1945, outlawed black associations as well as other groups concerned with ethnic and immigrant status.

Discourse about the rights of Afro-Brazilians or development of black newspapers was not possible because "everybody was a son of the state," according to Vargas' fascist-influenced ideology. A surge of black militancy occurred after Vargas' death, only to be crushed by the dictatorship that came to power in a 1964 coup.

The kind of civil rights mobilization seen in the United States was not possible in Brazil due to the greater degree of repression faced by all groups demanding racial justice. Because of their skin color, militants for black rights often suffered more at the hands of the military's secret police than white, middle-class communists.

Only with organization of civil society during the democratic opening of the 1980s did the subject of racial equality begin to be addressed in academic circles and the public sector at large. At this time, the Unified Black Movement (Movimento Negro Unificado) started to operate openly.

José Vicente, founder of one organization of the contemporary Afro-Brazilian militancy, Afrobrás, says that incorporation of black people into the political system was significant during the decade but none of the appointed Afro-Brazilian representatives had a discourse explicitly aimed at addressing the black question.

A new beginning for Afro-Brazilian militancy came in the 1990s, especially after the initial success of a new economic plan (Plano Real) when Brazilians started to have more money to support a consumer-based economy.

At this time, the first magazine for a black audience, Raça Brasil, hit the shelves. When Raça appeared on the streets, a new discussion sprang up in Brazil. Many people alleged that a magazine made by and for black people was racist.

Whites accused its publishers and readers of being "black racists." A parallel discussion ensued concerning Brazilian history: Who was black and who had the right to say what was black?

The 1990s witnessed the professionalization of the Black African movement with the creation and proliferation of nongovernmental organizations (NGOs), including Afrobrás and Educafro.

Burgeoning domestic social mobilization and international pressure led the administration of President Fernando Henrique Cardoso (1994-2002) to admit the fallacy of the racial democracy myth and acknowledge that racism was a social problem worthy of debate.

This was a significant step toward redressing the condition of Afro-Brazilians, since policies focused on the legacy of black people in Brazil could not be achieved while denying the existence of racism.

Political Inclusion, But Little Progress

The reestablishment of democracy in Brazil has led to some advancement in tackling racial disparities but progress has been slow. On a positive note, one of the most important works led by the federal government is to provide land tenure on quilombos to the descendants of escaped slaves. And in government itself, agencies have been established to deal with race issues.

Beyond the federal administration's creation of the Secretariat for Racial Equality, states and cities also are setting up offices to handle race issues. Activists from groups struggling for racial justice are managing them.

"It's a fact with two consequences: One of them is that for the first time, those groups have some kind of voice that can be heard. But on the other hand, the organizations have more patience now to wait for actions on behalf of the government," said anthropologist José Batista Ribeiro, from the University of São Paulo.

Success in establishing government agencies concerned with racial equality is partially attributed to collaborative efforts between Afro-Brazilian militants and international organizations.

The World Conference against Racism, Racial Discrimination, Xenophobia and Related Intolerance held in Durban, South Africa, in 2001, is considered a watershed event in forcing Brazil to seriously discuss how to resolve its racial problems.

One important source of information dispelling myths about racial disparities has been the comprehensive studies undertaken by the IPEA research institute.

"This kind of effort - based on hard data, empirical evidence, and serious analysis - has helped provide an invaluable framework for discussions between government officials and civil society, an essential first step in the design and implementation of effective public polices," assert Luiz Barcelos and Rachel Menezes from the Inter-American Dialogue, a U.S. policy analysis center.

While activists' involvement in development policy is a major achievement, some worry that it could result in the movement's cooptation.

"I'm proud in seeing black people involved in politics, and I think it is a great opportunity to be inside the government," says Batista, who recalls the time when only white people developed policies for black people. "But the movement lines cannot be erased because of that."

A major concern is the paucity of resources available for carrying out social programs, as in Ribeiro's case at the Secretariat for Racial Equality.

"A minister without a ministry and a secretariat without budget," Afrobrás' Vicente calls it. "With the budget she has, she will not be able to do anything substantial."

The Folha de S. Paulo newspaper wrote that, after one year in existence, the secretariat had been able only to raise the issue of affirmative action in the country's university system, yet had not taken any steps for it to become a reality.

Finally, in May 2004, a legal measure was approved that allowed federal universities to use a quota system. The irony is that the document outlining the program did not come from the secretariat but rather from the Ministry of Education.

Two criteria can be used in the quota system, skin color and social class. According to the Brazilian newspaper O Globo, some universities have worked on a quota system but most have preferred not to implement one. Schools that adopted affirmative action policies have shown positive results.

In the Federal University of Rio de Janeiro, the students who could afford being in university via the affirmative action program had better grades than those who did not.

In either case, many Afro-Brazilians remain at a disadvantage when taking the entrance exam without having studied in an expensive preparatory course called a cursinho.

An article in the conservative newspaper O Estado de S. Paulo bluntly put it: "The quota system needs a cursinho."

The newfound comprehension of racial problems seems to have divided government representatives and reveals the challenges in promoting other social programs, such as in the area of employment.

Fernando Haddad, a policymaker at the Ministry of Education, said, "We discussed and we cannot construct a quota system based only on race because that will just help the black middle class or rich."

But Ribeiro and most Afro-Brazilians defend the quota system and other affirmative action programs. "Tell me where are the black middle and upper classes?" Sant'Anna demands. "We have one or another exception who has ascended the social ladder because of some special talent, in general linked to sports activity."

Raquel de Souza emphasizes that blacks are entitled to affirmative action and other measures aimed at compensating for years of educational, economic, and political exclusion.

"It is at least ironic that there is so much opposition to these compensatory policies for Afro-Brazilians because the history of Brazil provides evidence of white affirmative action particularly when white immigration to Brazil was being advocated and subsidized by the white Brazilian elite," she says.

Actions by Nongovernmental Organizations

Many progressive groups have taken the initiative in addressing the gap left unfilled by government initiatives. Batista notes, "In the university, things have also changed, just a little bit, but they have changed. Now we have blacks studying their own problems and trying to find solutions for those issues."

One success has been the establishment of the Zumbi dos Palmares College by Afrobrás. The institution, the first designed to offer bachelor degrees especially for Afro-Brazilians, is named after a hero of the Palmares quilombo who defended it against attacks from colonial forces.

Establishing the university was no easy feat but was in fact easier than implementing quotas, since it did not encroach on the established privileges of whites. Financial backing for the Zumbi dos Palmares College came from state government, Unip (a large private university system in Brazil), and some others sources, including the American Chamber of Commerce.

The key to the success of the program, however, could only come from the Ministry of Education, which had to approve contents linked to black history, identity, and foundations. After convincing the ministry, Vicente from Afrobrás then garnered support from the media.

"The answer was positive because the institutions are controlled by white people and public universities were not the target of this kind of action," says Sant'Anna.

"I'm not saying that what Vicente did is not a big thing. It is a huge thing. He is doing a great work, but the reason why he received such support is clear." Afrobrás is now searching for ways to establish a graduate degree at the school.

Another activist in the area of black education is Frei David. He directs Educafro, which gives cursinhos to prepare black students to enter universities.

One professor of Educafro, Melissa Carnelos, said that "people want to go to the university, but it is too hard to work with them sometimes because there is a kind of inferiority feeling still. After discussing the issue, some students felt encouraged to go to free art exhibitions, as an example. They need to discover themselves; and last week we went to a recently inaugurated black Brazilian museum at the Ibirapuera park. It was our best class to date."

Despite some shining examples of success, more widespread changes remain a distant dream. In the last campus census, the University of São Paulo listed only 9% of its students as blacks, while the official statistics institute IBGE estimates that almost 50% of the Brazilian population is Afro-descendant.

Persisting Issues

The Afro-Brazilian movement continues to struggle against many other impediments. One fundamental concern is health care: Not only do blacks lack the resources to obtain proper care, but they also suffer from deficient research and treatment of diseases prevalent in people of African descent.

Many people, despite their white complexions, have African ancestry and remain susceptible to such diseases. "They took my baby and said they did not know what the problem was. After all the exams, the doctor told me he had falciform anemia, but he doubted the exam results because I'm white, and he said that it is a black people's disease," declared Sheila Onorico, a white woman with black ancestors.

"For the first time in my life, I started to feel outside the system. Almost no one has an idea of my child's problem. Hospitals did not know how to proceed, and sometimes they asked me if my husband was black, but in an invasive way, as if I was breaking a rule."

Onorico eventually did find treatment, but the problem perplexed her. "I asked myself: Why is it that a disease that has been known for some time has not been researched and obtained funding? I cannot help but think that this has something to do with color."

Last year was the first time that a medical congress in São Paulo decided to discuss black people and the public health system.

Organizations such as Fala Preta! and Criola play a very important role in fighting racial oppression and prejudice in Brazil. These organizations focus their efforts on issues that concern black women in particular.

