Brazzil

Is Becoming More and More Like the United States!

Let´s see, here´s a Manchete magazine, number 219 from June 30, 1956. White gal in a bathing suit on the cover, Lêda. Back cover, white guy in an illustration for an Epsom shirt ad. Inside, white Miss Brasil contestants, each hoping to win and go to Long Beach for the Miss Universe competition. Long Beach, my home town! O Cruzeiro, 19-9-53. White gal on the cover. White couple on back cover, illustration for Lever Soap. O Cruzeiro, 16 November 1963. Sigrid Dieken, German actress, on cover. White lady and two kids on back cover, Nescau ad.

This week´s Veja. Tomato on the cover, real tomato, not a girl. Inside, black looking guy, bank ad, Asian looking guy, GM ad. White guy, then Delfim, then black guy, white girl, then through to the last page, 72 white appearing, 12 mixed, 3 blacks. Including news items and everything, so means very little. Interesting though.

A few years ago at a conference an Englishman kept boasting that people in southern England spoke queen's English. Finally an Englishman from north of England jumped up and said, "speaking queen's English does n't a royalty make. Exactly my sentiments regarding this article...success does not whiteness make, eg. Singapore and Japan which is seen as successful but they are not white by a long shot!!! At the same time whiteness does not a success make, ie., Brazil is seen as a white country here in Asia but definitely not successful..if the Brazilians think they are white, they have convinced the world. However, if they think because they are white they are successful, they are just fooling themselves.

Very nice G. But I don't think how they perceive their color or how they think the rest of the world perceives it to be is what's driving them (other than perhaps in regards to ad effectiveness in the local markets). It's also not what's keeping them from being successful.

NO COMMENT
____________________
ISTOE Gente interview with paulista Eliana Tranchesi, owner of South America's most luxurius clothing store DASLU


...tenho 48 anos de responsabilidade social. Por vender luxo, fiquei responsável pela desigualdade brasileira, e a minha vida foi um exemplo do contrário.Criei o filho da minha babá. Quando nasceu minha última filha ela me contou que estava grávida do namorado dela e não queria casar. Falei para ter o bebê na minha casa. Ele foi criado junto com a minha loirinha de olhos verdes. Minha filhinha e o pretinho foram para a mesma escola.

very touching...
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it's the "fazenda" mindset again and again that prevents Brazil from moving forward to a more modern society.

"It's also not what's keeping them from being successful."

Part of the unsuccessful story.

It doesn't matter how many articles you write, I will be here to show the truth to the people. You are running out of arguments, aren't you? You just repeats the same statistical nonsense, worthless footnotes and little activist stories everytime.

In Uma História Não Contada (An Untold Story), the author provides detailed research of race relations in São Paulo between the years 1889 and 1930.
...
- There existed streets for whites and streets for blacks.

Great! The 19th century again! Don't you have any data about today?

These practices were the precedent setting guidelines that still govern race relations today.

This is a very big lie. There's no such thing of "streets for blacks" or anything like the examples you gave in Brazil today. Where do you get these ideas from?

BTW, today I was just getting home and I saw one of my neighbors that I hadn't the opportunity of knowing yet. It was a blonde woman with a black guy, both middle class apparently, living in the same neighborhood as I do. We see people together all the time in this country, everywhere. No segregation whatsoever.

This seems to go against the very idea you are trying to promote, that blacks are forced to live separated. That and my own family and many families from friends of mine. You can't deny the reality, it doesn't matter how hard you try.

The Brazilian media often demonstrates its willingness to attach measurements of value to racial groups. For instance, a study recently confirmed that since its inception, the magazine Veja has released a total 1,852 issues but featured only 58 afrodescendentes on its front covers.

Have you performed DNA testing to determine if any of those people didn't have any black ancestors? Your argument is flawed. You simply can't make such affirmation.

If what you are looking for are blacks, then say blacks not "afrodescendentes". And, yes, that number is proportional to the number of 100% blacks we have.

Any visitor who has been to Brazil knows that ethnic portrayal of Brazil in media does not represent a true reflection of the racial diversity in the country. This is no mere coincidence. The white middle and upper classes of Brazil believe it is their natural right to be represented as the face of a successful Brazil.

You are always careful to try to back your flawed affirmations with loosely related studies in order to achieve incorrect conclusions, or blatantly little activist stories, but this time you slipped in making it at least believable for those inclined to racism. You just make some broad affirmation you can't prove, and then appeal to the American/European racial to convince foreigners that come to Brazil "to see" it.

What foreigner visitors have to do with Brazil and brazilians to begin with? And why should they be the ones to give the final word in brazilian society.

You are simply sick. So, what do you mean? That we aren't as white as Sweden? No one said it was, but this country is of many mixings, and that's what Brazil looks like. Not this or that, just mixed. And that may cause people look in a variety of shapes and forms you might not be used to see in the "black/white US". Americans don't mix. Don't try to teach the priest how to conduct the mass, we are in this business of mixing far longer than any other country.

When you add the image of the sexually available mulata, it becomes clear that Brazilian society continues to see afrodescendentes as "objects of entertainment"

Nobody forces mulatas or whoever person to be an "object of entertainment", but any brazilian can tell how some seem to enjoy it. If I were God I would just finish this crap once and for all and from there on everyone would need to go through college and get a profession, but you know what? Some prefer dancing and beer than books.

Women believe they have power by being attractive. That's it. The exercizing power, and you, moron, is talking as if they are cast to lower roles. This no lower role! At least not for them, and that's what matters.

I have met some people living in those poorer areas. They have no will to study or do anything else for themselves besides sex and beer. I don't understand how their minds work, if I were in their place I would search all the ways possible to get out of there.

When faced with the vast amount of evidence that the Brazilian media seems to be ashamed of the darker side of its ethnic mix, one might ask what reasons are used to excuse this obsession with presenting Brazil as a white country

The only obssession I see is from americans protraying Brazil as a black country.

Continue...

The difference here is that countries like Brazil, Cuba, Puerto Rico and Dominican Republic have yet to deal with their own historical racism against its African descendents, thus they continue to see them as inferior beings that deserve to remain on the outskirts of their respective societies. For this simple fact, maybe all of these nations could benefit from affirmative action policies

Something from the 19th century? Today there's no racism. We don't segregate people by color, we don't see color (the many colors is evidence of that, "racial purity" is a Nazi concept for brazilians, something to be despised).

Benefit how? By start classifying people by their colors? To attribute notions like the IQ chart kids are taught in school in the US? To racially profile people? Are you sick?

BTW you cited once again the "police death squads", you are not telling that most part of the police is formed by mestizos and blacks. So it's not a racial matter since all parts of the society are represented in the police.

