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Why Can't Brazilians Get a US Visa? Denying Them Has Become a Cash Cow! PDF Print E-mail
Written by Jia Acoirema   
Friday, 28 April 2006 11:06

Brazilian passportThe US Consulates in Brazil administer the processing of Visa applications to come to the United States. They have the responsibility of administering every type of applications from a Fiancé Visa (K-1) to a Tourist Visa (B1/B2).

This is the process. A Brazilian father by the name of Rogério and mother, by the name of Rosângela decide they want to make a trip to the United States. Their middle son, Reinaldo married a wonderful American girl, Janice, two years ago, and they relocated to the U.S. They've not seen their son in a long time.

Step one. You have to pay the fee, so that you can make an appointment for the interview. They pay the 38 reais (US$ 17) fee to schedule the interview with the US Consulate. The first available appointment is 4 months out.

Disappointed, it will take so long but excited at the prospect of seeing their son, daughter-in-law, and of course Mickey Mouse, they wait. Rogério and Rosângela purchase their airline tickets for two weeks after their interview date and prepare for their impending trip. .

Step two. It's a week before their appointment, Rogério and Rosângela prepare for their interview. They find the required forms 156/157 on the Consulate site, complete their documents and have their two Visa photos taken at a local store.

The required fee is US$ 100 per applicant. They pay the fees at Citibank Brazil and are set. The excitement is building now that the trip is only weeks away.

Rogério and Rosângela want to buy the gifts to bring with them for Reinaldo and Janice. They ask what they want from Brazil. What do they miss? Checking if their papers are in order, the interview is tomorrow, they try to sleep.

They arrive early at the Consulate. Everyone says there's always a long line. Waiting for their admittance at the US Consulate, the air is quiet in the line despite the cars rushing by on the street. The line is long and filled with all of the same hopefuls to get the nearly unobtainable US Tourist Visa.

Step three. Doors open, let's go. Pass the security guards, we're shuffled off to the left auditorium and told to take the next seat in line behind the others. Complete these papers and wait to be called.

Here we go, moving on to the next room, back past the entrance, and take a seat in line behind the next Visa hopeful. The windows in front of us now have Consul Employees calling people up. Wow, this is going fast. We're called up.

The conversation goes something like this; What Visa are you applying for? Tourist. Purpose of your visit? Visiting our son, he lives in the US. Are your documents completely filled out? Yes. OK, take a seat over there, and we're moving again. The other side of the room, more chairs, more waiting. We take our seats and wait to be called.

The room is quiet, even though it's full of people. If you speak are you denied and sent out? The tension is so thick in the room, it's contagious. To your left is a room with half glass walls. You can see the interviews happening on the spot. You notice nearly every 5 minutes another number is called and another interview begins and ends.

Step four. Number 32, DaSilva, window 4. It's your turn. You enter the room and approach window 4. The consular officer takes your forms and passports and looks them over. He asks each of you, What's your employment? You respond. He asks if you've brought your Imposto de Renda (Tax Return). You reply, yes and provide them.

The interviewer takes your passports and stamps them; you feel the excitement swell in your belly. "I've been approved!" He then passes back your Passports and a white piece of paper. "I'm sorry you're been denied, please read the paper enclosed. Thank you".

What? What happened? The interview is over? 5 minutes? It's over?

As you both walk out, you're in shock. How come you were not approved?

In 2004, 37,647 others just like you, applying for a B1/B2 Tourist Visa had this similar experience. The answers were all the same: Denied! This is the sound heard around Brazil, at least in the walls of the US Consulates.

As you read the paper provided you try to make sense of it.

The presumption in the law is that every visitor visa applicant is an intending immigrant.  Therefore, applicants for visitor visas have the burden of overcoming this presumption by demonstrating that:  

The purpose of their trip is to enter the U.S. for business, pleasure, or medical treatment;  they plan to remain for a specific, limited period; and they have a residence outside the U.S. as well as other binding ties which will ensure their return abroad at the end of the visit.

Unfortunately, you could not overcome the presumption and are being refused under section 214(b) of the INA, which requires that applicants prove that they have sufficient ties to Brazil to compel their return after a short visit to the United States.

It goes on to say, you may reapply if your situation has changed in 6 months. It does not mention that if you reapply you will have to pay another 38 reais and US$ 100.

You can't understand. You have a good income of more than 6,000 reais (US$ 3,000) per month, money in the bank for the trip; you're the owner of your home and additional property. Your family is big, more than 20 if I have to count them all. Your ticket was for two weeks.

Who overcomes this presumption? How do you accomplish it in five minutes, if you could? What are the answers to be approved? The answers to these questions exist, but the cost is high.

This is the formula; US$ 100 X each applicant X 5 minutes per interview X how many work hours in a day X work days in a year.

If the US Consulate identified the criteria to be approved or denied, the applicants would know not to spend the time and cost in attempting, if they did not meet the requirements. The consulate can't afford the income loss.

Nearly every other country in Latin America has a higher approval rate for B1/B2 Visa's to the US. Countries with higher unemployment rates and higher populations living beneath the poverty line have a better chance to get approved then a Brazilian does. Brazil has a 95% return rate on Visa's granted. What is the concern with issuing Visa's to Brazilians?

Is the US afraid the Brazilians will bring with them their warm nature, zest for life, strong family values, and flood the streets with Churrascarias (BBQ Restaurants)?

I am an American woman married to a Brazilian man. We've lived in Brazil for 4 years and have witnessed the above story and others first hand. We currently live in the US waiting for my husband's Permanent Residency. I'll withhold my real name for fear of repercussions from the Consulate.