Afro-Brazilian women have to endure discrimination based on their racial ancestry that is further exacerbated by sexism and class differences. These organizations deal with domestic violence, health care, reproductive rights, and related issues.

Another grave problem affecting blacks is violence. In Brazil's poor shantytowns, called favelas, endemic violence results in barely one in three black men reaching the age of 19, according to historian Marcos Alvito.

Media and policymakers discuss the rise of drug traffic and crime resulting from socio-economic exclusion. But the issues' racial dimension gets short shrift.

"The main problem is to admit that this is a racial problem. When black people are murdered by police forces, it is usually framed in the mainstream media, and even in academic and political circles, as violence against the poor or as a form of combating drug trafficking, and not portrayed as violence against blacks," says De Souza.

He adds that official statistics are not concerned with the racial background of those who are victimized by urban violence.

Finally, outside of the favelas, blacks who obtain a degree of social mobility continue to face racism that is passed down from generation to generation. The socio-political and historical configurations of Brazil create a context in which lower class status is directly associated with African ancestry.

The case of Sant'Anna illustrates this problem. Despite living in a wealthy neighborhood in Rio de Janeiro, Sant'Anna is mistaken as a maid and her children are mistreated by others.

"People say to me that Brazil is not a racist country, but how can those other children offend mine if they did not learn it some place? And more, they see black servants being mistreated and consider this is normal," she said.

After 500 years of white oppression, change should not be expected overnight. Abdias do Nascimento, a former senator who has been an Afro-Brazilian militant for most of his 90 years of life, sums up the continuing struggle.

"Blacks lack everything to obtain equality promised by democracy. Where are the black people? Only in the shantytowns, only in these police shenanigans because they have nothing: no work, no housing, nor effective health care, and no education that equals that of whites," he was quoted as saying by the BBC.

At the forefront of the current struggle of Afro-Brazilians is access to education, one of the main keys to more widespread social, economic, and political inclusion.

Afro-Brazilians have played a major role in establishing Brazil as one of the largest economies in the world; it is only fair that they should equally reap the benefits of their participation in building the Brazilian nation.

-------------------------------

Key Challenges

Brazil was the last country to abolish slavery, and the legacy persists.

Uneven development has left larger black population in poorest regions of the country.

Elite repression, clientelism and paternalism have thwarted independent organizing by civil society.

Most of society denies a racial problem exists.

Employers discriminate based on skin color and link it to class background.

Historic marginalization has forced blacks to take the worse-paying and least desirable jobs.

Roughly 90% of those living in poverty are black; almost a third of the country is below the poverty line.

Blacks experience discrimination in health care provision and research.

In poor shantytowns, rampant violence results in barely one in three black men reaching the age of 19.

-------------------------------------

Black Activists' Agenda

Institutionalize debate and discussion about the nature of Brazil's racial problems. Implement affirmative action programs conducive to the advancement of blacks.

Enact laws that punish employers and others for discriminating against blacks.

Dismantle police forces that target black youth.

Provide social services to end drug abuse, violence, poor housing; increase education, opportunities, and social mobility.

Promote black pride in unique culture, history, and identity.

Rescue black history and rewrite textbooks to include its importance in Brazil's past.

Push for affirmative action to increase the number of blacks in media and assure better roles.

Raise awareness about unfair treatment of Afro-Brazilians in the health sector.

Combat ingrained racism throughout Brazilian society.

----------------------------------------

Tactics and Strategy

Activists and officials lobby agencies to enact laws that work toward racial justice.

Campaigns, protests, and debates raise awareness and visibility of discrimination and race issues.

Unique musical, religious, and other cultural traditions spread messages.

Nongovernmental organizations establish schools and universities for blacks to study race issues.

International alliances with other black activists throughout the African Diaspora aim to obtain resources, exchange ideas, and promote common agenda.

Collaborative efforts between black activists and international civil organizations can apply pressure on the government to address the problem of racial hierarchies in Brazil.

----------------------------------------------

Resources

Secretariat for Racial Equality (SEPPIR)
Esplanada dos Ministérios, Bloco A, 9º andar
CEP: 70054-900, Brasília, DF, Brasil
Tel: (55 61) 411-3610
Email:
seppir@planalto.gov,br
Web: http://www.presidencia.gov.br/seppir/

UNDP
Policy Evaluation Unit and Local Development Unit
SCN Quadra 2 Bloc "A: - 7 andar
Ed. Corporate Financial Center
70712-901 Brasilia-DF
Tel: 61-329-2043
Web:
http://www.undp.org.br/unv/

Fala Preta!
R. Vergueiro, 434, 3º andar
Aclimação,
CEP 01504-000 São Paulo , SP
Tel: 11 3277-4727
Email:
falapreta@falapreta.org,br
Web: http://www.falapreta.org.br/

Criola
Avenida Presidente Vargas 482, sobreloja 203, Centro.
Rio de Janeiro , RJ, 20071-000
Telfax: (21) 2518-6194/ 2518-7964
Email:
criola@criola.org,br

Geledés - Instituto da Mulher Negra
Endereço: Rua Santa Isabel , 137 - 4º andar
Vila Buarque
CEP: 01221-000, São Paulo , SP
Tel: (11) 3333-3444
Email:
geledes@geledes.org,br
Web: http://www.geledes.org.br/

Rede Nova Abolicionista
Rua das Palmeiras, 90 - Botafogo - Rio de Janeiro - RJ
22270-170 - Brasil
Tel: 21 286-1441
Fax: 21 286-1209

AFROBRÁS
Web:
http://www.afrobras.org.br/

EDUCAFRO
Web:
http://www.educafro.org.br/

Ministry of Education
Web:
http://www.mec.gov.br/

International Human Rights Association
of American Minorities (IHRAAM)
1 - 5765 Turner Rd., Ste. 117
Nanaimo , BC . V9T 6M4, Canada
Telfax: 250-758-0449
Email:
ihraam@usa.net

IPEA (Institute for Applied Economic Research)
SBS - Quadra 1 - Bloco J - Ed. BNDES - Térreo
70076-900 - Brasília - DF, Brasil
Tel: +55 61 315-5000 - Fax: +55 61 321-1597
Web:
http://www.ipea.gov.br/

This article was originally published by the Americas Program at the International Relations Center (IRC) - www.irc-online.org and www.americaspolicy.org.

Dayanne Mikevis is a freelance journalist based in São Paulo. Matthew Flynn is a freelance journalist and graduate student in sociology at the University of Texas, Austin.



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Comments (91)Add Comment
More Waist of words
written by Guest, April 19, 2005
What happens in the past never should be a reason for you not be able to achieve what you are looking for in the present of future.

today in Brazil you are free to go to any school you want.IF you want to go to USP make sure that you (Black or White) teach you kids the importance of Education. You don't need the GVT to tell you that.

If you are black or white plan before you have kids. If you can only provide for one kid ,please have only one


Library in Brazil in most cities are free. I went there many times and the place was most of the time Empty..

If you save the money that you proable spend in Soccer tickets(Black and white) you maybe after 20 years enough money for you kid to go to public or private college.


Library i most of the big city in Brazil are free and the only thing you need to get into to USP is to pass the test.


You can find all the Books you need free of charge with all the subjects that you will find the test entrance exam

One thing is Driscrimmination and other is blocking changes for better thenselves. Brazil give you tons of chances,Black and white.


In Brazil you also can find tons of poor white people.

You make you future. I hear that from a Black person in Brazil. Stop Blamming the problems of your life in the past and be pro-active

If people don't give you a chance ,build with your friends(Black or White ) the network that will enable you to help you and other people.

Stop with this non=sense Neo Sociallist

i'm nobody

i need you to go a head in life.