For instance, in 1995, the newspaper Folha de S. Paulo conducted a poll that found that 89% of Brazilians thought that prejudice against afrodescendentes existed in Brazil while only 10% admitted to personally having prejudice

Stop calling blacks "afrodescendentes". And this is taking advantage of the culture of Brazil for you little dirty goals. Brazilians are the most self-critic people I have ever known. They will say everything negative about this country, be it true or not, to the point of not being benefical for realizing the problems but it is simply masochistical.

The vast majority will say that most politicias are corrupt, will say that most policemen are corrupt, that most entrepreneurs are corrupt, that everyone is corrupt, etc. They will anything bad, even if they have no evidence of that.

I see a lot of americans using it as some sort of "evidence". You should be ashamed of yourselves. Americans love to live in denial, as if that country were perfect in every way and don't admit any problems. One example of this behavior is the denial of the existence of organized crime that bring illegal immigrants there, and the exploitation they suffer with lower wages and zero rights by greedy and corrupt businessmen.

They will paint a rainbow of happiness of those semi-slaves, dividing small rooms with 6 others and not eating too much for saving more money.

It's good that the concept of "Brazilian exceptionalism" is finally being put to rest. I think what most Euro-Brazilians fail to recognize and do not grasp is that an oppositional theory of racial dynamics arose long ago among black intellectuals to counter notions of Euro-American innate cultural and social superiority and hierarchy in the Western hemisphere, indeed the world, loosely denominated as the notion of the "Black Atlantic". To summarize, there is a commonality among the Afrodescended thoughout the Atlantic diaspora of Africans in their relationship with the dominant Euro-derived culture that has shaped and formed both, no matter what the specific local.. This phenomenon is generally unacknowleged by the dominant Eurocentric societies, who cling to outdated concepts of Euro exclusivity and privilege. Therefore, Brazil is no exception, but conforms to the rule. As Mr. Wells suggests, one must recognize a problem, before the problem can be addressed. This fantasy of racial democracy that Euro Brazilians embrace and which pervades the social, political, and economic conscious of the population, as evidenced by the comments on these pages despite all objective evidence to the contrary, is simply an enhanced state of denial bordering on the self delusional. The facts don't change; the people must. It's an inevitalbe dynamic that was set into motion long ago. Brazil will find its own way simply because the Afro-descended in Brazil have demanded change and will continue to do so as long as the society is so negatively skewed against their interests. Exactly when, how and why has yet to manifest fully, but the process is essentially unstoppable. And, it's not like the process is taking place in a vacuum of Brasilandade. There are cross currents of change throughout the Black Atlantic that nourish each other. The afrodescendent situation in the United States, Jamica, England, Columbia, the Carribean, all contribute and inform the situation in Brazil, as does Brazil to other Afrodesended. A luta continua. In general the Euro American cultural and political hegemony is breaking up all over the world, simply because the afrodescended and others refuse to continue to be defined, regulated and de-privileged as a matter of course based on ancestry and colour. So yes, we are all human beings, but as James Baldwin used to say, until white people get over being white, and start conceptualizing themselves as just plain human beings like everybody else, they will get no rest since white privilege and entitlement will always be attacked, and thus, the beneficiaries of it must always defend.

You can't be serious. Anyone reading your text can notice a lot of keywords used by american black movements such as "diaspora" (a brazilian would get an question mark on his head, because we don't have such a word, or at least it's not in the popular vernacular), "euro-americans", "african atlantic (?)".

summarize, there is a commonality among the Afrodescended thoughout the Atlantic diaspora of Africans in their relationship with the dominant Euro-derived culture that has shaped and formed both, no matter what the specific local

Dominant Euro-derived culture? Do you know anything about the brazilian culture? If you knew then you would know that african culture is as present as any others, and it's practiced openly and nobody is ashamed of it, in fact it's the exact opposite, people are proud of it as things that could exist only in Brazil.

This fantasy of racial democracy that Euro Brazilians embrace and which pervades the social,

Rethoric, rethoric, rethoric...

Mixed brazilians like me will always fight you and people like you, don't be mistaken of that. Don't pretend to speak in our behalf because we know things better than you could ever imagined. I would the process of mixing and blurring the lines between races in the one in motion and sooner or later the US will wake up to the reality. It will be the day every single white or black racist will be confronted with the rest of the human race, as one.

You are a shame to humanity. It's futile to fight against the end of races, you know you can't stop it, you can't go back in time!

You have a whistle Mark. You have your authorities. As an ex patrolman, law family (enforcement military and all that jazz) why do you broadcast all and these any uncertainties may be suspect? I see not how disturbing the sheep will do much to settle the flock block or ak ak ak flack you can't tolerate. Help out man get a card (one) or write your congress man or People an a conserving manner.

A Brazilian: Mixed brazilians like me will always fight you and people like you, don't be mistaken of that.

Lord Invader: Of course. You've been fighting and killing people like him--black Brazilians--since 1500. No surprise there. That's why he wrote what he did.

"It's futile to fight against the end of races, you know you can't stop it, you can't go back in time!"

It's equally futile to fight against reality, which is what you've been doing ever since you appeared on this board.

Your writting not much better than your farting!

"I have met some people living in those poorer areas. They have no will to study or do anything else for themselves besides sex and beer. I don't understand how their minds work, if I were in their place I would search all the ways possible to get out of there." - A Brazilian

Oh so too have I! Difference is I went for the experience to see the roots of where the most decent soul on this planet I know came from. Of course the souls that remain there would get out but they couldn't possibly do so without loosing thier families and unbelievable humanity. What you say about them is paydu and a clear pointer towards what's gone so seriously wrong. Do you think these lazy sex craving drunkards don't set thier children down to spend time after school to pratice thier reading, writing and arithmatic? That the pre-schoolers are not put to task during that hour in learning how to hold and control a pencil drawing something / anything over the pictures in a coloring book? Where do you think they want themselves and thier offspring to at least have a chance at being? You are not A brazilian you have risen to be an A whole Brazilian. Maybe you have no life or one that is inconsitent with / unworthy of what you say you mean to accomplish here.

The end of races won't ever happen if it's up to americans, they just can't live without it
written by A brazilian, 2007-01-30 15:41:57

Dominant Euro-derived culture? Do you know anything about the brazilian culture? If you knew then you would know that african culture is as present as any others, and it's practiced openly and nobody is ashamed of it, in fact it's the exact opposite, people are proud of it as things that could exist only in Brazil.

Mixed brazilians like me will always fight you and people like you, don't be mistaken of that.

And when a politician or policeman is found guilty of corruption by the investigators....what does the famous
Brazilian UNjustice do ???????
Impunity...of course, or absolving...of course !
Worse : when politicians are involved in corruptions such as in the vote buying scandal.....just re-read if not already done...what happened : they were absolved, IN SECRET VOTES, BY THEIR OWN PEERS AS MUCH CORRUPTED AS THOSE THEY ABSOLVED.