Comments (252)Add Comment
Alan
written by Guest, April 28, 2006
Yeah, kinda difficult... plenty of people in the same situation...
=/
You are so right!
written by Guest, April 28, 2006
And yes you are right to withhold your name. It has been impossible to get anyone fro my wife's family a visa (even with earning good income, etc in brasil), I heard a story where in one window the interviewer said a family was too poor and in the next window, another interviewer told a man he was too rich!!!. bastards!
...
written by Guest, April 28, 2006
I have quite a bit of experience with this subject matter here in brazil, and I'm american. I personally know people at the U.S. consulate in Rio and people at the embassy in Brasilia, and stories like the one above are heartbreaking, and I can understand how it makes many feel, BUT, lol, you knew there was a "but", unfortunately brasil has the 2nd largest population of illegal immigrants in the U.S. Estimated today at over 1 million. The vast majority of these illegals have came via tourist visa and have never returned. Also, another reason for the high denial rate for brasilians, and also a reason why people are not given specific documents to bring is certainly not because of the effect it will have on the consulates income, you can rest assured of that, it is because Brazil is one of the world leaders in falsification of documentation, and this is a fact. Just to illustrate a quick example just recently there was a huge global diamond smuggling ring, the diamonds were coming to brazil....strictly for falsification of documents. So, in the point of view of the U.S. gov't., and I have to agree with them on this point, if they would tell everyone what documents to bring, everyone would bring them, legitimate or otherwise.

Besides the above I'm very sure that everyone is aware of the current situation in the U.S. today in regards to illegal aliens, it's quite the controversy, and brazilians being the 2nd largest perpetrator of this crime, and it is a crime, they're even considering making it a felony, are certainly not going to be given any leeway.

Unfortunately, because of the actions of MANY illegal brazilians themselves, other brazilians with honarable intentions are paying the consequences for the actions of their brethren.
...
written by Guest, April 28, 2006
" I heard a story where in one window the interviewer said a family was too poor and in the next window, another interviewer told a man he was too rich!!!. bastards!"

Yes, I agree that the excuses they give are just that...excuses. And according to their regulations they did need a legitimate excuse. It is up to the individual consul to make a determination, and if she "feels" that someone is not going to come back to brazil, she has the right to deny the visa. I know and agree that is wrong, but that is the way it is.
Sad but true...
written by Guest, April 28, 2006
I am a Brazilian and I have to agree with the poster above.

This is not an easy issue. There are a lot of Brazilians traveling for fun or visiting relatives in the US. But as the poster above indicated correctly, there are many coming to stay or work illegally.

Some time ago, a newcomer Brazilian fellow asked me to help him to find job. He told me that he was on tourist visa and he wanted to stay in America. I asked him if he was single so he could find a lady here, (he is a white guy from south with blue eyes and light brown hair and I guessed that would facilitate things for him here) and his problem would be solved legally. He informed me that his wife was back in Brazil with his two kids. He holds a public job back in Brazil and he got some kind of well extended leaving (another thing to discuss here, how come?).

I told him to turn back and stay in Brazil because things are getting tough here. He has a house, a job and two kids going to school in Brazil but he wanted to make more money, quicker and easier. After two months in the USA without much help, he finally moved to another city with an illegal job offer. He is not the desperate type of Brazilian so I guess that people in Brazil are getting wrong signals from the media (Globo?) in our country. Things here are not as easy as they think. You can progress and make more money than in Brazil but there are things like language barriers, discrimination, laws and what Brazilians are not used to, a government that would really kick your butt to a jail if you do not pay your taxes.

By the way, I came here legally and I am legally staying, just in case someone wonders.
...
written by Guest, April 28, 2006
"Yes, I agree that the excuses they give are just that...excuses. And according to their regulations they did need a legitimate excuse."

that was a typo, should've said, "they do NOT need a legitimate excuse.

For the poster above, I agree with you, many think it's going to be a bed of roses, but for those illegal it's mostly anything but. I can't imagine living in constant fear of getting pulled over by the police and being discovered to be illegal and possibly deported, all the while being taken advantage of by many that look to employ illegals to not pay minimum wage and taxes, social security, etc. to the U.S. gov't.

As far as brasilians not getting acclamated, that is another topic all its own, but after spending my entire life in the states, and the last 6 years here in brazil, I definitely can relate and imagine the difficulties of many brazilians adjusting to american life. There certainly not going to be able to rely on "jeitinhos" to get them by there.
Oh, yes, \"jeitinhos\"...
written by Guest, April 28, 2006
Actually, they do or how do you think that 12 millions plus illegal immigrants (Brazilians and many others from everywhere) got to stay in the USA? How would they manage if not with the typical "jeitinho" as defined by another article in this forum?

...
written by Guest, April 28, 2006
it got them in, but it's not going to get them by, those are quite two different things and realities that will soon hit those in the face once spending a couple 24 hours in the U.S.

When I said "get them by", I didn't mean the border patrol, lol, I meant getting them by day to day.
...
written by Guest, April 28, 2006
Sounds like the experince of a gringo renewing their tourist visa in Brazil.
Re: When I said \"get them by\"...:)
written by Guest, April 28, 2006
Thank you for the "get them by".

However, my point was that the illegal immigrants, many of the 12 plus millions have been here quite some time (let’s say over two or so years). How did they manage to get by (survive) all the years unless they got help from Americans or other people with power and money capable to offer help or exploit them, either way? By the other hand, there are lots of very successful illegal immigrants here, I would say.