I disagree
written by Guest, April 19, 2005
While the article addresses a few serious issues, such as police targeting black people, it is full of misleading ideas and wrong data.
Just to give a few examples, the article says that almost 1/3 of the Brazilian population lives bellow the poverty line, this is a completely wrong. The correct number is 22% (please, check the CIA World Factbook). Also it is full of unproven and, clearly mistaken statements, e.g. white communists being better treated than black ones during the military dictatorship in the sixties-seventies (nonsense). Another example: the article compares the percentage of blacks at the university of Sao Paulo (USP) to the percentage of blacks in Brazil (the correct would be to compare the percentage of blacks at USP to the percentage of blacks in the state of Sao Paulo or the percentage of Blacks among the people taking the entrance examinations). Those mistakes appear here and there in the article.
However, the most serious problem with the article is its argument that the current social inequalities between blacks and whites in Brazil are caused by active discrimination in the society nowadays. This is far from being true (even tough it is reasonable to argue that this inequality has historical roots). Nowadays, a black child can have, in theory, access to basic education, health care, public libraries, exactly like a white child. If it does not happen, it is due to socio-economical problems rather than racial ones.
The part which most amazed me is their defense of affirmative actions in Brazil (they argue mostly about access to universities). While in the U.S. (where entrance procedures are subjective and racism can take place in it) those actions could be of some use, in Brazil, entrance to universities are completely fair and objective procedures, based solely on an examination. Granting a place at a university to someone obviously incapacitated to obtaining a degree will further increase the already high rate of drop-outs.
Surely, something has to be made so that we can overcome the effects of slavery in Brazil. Implementing welfare programs for the most impoverished ones (mostly black according to the article) is one way. Making sure that most poor Brazilians have access to a decent education is another. Putting inside the heads of our youth that because of their skin color they are handicapped and need the state intervention to finish their education is not the right way to go.
No doubt
written by Guest, April 19, 2005
No doubt the two posters above are prime examples of blacks that have pulled themselves up by their own bootstraps in spite of the socioeconomic conditions that they have inherited and lived their lives free from racism in Brasil and therefore know more than enyone else. Well, actually, I do doubt that. In fact, there is no doubt that they have no idea what they are talking about and should keep their traps shut.
Know-nothing
written by Guest, April 19, 2005
Article: "Almost one third of the population is living under the official poverty line, and blacks account for 70% of the poor, according to the federal research institute IPEA."

Know-it-all: "The correct number is 22% (please, check the CIA World Factbook)"

Oh, I'm sure the CIA knows more than Brasilians themselves; after all, North Americans know everything!

I'm also sure you think that the population of the University of São Paulo, the largest city in Brasil, should not be representative of the population of students in Brasil. I'm sure you think that 9% is a fair representation of blacks in São Paulo.

I'm sure you think you are a genius. You think you know what you're talking about. You think you have the answers to the problems of Brasil.

You have convinced me of one thing: You are a know-nothing loudmouth talking out of your ass.
Who is black in Brazil?
written by Guest, April 19, 2005
Since, I was toddle my mother used to call me Negro. I grew up in a poor neighbourhood. However, I struggled in my life. I wanted to be somebody. I wanted to make the difference. I believed that I could make something positive for my country.
I went to study Pharmacy, later I became a graduated student at Federal University of Parana. In my graduated program people used to call me by a nickname, Indian. So, I was not anymore a Negro as my mother used to call me but a native. Later, I went to USA in this kind of program that the white man calls pos doctoral but is a way to have cheap lab technicians.
In the USA, I discovered that I was white man. Since white people used to open the doors to me and black people used to look at me with angry eyes.
When I returned from the USA, the Federal University of Parana has an open for a Temporary Professor in Organic Chemistry. I applied for such position. I had a good number of papers, a PhD in Biochemistry done in the Carbohydrate Chemistry. I had experience in two big Universities in the USA. I was fresh and willing to work hard and make my way.
It was a big surprise that the position was giving to a young, blond lady that had finished an undergraduate program in this University in the same year. However, she was very gorgeous, blond, blue eyes, beautiful body; she was ready to take the position. So, far I make this question to myself. If there is no racism in Brazil, the dick of whom she was sucking?
In Brazil there is racism and a lot but people want to deny. I have black heritage, I have native heritage, and I have Spanish, Portuguese, Italian, Arabic and Jews. I am proud of that. I can be the head of the United Nations for that.
From such experience at Federal University of Parana, I decided that was better to try the life out of Brazil. I immigrated to Canada. Today, I look back and I do not feel sorry to change countries.

Half year ago, my grand mother was still alive. My cousin, a blond girl was taken care of her. One day my cousin sent me an e-mail with the follow words:

Yesterday, our grand mother received the visit of her brother. I never saw him before.
Do you know that he is black?

I was shocked with my cousin, we grew up together and now she was almost 40 years old and she never realized that our grand mother was black.

I am a black man in spite to look white and I feel proud of it. In Brazil, I had one wife that she had Austrian Heritage. Her parents were illiterate; she bared finished high school and never worked in her entire life. However, I was fed up to hear the aeiou from her, the Austrian was born to govern the world. She still thinks that she is from a superior race.


So, who is black in Brazil?

• Pharmaceutical R&D Technology Post Diploma 2003 - 2004
Toronto Institute of Pharmaceutical Technology – Canada
• Industrial Pharmaceutical Technology Post Diploma 2001 - 2002
Faculty of Technology, Seneca College, Toronto
• Chemical Technology Diploma 1998 - 2001
Faculty of Technology, Seneca College, Toronto
• PhD.Sc. Biochemistry Program 1988 - 1993
Centre Polytechnique, Parana University, Brazil
• B.S. in Pharmacy 1983 - 1986
University of Santa Catarina, Brazil.

You are what you want to be!
written by Guest, April 19, 2005
And if you dont want to be...be something else
Poverty Knows NO Stripe
written by Guest, April 19, 2005
Poverty plagues people of ALL races. And the main cause of poverty is socio-economic injustice.
white people are the main racists
written by Guest, April 19, 2005
white people are the main racists, which deny black, mestizo, mulatto, and indigenous people their fair share of the resources of the land.

white people are the main racist and they will fight to keep on or hold on to their privileges.

white privilege is the main problem.

This article is very good and the author speaks true and correct things. but the white oligarchy is the main enemy and what brazil needs is a socialist and communist revolution, like in Venezuela and Cuba.

...
written by Guest, April 20, 2005
if you say whites and blacks will never get along your are called a racist! if you say Blacks and whites can get along you are called a liar! there is no right answer!! I prefer to be with my own kind so call me what you want!!
What color is money?
written by Guest, April 20, 2005
Why don't we discriminate money for its color? Here in Brazil and in any part of the world the financial condition of an individual is what matters. In our capitalist society if you have money, it does not matter what is your color skin, you acceptable in the society, your rights are granted. The "black poverty" was inherited from the time when Brazil was colonized and the "white poverty" was created by the unfair capitalism. We have to tackle racial discrimination and poverty by making laws (and ensure that they work) to intergrate poor people into the society, without looking at their color skin. We can work to repair the injustice of the past without having to create special laws to assist black people, for me it's too a sort of racial discrimination, and politicians use this to promote themselves. If everyone has access to the basic rights, like housing, good education, health and job, the problems would be easier to deal with.
Okay
written by Guest, April 20, 2005
"I prefer to be with my own kind so call me what you want!!" Your kind is small minded a*****es? That's what I'll call you then, okay?
from the author of the second post
written by Guest, April 21, 2005
I was very surprised at the Ad Hominem arguments against my post. I just tried to show that the article was rather an agglomerate of common places rather than a well researched and carefully analyzed piece of work.
I thought that it would be obvious to everyone in this forum that just granting privileged access to blacks to teaching institutions will not solve our racial inequality’ problem.
In this nice paper (http://www.preal.cl/FIE/pdf/lopbc/Bonamino.pdf) it is shown that even tough the differences, in Brazil, among blacks, browns and whites regarding access to education are decreasing, differences in academic performance among those groups have been steadily increasing. That is, we are replacing our existing inequality by another one of a different kind.

Just answering a previous post: I am a Brazilian (from the northeast part of Brazil) of mixed race. My grandparents were illiterate and my parents could not go to college (actually, my mother hasn’t finished junior high-school). Even tough my parents could not afford a good education for themselves, they made sure their sons and daughters had one. I attended a public university in Brazil and later obtained a Ph.D. from a prestigious American university. Nowadays, I work for one of the biggest telecommunication companies in the world, as a research scientist. I do not say this to brag about myself (if I achieved anything, it because of my parents) but just to show that social mobility DOES exist in Brazil, even for blacks or people of mixed races. Nothing, but economical reasons, prevents these people from fully developing their potential.
...
written by Guest, April 21, 2005
""I prefer to be with my own kind so call me what you want!!" Your kind is small minded a*****es? That's what I'll call you then, okay?""
Small minds create small problems Big minds create Big problems ! You just create foul language!
from the author of the second post
written by Guest, April 21, 2005
I did not write the above post ...
WHOS WHAT
written by Guest, April 21, 2005
WHOS BROWN WHOS BLACK WHOS WHITE IN BRASIL?

AND WE KNOW INDIANS ARE INDIAN.

IVE SEEN SOME BLACKS WITH DARK BROWN SKIN DOES THAT MAKE THEM NOT BLACK?

MULLATOS WITH DARK BROWN SKIN? DOE THAT MAKE THEM BLACK
WHOS WHAT
written by Guest, April 21, 2005
WHOS BROWN WHOS BLACK WHOS WHITE IN BRASIL?

AND WE KNOW INDIANS ARE INDIAN.

IVE SEEN SOME BLACKS WITH DARK BROWN SKIN DOES THAT MAKE THEM NOT BLACK?

MULLATOS WITH DARK BROWN SKIN? DOE THAT MAKE THEM BLACK
...
written by Guest, April 22, 2005
Racism still exists I don't care what people say or how much they try to deny it. Yes some black people despite the hardships were able to make something of themselves but that does not mean racism ceased to exist it just means that they are part of a small group of supertalented individuals.