Every brazilian is corrupted, it is the way you are educated one way or the other.

In Brazil corruption is a daily lifestyle, something normal, something you all aspire and hope....to become successful.

SIMPLY BECAUSE OTHERWISE......THOSE SUCCESSFULL....THE MINORITY.....WOULD NOT BE AS SUCCESSFUL.

Simple demonstration of how unhealthy the Brazilian minds are !

And that is all due to your lack or bad........EDUCATION !

WTF do those lies have to do with anything written in here? Your brain is rotten.

When I lived in the US back in the 1990s, two groups were the main benefiticaries of affirmitive action: white American women and the white skinned Hispanics, some of whom were women and girls of Brazilian origin. The employers who did not want to hire blacks or Asians always went for the white South Americans to fill their quotas. These "whites" had a lot of fun. They were white and so the society did not discriminate against them. They were also considered non-white and hence were eligible for all the set asides. It must be fun to be white but not be considered one!!

written by A brazilian, 2007-01-31 09:46:30

WTF do those lies have to do with anything written in here?

Lies, Lies, and more Lies!!! "These cowards have no morals. They have no shame about lying"




"For the last time, Chief Brody, there is NO SHARK in these waters!"

...and the white skinned Hispanics, some of whom were women and girls of Brazilian origin....

We don't speak spanish and the capital of Brazil is not Buenos Aires. Hispanic is your mother.

Ti munca, A Brazilian. Deixa a mãe dele fora....

How can it be that many a*****es all around the world feel entitled to discuss brazilians "problems", problems in their racist view of course, but they don't any clue of what they are talking about? That G Chell is perfect example of that, he must probably think Brazil is of the size of some caribbean island and we are all black.

That G Chell is perfect example of that, he must probably think Brazil is of the size of some caribbean island and we are all black.

Everyone knows that brazil is a country in the southern part of africa buddy....everyone!

I hope that you are joking "bo" because you are dead wrong.....

Mark Wells Intentions are good and I respect him, but I cannot help but feel that he is on his way to causing more division amongst us all... Not only amongst whites and blacks but between Americans and Brazilians. His work is about obsessing and rekindling hate from the past. He should pay more attention to modern society and not just soap operas and small, biased and insignificate stories from his own experiences. The 18th and 19th centuries were hard times everywhere in regards to race. Mark, do you believe that Brazil has changed since the 19th century in regards to race? Or do you think that it would be accepted by any Brazilian if they saw a Negra get her hat knocked off while walking down the street? If so you are greatly confused and living in the past!!

"In other words, even when Afro-Brazilians climb the ladder of social success beyond the stereotypical roles reserved for them, they cannot be presented in this light. Social prestige, power and professional status are thus associated with the whiteness of one's skin. When you add the image of the sexually available mulata, it becomes clear that Brazilian society continues to see afrodescendentes as "objects of entertainment"(."

So when A Negra ou Mulata is not shown its because of racism and when they are shown during carnival for example, ( in small clothing) its because they are only sexual objects (a biased catch 22?)...Mark do you know if the so called "white woman " are portrayed as sexual objects? Does this only apply to As NEGRAS?? NO way!!!

ritten by Jorgao, 2007-01-31 20:04:39

I hope that you are joking "bo" because you are dead wrong.....

duhhhhh....eh mesmo?

He will repeat the same thing a thousand until it becomes truth.

illegal alien brazillian nationals in the usa , cry racism when apprehended or arrested for anything they do ... quite funny isn,t it ...being brazilian is a race ...but only if your illegally in the u.s.a.... and your headed for deportation....The only race problem in the u.s....is the race to get them out no matter what nationality or race.....

What are you talking about!?

The 18th and 19th centuries were hard times everywhere in regards to race. Mark, do you believe that Brazil has changed since the 19th century in regards to race?

For I what I have seen in his articles he has a predefined conclusion that must be reached, or that he expects to reach. If he used only stories from modern Brazil, i.e., from the 70s up to now there wouldn't be enough for him to make the conclusion he wants to make, that racism is generalized and a big problem. These kind of stories are to impress foreigners that have never been to Brazil, kind of sensationalistic.

The other tactic is to use cherry pick statistics and "facts" and use them to prove a point. For example the "sexually available mulata" he mentioned, purely his interpretation that doesn't match reality at all.

I saw a "fact" in another racism report that made me laugh. The person used the exact same arguments, with different words of course, that Mark Wells does (the "whitening", the violence on the streets, the black-killer police, the number of people on magazine covers, etc), but the most absurd one was that african religions are "denigrated" and not tolerated and cited examples of Evangelical groups giving such cults bad names. For christ sakes, the same evangelical cults accuse catholics and everyone that is not from their church of everything!! Remember when the a Holy Mary statue was kicked on TV, and that generated a lot of press? Isn't that offending Catholicism!?

Some people decided that Brazil has racism and they are determined to make it so, even it's not there. They will see racism everywhere.

Mark Wells Intentions are good and I respect him

I don't trust people as much as you do, especially on the internet. I think he knows very well what he is doing, his comments on Brazil are well constructed and I think it follows a pattern of what I have seen in other sites. Coincidence? I don't think so. Whatever his will is definetely it's not to help anybody but himself.

He seems more worried to prove that the society he grew in and the racial values he learned to praise are the only true in the whole world, and Brazil is just an "anomaly" that must be corrected. It doesn't matter the fact that we live here and see in our own families and friends otherwise.

FOR" A" " BRAZILIAN",...What are YOU talking about??... the post says, illegal brazilians in the u.s.a. when apprehended or arrested and deported or for any crime they commit ,..claim racism as the reason they are arrested....NOW SINCE WHEN IS BEING BRAZILIAN A RACE....Answer : when you have no other excuses for your actions!....

Some people decided that Brazil has racism and they are determined to make it so, even it's not there. They will see racism everywhere.

Many of those people appear to be brazilians.....even the president of brazil readily admits that racism exists in brazil. But, that's kind of like saying "water" exists" in brazil. Unfortunately, racism exists throughout the world, and brazil is certainly no exception..... numbnutz.

Bo,

Valeu!! Eu mau enterpretei a parada, poss admitir....Voce ta Nos US ha quanto tempo?? Essse sarcasmo ta demais!!! Tenta escrever algo inteligente!!

posso

I'm in brazil jorgao and have been for the last 10 years but am american. Spent my first 34 years of life in the U.S.