See, the issue is quite complex but the subject here is why the Americans are refusing visa to the Brazilians. If the US Congress is about to pass a reforming bill why should then the US Consulate be worried any longer with visa issues? My vague opinion here is that they think that many foreigners from poor countries want to go take advantage of some possible immigrant amnesty provided by the US government after the bill is finally approved.






...
written by Guest, April 28, 2006
well, I understand your point and also agree with you that without question, for illegals to be in the country for any significant time period, they are more than likely being exploited to some degree.

As far as the situation with the amnesty situation, within the last several months there have been numerous senate and house hearings, one lasted 2 weeks in which the head of the border patrol for our southern border testified during a two day period, and the statistics that have been obtained AFTER Bush's speech at the end of last year about giving amnesty, the average number of illegals actually CAUGHT on our southern border rose from 200,000 per month to 400,000 per month in the months of January and February of this year. Now those are the ones that were caught, imagine how many actually got in.

It is becoming a situation in the U.S. that is in epidemic proportions, and I can understand fully both sides of the coin. It's a truly diffficult situation to be resolved and without question the first thing that needs to be achieved is to secure our borders. Afterall, look at the trillions we're spending on two wars on the other side of the world in the name of terrorism, and our own borders are pourous as sieves.
Brazil and reciprocity !
written by Guest, April 28, 2006

Is there not a Brazilian law that gives reciprocity on the subject of visas ?
I read many times that Brazil will allow a foreigner to enter Brazil without visa provided the foreign country does the same with Brazilians.

That seems....fair !

Then why do Swiss must obtain a visa to enter Brazil, but not Brazilians to enter Switzerland ?????????
There is no problem between Brazil and Switzerland and we have no reason to go eventually to Brazil to obtain illegally a low paying job anyway compared to our wages here ! But many Brazilians enter Switzerland to find an illegal job.


Where is the Brazilian trick ? Bureaucracy creates jobs, red tape brings money to the government EMPLOYEES, cost of visa brings money to the government who can then pay their employees !

And finally the illegal
Brazilian worker is no longer a charge for Brazil, he has a job elswhere, and can send money back home.

Can anyone explain where the Brazilian reciprocity law is ?????

In another subject, and to the defense of the USA, EU : should they accept illegal people by the hundreds of millions from all over the world...without control ?
They have no desire to have favelas in their countries I
They cannot provide jobs for everyone, legal or illegal jobs.
The EU already has officially a 10 % jobless rate, similar to Brazil !
I understand that in a FEW cases as the one explained in the article is different, but what about the 99 % of the other cases that you very well know about ! These 99 % dont have money and want to enter the USA/EU to eventually find an illegal job and even eventually get married, so they could finally settle in a country that provide what their own country did not provide.
Therefore to generalize of a problem that affect 1 % of the people as in the example above, the true reality of the 99 % is .....HIDDEN !

On a third subject different but still related to the previous ones :
Do you know that in Geneva, 70 % of the people in jail are.....FOREIGNERS ?
In the 70 % some are legally residing here.
And that 50 % of people in jail are....ilegally here without visa ?(not brazilians then since they dont need visas -but some brazilians are also in jail within the 70 %)

Do you also know that jails in my coun try are considered 5 stars resorts by jailed people ?

Do you also know that the daily cost is US$ 200.- PER PERSON ?
They even have a choice of 3 menus DAILY TWICE A DAY plus Breakfest ! Smile but true ! They have clean shower and clean toilets in the cell ! Number of prisoners per cell is usually 2, exceptionaly 3.
And the above cost doesnt include the justice costs....YET !

Hopefully everyone understands the relation between visas/no visa -legal/illegal residency/job - jails !
...
written by Guest, April 28, 2006
The above poster mentions "reciprocidade" and that is a good place to start. The author of this article appears to be barking up the wrong tree to some extent because Brazil is also making an incredible amount of money charging Americans $150 (this is what I paid using a Brazilian agency) for a 5 year visa. Furthermore they actually grant tourist visas to Americans so Brazil makes even more $$ out of the deal because they get US tourist $$'s.

Brazilians are being denied visas because they are going to American on those visas and staying as another poster pointed out. I think America is a better place with Brazilians in it but I think that they are being exploited by large and small businesses alike when they enter illegally. To make matters worse, the majority of Brazilians living illegally in the US send the lion's share of over $6 billion back to Brazil rather than spending it in the country. Imagine if 1 million Americans were working in Brazil illegally and sending over 6 billion back to America instead of spending it in the local economies. It is admittedly a very small amount but it still has some impact on the decision to not admit many Brazilians. Morever, it is wrong to take advantage of any country's resources, including medical services and education, without paying into the system and illegal aliens do NOT pay into "the system" in income taxes. That is wrong - plain and simple. It seems even that much more contradictory to hear this kind of complaining when we hear so many posters here slamming the US while singing the praises of Brazil incessantly!
...
written by Guest, April 28, 2006
You Brazilians should realize that American capitalist want visitors who will stay illegally and work cheaply.
To the friend of U.S. Consulate
written by Guest, April 28, 2006
You are dead right but you did 2 major errors in my view when you said :
Unfortunately, because of the actions of MANY illegal brazilians themselves, other brazilians with honarable intentions are paying the consequences for the actions of their brethren.
Instead of : because of the action of MANY illegal Brazilians it would be more appropriate to say :
because of the goal of 99 % of illegal foreigners.

Naming brazilians is not fair, you have far more Mexicans.