Unlike the Jews, blacks were given NO form of reparations from the respective slaveholding governments who profited off their labor for centuries. Not one slave holding country was forced to pay a fair wage to black slaves or their descendants while freely opening up opportunities to white and other non black immigrants. Matter of fact these countries subsidized white immigration so that they would NOT have to pay a fair wage to blacks.

Now black people are supposed to just jump in there and make it. This despite the fact that racism today is no less than it was 500 years ago. It has not changed. To those who tell blacks to stop whining and complaining and whining about the past (as if racism is in the past) you obviously are not black. The same opportunities out there for you are not there for blacks.

As a black North American I can say that while there have been some gains for black Americans, they have been far less than those for other racial groups and oftentimes the black person must be far better prepared and far better qualified to get half as far.

Blacks will just have to keep fighting until we get out just due. As long as white supremacy is the law of the universe don't think that white people are going to freely share the wealth and goods. They haven't done it for the past 500 years and they are not going to start now. In the US many still stoop to the racial inferiority myth to justify why blacks have not achieved more in life as if the white power structure has ever allowed us to achieve more.

Racism exists and as long as white people are in power it will always exist on some level.
...
written by Guest, April 22, 2005
The reason why blacks have not achieved much in the past 500 years there is only one reason - RACISM!
Stop with all of the "pull yourselves up by the bootstraps" bullshyt! If you can't afford the boots how is one supposed to achieve such a magical feat!
...
written by Guest, April 22, 2005
There may be poor white people in this world but black poverty worldwide is far greater than that of any other race and the white people who live below the poverty line are in far fewer numbers than blacks also poor whites still have far better opportunities for advancement than blacks.
...
written by Guest, April 22, 2005
all of this racist talk can start a race War! and Anti semitism! PLEASE STOP!!
Start A Race War?
written by Guest, April 22, 2005
What planet have you been living on for the past 500 years? Columbus started the race war in 1492 when he brought the war ships from Spain soon to be followed by the slave ships. The goal of his mission - to take the world for Europe and Europeans and exterminate anyone who was not white which was very successfully completed.

The good old USA has taken the genocide to another level with the bombing and extermination of the Iraqis and God knows who else.
Racism is Cruel
written by Guest, April 22, 2005
I lived in Brazil, USA and Canada. I never could get a date with a black woman in such countries. I am a mix person but I look like the garbage white. However, I observed in these 3 countries that white woman after some years of age. The white man does not want her. She start to date only with black guys. Some women even go to hunt for black guys in some clubs done for that. Some black guys even charge white woman for sex.
The white woman still using the black man as sex slaver.
USA genocide
written by Guest, April 22, 2005
“The good old USA has taken the genocide to another level with the bombing and extermination of the Iraqis and God knows who else.”

You can’t be serious. Genocide is a very serious accusation and I think hardly accurate in this context. If you want to talk about genocide then let’s talk about Saddam. Saddam killed thousands of his own people. I’ve lost track of the number of mass graves that have been found. Not to mention the wars of aggression against his neighbors. Saddam cheated his own people out of humanitarian aid, skimmed money from the oil for food program all while building at least 30 palaces in honor of himself and his sons. Saddam was an Arab version of Stalin—a sociopathic madman who happened to run a country. Any talk of genocide against the Iraqis needs to start with Saddam. More Iraqi lives have been saved the USA then by any other country.
...
written by Guest, April 22, 2005
What planet have you been living on for the past 500 years? Columbus started the race war in 1492

Let me guess before 1492 there was no racism!! what a co incidence that was the same time Jews where thrown out of spain and portugal and wound up in south and central America!
You are an Anti Semite!!
...
written by Guest, April 22, 2005
OAS Shows Perils of Being Journalist in Brazil PDF Print E-mail
Written by Newsroom
Thursday, 21 April 2005

In its evaluation of the situation of freedom of expression in 2004, the Office of the Special Rapporteur for Freedom of Expression of the Inter-American Commission on Human Rights (IACHR) called attention to the increase in the acts of violence against media workers in Latin America, including Brazil.

In the 2004 Annual Report there are accounts of 11 murders of media workers related to their work as journalists. The IACHR presented its Annual Report before the Committee on Juridical and Political Affairs of the Organization of American States (OAS) last Friday, April 15, 2005. The third volume of the report contains the Report of the Office of the Special Rapporteur for Freedom of Expression.

Besides the evaluation of the situation of freedom of expression in the Region, the report of the Office includes a summary of the caselaw on freedom of expression in the United Nations Human Rights Committee; a report on access to information in the member states of the OAS; and contains a doctrinal report on concentration of media ownership and its impact on freedom of expression.

The annual report also analyzes the problem of hate speech in the context of the exercise of freedom of expression.

Moreover, the Office, following its biannual custom, reported the state of advances and setbacks in the limitations to freedom of expression through laws of desacato and of criminal defamation.

This year, the Office highlighted the important decisions of the Inter-American Court of Human Rights, which stressed the importance of freedom of expression in democratic societies by rejecting criminal liability as consequence of determined expressions.

When making the report public, the Special Rapporteur for Freedom of Expression asserted that "the great challenge facing the attacks on freedom of expression and of the press is that the society in its whole must take them on as their own fundamental rights, for their development and life in democracy, and not as a rights of a few privileged ones".

Brazil

In August, a legislative initiative proposed by professional organizations was sent for consideration to the Brazilian Chamber of Deputies, which sought to oversee the activity of journalists and create a Federal Journalism Council and Regional Journalism Councils in the country's 26 states.

The councils proposed would have the authority to "orient, discipline, and oversee" the exercise of journalism, and to impose sanctions on those who exercised it "irresponsibly," through warnings, fines, or suspension of professional registration for up to 30 days, or definitive expulsion.

In addition, the proposal required that journalists be registered with the Council as a condition for exercising their profession. Nonetheless, the initiative was not well-received in Congress, where in November different parliamentary groups signed an agreement to vote on and squarely reject the proposal.[1]

This year once again journalists were murdered in Brazil. On April 24, 37-year-old journalist José Carlos Araújo, of Radio Timbaúba FM, was murdered. Araújo addressed police-related issues.

On April 27, 2004, Helton Jonas Gonçalves de Oliveira was arrested; he had reportedly confessed to the murder,[2] and had indicated that it was because Araújo had accused him, on his program José Carlos Entrevista, of being responsible for several crimes, which he denied.[3]

On July 11, 2004, Jorge Lourenço dos Santos, owner and commentator on the radio station Criativa FM, was murdered in the state of Alagoas, in the Brazilian Northeast.[4]

On his program, dos Santos criticized local politicians and businesspersons. He had received death threats and had been targeted in two prior assassination attempts. Dos Santos had also been involved in politics and had run for the local council in a neighboring community.[5]

On August 12, 2004, the daily A Crítica of Manaus, state of Amazonas, reported that its journalists had received death threats and had suffered persecution and intimidation. Among those impacted were the team made up of reporter Gerson Dantas, photographer Antônio Lima, and driver Ednelson Arruda.[6]

The paper's columnist Orlando Farias de Lima, editor-in-chief Taiza Brito, and other journalists also received death threats, after disseminating information on a police operation that culminated in the detention of several public officials and businesspersons.

This year, the Office of the Special Rapporteur received information on a decision of July 6, 2004, by the Court of Appeals of Pará that confirmed a guilty judgment[7] against journalist Lúcio Flávio Pinto, director of the daily Jornal Pessoal of Belém, the capital of Pará.

In 2000, Pinto published information criticizing a decision of a judge who brought the criminal action against him. Pinto appealed the decision to the same Court, but his appeal was rejected. Other remedies being pursued by Pinto may be analyzed in the Court of Appeals and in the Federal Supreme Court.[8]

In previous reports, the Office of the Special Rapporteur has described proceedings against journalists who publish reports and criticisms of public officials, particularly those related to judicial decisions.

These proceedings are possible due to the existence of criminal laws that may be invoked by public officials, and which could have a chilling effect for those who wish to participate in the free democratic debate.

The Office of the Special Rapporteur urges Brazilian authorities to review this legislation in light of the standards established by the inter-American system.

In May 2004, the Office of the Special Rapporteur expressed its concern through a press release[9] regarding the case of journalist Larry Rohter, correspondent of the U.S. newspaper The New York Times, whose visa was cancelled on May 11, 2004, by the government of Brazil after he published information on certain personal conduct by the President of Brazil.[10]

The newspaper's attorneys sent a letter to the government, and on May 17, 2004, Minister of Justice Márcio Thomas Bastos revoked the decision and closed the case.[11]
white pigs
written by Guest, April 22, 2005
killed indigenous people and then harassed and abused black people as slaves.

they raped the indigenous women and black women and killed indigenous men and black men or enslaved both of them.

white people are the main cause for all of this world's racial and economic problems. white pigs are the main causer of racialist problems. that is the 100% truth.

