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Lula Lets Brazilians Down by Failing to Exercise His Authority PDF Print E-mail
2007 - April 2007
Written by John Fitzpatrick   
Monday, 02 April 2007 11:38

Disgusted passenger in Brazilian airportUnder article 42 of Brazil's constitution, the armed forces "based on hierarchy and discipline" come under the "supreme authority of the President of the Republic" and servicemen are banned from joining a labor union or going on strike.

On Friday March 30 a group of around 120 air traffic controllers in Brasilia, most of whom were air force sergeants, announced that they were going on a hunger strike and starting a sit-in as part of a campaign for better working conditions. The men's superior officer warned them that they could be arrested for mutiny. Within hours controllers all over the country stopped work.

They allowed planes which were in the air to land but prevented any other planes from taking off. The action affected over 60 airports and over 1,000 flights. Passengers were treated with contempt by the controllers and the authorities and once again Brazil's image in the world was tarnished.

Any move to arrest the sergeants was vetoed by President Luiz Inacio Lula da Silva who was on route to the United States at the time. He ordered a negotiated settlement and, after the government agreed to hold talks with the controllers on April 3, the flights started again. By acting more like the trade union organizer he used to be than the commander-in-chief he now is Lula took the easy way out.

We should not be surprised since this lackadaisical approach was the hallmark of his first mandate and will continue in this one. In fact, Lula could easily have used his trade union credentials to crack down in this case since they give him a credibility that no other president would have.

Flying has become a nightmare in Brazil since a mid-air collision last September between a passenger jet and a private plane which led to over 150 deaths. The accident highlighted the failings of the air traffic control system. Since then the air controllers have reduced the number of flights they handle for safety reasons and carried out a number of actions including working to rule.

Brazil has around 2,400 air controllers, the overwhelmingly majority of whom are air force personnel. This is because the monitoring equipment is used for civil and defense purposes. All controllers are subject to military discipline and one of their demands is for the system to be handed over to the civil power.

The government has already called for the system to be changed but, as this would need a change in the law, any alteration is more likely to be made through a provisional decree signed by Lula.

At the same time, many senior air force officers are against any change saying that the monitoring equipment is essential for defense purposes. The Aeronautic Club in Rio de Janeiro, which represents reserve officers, has threatened to take legal action against Lula for not disciplining the "mutineers" and for trying to demilitarize control of Brazil's air space.

This mixing of civil and military matters complicates the issue and, considering that the armed forces handed back power to civilians just over 20 years ago, raises unpleasant memories. While the armed forces have behaved in exemplary fashion since the return to democracy there are still remnants of the old mentality around, particularly among reactionary groups like the Aeronautic Club. This mistrust led to the ousting of the civilian defense minister, Jose Viegas, in November 2004 when he became involved in a public disagreement with senior officers.

By failing to punish those who committed these latest acts of insubordination Lula has let the military down and weakened his institutional position. The air force now says it wants the "mutineers" out of their quarters within 45 days. How this will be done is a mystery but we are now entering a stage in which we can expect more confusion and chaos in the air rather than less.

John Fitzpatrick is a Scottish writer and consultant with long experience of Brazil. He is based in São Paulo and runs his own company Celtic Comunicações. This article originally appeared on his site www.brazilpoliticalcomment.com.br. He can be contacted at jf@celt.com.br.

© John Fitzpatrick 2007



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Comments (75)Add Comment
...
written by simpleton, April 03, 2007
"The accident highlighted the failings of the air traffic control system. Since then the air controllers have reduced the number of flights they handle for safety reasons and carried out a number of actions including working to rule."

The highlighting is most unfortunate and also being miss-cast to at least some degree. Working to rule was an obligation those men supporting their superiors and the Brigs should have always been doing - it is contrary to their dedication and duty to have been doing otherwise. I don't believe that any but a few have made such mistake. At this point, pushing to immediately move to private / commercial control is not in Brazil's best interest. This will come with time but now is not that time.