Brazilian white oligarchy is 100% racist and will always be...as for the white middle class attitude it can vary from person to person btu there's lots of racism even there (especialy in Southern Brazil and among Brazialisn-Germans with Nazi ancestry).
It must also be noted that the "white beauty ideal" supported (willingly or unwillingly I have no idea) by Rede Globo & co has influenced even non-white Brazilians of all shades who often have white blond women as standards.
So I do support policies that would put more black people in the media and with positive roles ...this woudl help and so would quotas for jobs. But I also believe that the beaitiful Afro-brazilian culture should be cherished and supported as being part of the culture of ALL Brazilians otherwise in the long term it would end up like in the United States where hip-hop and rap and Black music are regarded by Blacks as a "balck thang" and white people who perform or dance to it as "stealers" or "exploiters" and black people who do something different as "sell-outs" or "whiteys"...Americans shoudl not export this to Brazil

Many of those people appear to be brazilians.....even the president of brazil readily admits that racism exists in brazil. But, that's kind of like saying "water" exists" in brazil. Unfortunately, racism exists throughout the world, and brazil is certainly no exception..... numbnutz.

Brazilians don't know what racism is, I can tell you that for sure. You would need experience abroad in order to see racism, and the majority of the population never left this country.

The president and other might say that, but they will do it to be "politically correct", not because they believe to have any evidence. If you asked any of them about the police, they would say they are underpaid, underequipped and some are corrupt. If you asked about the politicians, they would say they are corrupt. If you asked about rich people, they would say they are "greedy" and don't want to share the wealth (sic). Common places in a politically correct world, not facts.

Brazilian white oligarchy is 100% racist and will always be...as for the white middle class attitude it can vary from person to person btu there's lots of racism even there (especialy in Southern Brazil and among Brazialisn-Germans with Nazi ancestry).

I don't see how the top 2% of a society can be representative of everything else. And if german immigrants brought this crap from Europe, is it Brazil's fault?

This is not enough to make the kind of claim Mark Wells does. In Brazil you might even find isolated cases of racism, but those people are harmless and these are very isolated cases. If it were in the US they would form a gang and start killing blacks or committing other kinds of crimes in the name of race.

This guy is a joke. Citing examples in the USA we have:
The Black Congressional Cacus ( made up of elected politicians) not allowing anyone but blacks to join the Cacus, if there were a white Cacus all hell would break loose. Now, isn't the "integrated" thing to do is everyone join together for the betterment of the country?--- I guess not.
We have media darling Barac Obama, in his books complaining that there were not enough "people like him" ( mulatto- which is a bad word here in America) ti vote for, yet he expects whites to vote for him. Isn't the correct thing to do is to say, "Hey, I am a US citizen if you like what I stand for then vote for me?" Isn't voting for someone because of their color just as bad as not voting for someone because of their color?

To the Brazilians on this board, don't let this Wells guy export the duplicity and uglyness to you. Many Blacks want "equality" yet they want to have "their own" cafeterias, dormatories in college, own college social groups and so on. We tried that in the USA, it was called separate but equal, and it was a total failure.

Using the attitudes of the 1700's and 1800's and projecting them on today's people is stupid. Yes, there is still a long way to go, but we are making progress. I am sick of the bromide " In order to know where you are going, you have to know where you've been" ( this is said so the atrocities of the past can still be talked about as if they are still happening). Sorry Mr. Wells, but to make progress and move forward one should say " In order to know where you are going, you have to know where you are AT" ( note present tense).

Another note to the Brazilians, the subjects Mr. Wells discusses will only affect you if there is guilt. Don't allow people such as he to make you feel guilty. None of the Brazilians alive today have imported slaves you should have no guilt for what happened hundereds of years ago. Only you know what is in your heart

Brazilians don't know what racism is, I can tell you that for sure. You would need experience abroad in order to see racism, and the majority of the population never left this country.

Oh, Jesus, what horses**t!! Even President Lula(as stated above)admits that racism exists in Brazil. Most Brazilians nowadays would say so. You really are cluching for straws, bozo.

please don,t type so close to the screen ,...your breath smells!....

The president and other might say that, but they will do it to be "politically correct", not because they believe to have any evidence. If you asked any of them about the police, they would say they are underpaid, underequipped and some are corrupt. If you asked about the politicians, they would say they are corrupt. If you asked about rich people, they would say they are "greedy" and don't want to share the wealth (sic). Common places in a politically correct world, not facts.

"This is not a baby! It is simply a way for me to drop tiny baby shoes on the infidels below who would dare say that I would do something so stupid as to dangle my baby over a railing above a crowd of villians who would claim such a thing. I will not suggest that their stomachs will roast in hell, as I have beat that phrase into the ground, but I will state loudly and honestly that this dangling baby is not a baby at all, but an instrument of shoe dropping, as is obvious to all but the most ignorant of fools."

written by notsouglyamerican

" In order to know where you are going, you have to know where you are AT" ( note present tense).

Another note to the Brazilians, the subjects Mr. Wells discusses will only affect you if there is guilt. Don't allow people such as he to make you feel guilty. None of the Brazilians alive today have imported slaves you should have no guilt for what happened hundereds of years ago. Only you know what is in your heart"


This is powerful!! Nice clarifications....in other words way to sort out the BS!!!!

http://www.eurekalert.org/pub_...071098.php

Bo your use of Baghdad Bob is both hilarious and right on target. But please, don't tell these Brazilians Brazil is in Africa, they might not ever recover if the word gets out. O.K. yes, Brazil is situated next to the Congo, but don't tell them.

I have had a bad case of the flu this past week, but I shall return soon. A Brazilian does not realize what he has started, we will tail him now for the rest of his life.

Did you hear Ana the American Men's magazine "Ask Men" just released its results of the women American men consider to be the most beautiful. The African American Beyonce Knowles came in first; Scarlett Johanson came in second; Jessica Alba came in third; and the mixed race Northeastern Brazilian Adriana Lima came in fourth. I told you many American men consider Brazilian women with a "traditional" Brazilian look to be very pretty. And based on the evidence Mark Wells has presented, there would be very little cance of any black or part black women being named to such a list in Brazil. And yes, Adriana made the top five list, not Gisele Bundchen.

Anyway, I am off......

Cance to Chance.

"Wriiten by a Brazilian," why don't you do us Brazilians a favor and shut up? Your nationalism is cheap and does not solve anything. You prefer to live in a world of false ideology (inherited from the dictatorship) rather than face reality. Before you express you opinion on things why don't you get informed first.

Since this is between two Brazilians, I will stay out of this argument.

First, you seem to be bothered by some supposed "nationalism" of mine, which is non-existent. You, in the other hand, seem to have a problem. More exactly, an automatic response of self-depreciation, willing to bow down to any foreigner in recognition to your own problems without any consideration to the realities of the world. They, the americans, do have racial problems, given the highly fractured society of theirs, but we don't.

If I had to guess, I would say you are either a middle class brazilian that never lived abroad and have no experience in the US or in any other country that practices racism, therefore you have never seen it to know what racism is, or you are some foreigner pretending to be a brazilian to lend yourself more credibility.