White pigs????
written by Guest, April 22, 2005
So, if i'm a white pig and i'm the cause for ALL of this world's racial and economic problems.

Well then you call me a racist and i call you a filthy n****r !!!

Now, this helps a lot saving the problems does it?

Moron...
Do not worry white pigs
written by Guest, April 22, 2005
The white pigs are in extintion. White women want to f**k only with big dick black guys.White men are going to Asian to look for obedient wives. Black people are multiply themself like rats in all parts of the World while white people avoid kids because they want to enjoy life.
The white pigs are going to dissapear soon. Look to the big cities and you only see black hairs and brown eyes.
...
written by Guest, April 23, 2005
The white pigs are going to dissapear soon. Look to the big cities and you only see black hairs and brown eyes.

True enough, the world is getting worse and more violent.
This page has...
written by Guest, April 25, 2005
completed slid into the gutter.

What a bunch of worthless racist banter on both sides.
Foul
written by Guest, April 25, 2005
"Small minds create small problems Big minds create Big problems ! You just create foul language!"

You create foul air, a foul environmentl, with your foul, small-mindedness…So please, stay with your "own kind" of simple-minded and foul people. Was that genteel enough for your sensitive racist eyes, a*****e?
Second poster
written by Guest, April 26, 2005
"Nothing, but economical reasons, prevents these people from fully developing their potential" That is just wrong. To deny that ANY "active" racism exists in Brasil is just wrong. Putting that aside, it is clear that economic racial seggregation in Brazil is a result of historic racism. I'm glad to hear that you've been able to achieve so much. But you're not black, are you? And it appears that you left Brasil to do so. Even still, you do know that whites have a leg up, both economically and socially, don't you? Yes, it's possible to overcome racism enough to improve your economic status, but it's a rough road to hoe.
I am a black man
written by Guest, April 26, 2005
Look the size of my dick.
To Second Poster
written by Guest, April 26, 2005
“Yes, it's possible to overcome racism enough to improve your economic status, but it's a rough road to hoe.”

Well said and that’s exactly why most don’t even try. I’m not sure if your comment was meant to be an excuse or a statement of fact. If it’s an excuse, it’s a sorry one and I’m sure anyone using it has a sorry excuse for a life too. If it’s just a statement of fact, I completely agree and such rough roads are the reason most people wake up every morning and try to make a better life for their family.
Good to hear
written by Guest, April 26, 2005
As the saying goes, it is better late than never. Good to see that Black Brazillians are finally opening their minds to the concept that they must get together and demand their rights. Black Americans are the most progressive Blacks in the world and they had to fight tooth and nail for everything they have.

I am not African American, but I feel proud of their accomplishments and have always felt that Black Brazillians were too caught up in that "we are all color blind" nonsense. No one is color blind - such a concept does not exist.

Wishing my Black Brazillian brothers and sisters a better future.
most don\'t even try?
written by Guest, April 26, 2005
"most don’t even try [to overcome racism]" I really don't think you have any idea of what you're talking about. But your way of thinking certainly absolves you of any responsibility toward your fellow man. Such indifference allows you to deny the stark realities of prejudice. It is the kind of statement, utterly lacking in sympathy or understanding of reality, that is made by someone who has never faced prejudice, someone who has never felt the sting or borne the burden of racism, someone very self-righteous and selfish. If you cannot fathom the effect of racism on the individual and on society, you are a sorry excuse for a person.
Living the white lie
written by Guest, April 26, 2005
"most [blacks] don’t even try [to overcome racism and improve their status]" . . . "such rough roads are the reason most [white] people wake up every morning and try to make a better life for their [white] family."

KEEP LIVING THE WHITE LIE DUDE!
you all a buch of f**king slaves
written by Guest, April 26, 2005
black white pink or blue most of the posters on this page are slaves to thier own f**king little minds.

until the colour of a mans skin is of no more significance than the colour of his eyes. i have to say WAR
white racist pigs and bastards
written by Guest, April 26, 2005
white people are the real "evil doers". They killed, stole, raped tens of millions of native peoples, tens of millions of black people, tens of millions of non-white people in africa, asia, pacific islands, and the whole of the americas.

white people now live like kings, using the stolen property of native and black and non-white people and living off of slavery.

these white pigs also rape non-white women and kill non-white men.

so who is evil, non-white people, who are treated like s**t, killed, and discriminated against, or white racist evil-doing pigs.

white people, at least most racist white people, are the angels of death and racism on this planet. that is the truth.
white racist pigs and bastards
written by Guest, April 26, 2005
Try not to judge people based on the color of their skin lest you become like the people you detest. When you see racism, denounce it, protest it, fight it. Become political. But don't give in to hatred, which will eat you up.
...
written by Guest, April 27, 2005
to late for him, hes already a screwd up racist f**k. you dont have to be white to be racist
...
written by Guest, April 27, 2005
"you dont have to be white to be racist"

Oh, please, not a white victim of "racism." No, you don't have to be white to be a racist, I guess, but whites are historically better at it. So stop playing the victim in the face of angry words that reflect harsh truths. Be a man and take it and show us you have half a brain.
...
written by Guest, April 27, 2005
"You create foul air, a foul environmentl, with your foul, small-mindedness…So please, stay with your "own kind" of simple-minded and foul people. Was that genteel enough for your sensitive racist eyes, a*****e?"

in your mind if you are a peace loving person who prefers to avoid other cultures you are a bad person !! However the whites who abused,raped,and enslaved blacks did not follow this principle . the only way you can victimiz a culture is to first associate with that culture.and this is pure logic !! and yet you curse me?? if I as a Black man avoid whites totally how can I rape them or victimiz them if I don't even want to touch them?? and because I don't want to or choose to associate with them then I'am the bad guy? on par with slave owners and rapist!!
Black man
written by Guest, April 27, 2005
I see. You are a black man who wishes to associate with "your kind" (i.e., non-whites) becuase among non-whites you do not suffer racism. That is rational. No, that does not put you on par with racists.

Your statements do sound racist becuase you denegrate all white people (which implies racial superiority of non-whites). Your statement that you prefer to be with your "own kind" sounds racist too, becuase that's the way racists talk. Do you not see that? And so you should see that you have become a version of the people who you dislike, though your perspective is that of the oppressed, and therefore rational, as distinguished from the irrational and vile perspecitve of the oppressor who justifies oppression on a claim of racial superiority.

You do need healing, that's for sure. If you are a peace loving person, I hope you find peace in mind and body. But your rants against whites only justifies the true racism in others and leads others to conclude that you are yourself a racist. The historical and current atrocities against non-whites (i.e., the facts) are strong enough to make your point.

You are who you are, but you could channel that anger into much better advocacy. And perhaps you, as did Malcom X, will come to the realization that an end to racism is possible but that segregation is not the answser.
white people are all racist!
written by Guest, April 27, 2005
white people and especially the gringo republican party have been up to trouble all over the world.

the white party or the republican party, are doing coups in countries, where non-white presidents are trying to help the non-white majority population against their rwsident white oligarchy, like the gringo inspired coup in venezuela, guatemala, chile, nicaragua, el salvador, panama, ecuador, brazil, and more and more.

so white people are still upto no good, especially the racist and hate filled republican party, which is stealing from non-white people and saying they do no support affirmative action for non-white people and treating the greatest non-white presidents, like hugo chavez of Venezuela and robert mugabe of zimbabwe with trying to overthrow them.

so who are the evil doers, good and honest non-white people or evil and racist and coup mongering white people?
...
written by Guest, April 27, 2005
Oh, please, not a white victim of "racism." No, you don't have to be white to be a racist, I guess, but whites are historically better at it. So stop playing the victim in the face of angry words that reflect harsh truths. Be a man and take it and show us you have half a brain

no ive never been a victim of racism but im fed up of being acused of being racist becouse im white, if i was racist would i chose to live in brasil, no.

until the colour of a mans skin is of no more signifiance than the colour of his eyes ive got to say war.

you say whites are better at it. the truth is whites dont relly give a s**t about the colour they treat everyone like s**t. there were plenty of white slaves, plenty of black slave drivers to for that matter. and why do you think indians wernt made into slaves becouse they dident play the game. they dident work hard and went on slow strike so they were killed off. whites only give a s**t about money and slaves make money.
white bastards
written by Guest, April 28, 2005
you are all thieves and a**holes.

white people are blue eyed devils and evil-doers.

white people are like racist parasites. that is the 100% truth. white people hate, plunder, and steal and oppress black people, brown, red, and yellow people.
Most Progressive Blacks?
written by Guest, April 28, 2005
A previous poster stated that black Americans are the most progressive of all the blacks. There is still much work to be done. Comparing Afro-Brazilians to African Americans I can say that I see a lot of strengths in Afro-Brazilians and traits that I would like to see black Americans emulate. Yes there has been some progress made by black Americans but much more needs to be done.