But I agree with you that it is a real problem for the rich nations. These nations are aging, then some new foreigners are welcome, but we cannot accept hundreds of millions of them at they wish and not as we decide !

Brazil does the same anyway with their S.A. countries borders. They dont accept the poorest Bolivians by the hundreds of thousands. They understand why they do so but not why we do so ! Strange !

It is also strange that to legally retire in Brazil, a foreigner must justify a monthly income of US$ 2000.- per month. That is quite a good income in Brazil.
Then in view of the difference in income between the USA/EU and Brazil, the USA/EU should be able to ask for a minimum of US$ 4 to 5000.- income justification per month for brazilians desiring to "retire" legally in the USA/EU !

Curiously enough, Brazilians no longer agree.

Exactly the same could be said with the Brazilian law that say a foreigner can reside and work in Brazil if he invests US$ 50'000.- and create (I think 10) jobs within 2 years.
Then based on the same principle, we should be able to ask for at least the same.
Afterall the EU has as much unemployment than in Brazil !

Again curiously enough : Brazilians no longer agree.

It simply means that Brazil agrees to accept relatively wealthy foreigners that are self sufficient but that they want us to accept foreigners that are NOT self sufficient !

CURIOUSLY AGAIN...BRAZILIANS DISAGREE !!!!

Why then dont Brazil tolerate poors from other nations such as Africans and South Americans and even from the EU or the USA not having the US$ 2000..- per month or the US$ 50'000 capital ????.

CURIOUSLY ENOUGH, AGAIN AND AGAIN, BRAZILIANS DISAGREE !!!!

They always impose stricter rules and laws than other nations (rich and poor nations) but always expect LESS rules and laws from the other nations (rich and poor nations) !!!

Can anyone comment ?
...
written by Guest, April 28, 2006
I can comment - this is typical Brazilian hypocrisy and protectionism. It's the "take but never give back" mentality.
...
written by Guest, April 28, 2006
yeah, you've made nothing but assumptions and are totally wrong in many of your statements.

Firstly, because of the 12 million and some even put the figure up to as many as 20 million illegals, there are stricter guidelines that have been put in place, but particularly for those countries that have the largest population of "offenders", which is mexico first, and brazil second. This isn't a discussion about Mexicans obtaining a visa, it's about brazilians obtaining a visa, and this has been explained here thoroughly.

As far as your "curiously brazilians disagree", lol, well my friend, you only have to look at current headlines in the american news to find out that now americans are vehemently disagreeing with this policy of letting these millions of illegals across our borders and for the vast majority of them to do nothing more than spend what they need to survive in the states while sending as much as possible back to their home countries.

The US wasn't settled by people that wanted to "visit" it and rape it, but people that wanted to go there to LIVE and start a new life.

You don't see americans and english beating down the doors of brazil and having millions of them here illegally now do you?
...
written by Guest, April 28, 2006
Can you believe that just today a reporter asked Bush if he thought the national anthem should now be sung in Spanish as well as English....WTF is that!
so right, the above comment !
written by Guest, April 28, 2006


Brazil requests to justify US$ 2000.- per month, to give a residency permit to retire...but not legal work unless the $ 50'000 capital laws and job creation !

Argentina has a GDP per capita slightly greater than Brazil, but request to justify "ONLY" US$ 1000.-per month to retire, but not legal work.

Argentina tolerates hundreds of thousands of illegal Bolivians workers,
NOT Brazil !

The EU tolerates many many millions of illegal Africans/South Americans/Asians workers,
NOT Brazil.

The USA tolerates millions and millions of illegal workers, mostly from LATAM, S.A., and Asia,
NOT Brazil.

Simple question to Brazil :
where are you similar or better than other nations, richer OR poorer than Brazil ?????
To the U.S. Consulate friend !
written by Guest, April 28, 2006
You misunderstood me !
I agree 100 % with you !

But the EU and the USA the USA cannot accept hundreds of millions of even "sincere and honest" workers who desire to create a new life in these countries.
You already have millions as we have millions of illegal and honest workers for years already.
The problem we face is not only the "bad" foreigners, but the good ones too !
What about the next 20/50/100 ?? millions of good workers desiring to reside and make a new life in our countries.
As sad as it is, if you understand what I mean, the problem is different but also similar ! The QUANTITY !
To the U.S. Consulate friend !
written by Guest, April 28, 2006

Explained otherwise we have TWO problems : the quantity of "bad" foreigners and the quantity of GOOD foreigners ! Even if the GOOF fopreign workers are the vast majority.
We are unable to provide them legal jobs at the speed THEY/WE desire.

If we would let our borders open the quantity would at least double in 1 year or 2 ! What do we do then ?
Wait a minute…!
written by Guest, April 28, 2006
Do not take this as being anti-America but I am shocked with the following statement.

"I am an American woman married to a Brazilian man. We've lived in Brazil for 4 years and have witnessed the above story and others first hand. We currently live in the US waiting for my husband's Permanent Residency. I'll withhold my real name for fear of repercussions from the Consulate. "

Now this is very interesting. Why a US citizen would be afraid of using her constitutional right of expressing her political views because of fear of retaliation from an agency of the US government?

Lady, don’t you believe that your country would uphold your right to express freely politically without causing you any harm?
...
written by Guest, April 28, 2006
P.S.: Of course, I meant to say without hiding your identity, openly.
U.S. national anthem !
written by Guest, April 28, 2006
You are lucky, so far it could be in 2 languages, in 5 years in 3 languages, because you will have to sing it in Portuguese too !

