Brazzil

Since 1989 Trying to Understand Brazil

Home

----------

Brazilian Eyelash Enhancer & Conditioner Makeup

----------

Get Me Earrings

----------

Buy Me Handbags

----------

Find Me Diamond

----------

Wholesale Clothing On Sammydress.com

----------

Brautkleider 2013

----------

Online shopping at Tmart.com and Free Shipping

----------

Wholesale Brazilian Hair Extensions on DHgate.com

----------

Global Online shopping with free shipping at Handgiftbox

----------

Search

Custom Search
Members : 22767
Content : 3832
Content View Hits : 33088643

Who's Online

We have 462 guests online



Things Couldn't Get Worse to Brazilians Seeking US Visa. Still They Did PDF Print E-mail
2007 - February 2007
Written by Clara Angelica Porto   
Wednesday, 21 February 2007 09:24

US Ambassador to Brazil, Clifford SobelA Brazilian journalist said recently that if the businesses of the Ambassador to the US in Brazil, Clifford Sobel, had the performance of his consulates, he would have never left the list of anonymous entrepreneurs of New Jersey. That is a pretty hard statement.

Why would someone say such a thing about an Ambassador, who by the way is not a diplomat and was nominated to the important office because he is a close friend of President Bush, and also an important fundraiser?

The statement did not come out of the blue. Mr. Clifford Sobel arrived in Brazil last August, as the new Ambassador of the United States in the country. When he came, Brazilians had problems already trying to get visas to come to the US.

With a more stable economy, and the devaluation of the dollar, there was more money available and Brazilians are known to be attracted by all the wonderful places and things the US has to offer for tourists coming from all over the world; and Brazilians have been coming to this country as tourists for a long time.

There was a time, back in the 1990s, when Brazilian tourists lost in number only to the Japanese in places like New York, Orlando and Las Vegas. It was common then to walk into stores in Manhattan with signs that read "WE SPEAK PORTUGUESE," a language that in all of Latin America is only spoken by Brazilians.

There was no problem then to get a visa to come to the US, one could do it usually through a travel agency, and it was a matter of filling out the paper work, making copies of documents and travel tickets and the passport would return with a visa that was good for 10 years in most cases.

Occasionally someone would be asked for an interview, but that could be easily done at the Consulate in Rio, on the way to the airport. Simple and practical, as it should be, and as it is, as a matter of fact with most countries, in most consulates.

Then things changed. Interviews were required more and more often, and visas started being denied. Because of the increase in the number of Brazilian immigrants in the US, the Consulates started applying more rules and making it more difficult for a Brazilian to get a tourist visa.

It is understandable that the American consulates nowadays should have tighter rules, that they should be more careful and develop new criteria to give visas for foreigners to come to the US.

After all, much has changed, there was a World Trade Center attack, there is Osama Bin Laden out there somewhere in Afghanistan and there is a war in Iraq against, well, this part is not very clear.

But why should things be so hard for Brazilians? Why is it that only very wealthy Brazilians find no problem in coming to the US and everyone else, even people with good jobs, a home and family of their own, cannot get a visa and get no explanation?

When Clifford Sobel arrived in Brazil in August, the American Consulate in Rio imposed 49 days in a waiting list to Brazilians who were requesting a tourist visa to the US. It was pretty bad, but the arrival of a new Ambassador, who had charmed the press with good remarks about his new job and the country, threw new hope in the air.

It was only natural, because no one thought things could get any worse. And usually, when things cannot get worse, they get better. This was not the case. Since Sobel took office at the American Embassy in Brasilia, the wait for a visa at the Consulate in Rio moved from 49 to 72 days.

In São Paulo, the picture is not very different, only a little worse. After Sobel, the waiting went to 86 days, as opposed to the 73 days before he took office. In Brasília, at the Embassy where Clifford Sobel works, things are not any better, Brazilians used to wait 32 days and now they wait at least 49.

Why is it so hard for Brazilians to come to the US these days? Is it because they are afraid of illegal immigrants? Maybe, but why in Paraguay things are different? It takes only two days for a Paraguayan to get a tourist visa to the US, at the American Embassy. This is the way it should be.

What is wrong, Mr. Sobel? Why did things get worse after your arrival as the American representative in Brazil? Why the unfriendliness? With all due respect, why is it that the world's most powerful country cannot show more respect for the South American giant?

Let Brazilians come to New York, bring their children to Disney World, throw their money in Vegas if they so choose, give standing ovations during Broadway shows, shop in Manhattan, and try the English they have been struggling to learn in expensive language schools. Brazilians deserve a break and the US should welcome all the money that they are willing to spend here.

No wonder the Brazilian press has been criticizing Mr. Sobel. Despite all the admiration for the culture he has been showing lately, particularly the enchantment with the Rio de Janeiro Carnaval scene.

Clara Angelica Porto is a Brazilian bilingual journalist living in New York.  She went to school in Brazil and at the University of Wisconsin in Madison.  Clara is presently working as the English writer for The Brasilians, a monthly newspaper in Manhattan.  Comments welcome at clara.angelica@gmail.com.



Add this page to your favorite Social Bookmarking websites
Reddit! Del.icio.us! Mixx! Free and Open Source Software News Google! Live! Facebook! StumbleUpon! TwitThis Joomla Free PHP
Comments (129)Add Comment
...
written by bo, February 21, 2007
With a more stable economy, and the devaluation of the dollar, there was more money available and Brazilians are known to be attracted by all the wonderful places and things the US has to offer for tourists coming from all over the world; and Brazilians have been coming to this country as tourists for a long time.



that's horses**t, we've been seeing for quite a number of years now the "anti-american" sentiments that exist all throughout brazil. Not to mention that brazilians are now the NUMBER 1 peoples classified as OTM ( other than mexicans) streaming illegally through our borders!
...
written by bo, February 21, 2007
Why is it so hard for Brazilians to come to the US these days? Is it because they are afraid of illegal immigrants? Maybe, but why in Paraguay things are different? It takes only two days for a Paraguayan to get a tourist visa to the US, at the American Embassy. This is the way it should be.



Well maybe it's because we don't have well over a million ILLEGAL paraguayans Clara...ever think of that???

Maybe the "delay" in brazilian visas is due to the fact that BRAZIL is the #1 producer of FALSE documents in the WORLD!!!

Also to the fact that there is a little area down close to "fog de iguaçu" where there is the LARGEST population of muslims outside of the middle-east, and they do everything from money laundering, black market falsifications, drugs, etc, that sponsor TWO well known middle eastern TERRORISM groups, HEZBOLLAH AND HAMAS!!!!
...
written by bo, February 21, 2007
"foz de iguaçu"
WINGIN
written by forrest allen brown, February 22, 2007
I have been married to a brasilian woman for over 3 years and she is still trying to get a visa to come to the U.S.

i live in brasil with my wife , but dont make enough money to pass the suport her if we stay in the us , so the U.S wants me to leave her and come up and work 3 years and pay taxes .
of over 15.000 us a year than she can get a visa YEA RIGHT

and here is another one if you go to work in the good old USA , and your wife is not living in the states , on your w4 form you will notice you have to claim single statis and get on decudtions for her or him.

but if you bring them over with out papers you can file and pay the fine .

the US is going 3 world
every one that works there hides behind a wall of hand picked brasilians that tell US citisen we cant do that and we get no help eather

just a photo op Clifford Sobel and his workers are just living off the fat tit of goverment pay , along with the clown whom is working the decks for help us when something goes wrong , never emails back or never at his statino

all the embassy do is to sell visa to very rich brasilians .

but if a person gets in harms way it is a civil matter .
just like the brasilian goverment all power no back bone
Hot too high
written by mmm, February 22, 2007
Clara Angelica Porto get in touch with reality.
...
written by Ludwig Van Beethoven, February 22, 2007
Mr. Clifford Sobel keep up the good work....
...
written by bo, February 22, 2007
WINGIN
written by forrest allen brown, 2007-02-21 19:12:28

I have been married to a brasilian woman for over 3 years and she is still trying to get a visa to come to the U.S.

i live in brasil with my wife , but dont make enough money to pass the suport her if we stay in the us , so the U.S wants me to leave her and come up and work 3 years and pay taxes .
of over 15.000 us a year than she can get a visa YEA RIGHT

and here is another one if you go to work in the good old USA , and your wife is not living in the states , on your w4 form you will notice you have to claim single statis and get on decudtions for her or him.

but if you bring them over with out papers you can file and pay the fine .

the US is going 3 world
every one that works there hides behind a wall of hand picked brasilians that tell US citisen we cant do that and we get no help eather

just a photo op Clifford Sobel and his workers are just living off the fat tit of goverment pay , along with the clown whom is working the decks for help us when something goes wrong , never emails back or never at his statino

all the embassy do is to sell visa to very rich brasilians .

but if a person gets in harms way it is a civil matter .
just like the brasilian goverment all power no back bone



Well Forrest, I for one, hope you're drunk. Because if not, I can completely understand someone like yourself, or your wife, not getting a visa. smilies/sad.gif
VISA DENIED !!!!!!!
written by u.s.a. # 1, February 22, 2007
Nice try !!! ... But your visa has expired !!!!!!!... Your documents are suspect, ... your remaining in the u. s. is questionable,...in summary: you have " no respect" for u. s. law....... No Amnesty... No guestworkers !!!!!!!!!!!..........
No Credibility , No Respect
written by u.s.a. # 1, February 22, 2007
This article is as bogus as a brazilian illegal alien with a homemade green card !!!!!!
...
written by Ric, February 22, 2007
In defense of Mr. Sobel, he´s a political appointee. Spend some time in offices like his and you soon see that the real business is taken care of by the staff, mainly secretaries and others who have been there for a long time. They know where everything is filed. It is the job of the Ambassador or Consul or whatever to get around and meet people, attend c**ktail parties and make contacts. He or she may have very little clout at Foggy Bottom and very little say in affecting policy. Not trying to downplay importance, but that´s what I have observed. Claramente culpando a pessoa errada.
...
written by Susan, February 22, 2007
There are a huge number of Brasilian illegal immigrants in America.
A minority are involved in "Smash and grab" crime rings that steal large amounts of goods from U.S. stores in one go.
The numbers coming in is so large that the USA has to crack down now.

Don't forget that there are still many atrocity loving muslims who are eager to mass murder as many Americans as they can also, and Brasil is #1 place for fake documents...
...
written by Ric, February 22, 2007
I did not know that about the fake documents, but it doesn´t surprise me.
BO
written by forrest allen brown, February 22, 2007
No not drunk

just not happy with the fact i spent 2 tours in nam got my ass shot off and i cant even get my wife a visa to visit the states . i have more here than there but it does not matter to them .
but every crooked politician and his kids can buy a visa , take there stolen money and put it in the banks in the US without even having a SS card or correct ID

while i see almost 10 million OTM doing what they want in my country , and when you turn a person making fals papers to the embassy and it is not there job to hunt them down .

fake documents is a big business in the north of brasil , and the embassy in recife is a walk through for them , and it is going to get even worse when the pepole find you can fly from
Belem to the states

and now you can fly from the middle east to brasil and then from brasil to the states or venasula on a boat is only 1000 miles 14 days on a boat easy way to get the rong people in the U>S>

the U.S does need to stomp on the visa , just in texas alone 24.000 brasiilians were sent back to brasil trying to come over WOP

and now the rich go to school in Mexico for 6 months then file for a tourtist visa it is granted and they cross and never go back to school .

or how about the hundreds that go to school and get out and never go back till they get i trouble with the police .

and all the wellfare fraud that is pulled by all

I HAVE NO QUARMS WITH ALL THE GOOD HARD WORKING BRASILIANS BUT MOST OF THEM ARE STILL IN BRASIL TRYING TO SURVIVE







...
written by bo, February 22, 2007
BO
written by forrest allen brown, 2007-02-22 00:57:00

No not drunk

just not happy with the fact i spent 2 tours in nam got my ass shot off and i cant even get my wife a visa to visit the states . i have more here than there but it does not matter to them .
but every crooked politician and his kids can buy a visa , take there stolen money and put it in the banks in the US without even having a SS card or correct ID


bud, I understand your frustration, I'm familiar with U.S. visa policies. Unfortunately, for people like us that are living outside the U.S, ex-pats, if/when we decide to take our wives, if she is not american, then you must have someone, if you can't do it yourself, "sponsor" your wife, in other words, agree to take financial repsonsibility for her. But that should have nothing to do with her obtaining her visa.