Many black Americans who visit Brazil, especially Salvador come away totally impressed by the residents. Just as black Americans have traits that black Brazilians admire it is definitely vice versa. My proudest moment as a black American was observing the people of Salvador and seeing their own beauty, strength and dignity.

The struggle continues for blacks in the diaspora. America is not yet a paragon of democracy - far from it. The black American continues to fight the harsh battles on the way to true freedom which is still denied us despite the high achievers among us.
...
written by Guest, April 28, 2005
Yes black people have suffered in the past 600 years under universal white rule. Yes we (and other nonwhites) have been raped, murdered, cheated, enslaved, etc but guess what? We have survived! We may not be perfect but we are still here.

I can understand the poster writing about "white bastards, blue eyed devils" etc anger and pain but as black people we must move past the name calling stage. Yes we have a right to be angry over the abuses we have experienced but we have to do the best we can in our personal lives to do better and not be overcome by bitterness and rage where it only destroys us.

I try to focus on some of the positives. A life of racism and abuse has made a survivor out of me and instead of dwelling on the indignities I use those strengths to better my and others situation.

I speak from hard experience. Rage will only destroy the person who holds on to it. We can only hope that the higher powers that be will bring a lot of good out of the pain and horror that we have experienced - maybe not in our life times but for those who live in the future.
...
written by Guest, April 28, 2005
I guess what the world needs is peaceful racist!!
was there ever a time when race was not a factor??
and what about the asians can we blame them for african slavery because they are not Black??? one thing I noticed there are no Jews in rich and powerful positions that control white,Black and asians!! maybe we need more jewish communist thinking??
order and progress?
written by Guest, April 28, 2005
evil and hate knows no colour. if people continue to give it a colour then the situation will never end. the poster above has all the excuses he wants to hate whites. balcks were segregated from whites by force but this guy segregates himself by will. hes fallen in the trap, years ago whites dident want mixed races so they created race hate so colouers would not mix, this guy is exactly want they wanted. will it stop there, i doupt it he'll probley pass the hate to his kids and his kids will live a life of hate to. only tolerance and understanding will bring an end to this s**t. he dosent see individuals just colour. im luckey to have friends of all races and colours and i will be more than happy to teach my kids about other culltures. that way the racist have no chance, but if we contine to live in the past theres no hope for tomrow. though its importat not to forget the past so we dont make the same mistakes.

to the white pigs poster - make the best out of your life forget the hate and have a happy life. if you dont want to mix with whites that your choice. if you want to get one over on the white racist pigs then be happy and succesfull. if theres one thing an white racist pig hates to see its a succesfull happy balck man.
...
written by Guest, April 28, 2005
"years ago whites dident want mixed races so they created race hate so colouers would not mix"

like the honorable minister louis farrakhan ? or the chassidic jews or orthodox jews or like the japanese or like the Amish? By the way none of them owned slaves by the way!!

will the lamb ever lie down with the Lion?
sorry, man
written by Guest, April 28, 2005
You are one angry dude. Sorry you are that way. I understand, but I would like to see you get past that. Peace, brother. Not all whites are racist. I hope some day you'll see the truth that was revealed to Malcom X: that peace is possible among races. Peace, love, best wishes to you and your family. I live my days free of racism and full of love and respect to my fellow human being. I hope the same to you. Abraços, meu irmão.
...
written by Guest, April 28, 2005
not shure about lambs and loins, but cats and dogs get along fine when they grow up together. its just a matter of education.
...
written by Guest, April 28, 2005
"You are one angry dude"

Nope ! Just inquisitive!!
Color and race
written by Guest, April 28, 2005
Having said a few things about racism above, I would like to add that in my observation Brazil has very different race relations than elsewhere in the world. Poverty is disproportionately skewed toward darker-skinned people and people of African descent. That reflects inequality along racial lines. But it does strike me as more of a social problem, that is current inequality based upon past wrongs of colonialism and slavery. But I'm not aware of the kind of racial hatred in Brazil as exists in the US, for example.

I find it interesting that in the US, if you ask most people about their background they will tell you from which countries their ancestors came. In Brazil, even though it is also a country colonized by foreigners, many will simply say they are Brazilian. The foreign identity is lost. Many Brazilians just don't think about race the way people from other cultures do. I recall a Brazilian friend who came to the US and met someone's adopted child. It was only later that an white person pointed out that the child was black (the couple were white) that she realized that was true. Brazil is a true melting pot and people take note of color in a much diferent way than do people elsewhere. People have a spectrum of color, all of which is beautiful (though carrying social/economic significance).

It seems to me that color is a signifier of social/economic status in Brazil, but does not signify "race" in the same way it does, for example, in US. In this way, yes, poverty does have color in Brazil. It's not, however, racism in the sense that people know it elsewhere in the world (though I'm not so nieve to say that no good old fashioned racists exist in Brazil). As the article points out, there are terrible social consequences of social/economic segregation in Brazil.

The article emphasizes that poverty does have color in Brazil and that must change.
...
written by Guest, April 28, 2005
People are brainwashed to forget their culture ! in the USA we have white kids propagandized to act Black .Someone is pushing this agenda ! Some say it is the monolithic Jews pushing this agenda to benefit themselves ! I disagree I think you must educate yourself and not fall for self hating traps to benefit others .just as many are propagandized to call me names and hate me meanwhile I have not degraded harassed or belittled anyone. Africans have lost their culture and or had it stolen by a bunch of merchandisers .and now whites are losing theirs! meanwhile the culture of people who feel they are closer to God or are "chosen" By god keep theirs and their hollywood and hampton culture! Hitler was an Evil Man and so was Bela Kun who preceded him and evil man. and so was trotsky and che guevara (neither of whom African. however marxist robert mugabe who is african shares their same philosophy (I wonder Why?)
...
written by Guest, April 29, 2005
What do you mean white kids "propagandized to act Black." From my observation of world culture most of the world's people are "propagandized" to act white. As white supremacy is the law of the land most of the world's people are taught to act, look and think "white". Have you noticed that almost all of the contestants or models in beauty pageants especially international ones tend to look Caucasian regardless of country of origin?

In America white executives are the ones who control "culture". There are no brainwashing programs created to make anyone act "black". Music execs simply found out that American black culture is seen as hip and cool all over the world so it is simply PROFITABLE to market it for mass consumption in order to make money but the dominant culture in America and elsewhere is still Eurocentric - at least last time I checked.

As long as white people control the tools of mass marketing and media there is no danger of white people losing their culture and it is mostly white people who reap the profits off of black culture -always had and always will.
Is is Really True?
written by Guest, April 29, 2005
That Brazil has no real color line. From what I've observed race is definitely a factor in Brazilian society. If you are white you are more likely to be wealthy, if you're not - poverty. If blacks are poor because of their crippled past as slaves then what efforts are being made by the government and society to right those wrongs so that blacks will catch up?

Most of the whites who came to Brazil were not skilled and a good number of the black freed slaves were highly skilled yet most employers chose the whites over the blacks so race has to be an issue. Brazil cannot use the excuse that blacks are poor because they have not yet caught up. Many whites who arrived to Brazil were as bad off as black slaves but many of them rose up the ladder of success much more rapidly than blacks who couldn't even get on the ladder in the first place.

I will admit Brazil is better off than America when it comes to race relations. Americans are so obsessed with race and the possible takeover of the white race by blacks that it is horrendous although Brazilians tend to have some preoccupation with race and color too.

Whether Brazil admits it or not race, not class is the main reason blacks cannot rise up. As has been proven before white immigrants came to Brazil (as they did America) with no real skills but in Brazil's eagerness to "whiten" the country they gladly bestowed favors on the white immigrants and kicked the black ex-slaves to the margins of society.

...
written by Guest, April 29, 2005
For all who have been victims of hate, bigotry, abuse, etc, etc you have to look at it this way there is always a master plan to your pain and suffering. This is not some mystical nonsense but truth. Many people who have gone through traumas have gained new strengths and wisdom. Yes I will admit Europe and Europeans did kick a lot of behinds during the past six centuries but has it not toughened up some of those behinds?

You may not see it right away. Hell you may not see the positive results for another 200 years but I am convinced that nature has a master plan in designing future species. That is my take on it. It may be unpleasant going through it but hey if you look back centuries from now (from the afterlife of course) you will say "Wow so that is what that was for!"
Brazil Get off The Moral High Ground
written by Guest, April 29, 2005
Stop already with the "we are not as racist as the US and we are a racial democracy" crap. Blacks in Brazil have it worse than blacks in America. Most black Brazilians live in ghettoes, work as maids, are gunned down by police and better not be caught dead in a fancy hotel unless they are there to scrub the toilets.