Worse for the EU will have once the Regional anthem, not only there is almost 25 nations languages, but also the differents languages of Africa, Arabs (Spanish and Portuguese languages are in the EU already)

I am from Geneva, Switzerland. Known as an International city ! My state has a population of around 500'000.
Believe it or not, there are now less than 50 % of the LEGAL residents having a Swiss passport.
My city was rated the
2nd best lively city in the world, by a poll of Mercer. The best was Zurich, also in Switzerland.
Knowing that my city is also one of the most expensive in the world, it is "unfortunately normal" that we are a prime target from
"good and bad* illegal foreigners/workers.

This is the price of fame.
We have a large Brazilian community here. Overall no problem, very nice people.
And it is quite easy for them to enter Switzerland, since NO visa is required
for Brazilians. TRUE.
No doubt that the word of mouth will go faster than the speed of light !

Smile

From Jia Acoirema
written by Guest, April 29, 2006
I am the Author of the Article. In response to this commentary:
Lady, don’t you believe that your country would uphold your right to express freely politically without causing you any harm?

Absolutely Not! You are asking me to trust the same country that so clearly misappropriates Visa's to who they wish too. This story is not fiction. Perfectly qualified individuals in Brazil are turned away while 10's of 1000's of Citizens from dramatically poorer countries, with alot more reason to stay illegally, then an elderly couple wanting to visit their son, are being granted. Have you asked yourself why? The US has created the current issues with immigration by granting Visa's to the poorest of countries residents to bring in cheap labor. In just 2004 the US granted Mexico 722,173 Type B1/B2/BBBCC alone. How many of these people do you think make up the illegals in the country now? 12-20 Million (whatever number you believe) illegal aliens did not all cross the borders on foot.
agree somewhat
written by Guest, April 29, 2006
I agree the lack of transparency is frustrating in regards to the issue of visas for visitors to the US from Brazil. Hell my girlfriend was denied and she is a a solidly middle class engineering major at one of the best universities in brazil. Why would she want to wash dishes in america, when for what she will make when she graduates she will live as well or better than I in the US, living in Brazil. I don't want to turn this into a discussion of race but non of white friends have ever been denied, nor her mother or step father, but her dad is black from bahia and she is obviously mixed, could this have palyed some factor? I have no evidence, but I think it might. That being said, I really doubt with the bloated budget of the US federal government they are really pulling a scam to make a few extra bucks off brazilians. Especially when I doubt this money goes straight back to the consulate but into some general coffer. That would be like microsoft setting up a lemonade stand.
Jia Acoirema
written by Guest, April 29, 2006
Firstly, I'm the person that knows people at the consulates and embassy here in brazil. I can wholeheartedly understand your frustration and disappointment about these types of situations, believe me, it even happened to a friend of mine (brazilian) that is extremely qualified a few years ago, and even with me knowing several people there. I accompanied him to the consulate in Rio as the best of my consulate friends was stationed there, for 12 years, but has since been moved to another consulate in Africa.

About your personal situation with your husband, it is next to IMPOSSIBLE for them to deny your husband a green card. One of the only ways would for them to find out he was a wanted criminal, which I'm certain he's not. You will although have to, if you already haven't, assume financially responsibility for him for a time period, I believe its two years. So you will have to have a proof of income in the U.S. in order to do this, if you've just moved back to the states from brazil and do not have an established income over the last year or two, you will have to have a relative/friend that is willing to do this for you.

As far as your reluctance to state your real name, I'll just say that I understand, but in your situation I honestly don't think it would matter, although among the guidelines it does state that people applying for residence do have to have a "pro-american" attitude, lol, whatever that means. Naturally, they can't express and exhibit anti-american gov't. attitudes in the hope of establishing residence there. Which I wholeheartedly agree with, and also agree with your frustration about this process and your right to express it as well as his.

your quote:

"The US has created the current issues with immigration by granting Visa's to the poorest of countries residents to bring in cheap labor. In just 2004 the US granted Mexico 722,173 Type B1/B2/BBBCC alone."

I do not agree with your statement that the U.S. has created this situation by issuing visas to poor countries. Firstly, your example of mexico, did you know they are considered a richer country than Brazil? They have the worlds 10th largest GNP, but besides this fact, naturally Mexico, because where it is geographically located, and also a strategic trading partner (NAFTA), are normally issued more visas than other nations. Also, naturally, there is a much higher demand for american visas in Mexico than in any other country in the world. I don't buy your statement inferring the U.S. gov't. is approving tourist and other temporary visas with the intention or beforehand knowledge that these people intend on staying all in an effort to provide cheap labor.

Our situation with vast numbers of illegal mexicans has been a problem the U.S. has been dealing with for decades. If you remember, during the Reagan administration, he granted amnesty for more than the 3 million illegals in the country at that time, which in large part were mexicans.

One of the above posters made several good and logical points, and sorry about misunderstanding your statement last night, it was late. But there has to be a limit on the number of visas issued in a year, naturally meaning that qualified applicants are going to be denied and not because of anything they've done wrong, there are quotas which must be in place or it would have dramatic effects on our economy, health care system, educational system, social security system, etc. Which by the way, it is already having and has had a significant negative impact in these areas.

Many people like to attempt and justify the numbers of illegals saying it's we americans that want this, to provide cheap labor, and without question, there are americans profiting from this, but a very small group, but some very influential. And it's not only americans, did you just see last week that the INS busted a German company that has plants in several states and they had over 1,000 undocumented workers with fake social security numbers? They're in some hot water at the current moment. The point I want to make here is that there have been numerous studies over the last 10 years done, by the american gov't. itself as well as NGO's that have studied the impact the vast numbers of illegals are having on american society, and the detriments they bring, far outweigh the benefits they provide, and naturally the U.S. gov't. is quite aware of this. Although, the current administration(Bush) is unquestionably being influenced by some of these groups that are profiting from illegal labor.