First of all, how long ago did you start the process?? How did you go about getting married??? If you just came to brazil, got married, then started the process of getting her a visa it does take longer than usual and that's because you didn't go about it the way the consulate recommends. But evenso, it shouldn't take three years.

Good luck with that.
...
written by bo, February 22, 2007
agree to take financial repsonsibility for her. But that should have nothing to do with her obtaining her visa.



sorry, I mis-spoke, it does have everything to do with obtaining a visa, someone must "sponsor" her before she can be given one.
...
written by Ric, February 22, 2007
I´m troubled by Forrest´s reference to the Wop.
...
written by bo, February 22, 2007
hope he doesn't plan on moving to "little italy".
Susan
written by A brazilian, February 22, 2007
What you are talking about is only a false sense of security. Most illegals will cross the desert from Mexico, and even the ones that overstay their visas wouldn't stay there if they hadn't jobs. It's a simple matter of destroying the demand for illegals. People are only brought there by the organized crime because they know they will have jobs.

If the US is not competent enough to arrest employers of illegals and illegals IN the US, then they are incompotent to do anything else. If the US is incompetent to prevent people from crossing the desert then it means they could place a nuclear bomb under your pillow and you wouldn't notice.

Why don't they finish with illegals at once? It's profitable. Accept that, american businesses profit from the exploitation of such cheap labor, and the government won't dare to screw this up. The US needs illegals.

This type of attitude from US embassies seems to be some sort of "boi de piranha", a kind of diseased and thin ox that is sent to a river for the piranhas to eat while the healthy ones pass safely. This is only psychological help for american bigots to believe the US government is doing something, while, in fact, nothing changes.
...
written by bo, February 22, 2007
This type of attitude from US embassies seems to be some sort of "boi de piranha", a kind of diseased and thin ox that is sent to a river for the piranhas to eat while the healthy ones pass safely. This is only psychological help for american bigots to believe the US government is doing something, while, in fact, nothing changes.


Well, Baghdad Bob II, we'll soon see about that.
READ A HISTORY BOOK WONT YA
written by forrest allen brown, February 22, 2007
WOP WITH OUT PAPERS

IT IS A TERM THEY HUNG ON MOST ITAILANS WHEN THEY CAME OVER AS THEY JUST GOT ON THE BOAT AND SHOWED UP ON ELLIS ISLAND SO WITH OUT PAPERS THEY HUNG A TAG ON THEM WOP

but it is still in use today up north in the south OTM is used

all short terms see below

as far as having a sponsor for my wife i got one we are still here , did all the paper work , right , even i was deported from brasil as it took to long

the north of brasil is a total different country , but at least we can got to the embassy from 0800 to 1400 each day not have to waite till 1430 to get in the one in SP

AND A BRASILIAN YOU NEED TO READ YOUR HISTORY , PART OF YOUR CULTURE COMES FROM THE USA , A BIG PART ,
THERE IS 50.000 GRAVES IN EUROPE THAT SHOWS HOW MUCH THE BRASILIAN GOV USE TO ENJOY THE FRIENDSHIP OF THE USA .
OR WAS IT JUST THE MONEY ???????

WOP.
WITH OUT PAPERS
OTM
OTHER THAN MEXICANS
OAD
OF ARAB DESENT
Forrest
written by A brazilian, February 22, 2007
I didn't understand what you mean. We are free to take ownership of any culture we like, this is what antropofagia is all about.
to take to steal , to rob ????????? to break the law
written by forrest allen brown, February 22, 2007
THAN WHT DO BRASILIANS AND OTHER PEOPLES OF THE WORLD ALWAYS FALL BACK TO IT IS OUT CULTURE
WHEN THEY DO SOMETHING RONG IN THE USA

AND AS FAR AS I KNOW ONE DOES NOT OWN A CULTURE .
IT IS LIKE AN ECO SYSTEM IT TAKES TIME TO DEVLOPE
THE WEAK DIE OFF AND THE STRONG TAKE OVER

AND THINGS PANTED IN OTHER COUNTRIES ,
COPIE RIGHTED IN OTHER COUNTRIES

IS THAT WHAT YOU MEAN BY ANTROPOFAGIA
Red tape and Bad manners.
written by Professor, February 22, 2007
Well this article shows how frustrating it is for honest people or dishonest to get a simple visa to go to the U.S. Some how most of us have it in our mind that Governments should be compassionate and discerning. How ever, the fact is Government never has nor ever will be! So what we see now is the result, the result of immigration/visitation policy that is apparently stating, “We do not want any more Brazilian slackers!” or Brazil has exceeded the immigration quota.
Both the honest and dishonest are being penalized, why? Because of those who have taken advantage of the system in the past! Notwithstanding, a high quota of legal immigrants. We assume the U.S. Government should be compassionate and discerning, when in fact they are a bureaucratic entity that bases policies in relation to quotas and statistics!
As most know the U.S. suffers from a high number of Brazilians who have populated the U.S. and are not contributing; as citizens of the U.S. are expected to contribute. The Brazilians who reside in the U.S. legally and who are speaking the English language and who are supporting their families have become citizens by their deeds. On the other hand the problem lies in quotas of foreign population, and Brazilians have exceeded that both legally and illegally.
Being also that a large percentage of Brazilians past, present and future are ready to enter the U.S. and stay illegally, some entering first with a Tourist visa or by other methods. How is possible for the Consulate/Embassy to determine who will and who will not plan to stay illegally? One of the determiners is based on the applicant’s ties to his own country, a Brazilian who has a good job, property, a family, has a higher possibility of returning from Disneyland! So do not be in awe when the rich or better off can get a visa with no problem!
Unfortunately the lack of good opportunities south of the border is causing a record number of immigrants/migrants, much more than the population in the U.S. can stand. Like with most all countries in the world immigration/migration control becomes an issue when it gets overwhelmed. Latin America is essentially repopulating certain parts of the U.S. and instead of mingling they are creating areas where English is no longer spoken and importing the bad lawless habits of their home country and enlarging the base below the poverty line.
If anyone should put blame on anyone for this situation, we do not need to look any further than to those Brazilians who have abused the system and to those wanting to! And as far as rep**ation goes Brazilians have exhibited such bad behavior in Brazil and the U.S. by not abiding by the rules, that Brazilians are deemed lawless where the law applies.
you will get caught
written by u.s.a. # 1, February 22, 2007
The noose tightens ! ... the overwhelming majority of americans are demanding , a end to the flood of illegal aliens...interior enforcements are on the rise, the tide is rising against the illegals...
To the idiot who wrote : PART OF YOUR CULTURE COMES FROM THE USA , A BIG PART !!!!!!!
written by ch.c., February 22, 2007
Sorry, but in my humble and stupid view, a big part of Brazilian culture is mostly......EUROPEAN !
Are not ALL white Brazilians, one way or another, descendants of Europeans ?

Just think about it !!!!!! smile -smilies/wink.gif)
...
written by bo, February 22, 2007
If anyone should put blame on anyone for this situation, we do not need to look any further than to those Brazilians who have abused the system and to those wanting to! And as far as rep**ation goes Brazilians have exhibited such bad behavior in Brazil and the U.S. by not abiding by the rules, that Brazilians are deemed lawless where the law applies.



Have to agree. Brazilians aren't big on obeying rules, many laws for that matter. They're not enforced, so they're not respected, simple as that.
...
written by let me out of this Braz craze, February 22, 2007
"Unfortunately the lack of good opportunities south of the border is causing a record number of immigrants/migrants, much more than the population in the U.S. can stand. Like with most all countries in the world immigration/migration control becomes an issue when it gets overwhelmed. Latin America is essentially repopulating certain parts of the U.S. and instead of mingling they are creating areas where English is no longer spoken and importing the bad lawless habits of their home country and enlarging the base below the poverty line. "

This is what is called Globalization of Capitalism or Some are More Equal Than Others. Osama is right. These stupid crazy consumers just think with their asses and trashes everything in the world! smilies/grin.gif

I think this is a great moment for Brazilians stop sniffing their socks and start traveling other parts of the world. The fact that much of the A cultural industry is very well liked by Brazilians and they are stupid apoliticals citizens of the world, make them crowd journeys to us. Start traveling to other places! Oh better, keep going to US! smilies/grin.gif
To forrest
written by A brazilian, February 22, 2007
Brazilian culture is made of many cultures. We like it, we take it. It's how it was and how it will ever be.
Professor
written by A brazilian, February 22, 2007
As most know the U.S. suffers from a high number of Brazilians who have populated the U.S. and are not contributing; as citizens of the U.S. are expected to contribute.


They are contribute a lot, in the form of cheap labor force and by paying taxes. Whenever you buy something aren't the taxes calculated over the price? About the "repopulation" part, this is more about mexicans not brazilians. No brazilian would refuse to learn english, or live in a ghetto out of free will. The only people that wouldn't care about learning anything are those planning to go back home after saving some money.

I wonder, though, if americans would complain if the "mass immigration" were of european blondes. It seems to me that this illegal immigrant issue has more to do with racism than with actual economic problems.
...
written by out of this thks god, February 22, 2007
Get your asses kicked and still beg to enter that land of nazis. Brazilians are so stupid and real bananas. What a joke!
Brazilians
written by People I know, February 23, 2007
I live in the US., I am an American I have a Brazilian Husband. Many of my friends are Brazilian and I can tell you, all have good jobs (exception of 1 woman who expects a man to take care of her) speak very good English, pay Income Tax, Property tax and are better contributers to our society than some of my American friends. Most of them have attended higher education institutions in the United States and have moved on to graduate school. I am offended by the catagorization of Brazilians as lazy or don't really obey the rules. I have yet to see this. They love their culture and country, but hate what it has become. The USA has a rep**ation in the world as a place where you can have opportunities that you might not have in other parts of the world. Besides having Brazilian friends, I have friends from other cultures as well that display the same approach to life in the United States. The problem isn't these people being here, because from what I can see, they benefit our society, the problem is thier own governments failure to establish a government free of corruption and incompetence. If Brazil was a stable place economically ans socially, most of my Brazilian friends would not be here.
So to those of you that would put down my friends as a culture and a race, you know where you can go, as far as the anti-Americanism goes, I'm not but I understand it. Arrogance will bring that on any one person's behavior let alone an entire nation.
...
written by jabmalassie, February 23, 2007
I know there are alot of Brazilians in Orlando and Boston. I never heard of much trouble from Brazilian immigrants concerning crime ect.
back at ya, A brazilian
written by Professor, February 23, 2007
They are contribute a lot, in the form of cheap labor force and by paying taxes. Whenever you buy something aren't the taxes calculated over the price? About the "repopulation" part, this is more about mexicans not brazilians. No brazilian would refuse to learn english, or live in a ghetto out of free will. The only people that wouldn't care about learning anything are those planning to go back home after saving some money.