Your highest paid entertainer is a blonde named Xuxa, all of the faces on tv are white and blonde, you have a history of trying to whiten your black population so don't give us that sh-t that you are so much more advanced in race relations than the US. Where are the Afro-Brazilian MIchael Jordans, Tiger Woods or Oprah Winfreys? They don't exist in your country.

Most blacks are destined to live their lives in a stinking favela while you white Brazilians who sing the praises of racial democracy live in your luxury apartment buildings with a black maid to clean out your toilets. You only have a lot of race mixing because you employ a l ot of black maids who are raped by your husbands and sons but when all is said and done you promote whiteness and blondeness. Your brand of racism is no different than that of the United States. So get off your high horse already.

Brazil is such a hypocritical country.
...
written by Guest, April 29, 2005
"but cats and dogs get along fine when they grow up together"

Great Point!!
Now I as a non Cat Or Dog will use marxist doctrine to force all animal Shelters to integrate the cats and dogs at the animal shelters .and when they start killing each other I will institute Hate Crimes favoring one or the other!! (hey afterall I'am neither a cat or a dog for that matter) By the way I'am from the workmans circle or the highlander day school!
...
written by Guest, April 29, 2005
"What do you mean white kids "propagandized to act Black." "

EMINEM !! SAY WORD!! GANGSTA!! HO!!
*@%$@# !!!
Moral high ground
written by Guest, April 29, 2005
Right, the brand of racism in Brazil is different from that in other countries; but it's racism none the less. The highest standard of beauty in Brazil, for example, does seem to be the light skinned, blue-eyed blonde. The poorest in society are brown haired, brown skinned. The economic system has been rigged to maintain this situation. There is no moral high ground in racial inequality. But improvement of conditions of non-whites in Brazil is not a matter of improving black/brown pride. Improve the distribution of wealth, provide good education, provide health care to everyone, and you will see black/brown pride improve.
Eminem
written by Guest, April 29, 2005
Eminem gew up in poverty, living with black culture.

As for the rise of black culture in American society, I find it interesting that you claim it's propaganda when it's black (something you dislike) and when the trend is from white culture (i.e., something you do not recognize as different) it's not recognized as a result of propaganda, it's just capitalism. It's the same thing, buddy. If you don't like being propagandized to, you have to work for changes in the system. But if you only object to the propaganda that uses black culture to make money, then you are just a racist hypocrite.
...
written by Guest, April 29, 2005
"when it's black (something you dislike)"

I' am Black and I love wynton marsalis and Ella Fitzgerald and chris rock
blacks and whites are being marketed to in a positive way and a Negative way I apologize if my disliking the negative way offends you!

all these posts I have made and not once did I lower myself to name calling!! I guess it's a case of being nice and respectful that overrides the importance of my race !!
f**k off black and whites
written by Guest, April 30, 2005
Now, it is the Asian Time.
...
written by Guest, May 02, 2005
You're right it is the Asian's time. No doubt about that. Asia has the numbers, the nukes, the brains to rule the world. However, the white man is not going to give up world power without a fight so I hope Asia is prepared for battle because the old dinosaur of white supremacy is not going down without a good fight. The white race has held power too long and kicked everyone's ass too hard and too long to back off now.
...
written by Guest, May 02, 2005
"You're right it is the Asian's time"

Japanese? or Chinese? Or Korean ?
You group all whites as the Same (as if Hungarians and slovaks where respnsible for anglo hispanic portuguese colonialism) then all Blacks as the same . Now It's all asian . Go ahead blame them for Slavery too! They the chinese food delivery people have been killed by people of "color" !! Wow Now I'am starting to tow the blame others for my failure game as an exscuse to suck my teeth and be agressive!!
\"Black\" person
written by Guest, May 02, 2005
Well, you said you don't like it that WHITE kids are propagandized to act black. Now you say you are black and that it's only SOME propaganda that you dislike and that you are including blaks and whites into your statement. At this point, I don't know what to make of you, I don't know who posted what. Time to move on…
the white race is dying cause they do no
written by Guest, May 02, 2005
"You're right it is the Asian's time. No doubt about that. Asia has the numbers, the nukes, the brains to rule the world. However, the white man is not going to give up world power without a fight so I hope Asia is prepared for battle because the old dinosaur of white supremacy is not going down without a good fight. The white race has held power too long and kicked everyone's ass too hard and too long to back off now."

brother you are totally correct in all that you said.

the white race is a real bitch!!! but guess what, the whitey race is not breeding fast enough as the brown, red, black, and yellow races. Moreover, white folks are marrying with people of color. So, I presume the white race is not only going to be much smaller in the next few decades, but also weaker, and we the brown, black, red, and yellow are gonna kick the white man and white races' ass.

hahahahahahahahahahahahah. that is soooo nice!
...
written by Guest, May 03, 2005
It is true that the white population has dropped from 25% in 1960 to under 16% in less than 50 years, however, so has the black population. Also lack of numbers does not necessarily mean lack of power. There have been many instances in which a small group of whites have taken over entire nations and countries and they still own over 90% of the world's resources.

Asia is on the verge of being the world's new power but it may take as long as 200 years to actually achieve that status. Due to the AIDS epidemic the black race may not last more than another century and it has been calculated that if current AIDS rates stay as high as they are among American blacks, extinction will occur in less than 100 years.

In America the Hispanic population is rapidly expanding but white people still control all of the resources. Whites still have greater access to health care and much greater wealth than black people. The first race to become extinct will definitely be the blacks unless a miracle occurs to turn things around healthwise.
...
written by Guest, May 03, 2005
"we the brown, black, red, and yellow are gonna kick the white man and white races' ass. "

But I thought Black people are peacefull wonderful people?? Guess What? we are!! you are not!!
keep believing the Marrano propaganda!!
WILLIESE
written by Guest, May 04, 2005
NEWS FLASH BEDEJO MOST HISPANICS IN THE USA ARE OF MEXICAN DECSENT EITHER MEZTIZO OR INDIAN(PREDOMINATELY) EVER WOMDER WHY SPANISH MEXICANS, FRENCH MEXICANS(EUROPEAN MEXICANS NEVER CROSS THE BORDER?

HISPANICS ARE NOT A RACE OF THEIR OWN

SOME HISPANICS ARE WHITE SOME ARE INDIAN SOME ARE MEZTIZO SOME ARE BLACK IF HISPANIC PEOPLES WHERE TO TAKE CONTROL OF THE USA THERE STILL WOULD BE PROBLEMS FOR THEM ESP IF THEY ARE BLACK OR INDIAN AND WHITEz(SPANISH)

IF HISPANICS RAN THIS COUNTRY THEY WILL RUN IT INTO THE GROUND LOOK AT MEXICO, LOOK AT EVERY LATIN AMERICAN COUNTRY f**kED UP WITH ARMED MILITIAS AND OPPISITIONS GROUPS/COUPS.

THE UNITED STATES WILL BE TURNED INTO A 3RD WORLD COUNTRY AND THE NEXT SUPER POWER WOULD BE ENGLAND/GREAT BRITAIN, FRANCE OR SOME OTHER EUROPEAN COUNTRY.
...
written by Guest, May 06, 2005
ooooh, an anthropoligist and a political scientist! I'm taking notes!
Look ma, I\'m white!!
written by Guest, May 07, 2005
Yes well, whites can attribute all of their socio-economic resoures and power to their deeply seeded infactuation with weapons; "not to their human character". Lets face it white people, we are not a superior race. If it had not been for the chinese invention of gun powder, the moslim (I don't only mean Arabs, by the way) inavations in math and capitalism, as well as Waring cheifs in other parts of africa and their willingness to sell us their captured enemy tribes men, we would not, and could not be anything to day.."Fact". We are liers, we lie to ourselves, and everybody around us..(I know, I know," I hate to hear this also")

Christopher columbus was nothing but an low breed Italian idiot, who could not navigate.. "Whites, a Superior race, my ass". If you would like to call, coseying up to Native people, before shooting them in the back with Chinsese inventions, the work of a Superior people, then you my friend, are welcomed to think what you like. Fore, With out the weapons which we white people so desperately cling to for security, we could not be much more than our ancestors, thats is, "Primitive Barbains from the wilderness"...With small penises, and poor athletic ability...(I hate myself)

You know what? We actually haven't been in power for very long, "like 400 years". Egypt's Original dynasty stayed in power for far longer than that, Egypt, in its non- european touched form lasted something like 4000 years. Babylon was a beaker world power for thousands years of, also. Nubia, which by the way, was far more advanced than any European province at the time, lasted alot longer than 400 hunderd years, beleave me..Western European and North American dominance only seems infinate, because we are living in the time period, even now, it is slowly degressing..

There is a verse in the bible - I don't know the exact location of this verse, but never the less - It reads (more or less) ""And the Meek shall in heritate the Earth, and the wicked shall be struck down"", yada yada yada, blah blah blah .... ."I'm afraid"..