Second, this is no nationalism, so much that other brazilians and some americans are replying in this same topic against the author of this article. This simple a matter of ethics and honesty. The writer of these racist texts is a biased american writer, that came from a racist society and it's trying to paint Brazil in worse colors than their own reality is according to some agenda. You will find this same script, i.e., the sad stories and bogus statistics including sad facts from the 18th and 19th centuries, in text from black activist groups. The story is exactly the same, with different words of course.

The reality is that african culture is present in Brazil more than in any other non-African country. And nobody hides it or is ashamed of it, nor labels it with prefixes like americans would certainly do. Besides the facts we all cited, other brazilians and I, plus some american contributors, I also cite my life experience in Brazil, being mixed myself and seeing the relationships between people of different origin since my birth.

If you disagree with any information provided in here then I would ask you to be more specific.

His only purpose in life is to serve as a warning to others against the dangers of self-lobotomy surgery.

Bo
written by The American Historian, 2007-02-03 13:43:06

Bo your use of Baghdad Bob is both hilarious and right on target.

I had a friend from Norweigh at my house a week or so ago and we started talking about the war in Iraq. He asked about the former Iraqui Information Minister and I did a few searches on the internet and we had some good laughs, but it dawned on me while I was reading actual quotes he made and filmclips of the speeches he made "informing", or rather I should say, "misinforming" and blatently denying the blatently obvious reality at hand......Baghdad Bog IS "A brazilian"!!!

I mean anyone who denies the existance of racism in brazil, who compares the situations of slave laborers in brazil with the situations of illegal aliens in the U.S., is so proudfully ignorant while denying the very reality that hits him in the face everytime he wanders outside his home......it's Baghdad Bob to a tee!!!

written by A brazilian, 2007-02-03 20:17:31


They, the americans, do have racial problems, given the highly fractured society of theirs, but we don't.


First, you seem to be bothered by some supposed "nationalism" of mine, which is non-existent.


The reality is that african culture is present in Brazil more than in any other non-African country. And nobody hides it or is ashamed of it...

that is a recent photo of A brazilian preparing for carnival in Rio!!!

I think you make a lot of assumptins about me, my dear. I have lived in the US for 28 years, thus I know it well--but never perfectly. I also came from very poor beginnings in the suburbs of Rio. As I said, your nationalism and the nationalism of people like you is cheap and blind. In your eyes, Brazil is this perfect country with no racism, no poverty, no sexism, etc., which cannot be criticized by "foreigners" or anyone else for that matter. Brazil for you guys is this utopia of "mulher bonita," "samba," "futebol," and "a cidade maravilhosa;" a place where everyone gets along beautfully. The problem is that the utopia is rotting with bullets, violence, and violation of human rights. The favelas of Rio have become war zones where five to ten people dying a day is no longer news. Sao Paulo is not that far behind either, with its eruptions of bullets and bombs in the city.

"The reality is that african culture is present in Brazil more than in any other non-African country. And nobody hides it or is ashamed of it."

Give me a break. Your cheap nationalism cannot withstand the numbers, the statistics about the differences between black and whites in the country. Also, everyone likes African culture in Brazil until you bring a date home and the date is black. Black people in Brazil themselves have been so indoctrinated by "whiteness" that they think of marrying up, marrying white. The campaign for the census of 2000 was "don't let your color pass as white." This thing that racism is a monopoly of "gringos" is sheer buls**t! There is racism in Europe and the United States but there is also racism in Brazil. The difference is that in these other countries the issues has been in the open for quite a whilee. In Brazil, when activits try to put the issue on the table they are confronted by nationalist morons like you.

Part of living in a democratic world is being able to withstand criticism. Brazilians need to learn thiss. We certainly like criticizing countries such as the United State a great deal; I hear that all the time from my fellow coutry men and women. We resent it when it is our turn to be cricized.

I think you make a lot of assumptins about me, my dear. I have lived in the US for 28 years, thus I know it well--but never perfectly.

On the internet anybody can be anything.

As I said, your nationalism and the nationalism of people like you is cheap and blind. In your eyes, Brazil is this perfect country with no racism, no poverty, no sexism, etc., which cannot be criticized by "foreigners" or anyone else for that matter. Brazil for you guys is this utopia of "mulher bonita," "samba," "futebol," and "a cidade maravilhosa;" a place where everyone gets along beautfully.

Hey, I think you have just lost it. Could you be more specific? Any textual reference to me actually saying any of that? Either you have reading problems or you didn't read anything at all, because you completely misses the point. Are you bothered by anything said in here or just by my attitude of questioning and defiance?

So the problem isn't actually any data I might have provided, but instead my simple stance of defiance? So, as a "brown starving latino" I should be crying my problems out to the world in the hope of getting a "toilet cleaner" job in "America" someday? Is this the role reserved to me in here that you and your gringo friends expect to see?

And as I stated earlier you are just following the "self-depreciative brazilian" script (that is, if you are brazilian at all), willing to take all the guilty of the world for any "problem" that might exist, be it truth or not, ignoring anything else.

Ignorance will take us nowhere, education and intelligence does take us forward. That's why other brazilians and I, plus some other foreigner contributors, are replying to the racism promoted in these articles. If you look in the content of the majority of the comments in these forums you will see the hate and agenda promotion of some foreign groups.

The favelas of Rio have become war zones where five to ten people dying a day is no longer news. Sao Paulo is not that far behind either, with its eruptions of bullets and bombs in the city.

It's nice to know that Brasil is not only Rio.

Your cheap nationalism cannot withstand the numbers, the statistics about the differences between black and whites in the country

What numbers? The statistical bulls**t spread by Mark Wells?

Tell us, do you really know Brazil? Are you really brazilian? I ask this because any brazilian would be able to tell how the african culture is blended in the brazilian. There's no need to make a big deal of it. So did the italians bring "Carnaval", "samba" and "campoeira" to Brazil? So is feijoada something tipically European? Is the culture diversity of all the brazilian regions an imposition from the "white elite" to promote whiteness and European values?

The only examples of violence they can come up with are from the 19th or 18th centuries, in some "Brazil as a big farm" dream, where people are forced to things by mighty white land owners, just like the "Us South". Hahahahahaha They don't know brazilian industrialized itself a long time ago.

In Brazil, when activits try to put the issue on the table they are confronted by nationalist morons like you.

I thought in a democratic society people should be free to speak their minds. Now if we don't agree with the absurdities proposed by some and fueled by racist writers such as Mark Wells, of officializing "racism" a la americana in Brazil, with a clear distinction between "races", ignoring any biological evidence against such thing, then we are "morons".

Thanks for your participation in this forum. But I believe you will need to do better than that.

I think you are so pathetic you are not worthy of a reply. By the way, I will take my "gringo" friends over you anytime. You are just full of wind.

Did I accidentally hurt your feelings by reminding you of some "toilet cleaner" job you might have had?