People who are legal or illegal end up paying state and city taxes every time they purchase something. At the end of the year legal people file state and federal tax returns, however illegal people do not. The illegal people siphon money from the economy. Also take advantage of an infrastructure they are not supporting. In the U.S. citizenship and responsibility are more absolute as say compared to Brazil. Then again if you had millions of illegals in Brazil say from Colombia and these Colombians were sending most of their wages back to Columbia and not paying IR, then it would be more understandable I suppose. Lets also suppose that these millions of Columbians lived in São Paulo and when you went to the Padaria everyone was speaking Spanish. Trust me not all Brazilians in the U.S. are functioning fully in English, just like not all Gringos in Brazil are functioning in Portuguese. For the most part thou I agree with what you say, but then again apparently the U.S. does not or we would not have a visa problem! I guess the fact is that Latin America has so many illegals in the U.S. creating sub-cultures; it has got the population pissed off!

I wonder, though, if americans would complain if the "mass immigration" were of european blondes. It seems to me that this illegal immigrant issue has more to do with racism than with actual economic problems.

I think a few blondes would be okay, but imagine millions of dumb blondes!! Are you kidding, send them back to Europe!

In the past I worked alongside illegals in Texas and Arizona, none of them spoke more than a few sentences in English, most hardworking people I have ever met! Now again Brazilians in the U.S. are not like the Mexicans at least the Illegals I know about, they are from the middle class here and speak some basic English at the minimum. Even though Mexicans are a majority, there are an abundant amount of Brazilians among others as well. For the most part just the amount of Illegal Brazilians in the U.S. are almost greater than the population of Guyanese living in Guyana give or take a few. In my opinion I think we should be able to live easily wherever we wanted to! But if this was the case half of Latin American would have already moved to the U.S. thus leaving no room for the Dumb European blondes!
...
written by oat flakes, February 23, 2007
..I live in US I hava a Brazilian Husband...

I thought you had an American husband, with Braz mommy and daddy.. what happened? didnt like the last nationality?

Oh don't forget to supervision Mexican borders and call toll free number when you see a Mex pulling the gate.
...
written by out of this olodum, February 23, 2007
...as for the Anti-Americans goes I'm not but understand it. Arrogance will bring that to ...

I wonder what experiences make you 'understand it'. Let alone talking about a Brazzil's gringa poster! Go back to your quack farms!
...
written by out of this olodum, February 23, 2007
or quacker smilies/smiley.gif
BRASILIAN
written by forrest allen brown, February 23, 2007
SO IF THERE WERE A MASS OF BIG BUTTED WOMEN FROM ANY WHERE IN THE WORLD WHAT WOULD THE BRASILIAN GOV DO
NOT A THING TILL THE WOMEN OF BRAZIL GOT MAD BECAUSE THERE HUSBANS NEVER CAME HOME

SO TAKING SOME THING PATNTED FROM ANOTHER PERSON IS YOUR CULTURE
COPIE RITE IS NOT OPEN TO LAW BY YOUR CULTURE
KILLING SOMEONE FOR HAVING SOMETHING YOU WANT IS YOUR CULTURE
POLICE ROBING THE PEOPLE THEY ARE SOWRN TO PROTECT IS YOUR CULTURE

DONT BRING IT TO MY CULTURE YOU WILL END UP IN JAIL AND AGAIN TAX PAYERS WILL HAVE TO SUPORT YOU

ALSO HAVE ANY ONE HURD THIS ONE
ILLEGAL GETTING OUT OF JAIL AFTER 5 YEARS OAR TRYING TO FILE FOR CITISEN SHIP THROUGH THE COURTS
...
written by bo, February 23, 2007
Brazilians
written by People I know, 2007-02-22 19:16:16

I live in the US., I am an American I have a Brazilian Husband. Many of my friends are Brazilian and I can tell you, all have good jobs (exception of 1 woman who expects a man to take care of her) speak very good English, pay Income Tax, Property tax and are better contributers to our society than some of my American friends. Most of them have attended higher education institutions in the United States and have moved on to graduate school. I am offended by the catagorization of Brazilians as lazy or don't really obey the rules. I have yet to see this. They love their culture and country, but hate what it has become. The USA has a rep**ation in the world as a place where you can have opportunities that you might not have in other parts of the world. Besides having Brazilian friends, I have friends from other cultures as well that display the same approach to life in the United States. The problem isn't these people being here, because from what I can see, they benefit our society, the problem is thier own governments failure to establish a government free of corruption and incompetence. If Brazil was a stable place economically ans socially, most of my Brazilian friends would not be here.
So to those of you that would put down my friends as a culture and a race, you know where you can go, as far as the anti-Americanism goes, I'm not but I understand it. Arrogance will bring that on any one person's behavior let alone an entire nation.



well, "people I know", you must be talking about approximately 25% of the brazilian population in the U.S., because the other 75% are there ILLEGALLY!

If they wouldn't break the law on their very entry into the country, maybe they would deserve a little more respect!
Hmmm...HMMMMM !!!!!
written by ch.c., February 23, 2007
I could understand Brazilians only if they would offer reciprocity !!!!!

Can Americans, Europeans, Africans, LATAM people and whoever stay in Brazil illegally if there is passport checking ???????
What do Brazilians when they find and arrest an illegal (without visa) or someone with a visa that expired ?????

Quite simply.....why do Brazilians find as normal the Brazilians laws for illegals and not similar laws when other countries, wealthy or not, have similar laws than Brazil ?????

The same question should be answered for JOBS !!!!!!!!! Would Brazilians companies hire a well paid job for an illegal foreigner ?????

Yessss very sad that Brazilians complain all the time...against laws in other countries.

Furthermore, as one member wrote, that illegals bring prosperity to America, then why it would not bring prosperity to Brazil ! Quite simple !!!!

Finally who of the USA or Brazil needs more development and prosperity ? smile !!!!!

Dont forget that millions and millions of brazilians are already in the informal sectors.
In that sense, using the same idea that illegal jobd bring prosperity, Brazil should be ALREADY extremely prosper ! It is not....from what I know !

Conclusion : those, Brazilians and whoever, saying that illegals bring propserity...simply just dont know anything. Because as said, then, Brazil should be extremely wealthy....ALREADY !!!!! QUITE SIMPLE.....SORRY !!!!!
CONTINUED.....
written by ch.c., February 23, 2007
And everyone know or should know that if America or European countries would let without control and without controlling the numbers......all these countries would double....AT LEAST....their population...in only a few years time !

Because I am not talking specifically only for LATAM citizens, but also Africans, Middle Easterns, Indians, Asians and Chinese.

Simply stated, open the borders, and it wont be millions more of foreigners but hundreds of millions of them from China alone, who are dreaming to leave their
country !

Conclusion : over a billion people are dreaming of a better future !!!!!!!!

Good luck America...the day you open your borders to whoever want to work freely and legally in your country.
The boom wont be only in real estate in huts....but also in your poverty rate that will by definition as high as in these large emerging countries.

Where is the common sense ??????
U.S. LAW will have the last word on this
written by u.s.a. # 1, February 23, 2007
If you are in the u.s. illegally... you can leave and return to your home country...you can leave now , or you can leave when you get caught...your chances of remaining in the u.s. illegally are narrowing and the noose tightens...its quite simple... its the law... amnesty and guestworker lobbys are playing with rhetoric and slogans and nonsense...immigration reform is the attempt by these groups to re-write current laws to allow illegals to remain and allow millions of foreign nationals to the u.s..... the left, and other radical groups agitate, and give illegals a sense of ,"well maybe i,ll get an amnesty"... the reality is this, the future of being a illegal alien in the u.s. does not look good....you can leave now or you can leave later.....
disney land??????
written by u.s.a. # 1, February 23, 2007
VISA DENIED.!!!!...
Ch.c, our savior
written by A brazilian, February 23, 2007
I am glad our messiah is returned with his priceless pieces of wisdom! smilies/smiley.gif
Professor
written by A brazilian, February 23, 2007
The illegal people siphon money from the economy. Also take advantage of an infrastructure they are not supporting. In the U.S. citizenship and responsibility are more absolute as say compared to Brazil.


How do you say that? We pay more taxes than any of you! You are not considering the whole picture. They work for less than an american would, they are contributing to the economy! So if the owner of a fast food store can pay 2 illegals to work for the price of 1 american, isn't that good for his business!? Won't that bring more profit for him, therefore he will spend more and pay more taxes for your economy?

I can't believe americans are that incompetent. Doesn't any of your government agencies know about places, gangs or contacts that take illegals to their employers? Doesn't any of your fellow citizens see illegals and denounce them!? My guess is that finishing with this party is bad for business, that's why they do nothing.

Then again if you had millions of illegals in Brazil say from Colombia and these Colombians were sending most of their wages back to Columbia and not paying IR, then it would be more understandable I suppose. Lets also suppose that these millions of Columbians lived in São Paulo and when you went to the Padaria everyone was speaking Spanish.


I would think the government would have the obligation of offering the opportunity for them to become legals so at least they would have a chance against exploitation. Brazilian laws protecting are one of the kinds that work.

About the spanish part, I think we have more urgent problems than training workers to speak spanish and putting spanish signs on the streets! I was amazed that I actually saw signs written in spanish in one city I visited there! That's crazy! They would have to learn english if you didn't help them by providing services in spanish! Or else they would starve!

Recently I saw an article about illegal bolivians in Brazil. The only problem for them to become legal immigrants would be that they don't have the money for paying the taxes for the visa. This is ridiculous, in such situations there should be a free of charge way.
illegal aliens and anti americanism
written by I.C.E., February 23, 2007
question?... why is it that when a illegal alien farts ,they blame an american for the smell....Answer: being illegal in the u.s. causes stomach cramps, gastrointestinal disorder, excessive gas, and anti americanism ...
Forrest
written by A brazilian, February 23, 2007
SO TAKING SOME THING PATNTED FROM ANOTHER PERSON IS YOUR CULTURE
COPIE RITE IS NOT OPEN TO LAW BY YOUR CULTURE


You don't quite get what I mean. You can't patent Shakespeare, you can't prevent people from reading Homerus, you can't prevent people from appreaciating Goethe. I feel free to read them all and consider them part of my culture, regardless if they are english, greek or german, they are all brazilians to me.



AS WE SHOULD SEE IT
written by forrest allen brown, February 23, 2007
IF THE GOVERMENTS OF BRAZIL AND MEXICO GOT THE POLE OUT OF THERE ASS

AND PASS THE WAGE LAW TO MAKE THE BIG BUSINESS AND THE REST OF THE 3 WORLD COUNTRIES
IT WOULD CUT THE MIGRATION OF PEOPLE LOOKING FOR A BETTER LIFE ELSE WHERE .

LIKE IT HAS BEEN FOR THE LAST 15.000 YEARS LOOKING FOR A BETTER PLACE TO LIVE FOR YOU AND YOUR KIDS

AS WOMEN SMART WOMEN DO LOOK FOR THE BEST PROVIDER FOR THEM AND THE KIDS
...
written by A brazilian, February 23, 2007
Forrest, I can't really understand what you mean. Please stop using the caps lock, and spend a little more time putting those sentences together in a meaningful way.
Hey, dont bring Paraguay into this
written by Pioneer, February 23, 2007
Most Paraguayans do not even bother applying for US tourist visas because they have leanred from the countless horror stories of others being denied a visa. The consular officers in the U.S. embassy in Asuncion are merciless -- they interrogate applicants and grill them about their finances and family situation, in full view of a roomfull of applicants. Asides from the humilliation of having a visa rejected, there is the financial pain of having to pony up $100 for a shot at being considered a B-1 tourist visa. I hate to say this, but $100 is a lot of money for a country where the monthly wage is barely $200. Hence, the U.S. is not the destination of most Paraguayans, and Clara Angelica obviously doesn't know what she is talking about when she compares U.S. consular policies in Paraguay against those in Brazil.