In all fairness and impartiality, as much as I can be as an american, but given today's situation, an estimated 12-20 million illegals, our friend from switzerland, with all due respect, that's 2-3 times the population of that entire country(!), with our wars on terrorism, with our pourous border(putting it mildly), when everything is taken into account one should be able to understand the overall strategy of the U.S. in respect to issuing visas and residency. And, one should be able to understand why countries such as brazil have the guidelines that they do. First and foremost as the second leading perpetrator of illegals in the U.S. But it's also much more than that....I'll explain.

I previously mentioned the fact the brazil is world reknowned for the falsification of documents, it is also reknowned for money laundering. There is also a city on the border of Paraguay, Argentina, and Brazil called Foz do Iguacu, Brazil; Ciudad del Este, Paraguay, Puerto Iguazu, Argentina. This area is reknown for black market trading, money laundering, and drugs, it is also reknown for the largest population of muslims outside the middle-east. I'm sure you've heard of Hezbollah, they have a camp and operate there. Osama bin-laden himself was there in the 1990's, this is fact, even confirmed by the brazilian gov't, as well as Paraguay, Argentina, and the CIA. The Israeli embassy bombing in Argentina in the '90's was carried out by hezbollah from this region. So, what do you have, you have a country that is world reknown for falsification of documents, you have a country that is second in numbers of illegals in the U.S. You have an area in the border region of this very country where hezbollah operates. I'm sure you can understand, given all these factors, why brazilian visas are scrutinized as they are.

Right, wrong, or indifferent, I understand your frustration. In many cases these denials of american visas don't seem fair, but as I stated, there has to be a limit, a ceiling on the numbers. Meaning that many well-intentioned visitors are going to be denied, the quota was more than likely already met.






...
written by Guest, April 29, 2006
http://usinfo.state.gov/wh/Arc...93923.html



http://www.ict.org.il/spotlight/det.cfm?id=30



The consulate sucks!
written by Guest, April 29, 2006
I feel like most of the comments here are blind to the spirit of the article written.
other than immigration, the visa process for Brazilians is degrading, not
only but having to pay U.S. dollars for the privilege of a ridiculous denial.

Personally I know of a handful of people who have been denied wrongly and a couple who were approved that went to the U.S. with intention to live illegally.
Their process is hit and miss, but we can see the bright side for the consulate, they are making dollars hand over fist, a lovely way to rape people of their hope and dignity and
charging them for it.

Their process is justifiable for the consulate, but the end result for the person is humiliation and the process as I said is hit and miss. They should find a process that
is more in black and white, or to be fair refund the money.

Basically this is bad service, a bad reflection on Americans and the United States.

On a personal note, being American, I have not had a good experience yet at the consulate. My take on it is they are more of a high price post office, if you need any real
help they simply fall short of the mark. As for me I will never go to the consulate here
unless I have no other choice.
Re: Jia Acoirema
written by Guest, April 29, 2006
Thank you for answering my questions.

And who can guarantee that the Brazilian government itself has not requested to the US Consulates to be tougher on Visas? Take in consideration the fact that the Brazilian media made a huge case for the illegal Brazilian immigrants in US being arrested and deported from here, recently. I believe that our government in Brasilia is very embarrassed.

I also believe that it is highly probable, that some of the readers here do work for the US consulate but it is sad when a citizen of ANY country is afraid to express politically an opinion, objection or idea because of possible retaliation from an agency of the government, especially from a country that has one of the best constitutions ever written.

Anyway, there should be a way to provide visas to the good people willing to travel to US without compromising the US security and policies.

The situation at the border between Brazil, Argentina and Paraguay is not good but I also believe that the Muslins moved to the area, in the beginning, to take advantage of the rules of commerce existent there. How to crack the international crime going on there without violating the rights of the good Muslins? We must keep that in mind.

Back to “visas”: How to select the good Brazilians from the bad ones without practicing unfair rules? I know my country and I know a lot of good Brazilians who would never resort to illegal documentation, stealing or any criminal practice of any sort. How to be fair to this good people?
From Jia
written by Guest, April 29, 2006
1st the above post is not from me, but to me. Just to clarify.

The GNP of Mexico is not relevant if the Povertly line is 40%. (Brazil is 22%) The money is not reaching the hands of the people. Therefore they go elsewhere, like the US to make a good living. The Poverty rate comes from this link. The CIA Factbook. http://www.odci.gov/cia/public....html#Econ

Of the 722,173 Visa's issued in 2004, above to Mexico, 675,289 were BBBCC. This type of Visa has the same requirements as a B1/B2, and it also 'prohibits' work in the US. Why is it being issued in enormous volume?

When the BBC's were being reissued in 2001. The US actually allowed the Foreign border companies to assist them in issuing the cards. No surprise their denial rate was less then 1% by these companies.
http://www.sonic.net/~undoc/bccnew.htm#_Toc7486615

Look at Guatemala for another example.75% of the people living below the Poverty line, per the CIA factbook. In 2004, they were issued 23,851 B1/B2 Visa's. 2% of the Countries Population in just 1 year were granted Tourist Visa's. They were issued 1 1/2 times the Visas Brazil was issued at only .04% of their Population.