Ana posted a link to an article explaining the stereotypes associated with racial designations in the US, mostly the "Latino" one, in some thread in these forums. It's a nice read.

People often project their own lives in the things they say. Your message seems revealing of your own situation, thus the reason you are so full of resentment. This is not really about Brazil. This is about you unleashing your resentment on people.

If you were like Bagdad Bob, wouldn´t you be resentful?

The U.S. is getting millions of illegal Mexicans. The face of the U.S. is changing partially because of that. But that's OK. 10 years from now we will see how all this turns out.

Pay no attention to his (A Brazilian's) comments Luigi. He has greatly distorted what I and others have said previously. I suppose that is the only tactic he can use. We think you have a nice country that nevertheless has some serious problems--in other words, little different than other places.

You just couldn't point a single incorrect thing I had said, haha. Now tries to divert the attention from your pathetic text to me. I am not the one in the US, so the only possible "toilet cleaner" here is you.

As an immigrant tell us what indignant job you have performed in the early years you were there. Come on, tell us what an immigrants' life is like. Did you share a small room with other six people?

As an immigrant tell us what indignant job you have performed in the early years you were there. Come on, tell us what an immigrants' life is like. Did you share a small room with other six people?

What about the 40 million of BRAZILIAN POOR people Baghdad Bob??? Not immigrants, but actual brazilians, born and raised??? Living on les than 2 dollars a day??!! Do you think they're living in the lap of luxury and not humiliating themselves even more than someone with an actual job having to go around begging for change, and even food to survive??

So you are saying that only the "starving marvins" go to the US? Uneducated people that would starve in Brazil?

I guess in despair anything is better than nothing, but that doesn't make an immigrant life any less indignant.

No idiot, it's a well known and statistically proven fact that primarily middle class brazilians immigrate, mostly illegally, to the U.S. from brazil.

And don't try to compare the reality of someone with a job as a janitor in the U.S. with the millions begging for money and food in brazil making less than 2 dollars a day!

Talking about having to lose your dignity!

Just for the purpose of dispelling your stereotypes, I have a Ph.D. and work as a college professor. This is the reason why I think you are an idiot.

For someone who claims to be so free of racism, you are certainly classist. It is that old Brazilian philosophy that people who do menial jobs are worth s**t. I bet anything you grew up surrounded by "empregadas" or had an "adopted" black "brother" or"sister" to do all the work for you. Your family treated them "just like one of the other kids." They just had do "a few additional chores."

Just for the purpose of dispelling your stereotypes, I have a Ph.D. and work as a college professor.

On the internet anybody can be anything.

For someone who claims to be so free of racism, you are certainly classist. It is that old Brazilian philosophy that people who do menial jobs are worth s**t.

Certainly an intellectual job is better than a manual one, and that tells something about the person in question. I do think those that immigrate to clean toilets are worse than the average brazilian because this is an indignant job. If that's to be "classist" then I am one, people are what they do.

I bet anything you grew up surrounded by "empregadas" or had an "adopted" black "brother" or"sister" to do all the work for you. Your family treated them "just like one of the other kids." They just had do "a few additional chores."

Another one of your fantasies. You can notice so far you were unable to point a single thing I had said that was incorrect, and all you did was to claim what I think and what I am without any source to any data provided by me.

I did assume you were a toilet cleaner because your cluelessness could only match that of a loser.

No idiot, it's a well known and statistically proven fact that primarily middle class brazilians immigrate, mostly illegally, to the U.S. from brazil.

Oh really? Where?

There is at least one article in this publication: http://www.vernonjohns.org/plcooney/brimmig.html

There is also the book "Brazilian Identities in Los Angeles and Riverside" by
Rosemary E. Galli

Well, I have run into Brazilians on the I-5, Pea Soup Restaurant; south of Fresno; Santa Maria; San Francisco; Des Moines; Chicago; Miami Beach, of course; Tampa; Niagra Falls; Cleveland; Spokane; Santa Ana; Whitefish; and the list goes on. Who knows how many Brazilians there are in the states? Nobody does.

the author of Brazilian Identities in Los Angeles and Riverside is actually Bernadete Beserra. My mistake.

That´s OK, just hearing the word Riverside brings back memories, San Jacinto, Hemet, Redlands, Norco, San Berdoo. I first heard Portuguese from the Azores dairy farmers in Cypress. Later they moved out to places NW of San Jack. Now they are moving farther out. Portuguese radio station, 600 something, on the road east from Hanford to Visalia. More xiado than Jader Barbalho, love to listen to them.....

...
written by A brazilian, 2007-02-05 18:17:45

....people are what they do.

Well then I guess you just be a popeye stand-in since your forearms are so out of proportion since you're the biggest jackoff most of us has ever seen!!!

I had a toilet cleaning job on the first two years I was here (nine years now.) I still remember the first time I cleaned a toilet. I cryed. Not because I felt less human, I cryed because I was proud of my independence. I was tired to see my father's strugle to pay my tuition in university in Brazil( I was studying psychology.) Then, I worked delivering newspaper for two years ( The New York Times and The San Francisco Chronicle, at least I could read them for free) so I can study during the day. Oh Boy, I can tell you, I learned a lot about life in those years. I think all jobs are dignified, they have a purpose. What could I expect when I came here? I couldn't speak English. I remember one of my English teachers asking the class, "Eight years from now, where do you guys think you'll be?" I said I'll be in university. Some people laughed. Four weeks ago I received a letter from SFSU, saying that they have admitted me.
Luigi, I believe life is building blocks, if one wants to be on the top, needs to start on the bottom.
I don't know about you but I plan to go back, I want to go back for the children. That is why I'm studying Child and Adolescence.
What subject do you teach? If you want to answer of course, maybe you don't want to be like me, making this forum a personal diary (joke.)

..... Grande patria desimportante
Em nenhum instante
Eu vou te trair
Nao, Nao, Nao vou te trair
BRASIL, MOSTRA A TUA CARA
QUERO VER QUEM PAGA
PRA GENTE FICAR ASSIM
BRASIL, QUAL E O TEU NEGOCIO
O NOME DO TEU SOCIO
CONFIA EM MIM, CONFIA EM MIM, CONFIA EM MIM
BRASIL!!!!!
(CAZUZA)
...................

You are a winner, Adriana. Congrats.

Adriana is the kind of immigrant that has made the U.S. the greatest country on the planet.

You are a joke. There's not purpose in that, people only stay in such jobs because they can't any better. Unless the person went through a bad time (like getting unemployed, or some grave problem) this is forgivable, but it makes it no less indignant.

I had a decent education and I am self-taught, anything less than high middle class is a shame to myself and to my family. It's all about standards and values.

She found that most of the Brazilians she interviewed were ashamed to be immigrants with almost 90% saying they are not immigrants, but rather are just passing through.