The U.S. has the duty to control and secure its borders and enforce its immigration laws. Do you want to know what living in a country run over by illegal immigrants feels like? Do you want to see for yourself what it feels like to be invaded and over-run by foreign citizens who don't speak your language, don't share your culture and who try to impose their institutions on you? Check out Pedro Juan Caballero, Saltos de Guaira or Ciudad del Este, all located in the eastern portion of Paraguay. This region is being over-run by ilegal Brazilian immigrants who practice slash-burn agricultural techniques and who disregard Paraguayan culture and laws.

...
written by A brazilian, February 23, 2007
This region is being over-run by ilegal Brazilian immigrants who practice slash-burn agricultural techniques and who disregard Paraguayan culture and laws.


Are they crossing the desert to Paraguay?
A brazilian.......
written by Professor, February 23, 2007
The illegal people siphon money from the economy. Also take advantage of an infrastructure they are not supporting. In the U.S. citizenship and responsibility are more absolute as say compared to Brazil.


How do you say that? We pay more taxes than any of you! You are not considering the whole picture. They work for less than an american would, they are contributing to the economy! So if the owner of a fast food store can pay 2 illegals to work for the price of 1 american, isn't that good for his business!? Won't that bring more profit for him, therefore he will spend more and pay more taxes for your economy?


Brazil is a different story! I guess siphoning all that money out of the U.S. is justified because it is an American problem, right? But try to do the same from Brazil.
Illegals are good for business to a certain extent and who profits? The farmers etc. plus this keeps the cost of produce down. But the Illegals, other than siphoning money out of the U.S. are not paying their Fare share that supports the infrastructure. When they get sick they use the welfare system to pay for their medical, when they start breaking the law the police are called, when they start a fire the fire department is called and so on, are they paying for these services which are supported from property taxes, legal employmey etc.? NO! The legal taxpayer pays for this, so even though a head of lettuce is 20 cents cheaper, the taxpayer has to pay 70 cents more per head of lettuce to maintain illegals.

I can't believe americans are that incompetent. Doesn't any of your government agencies know about places, gangs or contacts that take illegals to their employers? Doesn't any of your fellow citizens see illegals and denounce them!? My guess is that finishing with this party is bad for business, that's why they do nothing.


Incompetent is part of the problem, overwhelmed better describes the situation! Of course Employers would all love to pay slave wages if they could get away with it. Look at wages in Brazil for an example! Things are so crooked here that you have to have a 13th salary, food supplement and other guarantees in case you get fired, And the burden is forced on to the employer who is paying you low wages in the first place and is not paying his fare share of taxes in which the government is forced to make the employer pay in other bureaucratic ways.

In the Latin mentality the 11 million Illegals is a good thing, right? Because it benefits who? Good for the U.S. but keep them Bastardos out of Brazil, Ne?


Professor
written by A brazilian, February 23, 2007
The legal taxpayer pays for this, so even though a head of lettuce is 20 cents cheaper, the taxpayer has to pay 70 cents more per head of lettuce to maintain illegals.


Any source for such data?

Look at wages in Brazil for an example! Things are so crooked here that you have to have a 13th salary, food supplement and other guarantees in case you get fired, And the burden is forced on to the employer who is paying you low wages in the first place and is not paying his fare share of taxes in which the government is forced to make the employer pay in other bureaucratic ways.


I am looking and I see no problem. The values are completely compatible with the economy, so much that it will differ from region to region. The working rights of 13th salary and other benefits are just that, rights of the worker, there's nothing to do as a workaround to "low wages". Please inform yourself better about brazilian working laws before making such stupid claims.

Associating 13th salary to low wages is one of the stupidest things I have ever read in these forums! Now the worker to have rights is something bad!

In the Latin mentality the 11 million Illegals is a good thing, right? Because it benefits who? Good for the U.S. but keep them Bastardos out of Brazil, Ne?


Latin who? Who is latin? Is the such a country "Latinia" or "United states of Latinia"? It's your problem and your government is either incompetent or unwilling to solve the "problem".
CAPS LOCK BROKE ON LAP TOP
written by forrest allen brown, February 23, 2007
ONLY PLACE TO REPAIR IN TROPICAL MAC IN RECIFE BUT LAST TIME I TOOK MY COMPUTER IT WAS 4 MONTHS AND $1500 R TO DO A SIMPLE TASK
AND THEN THEY DOWN LOADED MY PROGRAMS AND SOLD WHAT THEY COULD , ANATHER CULTURE TRATE OF BRASILIANS

SO YOU CAN READ ANY THING YOU WANT I WISH MORE PEOPLE IN THE WORLD READ , OR WERE ABLE TO , SCHOOL HELPS THAT A LOT

I AM TALKING ABOUT THE AIDS MEDS YOUR COUNTRY TOOK BROKE THEM DOWN AND ARE RESELLING TO OTHER COUNTRIES . UNDER YOUR LABLE CULTURE BRASIL


HAVING EVERY MAJOR CITY IN BRASIL THAT HAS CLUBS TAKES MONEY FROM THEM FOR PLAYING CANED MUSIC UNDER THE WE SEND IT TO THE ARTIST , NEVER HAPPENS

MOVIES DOWNLOADED FROM THE NET SOLD TO PEOPLE AT STORES YOUR CULTURE

THE ONLY LATIN COUNTRY I KNOW OF IS POPE LAND WHITCH MOST OF ALL BRASILIANS CLAIM , AND YOUR HOME COUNRTY WOULD NOT EVEN BE THERE IF IT WAS NOT FOR THE CHURCH AND ENGLAND

AS FAR PAY THE ONLY BRASILIANS THAT MAKE SOME WHERE AROUND A GOOD WAGE IS CONGRESS .
AND THOES WHOM WELL YOU KNOW WHO THEY ARE

I HAVE SEEN BUSINESS OWNERS NOT PAY HIS PEOPLE BECAUSE HE DID NOT HAVE THE MONEY HE NEEDED TO LIVE HIS LIFE STYLE CULTURE BRAZIL
americans doing what they do best...
written by costinha, February 23, 2007
arrogant a$$holes!
Forrest
written by A brazilian, February 23, 2007
Do you use a Mac? Haha. You deserve to be charged abusive prices then! smilies/smiley.gif
Back at ya, A brazilian
written by Professor, February 23, 2007
The legal taxpayer pays for this, so even though a head of lettuce is 20 cents cheaper, the taxpayer has to pay 70 cents more per head of lettuce to maintain illegals.


Any source for such data?


Sorry that I wrote above your abstract ability to comprehend! I did write in such a way that was meant to confuse the simple in mind but not the simple. Why not Google for the source data?

Look at wages in Brazil for an example! Things are so crooked here that you have to have a 13th salary, food supplement and other guarantees in case you get fired, And the burden is forced on to the employer who is paying you low wages in the first place and is not paying his fare share of taxes in which the government is forced to make the employer pay in other bureaucratic ways.


I am looking and I see no problem. The values are completely compatible with the economy, so much that it will differ from region to region. The working rights of 13th salary and other benefits are just that, rights of the worker, there's nothing to do as a workaround to "low wages". Please inform yourself better about brazilian working laws before making such stupid claims.

Associating 13th salary to low wages is one of the stupidest things I have ever read in these forums! Now the worker to have rights is something bad!


Again I am sorry, I wrote above your level of experience! I wrote in such a way that a person both knowing the system of the U.S. and Brazil could comprehend. Twisted concepts from a twisted latin mind makes for twisted ways of appeasing twisted subservient people who base their progess on how many Cesta Basicas one makes! Perhaps a 14th salary is on the way?

In the Latin mentality the 11 million Illegals is a good thing, right? Because it benefits who? Good for the U.S. but keep them Bastardos out of Brazil, Ne?


Latin who? Who is latin? Is the such a country "Latinia" or "United states of Latinia"? It's your problem and your government is either incompetent or unwilling to solve the "problem".


It is more than a U.S. problem. The problem comes from South of the border. Again Latin mentality.


ONCE YOU GO MACK YOU DONT GO BACK
written by forrest allen brown, February 23, 2007
NO YOU DONT UNDERSTAND I WILL NOT OVER PAY FOR THE SERVICE .

AND HAVE INFORMED APLE IN THE STATES OF THE MISS DEALINGS OF TROPICAL MC .
MAY NOT BE ABLE TO WORK ON THEM MUCH LONGER
AND THEY ARE SENDING ME MY PART AS WE SPEAK WILL REPAIR IT SOON MYSELF CULTURE USA


SO ON YOUR PC YOU HAVE HOW MANY PICES DO YOU HAVE TO PROTECT YOU FROM
COMPUTER VIRUS.

AND WHAT IS THE NEW SOFT WARE YOU HAVE TO BUY TO KEEP YOUR STUFF CLEAN

AT LAST COUNT THERE WERE OVER 27.000 VIRUS FOR PC AND ONLY ABOUT 300 FOR MAC

SOMETHING A PERSON LIKE YOU WOULD NOT UNDERSTAND I GUESS , CULTURE BRAZIL ???????
Forrest
written by A brazilian, February 23, 2007
Maybe they only have 300 viruses because they are only 1% of the total personal computers?
...
written by A brazilian, February 23, 2007
Why not Google for the source data?


You were the one that brought that up, do as Bo do Google for it and paste the link here.

Again I am sorry, I wrote above your level of experience! I wrote in such a way that a person both knowing the system of the U.S. and Brazil could comprehend. Twisted concepts from a twisted latin mind makes for twisted ways of appeasing twisted subservient people who base their progess on how many Cesta Basicas one makes! Perhaps a 14th salary is on the way?


You and those inhabitants of "latinia" again, what about them? This is forum focused in Brazil matters as far I know, not sure why you come up with matters of foreigners. Perhaps you might elucidate for the poor souls, brazilians and mainly americans, whose geography knowledge is zero, where "Latinia" is.

It is more than a U.S. problem. The problem comes from South of the border.


But it is there! Not here. Again, why does your government not end with it? Are they unable to prevent people from coming through the border!? That's called incompetence.
Increedahblee Stoopeed Peahole Doh No Nuttin
written by Simpleton, February 24, 2007
"...
written by A brazilian, 2007-02-23 00:45:41

Forrest, I can't really understand what you mean. Please stop using the caps lock, and spend a little more time putting those sentences together in a meaningful way."

Abe, you are one total dolt. I've never seen anything forrest has posted that I did not understand. At his worst, there may have been a couple minor points that didn't ring full and true or were abbreviated that less experienced folks didn't understand (that he clarified in followup posts when asked). He says so much more in so few words than anyone else I find it incredibly delightful hearing from him. He's also so very very close to the mark on what real life does to people when they live in the real world. Maybe the school of hard knocks has made him a bit vengeful for most people's taste from time to time but it' a sure sight better hearing the truth from someone's real life experiences than your b-s.

No good job (i.e. one that pays as if you had attained "superior"), no immediate family obligations staying home during your "visit" to the states, no ownership of your house or property or an ongoing business or a sizeable bank account balance - good luck getting a visa approved. You have nothing going for you to convince the consulate that you do in fact intend to return to Brazil. Doesn't even matter if you have personal sponsors stateside, came there many times during the 70's and 80's as well as traveled all over Europe - if you have none of the above it's a very riskly bet to buy non-refundable tickets and plunk down the US$100.