"I for one, am all for racial mixing", yum, hmm hmm good. "Did you know Jusus christ was a mixed child", thats right, beside being jewish, he also had a good amount of Hamitic blood (black blood, in other words). I guess then, this would make racism Blasphimous, "the work of the devel"; then again, I'm no genius...

On that Note, I would just like to give a friendly "Hitler selute" before I leave, oh yah! and a charming " WHITE POWER"!!!!!.. Thank you, Take it easy guys...

Oh, in response to the poster above. "When did a Lation become white"??? Not in the good old U.S., no sir, uh uh.


\"Ice Mutant\" in da house ya\'ll
written by Guest, May 07, 2005
I ment to say, when did a " Latino" become white??? YEEEHAAAA!!!!!
are you people serious??
written by Guest, May 09, 2005
Havent you ever heard the term "why cant we all just get along?" all of you white people that are commenting on how all of you hate the blacks or the asians...stop it, grow up and learn how to except people for who they are. I know if your mothers read this she would not approve. All of you black and asian people stop feeling sorry for yourself because you are a differant color and get out there and prove yourself to the world, sitting around and complaining will not solve the problem... you should all be trying to mend our country instead of trying to pull it apart with something as petty as racism...u should all be ashamed of yourself!!! Grow up and start taking responsibility for the things that you say. Respect other people, of any race, and they will respect you.
...
written by Guest, May 09, 2005
Who feels sorry for themselves?? I think more people feel anger,spite, and distain, rather than sorry for themselves. Such a lowley expression, I do not care for.

Who really cares who white people hate??? They are clowns, and they have been spoon fed their pride starting at an early age. If the government did not control the distribution of wealth, then this inferior white race would be so far out of power it would be laughable... "They rode in on Muskets and Desease, I think they should go in a fashion, equal to this"..
Ice Mutent, Barbarins from the wildernes
written by Guest, May 09, 2005
Who feels sorry for themselves?? I think more people feel anger,spite, and distain, rather than sorry for themselves. Such a lowley expression, I do not care for..

Who really cares who white people hate??? They are clowns, and they have been spoon fed their pride starting from an early age. If the government did not control the distribution of wealth, then this inferior white race would be so far out of power it would be laughable... "They rode in on Muskets and Desease, I think they should go in a fashion, equal to this"..
little c**k, the White boy..
written by Guest, May 09, 2005
'They think that they are so goddamed smart"... "The f**king swine coloured Yellow haired dogs, to hell with them"..
hää
written by Guest, October 02, 2005
gyes u are crazy..i am white. i love u. i feel sorry about all the things that my ancestors did to urs.
we should work together instead aganst us.
i never had bias aganst blacks or asiaten. ones i had a girlfiend she was/is black and i cant understand why people think there is somethig bad on black people.
but if i read ur stupit comments abaut an inferior race i guess i found the race who is inferior, enough enough for me
well greez to all brasila
We are feeding of hatred
written by Guest, January 10, 2006
wow..........this is worst than aol chatrooms i go to, i never heard such foul mouths and negativity coming from so many people. racism evolves everywhere.........no matter what color you are..........America is just as worst as Brazil.....A,erica is not special from any other countries out there about racial standards. As long there's color blind in this world we will never get along because we automaticaly judge one another. there's just too many ignorants, bigotry and prejudice outhere. I've been living in america for all my life, and i've seen and face prejudice it just makes me wonder if i go to another country what would it be like. i don't need to go to another country to know there's racism because alot of us are color blind, america is color blind, european countries are and etc...... we just can't get along
Brazilian?
written by Guest, January 10, 2006
why does that surprise us that brazilians are racist, and why there so much anger because of braszilians, right here in america.....so call the country of freedom is racist as hell..........compare to a country that isn't really mention everyday. ...i mean........why does that surprise us. Black people are being intimidate, by people who hate the color of their skin in america and now we are arguing about brazilia. Black people face torturing, rape, beating, being sold to slave owners, and treated as properties..............from the white men. It's not just Africans, there's Asians, Midle eastern, and Hispanics

Hitler" believed that blond hair, blue eyes were superior. Hitler was insane for thinking that, no wonder he commited suicide.........i mean what about the brown eyes, brunette hairs , what about green eyes.....did any of any white people ever thought what would hitler do to the brunetter hair, brown eyes, black eyes,red hair, white people.........i think he would of thrown you guy to the gas chamber.......(i'm sorry to say that) or would he make the white people who did not have blond hair, blue eyes change the style to make the perfect white race............now that's racism.... and i haven't seen or heard a single white person arguing about this, but they go directly to black race or mulattos, the asians and middle eastern or hispanic race.
...
written by Guest, April 03, 2006
Look at Africa - the prets are simply closer to the chimpanzees than the people that had the sense to get out of that hell-hole. Get used to it - The Africans can dance, fornicate and eat each other while the Chinese and Europeans eat their lunch, an outcome deserved by both sides. Not because the Chinese and Europeans shed their negritude, after all that is about no more than vitamin D - but because they value education and civilization enough to actually improve the human race. This crap about white racism holding down the darky is indefensible in light of the truth - the the same horrors of slavery endured under whites they endured under blacks, and the worse thing that happened to 20th century Africa was decolonialzation. Move 'em to Brazil, Jamaica or South Central Los Angeles, they are they same people they ever were.
humm
written by Guest, May 16, 2006
you are all ignorant.. peace be with you all that posted on this board.
vivid
written by Guest, June 08, 2006
if you want to stop racism look within yourselves and not the goverment I am a prouud african living in britain and have been subjected to racism from an early age but this hasn't lessened my view of white people it's our differences the that make this world what it is
savas
written by Guest, June 22, 2006
dirty kaffers, you'll always be poor, that's your destiny;
Racism is more grey, than a black or whi
written by Guest, June 25, 2006
While no one, including myself, is free from racism or ethnocentrism, it is not only tragic but a disgrace at the lack of civility, stereotyping and foul language that most of the comments of this forum have shown.

The tragic legacy of 36 million Africans seized by raiding parties, marched to costal ports and chained inhumanely to berths below deck for months while sailing to new lives of even greater degredation, despair and death. How many of those millions died at sea before even setting foot in the Americas. The 500 years of such injustice will sadly be a legacy in the Americas for centuries to come before true social, economic and political equality is a reality.

While many whites still look on blacks and African-American culture as inferior or not mainstream, it doesn't take long to recognize African-American influences in jazz,blues, rock, r&b,soul,etc. or in religion such as gospel music, glossalia, social activism. Many Southern customs and traditions were originally from slaves who tried to maintain as much dignity and memory of the African homelands as possible.

To say that all white, blue eyed people are devils and the all black people with brown eyes are saints is not only absure but hopelessly racist to the core. Not only can racism be seen in the white supremecist organizations but also the brown paper bag test that was formerly applied to segregate lighter and darker skin blacks at social functions. Reactions of to white racism in among Black Muslims or power groups only show a racist solution or reaction to the original racist dilemma.

While my white ancestors were not subject to same cruel indignities as the black slaves, their lot was far from privileged. My paternal ancestry is German Jewish (imagine the numerous religious pogroms, onerous restrictions and constant deportations for European Jews). My paternal great-grandfather was a socialist revolutionary who came to America to escape the Prussian secret police after a failed German uprising. My maternal ancestry is Irish Catholic. They came over to escape the chaos, misery and death of the Irish Potato Famine of the 1840s which decimated the island's population from 8 to 3 million in little over a decade. For three centuries, the Irish Catholics were referred to as the "common enemy" by the foreign English Protestant aristocracy which had invaded, resorted to occasinal genocide, dominated Ireland making the original Celtic inhabitants strangers in their own land.

Like many other white Americans, my ancestors while not slaves, were serfs or outcasts who came to America in the hope of escaping their respective oppression, poverty and ignorance. Their lives in the New World were almost as harsh as the Old facing Nativist discrimination, life in violent ethnic ghettos, sweatshop working and living conditions. It would be generations before both my parents would be the first ones in their families to have completed college and be assimilated into the middle and eventually upper middle class.

The same could be said for Asian and Hispanics who have come to America hoping to find opportunity but more often disappointment, discrimination and disillusionment. America is not the source of world evil and the oppressor of the nations (although meddlesome would be accurate), but neither is she that spotless beacon of human rights, racial equality, and endless equitable economic growth. She stands as a real world nation with many strenght and many weakneses to be addressed. Her alleged "superpower" status has blinded her understanding of other countries' aspirations for democracy, sovereignty and economic independence (i.e. Iraq, Iran, Vietnam, et alia).
...
written by guest1, November 26, 2006
Visit http://www.bullseye.tvheaven.com for background check of white racist men. White countries do background checks on immigrants from non-white countries. Time to do background check on white racism.
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written by DyerArlene31, October 08, 2010
Set your life easier get the loan and everything you need.

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