They ought to be. Being a toilet cleaner is simply a shame, at least they have the good sense of recognizing it.

Margolis discovered that most of the Brazilians in the US are from middle-class families and that the "Immigrants defend themselves from frustration by thinking that they're doing these services only for a year or two, that it's a temporary situation."

That's very accurate, no numbers, no socio-economical evalutation (age, gender, education, average income in Brazil, etc).

Adriana is the kind of immigrant that has made the U.S. the greatest country on the planet.

Toilet cleaners. Nice.

There you go again, Bob. A nattering nabob of negativity.

Adriana
written by A brazilian, 2007-02-06 10:23:15

You are a joke. There's not purpose in that, people only stay in such jobs because they can't any better. Unless the person went through a bad time (like getting unemployed, or some grave problem) this is forgivable, but it makes it no less indignant.

I had a decent education and I am self-taught, anything less than high middle class is a shame to myself and to my family. It's all about standards and values.

Baghdad Bob, MANY wealthy americans today started with very modest means, from poor families. I know, my grandfather was born into a very poor family in the early 1920's. He did many jobs that would most certainly appear to not be up to your high standards. But he was intelligent, although only being formerly schooled until the age of 14, and he had the desire to work and make a better life for his children. In the late 1950's, 60's, and 70's he was one of if not the richest men in our city. And he accomplished it all by hard work. Whatever legal job someone may have, whether its a dishwasher or the CEO of a company, those people are respected.

Hard for me to imagine someone talking about another working a legitimate job, whatever that may be, saying he is "humiliating" himself, yet there are literally millions and millions here in brazil that are in the streets and go door to door begging for money or food. Now that must be humiliating.

O.K. A Brazilian, I have long suspected you are a professional baby chick stomper and this confirms my suspicion. In addition, of course to being Baghdad Bob.

Oh, I should also mention my late grandmother clean toilets too--back in the day when they did not have scrub brushes but only cloths. She was much more honorable than many of the families she worked for. Loosen up A Brazilian, after you step on those chicks go out and slip some bad checks to somebody or steal some kid 's lunch money.

"cleaned"

At the very minimum the newer generations must match their parents achievements. If your life standards decay after you leave home then it means you blew it, unless some disaster like a hurricane or some war is the cause of it. In most cases it means the person is an idiot.

Don't come with sad histories about some grandmother cleaning toilets, that's past and you should look forward and higher. Any person willing to give up their current standards and values to clean toilets, accepting to be humiliated that way, is a joke.

Do they want a better life? Why don't people study!? At least to get a decent a job that could serve as a start to something else? This idea of going to the US to clean toilets is something they could do here only without the "cleaning toilets" part. What a bunch of losers.

I am always for people studying and being all that they can be. I have always loved the pursuit of knowledge. Yet I also could not possibly fully understand each and every person's story so as to say "uh, you are cleaning toilets, you must be a loser...." Maybe such as person is a loser, but I will not judge them until I know that to be a fact. Probably, the biggest factor in their having to take such a job today is the language barrier--they would be eligible for a lot more jobs if they were fluent in English. Your attitude is revealing A Brazilian, why do a certain percentage of Brazilians look with disdain on folks who are struggling and say "oh yes, must be a loser" ? I know we have some Americans who have similar knee-jerk reactions to poor people, but what do you see in them that you fear about yourself?

At the very minimum the newer generations must match their parents achievements. If your life standards decay after you leave home then it means you blew it, unless some disaster like a hurricane or some war is the cause of it. In most cases it means the person is an idiot.

Don't come with sad histories about some grandmother cleaning toilets, that's past and you should look forward and higher. Any person willing to give up their current standards and values to clean toilets, accepting to be humiliated that way, is a joke.

Do they want a better life? Why don't people study!? At least to get a decent a job that could serve as a start to something else? This idea of going to the US to clean toilets is something they could do here only without the "cleaning toilets" part. What a bunch of losers.

You sound like a Republican from the U.S., and the neo-con kind of Republican to boot.

I am curious now Adriana, how is it that you came to live in the U.S.? If you told me it was to get away from people like "A Brazilian" I will understand.

You probably needed to also get away from people like Costinha, the vulgarian, so what is your story?

"Any person willing to give up their current standards and values to clean toilets, accepting to be humiliated that way, is a joke."

Giving up their values? In what way? I think you and others who present such a perspective can't make up your mind. On the one hand, you complain that too many folks will not work at all and should take pride in whatever job until they find something that pays better. Yet then you say such folks are "giving up their current standards and values" or degrading themselves by taking such work. I am not suprised you send this contradictory message because you have done so on other topics. Maybe when Adriana receives her Psychology degree you should be her first patient since you need to work through such contradictory feelings.

I mean were you not the one who earlier said your darker skinned Brazilian relatives live in s**t and seem proud to live in s**t and thus were too lazy to change their condition? You are all over the place my man.

"Do they want a better life? Why don't people study!? At least to get a decent a job that could serve as a start to something else? This idea of going to the US to clean toilets is something they could do here only without the "cleaning toilets" part. What a bunch of losers."

This quote confirms you are an idiot. Hasn't it occurred to you that in a country like Brazil some people simply don't have the opportunity to study? Some have to work when they are 5 in the Northeast. Have you ever cared to notice the kids on the streets selling stuff to survive? Go and tell them about opportunity to study , you insensitive ass. Hasn't it occurred to you that even for those with a college degree opportunities can be very limited in Brazil? I know quite a few who are unemployed. What is the dignity of seeing one's family hungry?

Two years, I didn't speak English, so I couldn't be able to work in an office. Then when I could speak a little better, I took the newspaper job. I think it was a funny job. My two newspaper's routes were really good, in a rich neighbourhood ( El Cerrito, Oakland, and Berkeley Hills.) I used to get good tips on the holidays; $2,000.00 or more. But I don't work as a cleaner or newspaper delivery anymore. It has been five years I have been working with children. I started as a nanny, and know I work with different families and children from different ages. This Child and Adolescence program in SFSU will able me to work with families like a social worker. Then if I want, I can go further into teaching, and research. five years working with American Families and their children, gave me an important foundation to understand a little bit of their dynamics and Culture. We stablished a strong bond. The families I used to work still keep in touch with me and I with them. To the point that one of the families made me promised that to take them to Brazil. they want their kids to know my culture, my background. They said that the first place they want to visit is my old pre school and high school.
Coming to The USA gave me life experience. I wanted to be independent from my parents. I could have gone to other places, but my friend was coming here, and it was once in a lifetime chance. I came here legally and I'm legal now.
I think we should always better ourselves.
One thing we need to remember though, if we want to understand another person's life is to be in their shoes. If we don't do that then, will be no understanding. I keep reminding myself that, all the time.

But I hope we can be using this forum for a nice debate.