I know a librarian for a local school with major multimedia and web resources under her charge that was very very aprehensive about giving up the macs last year. I guess it all depends on what you are used to and or like and or need to accomplish.
Here is the problem
written by GTY, February 24, 2007
Back in the day, illegal migrants were very important to the US economy. Almost 65% of America's food is grown in the Central Valley of California. Mexican migrants were exactly that, migrants, hard working families that brought benefit and that includes parta of their culture to California. The worked hard, followed the laws and raised their families. The problem was and is the following generations and the fact that if you have a kid on US soil, he is an American citizen...very, very, bad policy. Many of the sons and daughters of these hard working immigrants became gang members, chosing instead to sell drugs than to work like their parents or grand parents in the fields. Mexican gangs were among the first to appear, does anyone remember the movie Colors with Penn and Duvall? Today, the most violent gangs are not Crips or Bloods, but the Latin and South American gangs like the gangs from Mexico, El Salvador and Nicaragua.

Brazilians are like the immigrants of old, they are considered the largest group of OTM (other than Mexicans) immigrating into the US, in fact just yesterday a truck was stopped, it's driver arrested and 45 Brazilians are in detention awaiting deportation on the Mexican border. Not only are illegal immigrants a costly burden because they use services they don't pay for, but the costs of the security and steps being taken to keep them out are astronomical, including border enforcement and deportation. Any guess who is paying for the 45 plane tickets back home to Brazil? The good news is, as reported by the New York Times last week, these new border security steps seem to be working.

The unfortunate consequence of this, is the plight of Forest, who lives in Brazil with his wife and she can not get a Visa to immigrate with him. His circumstances are not the norm, you do not need to have huge resources to prove support, why can't Forest simply sponsor his wife, you just have to show a modest income, bank accounts and the potential immigrants has to pass a health exam and criminal background check. No, there is something else behind Forest's difficulties, he should be able to easily obtain a Visa for his Brazilian wife unless there is something wrong, it makes no sense, so although Forest is a war hero...there is more to his story that he is not telling us. A Visa for a spouse is among the easiest to get, especially if they can prove they have been together for 3 years.

It's time to close the door, almost 1 million people immigrate leagly every year...there are tens of millions more who would like to, even with rampant anti-Americanism around the world. I know we are not perfect, but we still seem to have what a lot of people want, we just can't accomidate everyone that wants to live here any longer.
...
written by Simpleton, February 24, 2007
Still don't see how this place or that place being such a great place helps move things forward to get over the reciprocity / repraisal situation.

I think forrest laid the issue out clearly. That it's he is there, not here. That he would have to come back here and establish a presence for himself for roughly three years with some subsistance level income before he could be the sponsor for his own wife. It's kind of like the catch 22 in the investador status. Unless you own a business here first you can't get a business visa to go down there to do the research, make the contacts and start the process of setting up a new business down there via the external capitol investment mechanism. Why? Because you have to submit a letter of guarantee on company letterhead with the application for the business visa in the first place. Doesn't matter that you have the money, you don't have the previously registered name in the right place for the long enough period of time backing it up.
This forum is a perfect example of wasted sperm.
written by Alex, February 24, 2007
This forum exemplifies that stupidity and mediocrity go hand in hand with arrogance and racism. Forrest, I think you last name must be Gump. You type like a complete retard, your arguments don't make any sense whatsoever (you seem to be in some kind of medication. Most people that I know who have been to Vietnam are old enough to have amassed enough funds to qualify any able and willing BraZilian woman to come to the USA. If you have been facing so many obstacles to bring your wife to the USA, it is quite possible that the American Consulate has very well founded objections to your request. I don't believe, however, that your markedly lower IQ should be grounds for their denial.
Professor, you use articulate language to hide your complete lack of logic and intelligence. You make assumptions feeding them with circular reasoning and deranged theories that indicate a partial lobotomy (that's all I am going to say about someone who rebuffs an argument with "google it".
Probably, the smartest thing that has been said in this Forum is this: If the US really wanted to correct the Immigration problem, it would have done a long time ago. Cheap labor has always fueled the American economy, first with slavery, later with the immigration of Irish, Chinese and Italian workers. As an American, I believe that something must be done in order to curtail the uncontrolled flux of illegals into this country. The assumption that illegals drain the economy is, however, completely and accutely false. Illegal immigrants aren't exempt from paying sales taxes. Illegal immigrants don't have any rights to medicare or medicaid coverage. Illegal immigrants will not be treated in any hospital in America, unless they have insurance (like everybody else). In cases of emergency, illegal immigrants will receive treatment, and eventually, will be charged for this treatment (I have seen this firsthand). Illegal immigrants don't qualify for food stamps. Illegal immigrants benefit from the infrastructure that provides for police and schools. We must not forget, however, that these services are most of the times funded by property taxes (automobile and home). By renting and owning automobiles, illegal immigrants don't get a free ride, as mentioned here before, but contribute to community services.
The truth of the matter is there is way too many Brazilians willing to lie in order to get a visa under false pretenses and stay illegally in America. Cheap labor is a necessity for the continuation of the American way of life. What this governement needs is a cohesive and sensible policy to regulate cheap labor and the integration of foreign workers that come here and decide to stay.
...
written by bo, February 24, 2007
The assumption that illegals drain the economy is, however, completely and accutely false. Illegal immigrants aren't exempt from paying sales taxes. Illegal immigrants don't have any rights to medicare or medicaid coverage. Illegal immigrants will not be treated in any hospital in America, unless they have insurance (like everybody else). In cases of emergency, illegal immigrants will receive treatment, and eventually, will be charged for this treatment (I have seen this firsthand). Illegal immigrants don't qualify for food stamps. Illegal immigrants benefit from the infrastructure that provides for police and schools.


While some of what you say may be true, the fact of the matter is that MANY illegal immigrants DO receive and are receiving social services in which they do not pay for. Just because someone is "billed" for hospital services certainly doesn't mean they pay them. I hope that you're not trying to say that in the overall picture that the vast numbers of illegal immigrants today in the U.S., ranging from 12-20 million, are providing a greater benefit than detriment they are causing, because that plain and simply isn't so. And if you like, I can show numerous studies done by NGO's as well as government agencies in the U.S. to show both the benefits provided as well as the detriments, and it's not even close.

The fact of the matter is that it doesn't really matter what a handful of people in the "gov't." or a certain faction of industry wants when 80% of the american public want something done. Most of the newly elected and re-elected democrats in congress today ran on a platform of doing something significant about the illegal immigration problem, and providing "amnesty" certainly doesn't appear to be a solution. If they don't fulfill their promises, they more than likely be signing their own death warrant to their political life.
...
written by bo, February 24, 2007
You have nothing going for you to convince the consulate that you do in fact intend to return to Brazil. Doesn't even matter if you have personal sponsors stateside, came there many times during the 70's and 80's as well as traveled all over Europe - if you have none of the above it's a very riskly bet to buy non-refundable tickets and plunk down the US$100.


Getting a permanent visa, or green card, and a tourist visa, or student visa, are two completely different things simpleton. When an american marries a foreigner and wants/needs to get their american documents, the U.S. gov't. requires someone to be fiscally responsible for that person. If the american is not currently working in the U.S. or does not have a sufficient enough U.S. income, then they need to find someone else, normally another family member, to be that person's sponsor.
...
written by bo, February 24, 2007
This is just one org, but there are numerous others, and their numbers are pretty damn accurate. This org, CIS (centers for immigration studies), is one of the most rep**able that exist in respect to this issue.

Immigration's Impact on Public Coffers

Testimony Prepared for the House Judiciary Committee
Subcommittee on Immigration and Claims

August 24, 2006

Steven A. Camarota
Director of Research, Center for Immigration Studies

Summary
There is general agreement that the fiscal impact of immigration (legal or illegal) depends largely on the education level of the immigrants in question. Immigrants with a lot of education pay more in taxes than they use in services, while those with little education tend to have low incomes, pay relatively little in taxes and often use a good deal in public services. In the case of illegal aliens, the vast majority have little education, and this is the key reason they create fiscal costs. Illegal families often receive benefits on behalf of their U.S.-born children. The costs associated with illegal immigration, such as emergency medical care or public education, are difficult to avoid if illegals are allowed to stay. As a matter of policy, either we enforce the law and make the illegals go home or stop complaining about the costs.

Key Findings of Research:

*

The National Research Council (NRC)1 estimated that immigrant households create a net fiscal burden (taxes paid minus services used) on all levels of government of $20.2 billion annually.

*

The NRC estimated that an immigrant without a high school diploma will create a net lifetime burden of $89,000, for an immigrant with only a high school education it is burden of $31,000. However, an immigrant with education beyond high school is a fiscal benefit of $105,000.

*

Estimating the impact of immigrants and their descendants, the NRC found that if today’s newcomers do as well as past generations, the average immigrant will be a fiscal drain for his first 22 years after arrival. It takes his children another 18 years to pay back this burden.

*

The NRC also estimated that the average immigrant plus all his descendants over 300 years would create a fiscal benefit, expressed in today’s dollars of $80,000. Some immigration advocates have pointed to this 300-year figure, but the NRC states it would be “absurd” to do so.

*

The Center for Immigration Studies (CIS) estimates that in 2002 illegal alien households imposed costs of $26 billion on the federal government and paid $16 billion in federal taxes, creating an annual net fiscal deficit of $10.4 billion at the federal level, or $2,700 per household.2 (*and that's only federal)

*

Among the largest federal costs, were Medicaid ($2.5 billion); treatment for the uninsured ($2.2 billion); food assistance programs such as food stamps, WIC, and free school lunches ($1.9 billion); the federal prison/court systems ($1.6 billion); and federal aid to schools ($1.4 billion).

*

If illegal aliens were legalized and began to pay taxes and use services like households headed by legal immigrants with the same education levels, CIS estimates the annual net fiscal deficit would increase to $29 billion, or $7,700, per household at the federal level.

*

The Center for Immigration Studies estimates that state and local governments spend some $4 billion a year to provide health care to illegal aliens and their U.S.-born children and $20 to $24 billion to educate children from illegal alien households.

*

The primary reason illegal aliens create a fiscal deficit is that an estimated 60 percent lack a high school degree and another 20 percent have no education beyond high school. The fiscal drain is not due to their legal status or unwillingness to work.

*

Illegal aliens with little education are a significant fiscal drain, but less-educated immigrants who are legal residents are a much larger fiscal problem because they are eligible for many more programs.



...
written by bo, February 24, 2007
Many of the costs associated with illegal aliens are due to their U.S.-born children who have American citizenship. Thus, barring illegal aliens themselves from programs will have little impact on costs.

*

There are now some 400,000 children born to illegal-alien mothers each year in the United States, accounting for almost one in 10 births in the country. Of all births to immigrants, 39 percent were to mothers without a high school education, and among illegals it was more than 65 percent.3

*

The costs associated with providing services to so many low-income children is enormous and will continue to grow if the large-scale influx of less-educated immigrants (legal and illegal) is allowed to continue.

*

Focusing just on Social Security and Medicare, CIS estimates that illegal households create a combined net benefit for these two programs in excess of $7 billion a year. However, they create a net deficit of $17 billion in the rest of the budget, for a total net federal cost of $10 billion.

*my comment

http://www.cis.org/articles/2006/sactestimony082406.html
a
written by a, February 24, 2007
smilies/smiley.gif smilies/wink.gif smilies/grin.gif smilies/angry.gif smilies/sad.gif smilies/shocked.gif smilies/cool.gif smilies/tongue.gif :- smilies/kiss.gif smilies/cry.gif
Show me da money!
written by Simpleton, February 24, 2007
THX bo.