If the criteria to be granted a Tourist Visa is that the Conulate believes that it is more beneficial to return to your home country then to stay in the US (as stated to me by the Consul in Rio).

Do you really think that a country in such gross poverty can possibly have the population to exceed this criteria by 1 1/2 X's the people of Brazil could?

I agree the bigger issue is in a large part discrimination. Whether it be by race or social class, it is a factor.

My family are not among the rich Brazilians, but they own their own home, have good jobs, and huge family ties.

The judgement of the Consul appears to be predominantly based on Job Title, as this is the one common factor in the interview process.

I have quotes from two of the Senior Consuls in Rio. In my questioning of the reason for denials of the Vissa's for my family. I was told: "Since this appears to be a once-in-a-lifetime trip and not something people of this income level are going to be doing several times a year, give it some time and try again."

The Consul had no evidence of their income, because they didn't ask for it. When I told him, just one of the applicants alone made $3,500US per month, he said I could appeal.
They determined by job title alone, that my family were 'people of this income' .

Why is it suggested to apply again in the future? Nothing will change. These are people in established lives.

The next Consul said:
"The presence of family members in the United States may also be a factor in judging the strength of the applicant's ties to the residence abroad."

Are you kidding me? One son in the US is a stronger tie then 20 family members in Brazil.

Not to mention the 9 FAM(Foreign Affairs Manual) states that one of the reasons for people to travel is for visiting family and friends.

Repeated requests to be told what is the exact reason for denials were evaded. On one occasion I was told they can not reveal this to a 3rd party.

So my in-laws made the request. The Consulate has yet to respond to them. It's been 8 days now.

There are no Visa quotas placed on B1/B2 types. This is applied to various other types of Visa's, usually that would lead to residency, not vacation.
http://travel.state.gov/visa/frvi/bulletin/bulletin_2757.html

If there were a quota, offical or unofficial for B1//B2 Visa's and the limits were reached by April. Notice should be given to applicants to stop spending $100US dollars applying for something they have NO chance of obtaining.

Perhaps in the case of Brazil this should already be stated!
...
written by Guest, April 29, 2006
being a brazilian I guess three reasons for consulates not to issue brazilian visas: the high proportions of illegal immigration if the figures that the country has the second largest illegal immigration population are right, then social class/race discrimination and the greed for cash.

In my opinion Americans have showed an horrible intolerande on this site towards womem, men and brazil so you can say they are not very fond of multiculturalism. I have my own experiences in American soil, but only my internet experiences have showed me it in a not tourist/ money spender view.

I have my doubts about the motivation of the American gov not looking for money as well. American public deficit is the largest of the world, Iraque, and now probably Iran war, demand a lot of money from american tax payers.

There's exploitation when they deny visas and make people apply for four times or more.There's exploitation when Americans hire illegal people to clean their mess and pay less than half if they were american.Now they want these people to die in hospitals because they are not allowed to have care! People should stop this and allow some dignity to immigrants.

America is not more the land of freedom than any other country. I think this is an American mito myth, take what happened to the democratic senator whose task was to come back from Iraque with Saddan Hussein's mass destructice arsenal information.

All I wish to America, as for my own country and myself, is that people can be open-minded about themselves, see what's going on allow us to make a change of directions that are dificult to handle in later times.
I can Relate to this Article
written by Guest, April 29, 2006
My mother sent me to America to live with my father who is of brazilian descent living in Newark.. she figured i'd have a better life here in America, When i left the airport security had to hold her back because she was so distraught... Since then she's tried to get a visa and failed miserably the only way i see her is visits once every 3 years... and now that im starting college money is tight and i have no idea when the next time i see her will be

In the end what she did for me was the best gift ever, puting herself aside to give me a better education... however i wish i could see her... it shudn't be this hard for honest hard working people..
Mexicans
written by Guest, April 29, 2006
I hate to say but Mexicans are f**king things up for everyone else. They have become quite arrogant about the illegal issue. They talk about it as if it were their right to send as many people to the US as they want. There will be a lot of backlash for everyone else, over political unsavvy moves such singing the national anthem in Spanish.
Mother to America !
written by Guest, April 29, 2006
sorry but you are full of contradiction !
I understand your problem but if money is tight, then if your mother cannot enter the USA
(meaning she has money to travel) she could as well send you that money for you to travel to Mexico !

And then your whole problems are solved !

This story simply depicts situations where in fact it it the reality behind the story that is hidden.
To : being a brazilian !
written by Guest, April 29, 2006
Looks like you never talked to a brazilian woman. Areyou gay...may be ?

Many many brazilian women have a desire to meet and marry a foreigner because they dont like how brazilians men treat them.
You could even see this in articles on this site how brazilian women are beaten by their husband or partner, but then when they go to justice nothing happens...as usual with your injustice in justice !

Talk to brazilian women about their desire, dont talk for them.
provide visas to the good people
written by Guest, April 29, 2006
That is the whole point !
Eventually if a Brazilian books for 3 weeks a good U.S. hotel, he may very well have his visa.

Why is the visa only a one way problem ?

Does Brazil give
easily a visa to Bolivians, Nicaraguean, and Honduras, Peruvians....to anyone who wish to "visit" Brazil ?????

When you will have answered to that question you will have the same answer from our side !

Is that not simple ?
american visas in Mexico
written by Guest, April 29, 2006
Wait wait wait a second !
Why did the US government "warned and strongly suggested" officially to U.S citizens not to go to Mexico ????????