I was in Oakland a couple of years ago, walked by the Tribune building, surprised to find out that it no longer exists as an independent paper. Seems like all the Bay Area papers are in trouble.

Had a great time in Jack London Square, lots of good things happening in Oakland.

You have quite a story; I have no doubt you will be successful wherever you choose to live.

First you claim that the majority of the brazilians that go to the US are middle class, then you claim that they don't have the opportunity to study!? How? If they are middle class it means they DO have the means to pursue their goals!

What are you talking about, starving people in some God forsaken place, or losers crossing the desert?

Yes, they are humiliating themselves, they have chosen to go to an inferior status in society out of free will, not because of any tragedy in their lives.

As I said, it's all about values and standards, some people see no problem on giving up on them.

And please, allow these people to stay in the US, we don't need more idiots here in Brazil.

That box of baby chicks just arrived for you to start stomping a Brazilian. I am sure you will enjoy yourself. Some little kittens may be in the box too.

Yes, when I was about to live my route in The San Francisco Chronicle, it was going through a hard time. I think it was sold to another big company.
Ric, you're gonna think is funny but what I like in Oakland is The Fairyland in Grand Ave, specially the puppet shows. I used to take the children there, and my friends' children. They were not the only ones who were having fun. I did too. It reminded my childhood in Brazil.

Thanks, but...
There is a special ingredient to this success. I call it The San Francisco Bay Area "Variable."

My parents took me to Fairyland when I was four years old. It is the first memory I have of being at an amusement type park. That and a place in San Jose that closed long ago called Frontier Village. I have nice memories of the Bay Area. It is a nice place to live.

If you are, life is gonna show you important and valuable teachings. I'm glad that you were able to find a good place for you in the Brazilian Society, a place that corresponds with your expectations, and standards, most people don't.
You need to take in cosideration all the social "variables" that combined, resulted in opportunities for you. By "social variables" I mean, your family, education, intellect, and so on....These are important things to make a probability or "try" to predict where an individual will be place in a particular society. Although, I don't think it has 100% accuracy.
Now, take a look, and see these "Social Variables" within the population of The Black Brazilians, Brazilian Women, Poor Brazilians, and........the list goes on.
"Try" to predict where are they going to be, in terms of opportunities, and relevance, in the Brazilian Society.

If I go back to Brazil like I'm planning, I'll leave "my heart in San Francisco." Or in my case The San Francisco Bay Area.

"wriiten by a Brazilian" obviously spent time in the USA. (Cleaning toilets?) It tried to get a green card and could not. Now, the "thing" is frustrated, resentful, and hateful.

"And please, allow these people to stay in the US, we don't need more idiots here in Brazil."

I agree. You are certainly enough!

I wondered when someone was going to see how nicely he set himself up, Luigi.

I wondered when someone was going to see how nicely he set himself up, Luigi.

You are the person that couldn't point a single word from what I had said that was incorrect and talk as an adult, and spent every single post just calling me names and accusing me of being this or that.

I guess that tells a lot about your capacity of argumentation. Please, stay in the US, never come back.

"You are the person that couldn't point a single word from what I had said that was incorrect and talk as an adult, and spent every single post just calling me names and accusing me of being this or that."

The only thing you have done is to fart words left and right, without a drop of evidence, and to offend people, e.g., Hispanics. You simply dismiss any evidence that does fit your mode of thinking. Isn't it amazing how blinding nationalism can become? The dictatorship of the 1960s-1980's certainly took advantage of people like you. Those who criticized Brazil were said to have "ideias alienigenas" (alien or foreign ideas) and were put to jail. There are still close to 2000 people unaccounted for. People like you are dangerous.

People like you are dangerous.

You have just criticed the dictatorship and expressed yourself against free thinking. In a free society, even if you don't agree with me, thinking wouldn't be dangerous.

...
written by A brazilian, 2007-02-08 13:44:43

....thinking wouldn't be dangerous.

Well, I "think" you have nothing to worry about.

are you seeking a foreign experience?... Do you need to gather information on your thesis?...Is your subject third world cultures???...Then may we suggest,... save your money and simply drive through south miami !!!...

I agree with some of what you say regarding illegals... In the u.s.a. for example the majority of u.s. citizens over whelmingly, and this cuts across all classes of americans,, and all races,...are insisting that law enforcement and government agencys clamp down on this security issue, which it is...The illegals we have here hail from latin america, carribean, european (east) , russia, the middle east ,asia ,east africa,etc...their methods of entry is as varied as their nationalitys,..border crossers, passport visa abscounders,student visa abscounders, ( 9.1.1., terrorists were student visa abscounders and tourist visa overstayers),temporary worker visa abscounders...and other visa passport schemes were un covered with some international religious organizations...laundering,fraud , tax evasion,immigration violations,etc.,religious workers operating out of store fronts...Their numbers are estimates... the apparatus necessary to implement strict controls, along with connecting all local , national, and international agencys is coming into place and increased deportations are being done...Although the u.s. a. is absolutely capable of mass deportation operations, (it is capable of dispatching over 2.5 million military soldiers within days)...It has chosen to implement measures which will net illegals who violate other laws along with their initial crime of being in violation of u.s. immigration laws...Document fraud,trafficking,aiding, abeting,concealing,harboring, employing, etc...Of course any illegals jailed in u.s. jails or prisons are assured of being deported after their sentence is complete...Borders of the u.s.a. will soon have high tech technology capable of picking out a farting ant on an orange peel, as well as military units...Of course, there are small insignificant radical groups scattered and fragmented, anarchists, socialist/communists, ,usefull idiots, and a few pussy whipped politicals who support a government subsidized chicken ( or was it pig in everyones pot)...Aside from the very few impotent pussy whipped pols getting a hummer from their illegal maid...And as the " every american should have an illegal", blowhards hyperventilate... The illegal lobby, has quite frankly, been left out in the lobby, for being their illegally, their frothing shrills , bad breath,farting, and indigestion creating a boom in business to a pussey whipped pol who owns a toilet cleaning business ,... His new contract will be terminated with recent employers of illegals laws... So as the noose tightens ,and the greatest nation in the history of the world basks in its sole # 1 super power status, I conclude americans are compassionate,generous, inventive,and have liberated millions and millions of people world wide... But they will not tolerate, farting , frothing, loud ,shrilling, illegal alien foreign nationals, in their country waving colorfull rags on sticks in their lobbys ,leaving a mess , a huge bill, a increase in crime...etc....

And consider the possiblity that the american national interest is actually better served if the radical La Raza types actually do believe that they shall overcome. At least at the street level if not their leadership. The more they think their cause will prevail, the more open and vocal and specific they will become.

They extrapolate the last ten years into forever, forgetting that present trends rarely continue and conditions change.

Well said Ric.....

Precisely ! ...