In regards to permanent or psuedo permanent visas, Yes, forrest has to show the money is already here but don't assume he doesn't already have it there. Maybe there's just not enough of it to liquidate it / split it up and put a big chunk of it here in advance (or like any of us, just plain doesn't want to waste anything on taxes). Who's to say that he could not / would not sucessfully set up shop back in the country that owes him a debt and take care of his own? Ditto going the other way, one may have enough to set up shop there but without paying someone off on that end one has to show that there's a commercial existance on this end first - can't afford two businesses, paying two taxes, refuse to pay someone else for nothing other than their name backing? Forget it.

In regards to tourist visas it's the opposite - it's show me the money and connections on the departing end. Going that way - no problem just show you have a address with utility bills in your name and that the round trip tickets are paid for, coming this way - you're automatically assumed to be a high risk till you prove significantly otherwise. What, more or less living with kitchen cattatori work? Your sister backs your utility service by putting it in her name? Your son sends the money for your rent if needed / when he is able from his foreign place of residence? Unusual situation for sure but the point that someone has previously made is only the RICH can buy their way through.
CIS is biased and anti-immigrant.
written by Alex, February 24, 2007
written by bo, 2007-02-24 07:35:41

This is just one org, but there are numerous others, and their numbers are pretty damn accurate. This org, CIS (centers for immigration studies), is one of the most rep**able that exist in respect to this issue.


The Center for Immigration Studies describes itself as "the nation's only think tank devoted exclusively to research and policy analysis of the economic, social, demographic, fiscal, and other impacts of immigration on the United States." Founded in 1985 as a think tank to support the more activist work of the anti-immigrant Federation for American Immigration Reform (FAIR). CIS describes itself as “independent” and “nonpartisan,” but its studies, reports, and media releases consistently support its restrictionist agenda and works closely on Capitol Hill with Republican Party immigration restrictionists. “Let’s be clear,” wrote Frank Sharry of the National Immigration Forum, “CIS was birthed by FAIR, the militant anti-immigration group. The CIS executive director moved from FAIR to CIS to head up the organization. Although now independent, the two organizations share the same basic agenda: an American version of what in Europe is called ‘zero immigration.’” According to Sharry, CIS masquerades as an objective, “squeaky clean” think tank, but CIS is “simply churning out high-sounding, low-credibility grist for the high-pitch, low-road anti-immigration forces in the United States.” CIS has also been critiqued as being part of a network of anti-immigrant groups that cater to a white supremacist constituency by right-wing economic libertarians who believe in the benefits of mass and unfettered immigration. A Wall Street Journal op-ed (June 15, 2004), that was widely praised and circulated by pro-immigrant groups, reported that despite the fact that CIS “may strike right-wing poses in the press,” it and other like-minded groups “support big government, mock federalism, deride free markets, and push a cultural agenda abhorrent to any self-respecting social conservative.”


...
written by V-Spot, February 24, 2007
Forrest has some good points, but his grammar skills hurt my eyes.
Being in Recife has its good aspects and bad ones. Unfortunately for you, Forrest, it is not a place were bureaucratic matters always go smoothly. I would try to enjoy the good things, though, like tropical weather, beaches, food and music.
The visa situation is out of our hands. We are all little puppets in the big brother's eyes. If one can choose not to come to the US, one should stay or go somewhere else. North America has great things to offer, but in my humble opinion nothing worth going through the trouble of dealing with all the crap to get a visa.
the last word
written by u.s a. # ...1, February 24, 2007
visa denied !!!!!!!....
Thanks Alex
written by A brazilian, February 24, 2007
Your points are intelligent and logical. I am not defending illegal immigrants, I believe that if someone wants to go live in another country they should do it legally, but the it is just not true this over-simplification of the situation. The american economy benefits from the cheap labor force, and it makes many businesses more competitive. The end of illegal immigration would hurt many people in there.

About the link Bo provided, that's exactly what he does. If you check other articles you will that puts lots and lots of links to "studies", that usually are biased towards some group or party, and then he paints them as "the ultimate truth".
...
written by bo, February 24, 2007
CIS is biased and anti-immigrant.
written by Alex, 2007-02-24 14:56:31


Well Alex, it doesn't matter who they support if they're numbers are correct. Certainly with all the "big agri-business" supporting illegals they MUST have studies that support their side.....correct??


Can you please show us these studies??
caps fix
written by forrest allen brown, February 24, 2007
alex git a grip
my life here in brasil has been good when not dealing with gov matters ,
as far as money 600 hectors of land some money ,
building boats in brasil more money , but culture brasil tons of paga me or mountains of paper work , i do
taking the goverment of brasil to court , very different as they can point you to someone else whom is responsible , not them

yes year round growning season , good water , for cows , chickens , goats , and fish , and all the veggies we grow , plus 12 types of fruit
illove my life , not as much as my wife,

support for my wife and her family to build this place into a money making ranch

you would think that would be enough for the US goverment to allow my wife into the country as we would return very soon
NO
looks like i will have to buy another place put it in her name alone , and a car with bills , and a paying job for her to get a visa that way .

so am going the sponsor rute for now , if not that way just take my boat up island fly her up and sail into the states NOT THE WAY I WANT TO BUT I WILL

an just to let you know Stanford UN did a study saying if the first and last letter of a word are correct a person with an IQ of 98 will be able to read it with out any problum an understand it . so we know how low on the IQ you are dont we ????
also some times i type in code go back and see if you can make sence of it !!!!

1 % of the total pouplation of the world controls the worlds , money and people , so i will stay with apple and its 1% .

now i am going to my pool and take a swim and have and then watch a video
...
written by bo, February 24, 2007
“Let’s be clear,” wrote Frank Sharry of the National Immigration Forum, “CIS was birthed by FAIR, the militant anti-immigration group. The CIS executive director moved from FAIR to CIS to head up the organization. Although now independent, the two organizations share the same basic agenda: an American version of what in Europe is called ‘zero immigration.’” According to Sharry, CIS masquerades as an objective, “squeaky clean” think tank, but CIS is “simply churning out high-sounding, low-credibility grist for the high-pitch, low-road anti-immigration forces in the United States.” CIS has also been critiqued as being part of a network of anti-immigrant groups that cater to a white supremacist constituency by right-wing economic libertarians who believe in the benefits of mass and unfettered immigration. A Wall Street Journal op-ed (June 15, 2004), that was widely praised and circulated by pro-immigrant groups, reported that despite the fact that CIS “may strike right-wing poses in the press,” it and other like-minded groups “support big government, mock federalism, deride free markets, and push a cultural agenda abhorrent to any self-respecting social conservative.”



LOL...every single group, person, or organization quoted here is FOR mass immigration! So naturally they're going to criticize and try to undermine CIS's credibility.

Naturally, EVERYONE has access to public records and can do research!

CIS numbers and statistics are FACTUAL NUMBERS, and I challenge anyone to show otherwise.

As I previously stated, with all the powerful groups in the U.S. today that SUPPORT mass immigration and AMNESTY, naturally there would be at least ONE study that takes into account all the benefits and detriments that illegals bring and show where they bring more of a BENEFIT.....please, post the results here!!!




YOU CAN'T!!!


Because the studies done by CIS, and OTHER NGO's are VALID!


It's not even close, illegals HURT the american economy much more than they help. But we don't have to see anymore of your posts thad, uh-hum, "alex", since you originally claimed that illegals don't even receive social services in the U.S. It's a well known fact that they do. Illegals and the children of illegals, which are now representing 1 out of every 10 children born, are causing a detriment to the american economy every year in mult-Billions, that's with a B! And in places like California they are causing huge problems in regards to social services, education, etc.

Instead of just blowing wind Alex, can you post something a little more concrete that your own biased opinion?
Thanks Abe
written by Ric, February 24, 2007
Your points are intelligent and logical, Abe, Bob, but as a matter of national sovereignty, doesn´t each country have the right to establish any policy it want to regarding immigration? Brazil has its own policy based on what it perceives to be its national interest. A few years ago there was a Canadian who was held for a long time by the federal police on Manaus because his passport had become wet and it smeared the visa. I visited him in his cell and he was sleeping on cardboard. The American voter doesn´t care if people in other countries think that its policies are "fair" or not. Nor do the Brazilian voters, regarding their immigration policy.

So let those who come thru the legal channels and those who have capital to invest, immigrate to the USA and let the Uetbax and Wallydrags stay home. Difference between me and you is that I can vote on this matter and all you can do is ACHAR RUIM.

Abe the idiot...
written by bo, February 24, 2007
Thanks Alex
written by A brazilian, 2007-02-24 15:30:08

Your points are intelligent and logical. I am not defending illegal immigrants, I believe that if someone wants to go live in another country they should do it legally, but the it is just not true this over-simplification of the situation. The american economy benefits from the cheap labor force, and it makes many businesses more competitive. The end of illegal immigration would hurt many people in there.


A brazilian, do you understand that there is a HELLUVA lot more to consider when taking everything into account deciding if illegals are overall detrimental or beneficial??

It's a helluva lot more than just..."well, duh, they provide cheap labor".

Yeah, they do, and that's all been noted in the studies, matter of fact, in those studies, which are THOROUGH, they show all the benefits they bring, they even mention that immigrants that have an education level of a college degree bring a benefit of over 100,000 dollars per during their lifetime.

The problem is not that they are illegal Baghdad Bob, the problem is the VAST majority of illegal immigrants do not have more than a high school degree.
And Alex...
written by bo, February 24, 2007
you left off some of that copy and paste job...

" Founded in 1985 as a think tank to support the more activist work of the anti-immigrant Federation for American Immigration Reform (FAIR), CIS is dedicated "to expand the base of public knowledge and understanding of the need for an immigration policy that gives first concern to the broad national interest. The Center is animated by a pro-immigrant, low-immigration vision which seeks fewer immigrants but a warmer welcome for those admitted."


And I don't think you'll find many americans today that disagree with that last statement, to the tune of about 80%. But most importantly, as was stated earlier, I challenge you Alex, to disprove their studies.

But let's continue about CIS..

"However, CIS has achieved credibility with the media and in think tank circles because of its lack of the kind of strident anti-immigrant rhetoric associated with many restrictionist groups, its willingness to invite pro-immigrant voices to its forums, and the scholarly format of its reports.

CIS publishes books, reports, papers, and monthly backgrounders. Its analysis on such issues as immigrant voting and electoral redistricting, impacts on low-wage and high-skilled workers, and tax impacts are closely followed by immigration experts of all persuasions."

So everyone, not only those that are against mass immigration, but especially those that are FOR mass immigration, have naturally seen their studies and results.......where are their studies to the contrary???


Ric
written by A brazilian, February 24, 2007
Do you think I care? I am just pointing out the obvious, as I said already, it's your problem and not resolving it shows either incompetence or unwillingness. Illegals don't live underground in caves! There must be americans seeing them, giving them jobs and shelter, and don't denouncing them! You should start arresting employers of illegals, so there wouldn't be demand for cheap labor!

The US consulate is a joke, so much I have risked the US off the map for tourism. I haven't been denied any visa yet, all times I went there was because of work assignments or business, I would stay only a few weeks, a few months some cases. But they have no quality whatsoever, I wouldn't subject myself to such thing if there weren't a good reason to.

In one case I was going to pay the value for the visa, I think it is 100 something dollars, the guy just said "we won't accept this money" (a 50 dollar bill). I stared at him for a few seconds expecting some explanation, it was just unbelievable. Then I asked something like "By any chance, is there any reason for this bill not to be good for you? Just wondering". According to him it was not in good condition. They act as if they were making you a favor it's simply pathetic.