And this on more than one occasion !
To the US consulate friend
written by Guest, April 29, 2006
Wait wait ! you may have 2 or 3 times more illegal residents than the whole population than Switzerland BUT even 20 millions would represent "only" 8 % or so of your population.
In Geneva....we have at least....double your 8 %...due to easyness to enter our country.

But as I said, this is the price of fame of being an International city, wealthy country and lack of stricter entry laws !
On top Geneva provides legal jobs for 30'000 French residing in France, around the border !
When we go shopping in the commercial zones, We see there are a minority of.... Swiss !!!
True !
she figured i\'d have a better life here
written by Guest, April 29, 2006
You said it all !
Then now you know why Brazilians wish to "only" visit the USA by the millions and millions !!!

They all agree with your mother !
...
written by Guest, April 29, 2006
"I have my doubts about the motivation of the American gov not looking for money as well. American public deficit is the largest of the world, Iraque, and now probably Iran war, demand a lot of money from american tax payers.

There's exploitation when they deny visas and make people apply for four times or more.There's exploitation when Americans hire illegal people to clean their mess and pay less than half if they were american.Now they want these people to die in hospitals because they are not allowed to have care! People should stop this and allow some dignity to immigrants.

America is not more the land of freedom than any other country. I think this is an American mito myth, take what happened to the democratic senator whose task was to come back from Iraque with Saddan Hussein's mass destructice arsenal information."

Wow - you're an angry little fella aint ya? What's wrong little man? Did someone refuse to let you back into the US? Well I'm sure that kind of attitude shows when you sit there in front of the staff at the consulate . . . Maybe consulate staff recognizes that Brazilians like you generally hate America and all it stands for but just want to feed off of it parasitically because you have no job opportunities in your own country. You pissed about that buddy?

Finally, lets not forget to mention the 3 rules of engagement by any Brazilian poster in any thread.

1) Immediately blame the US no matter the circumstances. IN this instance, blame the consulate instead of the millions of Brazilians who have stayed and worked in America illegally while sending money back to Brazil. They have set a wonderful precedent for you all to follow. It isn't just Mexicans to blame for this either. Your stupid "reciprocidade" policy and subsequent photographing and fingerprinting of Americans entering Brazil didn't help matters for you. Neither did comparing US actions to the worst acts perpetrated by Nazi Germany when we began fingerprinting and photographing all visting Brazilians. STUPID! There are plenty of reasons to compare America to Nazi Germany but that certainly was not one of them. . .

2) Twist the argument and/or cite Brazilian technological, sociological and economic superiority at your earliest opportunity. Deny that there are any problems in your own country which brings us to rule number . .

3) ALWAYS, ALWAYS mention Iraq and/or Iran even if the thread is about Carnaval or Soy Exports. Never, ever miss an opportunity to point out that America is engaged in an illegal war that is DEEPLY AFFECTING THE BRAZILIAN PEOPLE ON A VERY PERSONAL LEVEL. Tell us big guy . . .How has the war in Iraq "touched" you on a personal level in any way? Now get the f**k over yourself!
RE: f
written by Guest, April 29, 2006
It\'s Worse than a Bad Joke
written by Guest, April 29, 2006
My ex-wife and daughter are Mexican. She's not an American citizen so she needs a visa to visit the U.S. There is a two month wait to obtain an interview at the U.S. embassy in Mexico City. The fee just for the interview is $120. She and her family are mainly middle class professionals. From my experience more than half are refused visas after the interview.
So I couldn't take my 7 year old to Disney World. Meanwhile thousands of ill educated peasants cross the Rio Grande illegally every day.Does any of this make sense?
RE: from Jia
written by Guest, April 29, 2006
Just got in Jia and read your response. Jia, did you not read my previous post?

Numbers of illegals? Quotas? Money laundering? Terrorism? Falsification of documatation?

What do you suppose we do Jia?? Have an open policy on residency and have 100 million illegals and for the goverment to collapse??? Because that's exactly what would happen. Try to sepertate yourself from the situation on a personal level....and think rationally.
...
written by Guest, April 29, 2006
Here's another outlook. Brazil has been big on reciprocity, and its a common standard for countries to implement standards of reciprocity with one another.

In brazil, you basically have two options of obtaining a permanent visa, one is marrying a brazilian, the other is an investors visa, which today requires a 50,000 dollar investment, and they just changed this from 200,000 dollars.

Now let's imagine that the U.S. gov't. required this, how many illegals would we have and just how would the system be?
US VISA
written by Guest, April 29, 2006
The main question is, why govisit to US and be treated as s**t if you can go to EU without visa (3 months) or Patagonia (Argentina). Even Brasil is a lot prettier than US, we have more waterfalls, forests, caves and so on. If they don't want you there, don't go, easy like that. Cheap stuff you can get anywhere in EU or Canada. Get a visa to Canada is easier than US one.

Don't be a fool: travel to US as a tourist is a waste of time and money.

Now, if you want to visit you family at US, why not pay to then come? Or meet then anywhere else...
...
written by Guest, April 29, 2006
these people are being extremely unfair to the american gov't. as if they're the Red Cross.....compare it to other gov'ts. in the world, and you'll see it's the most lenient of all.
Re: What do you suppose we do...
written by Guest, April 29, 2006
a good foreign policy to go around denying visas to good people because of the possibility of getting bad people. This is not the most elegant and democratic solution.

While I understand the problem that the US are going through with millions of illegal immigrants I like to remind you that Hollywood played a big role in promoting the US as the land of excitement, romanticism and material gain.

The USA should not walk the path of pride now.

I came to US as a legal immigrant and took advantage of the cap