I don't like brazilians customer service, I think brazilians tend to be too informal, and sometimes they say things that aren't exactly things you should say to a customer. But the consulate workers are just and simply disrespectful! Even the brazilians that work there! They actually manage to have a worse service than the worst brazilian store or company.
I'll agree with most everything you posted above Abe....
written by bo, February 24, 2007
even about the treatment that brazilians receive at the U.S. consulates, I've witnessed it first hand and I complained to people in Brasilia as well as Washington.

But ya know what?? The vast majority of people that were rude were actually the brazilians that were working there being rude to other brazilians. Although there was one american consul that I witnessed there that was extremely rude.

The only thing I would take issue with you on your above post is that it's not incompetence that the U.S. has all the illegals they do, it's a lack of willingness to do what is necessary. But you see that is changing.
Lack of willingness in US is changing?
written by Simpleton, February 24, 2007
bo, do you really think there's been enough media / politico flame fanning to get any real change in motion? Or is it just more hot air, more promises promises and more promises (aka lies lies and more lies as you say when it comes from the Brazil politicos). Certainly things aren't as apathetic / hopeless here as for the masses in Brazils metropolosis's. Even residing in a local district with one of the highest percentage voter turn outs time after time out of any in this state as well as several neighboring states still does not give me the impression that the power of the people will rule. Yes, those voted in will change but as a whole it winds up balanced out and nothing moves one way or the other in any great hurry.

BTW - GO forrest GO!! I obviously can't spell on the fly worth a crap either and don't give a fut. Stick to proper code usage when applicable and forget those that can't read worth a payday.
Travel
written by Ric, February 25, 2007
Going to the states is no fun, even for someone with a USA passport. For a foreigner it must be awful. The airports are too full, the lines are too long, the airlines are often unhelpful.

Last time I saw a guy in the foreigners line being checked out and taken away to somewhere. The bishops of the Renascer must have been out of their minds to pull a fast one checking in through Immigration and Customs.

And now there´s no more Varig SP-LAX flight.

Just got a new Smiles card in the mail. Maybe they´ll be back up soon.

I think the reason the protocols are so rigid at US embassys and consulates is that so many of them have been attached or bombed worldwide, and it has to be one policy fits all.

What bugs me is the crummy attitude of many of the Canadian border personnel in places like Niagra and Blaine.
...
written by Alex, February 25, 2007
Let's get to the facts an not entertain highly biased and controversial stats (from either side of the debate). This country needs cheap labor. It is a fact that cannot be denied by anyone, regardless where he stands in the political spectrum. We need to regulate and reform the whole immigration system (Shocker!) As an American, I oppose amnesty on the grounds that it is immoral for it rewards unlawful behavior. We need to begin to deport illegal immigrants ASAP. We need to close our ridiculously porous borders. We need to support the policies of our embassies and consulates (and yes, even the ones in Brazil). We need to give preference to the immigrants who have played by the rules and have been here longer.
It is also a fact that the real burden on the welfare system of any country is NEVER generated by the working class (illegal and legal). Economics 101 will tell you that the social system has been plagued by endemic misuse of funds as it insists on supporting second and third generation of deadbeat morons who are not employed, do not want to be employed, but prefer to live in housing developments or trailers parks across the land. As they go on with their useless lives, watching Jerry Springer, defending the right to inbreeding, shopping at the local Dollar Store and rapping all their way to the Social service office, they take advantage of socialistic system that should have never been established in the first place. These are the leaches that are draining the country of resources that could be used to preserve the integrity of the Social Security system and other programs. Working immigrants (legal and illegal) maintain inflation in control and keep jobs from going to overseas. It is common knowledge that the construction, the agronomical, the food industries (just to mention a few) would collapse if immigration were to halt. Any economy, however, has its limits and we are approaching the point where the demand has been overshadowed by the plenteous supply of labor.
If you have problems about children born in this country being benefited by its social infrastructure, then you must write your congressman and ask him to work on changing the Constitution. There are countries in Europe where such right is denied to children born from immigrant parents (Germany for instance). You may not agree with me and we may never drink pina colada our get caught in the rain, but it is obvious that denying citizenship to babies born in this country would make the assimilation and integration of immigrant children impossible into our society, creating a caste system that would go against the principles America was founded upon.
U.S. LAW
written by u.s a. # ...1, February 25, 2007
anyone entering the u.s. illegally or remaining in the u.s. illegally is subject to immediate Deportation... fraudelent documents is punishable with prison ,fines , and deportation...assisting ,harboring, employing, are felonys ...
...
written by bo, February 25, 2007
...
written by Alex, 2007-02-25 00:52:44



I agree with pretty much everything you said in that post alex, with the exception of I don't think it would be the "collapse" of the agro and construction sectors, matter of fact, it wouldn't be possible to collapse the construction sector simply by the withdraw of a certain group, naturally that industry/those industries would become much less cost effective and their end products much more expensive.

...
written by bo, February 25, 2007
Travel
written by Ric, 2007-02-24 19:42:49

Going to the states is no fun, even for someone with a USA passport. For a foreigner it must be awful. The airports are too full, the lines are too long, the airlines are often unhelpful.



I'll agree with you there 100% Ric. I travel to the states several times a year and it never ceases to frustrate and even disgust me at times the "paranoid" attitude they seem to be conveying to travelers. I understand that a lot of it is necessary, it just seems like there could be, or should be, a better way.
It's Easy
written by SAVY, February 26, 2007
If it us such a bad expereince, then just don't come here, go to Europe or Cuba or somewhere else. The ICE peronnel in points of entry are trained to be thourough and acurate. Tough s**t if it takes you a little time to get through the immigration line, we need to make sure your not planning to wrap a bomb around you and blow yourself up in some mall, also that if you come, you get your ass on a plane and go home. On the other hand, the immigration entry into Brazil is so easy, I just smile for the camera, give em my thumprint (yea like it really means anything) say bom dia and I'm out, I might stop to chat with those hot Duty Free gatas. They know I'm going home, who the hell is going to stay for good in a craphole like Brazil. Then the entry back in the US...easy, I get in the US citizen line breeze through and get a good laugh at all the crying old ladies and kids they are taking back to "The Room" for secondary interviews...God it's great to be an American. Don't they all wish they could be...oh and as far as the US Embass, I'm glad the treat Brazilians who want Visa's like crap, it makes them think twice about coming here.
Bo
written by SAVY, February 26, 2007
You and Ric continue to be disgusted, who gives a s**t anyway, I don't care if it takes you all day and you are treated like Osama Bin Laden or a couple of mutts. There are people in the world wishing us harm and your inconvience is a very small price to pay. The best advice is to not come at all, we already have about 10 million of you here illegally anyway, you and your Canadian buddy can stay right were you are. It's time to turn of the facuet, both legal and illegal...even tourism, I'm glad it harder than ever to get a Visa, the lines at Disney need tp be shorter anyway, and we sure don't need you $$$ to fuel our ecomony as you need ours.

Welcome to the US...now go home!
...
written by hypocritals, February 26, 2007
I wish that what the rednecks Americans want come true and no amnesty meaning deportation happens. the illegal immigrants leaving your territory and you having no baby sitter to watch your children and to be explored... Your economy will certainly be harmed and inflation or a much more modest style of life will knock American doors.
SAVY
written by Ric, February 26, 2007
Is your name but Slow on the Uptake is your game. If you will read carefully, I am an American, born in Long Beach, California. Doesn´t mean I can´t spot inefficiency when I see it.
SAVY
written by A brazilian, February 26, 2007
I think the same, it would be funny to see all illegals to be deported from the US. It would be a situation to be observed and studied, what the impact in the economy would.

Are you the one talking about racism in the other thread? Another dumb american.
Difference
written by SAVY, February 26, 2007
There is a big difference between racism and being against illegal immigration. Our failed polices of the past are finally being addressed and the fact that a couple of people are whinning about how they are treated when they try and obtain a Visa and come to the US just don't count high on the sympathy meter. Again, they Brazilians seems to feel they should be treated differently than other visitors, but they are no different than any other nationality. The Brazilian is quick to call others "dumb" but most of his arguments are shallow and not well thought out, typical Brazilian ideology. Do us all a favor, go to Europe or Canada any quit whinning.

Ric, I grew up in Manhattan Beach right up the street and also recognize ineffeciency. Perhaps things can be done better and more efficent, but for now, ICE needs to be very conscious of who come in to our country and even more, that they leave when they are supposed to...so a little inconvience is a very small price to pay, an hours delay or so id no big deal...in fact I would like to see more people discouraged from visiting.
...
written by bo, February 26, 2007
Bo
written by SAVY, 2007-02-25 19:59:30

You and Ric continue to be disgusted, who gives a s**t anyway, I don't care if it takes you all day and you are treated like Osama Bin Laden or a couple of mutts. There are people in the world wishing us harm and your inconvience is a very small price to pay. The best advice is to not come at all, we already have about 10 million of you here illegally anyway, you and your Canadian buddy can stay right were you are. It's time to turn of the facuet, both legal and illegal...even tourism, I'm glad it harder than ever to get a Visa, the lines at Disney need tp be shorter anyway, and we sure don't need you $$$ to fuel our ecomony as you need ours.

Welcome to the US...now go home!


Savy, ditto what Ric said, I'm an american, born and bred, if you would've read my posts from other threads you would clearly see that. And although you are correct in regards to some wanting to do us harm, don't let some use 9-11 to turn our country into a police state. Although I agree with the last sentence in your last post, I also would like to see less immigration, especially illegal.
...
written by bo, February 26, 2007
...
written by hypocritals, 2007-02-25 21:21:29

I wish that what the rednecks Americans want come true and no amnesty meaning deportation happens. the illegal immigrants leaving your territory and you having no baby sitter to watch your children and to be explored... Your economy will certainly be harmed and inflation or a much more modest style of life will knock American doors.


Hypocritals, you talk as if that americans have had the style of life they've had over the last 60 years because of illeal aliens. Wake up son! Illegals were NEVER a "huge" problem until the last 15-20 years, and we did quite nicely without them before, but thanks for your concern. A "few" american may have to make some small adjustments, afterall, the illegal population only makes up approximately 2.5% of the total population, but imagine the adjustments the illegals will have to make after they're shipped back home to their third world countries.
Murdering Brazilian Illegal Immigrants using Framingham as a hideout
written by bo, February 26, 2007
February 19, 2007
Murdering Brazilian Illegal Immigrants using Framingham as a hideout

Read this interesting little tidbit from the WCVB-TV News that reveals that federal immigration authorities have arrested their third Brazilian murderer in Framingham since 2005. Vander Pedro Silviera was convicted of a 1999 murder in the Brazilian city of Tarumrim and has since been living in Framingham, Massachusetts. How lovely.


Have you ever seen the end of a Superbowl game when the winning quarterback is asked “Now that you have won the Superbowl what are you going to do?” and the quarterback responds “I am going to Disneyworld”. All I can imagine is that in Brazil when murderers are asked “Now that you have been convicted of killing another human being what are you going to do?” they all must answer “I am going to Framingham, Massachusetts”.


Any politician that turns the other cheek to the mounting problem of illegal immigrants in this country is acting with reckless abandon. Clearly the message has been sent to countries as far away as Brazil that the USA, and perhaps specifically Massachusetts, has become a safe haven for people who wish to run from the law. The fact that in the single community of Framingham immigration authorities have caught their third Brazilian murderer is astounding. I congratulate the authorities and ask that the politicians that wish to use the murderers as political leverage to cry racism and class warfare reconsider the implications of their actions. Many, not all, of these illegal immigrants are killers, rapists and law breakers that are hiding from the law. It is time to round them up and send them home.


Please do not give them the chance to kill again in OUR communities before taking action. If they will kill in Brazil they will kill here. Furthermore, do not be fooled by Deval Patrick's assertion that this fine young man was only here to get a job - a job that an American refuses to do. No, this man was a killer and he was hiding from the law in a place now known as a safe haven for illegal immigrants.


http://gopnews.blog.com/Illegal Immigrants/
Boston
written by GTY, February 26, 2007
Both Framingham and Sommerville are completly Brazilian communities dominated by poor and uneductaed Brazilans who are a complete drain on local resources...many of the people that have illegally immigrated there are criminals who must leave Brazil or be killed for their drug and gang affiliations. In fact, both these areas are rife with Brazilian fugatives, traffickers and the makes of illegal documents, it is well known for $5000 you can get an almost perfect green card and drivers license. But the good news is ICE has increased it presence their and local law enforcement no have the legal ability to enforce immigration law. Many more Brazilians from the Boston area are headed back with free trips home.
...
written by bo, February 26, 2007
It's ridiculous we've allowed this problem to get to the depths it has. Truly shameful. At least it "appears" as if we're finally starting to do something.....hope it continues.
SAVY
written by A brazilian, February 26, 2007
You sound pretty much like a stereotype, you seem to believe everyone in the world is "dying" to go to the US. I couldn't care less about you, the US or visas, I only get it when I have a good reason to. And, yes, the same way I would complain if the service of a store or company was bad, I do complain that their services are bad. You simply suck.

As I stated in some previous post that you probably didn't read, this innecficiency, and outright disrespect, in the US consulate seems to be more like a threater to make american bigots to believe their government is doing something. If they really wanted to make illegals to stop going to the US they would start taking measures to combat the demand for cheap labor in the US and to dismantle international gangs that traffic people through the border. What does it change? What does it solve?

Incompetence or unwillingness, pick what you would like to believe the most.

Unfortunately for people like me, we don't have much of a choice in going to the US or not, it's going to depend on other things. But I have decided to go there only when strictly necessary, because it's simply ridiculous what you have go through in the consulate to get a visa. Yes, I happily spend my tourist money in Argentina or Europe, but I won't give a cent for tourism in the US.
go to the brasilian embassy
written by forrest allen brown, February 26, 2007
go to any embassy any where and you get a dog and pony show .

look how many people from south amercia and mexico are not given a visa to brasil .

when i was in Trinidad to get my visa for my boat and myself , the embassy sent someone down to insepct at my boat .
i had to show proof by title no big deal , charts paper ones no big deal ,
pay for cab fare to and from the boat , lunch ,the cd he used to document all the things i had on my boat , and $100 us for the okay , on top of the $100 for the visa

brasilian at least you give to the us toursim .
it is not taken from you like when you come to brasil
can,t you take a hint....
written by u.s a. # ...1, March 01, 2007
STAY HOME,....your cousin is returning soon.....
...
written by hypocritals, March 01, 2007
There is a big difference between racism and being against illegal immigration. Our failed polices of the past are finally being addressed and the fact that a couple of people are whinning about how they are treated when they try and obtain a Visa and come to the US just don't count high on the sympathy meter. Again, they Brazilians seems to feel they should be treated differently than other visitors, but they are no different than any other nationality. The Brazilian is quick to call others "dumb" but most of his arguments are shallow and not well thought out, typical Brazilian ideology. Do us all a favor, go to Europe or Canada any quit whinning.


I am not whinning about not getting an American B1 tourist VISA. I've already got a still valid one with 10 years limit and If I wanted I might get another one in the first try again. I couldn't care less about the American visa. I am actually interested in visitng Canada in North America.

A Trip to the American Consulate
written by Ric, March 01, 2007
I went in yesterday. They were friendly and called me by name. They gave me a cup of Brazilian coffee. My business was taken care of promptly and efficiently. They said my new passport would be ready in three weeks and indeed it was.

By contrast my Brazilian ID took 8 months. But I´m not blaming the people there. Evidently there was a change in suppliers in Brasilia, the people who make them, guy got sick or something, didn´t catch it all but it was definitely not their fault. They were very cordial.
...
written by bo, March 01, 2007
But I´m not blaming the people there. Evidently there was a change in suppliers in Brasilia, the people who make them, guy got sick or something, didn´t catch it all but it was definitely not their fault.



It never is Ric, it never is.


The beatiful thing about living in brazil, no one ever does anything wrong, hence, there's never a need to say, "I'm sorry."
Sorry
written by Ric, March 01, 2007
No word for the concept in Tupi-Guarani.
Ric
written by A brazilian, March 01, 2007
Nice made up story.
Not Made Up
written by Ric, March 01, 2007
Both experiences are absolutely true. I was surprised to see the big differences in the new US passports, virtually fraud-proof. And since you questioned me, I was also surprised to see that my new carteira is absolutely like the old one, they will not stand up to any kind of rough handling, the PF admit that, the printing sloughs off internally after awhile. Plus a little bit larger than any of the other cards in a wallet, which means corners go first. Have it color copied 90% and embossed. Will pass anything except actual entry and exit from Brazilian soil.
Ric
written by A brazilian, March 01, 2007
The treatment you described is nowhere close to what we see to get a Visa in the US consulate. Nobody offers us coffee or anything of what you said.

I can only assume you are joking. One of your not funny jokes.
HOW MANY TIMES
written by Ric, March 01, 2007
Do I have to say it, it wasn´t a joke, I went the the PF and got my new carteira lat week, and to the US consulate and got my new passport this week, three weeks after turning in a form, a fee, and three photos. Does denial and suspicion spread to everything you get involved with?
Ric...
written by bo, March 01, 2007
Abe just can't believe it. He thinks that HIS experience is THE experience of everyone. Yet when we get poster, after poster, after poster, that states something about brazil that isn't blowing sunshine up your ass, they're a "hate-filled bigot".
Bo
written by Ric, March 01, 2007
What Abe can´t grasp is that I am not lying. Some activities are wrong. Some are short-sighted. Like embezzlement, lying is both wrong and short-sighted.

I kid around, obviously over the top, but I won´t lie. There are people on several continents who read this blog and know exactly who I am. If I make a personal statement that´s purposely inaccurate, I´ll hear about it sooner or later.

Abe loves the word, "bigot". It´s his "housewares".
Ric
written by A brazilian, March 02, 2007
The way the US consulate is structure and how an interview is done make it impossible for people to have offered you coffee, and if they called you by your name it was no different than a bank teller, because the interview is done with you standing up in the other side of security glass while in front of everybody.
...
written by bo, March 02, 2007
Abe loves the word, "bigot". It´s his "housewares".


I've noticed that.
...
written by Ric, March 02, 2007
Embassies and consulates are there mainly to further their own national interests and serve their own people. That´s true for the US Consulate on Woodrow Wilson in Rio and for the Brazilian Consulate on Wilshire in L.A. While you´re at the latter, drop by The Grove on Fairfax.
Too much nonsense
written by Fair, March 02, 2007
This is too much nonsense for a very sensible article. A lot of this forum is just so biased, people just don't seem to see what has been pointed by the author. And I agree with the person upthere who stated that if the immigrants coming by the thousand to the US everyday were all white, they wouldn't be making such a fuss. They need them and they resent them. Well, they also fear that Mexicans will take their part of the country back. Well... not just what once was their country. In new York, for instance, you hear a lot of Mexicans saying they don't need to learn how to speak English, because New York speaks more Spanish than English and the city will soon be taken over by the Spanish people. And if anyone asks 'and where will the Americans go?' they will simply say 'To hell.' This is one side. There is the other side of all the Mexicans who have moved to the US, and go back home with enough money to make a better life for themselves right there. And still others who acculturate so well that they make a good life for them right here in the US. In short, it's the difference that education makes... but the article is simply asking for more respect with Brazilians in American consulates. And this is fair to ask.
BRAZIL # 2 VIOLATER !!!!
written by all american, March 02, 2007
STOP THE TRAFFICKING OF ILLEGAL ALIENS FROM BRAZIL TO THE U.S.A... STOP ISSUING TOURIST VISAS TO PEOPLE WHO INTEND TO COMMIT CRIMES IN THE U.S...TAKE BACK YOUR ILLEGALS IN THE U.S.......
THE LAST LAST LAST WORD
written by all american, March 02, 2007
VISA DENIED !!!!!!!!
No, the real last word
written by Ric, March 03, 2007
Is the new article from the Ambassador citing numbers which invalidate the premise of the article at the top of this page.
And for you, Clara
written by Ric, March 03, 2007
How could Sobel have been an "anonymous entrepreneur"?
And
written by Ric, March 03, 2007
If he were, how would his name have been on a list?
...
written by bo, March 03, 2007
Guess you got Clif's attention Clara, want to explain the flawed premise of your article??


Would you rather wait a few extra days, or even a couple more weeks, and get approved, or a real fast denial?
WHERE'S CLARA???
written by bo, March 03, 2007
Clara ??????
written by cold as I.C.E., March 04, 2007
In america .... But really not.....
Clara?
written by Ric, March 05, 2007
Whenever I heard that name, I think "Clarabell". She was a cow, dated Goofy.
...
written by Mrs.S, March 06, 2007

I was reading Ambassador Clifford Sobel's letter responding to this article and I just had to read it. Oh my, I thought I was going to face something really critical, negative and all I saw was criticism on how things are being conducted these days in the American Consulates in Brazil. As an American with Brazilian relatives, I synpathize 100% with what has been said in this article. It is true that the process is not only slow, but the criteria is hard to read. Because there are cases and cases and the particularities of each case should be considered. It is unconceivable that a relative cannot come to the US for a visit, being denied a visa. It is also unconceivable that a spouse can't bring a spouse in. What kind of world is this? And if the Brazilian press criticized our Ambassador because he hasn't changed things, they are entitled. As Americans, we must stop thinking that no one can criticize us, because we criticize, we are free to do it, and we should take criticism with the same freedom and dignity as we exercise it.
Mrs. S...
written by bo, March 07, 2007
what planet are you on?? You talk as if people from other countries don't criticize the U.S. and americans arent accustomed to this...PLEASE!!

And, as an american, with brazilian family, including children, you can't tell people in brazil to bring documents 1,5,7-D, and 5-C and they will get their visa. Do you know why? Because Brazil is the #1 country in the world for falsification of documentation! It doesn't matter if they would have the documents that were required or not, they'd soon have them!

Why don't you take a look at brazil's immigration policies in respect to foreigners, americans included, and tell me which you think is unfair? And also, please try to keep in mind that the U.S. does currently have 12-20 million illegal aliens in our country, which approximately 1 million are brazilian.
...
written by A brazilian, March 07, 2007
Because Brazil is the #1 country in the world for falsification of documentation!


Any evidence?
what is true or rela in brasil
written by forrest allen brown, March 07, 2007
yes but would you think they were fals also .
Shut up.. Piece of s**t!!!
written by A Mexican., March 19, 2007
Mr. BO: you are a such ridiculuos person!! You want to see the laws being respect in your country but don't give a s**t to other contrie's law. If not, just ask to the majority of iraquian people if they want to see you there. Have you entered that country with a visa? Or with at least a passport? And to finalise: how about haf mexican territory that you people took from the Mexicans? Want to discuss this matter? The mexicans have all rights to go back to Texas, California, Arizona, Oregon... Think twice before opening your big mouth...

Write comment

security code
Write the displayed characters


busy
 
Joomla 1.5 Templates by Joomlashack