Is their an offer for immediate intensive training for estangeiros to at least come try to pitch in and help?

...
written by João da Silva, April 03, 2007
By failing to punish those who committed these latest acts of insubordination Lula has let the military down and weakened his institutional position. The air force now says it wants the "mutineers" out of their quarters within 45 days. How this will be done is a mystery but we are now entering a stage in which we can expect more confusion and chaos in the air rather than less.



Yes, it is sad that the President undermined the authority of the General Officers of FAB. Of course, the Minister of Defense was not a big help either. The minister reminds me of ex SecDef of U.S. All the officers of Pentagon wanted him to get out and he really didnt want to. A similar situation prevails here too. Even the Union of the Air Traffic Controllers dont want this Defense Minister.But he wants to continue.You cant argue with a guy like him about anything,because he is always right.

Hope the sergeants will get a better pay after being unionized and if they are not happy, they could go on hunger strike again. Good luck to them .

Separation of systems in interest to country.
written by aes, April 03, 2007
The supplying of the equipment and the construction of its infrastructure is something the U.S. would have an interest in facilitating. It is self evident that there needs to be a separation between military and private air space. The military ultimately under authority of the President has ultimate authority. Barring such exigencies it is necessary to separate the two sectors.
THE SAD TRUTH BEING......
written by ch.c., April 04, 2007
.....no one govern the country !
.....nothing is done to prevent crimes, insecurity, corruption, slavery, tax evasion, impunity.
.....despite 14 interests rates cuts, Brazil has still the World Highest Interests Rates.....after inflation, and still a low economic growth rate. Doing worse...is thus very diffcult !!!


In Brazil there is no accountability, and few of the written laws are applied !

Common sense simply doesnt exist !

Yessssssss Brazil is a in a state of total anarchy !
I Laugh When I read : Is their an offer for immediate intensive training for estangeiros to at least come try to pitch in and help?
written by ch.c., April 04, 2007
In my view it should read : Is their an offer for immediate intensive training FROM estangeiros to at least come try to pitch in and help ?

Because lets face it, YOUR INSTRUCTORS ......ARE ALSO SOMEWHAT RESPONSBILE FOR THE LACK OF ATC SKILLS !!!!!! Simple as that !!!!!
the truth
written by barbosa, April 04, 2007
the truth is ,the air controllers are civilians,a litle time ago on the 80s,the sector was transformed in a military sector,is because of this and just because of this,they stops the work,the brazilian army never joining a labor union and never make a strike.thath civilians with military status dont have a military mind they are civilians,one of cvonditions to begin work is "a non military status".and for you know,it is a democratic country let them think free.wath you expect form lula^?maybe you hope lula says "put this traitors on the jail!!!!"but he not nake this.everibody think with me(a leftist go out the country,the rigth wing rules the country and say "put this traitors on the jail" the president outside the copuntry say come back with this order i will not gona put people in the jail,because hes a former union leader ,he is a politician and he knows the air controlers are conducted by other forces, he makes wath we expect form a leader,now he will training more people to be air controler,ON MILITARY RULES ,WITH THE ARMY ON CHARGE because if we not have other team to substitute the air controlers the confrntation is noth the path .no one will die because lost the fligth,on the other side we never have a airport closed by winter conditions on brazil i alway see on tv year by year on us and canada ,europe on the winter the weather conditions close many airports.and thepresident never arrests someone elses.
barbosa...
written by bo, April 04, 2007
scribbling with crayons on the walls of caves!
To Barbosa
written by ch.c., April 04, 2007
Hopefully you understand the differences between a bad WEATHER....and bad WORKERS !!!!!!
Bad Weather cannot be controlled where it snows.
Bad Workers cannot be controlled in Brazil.

End results : both close their airports !!!!!!

But please please dont mix up MOTHER NATURE AND HUMAN NATURE !!!

Smile
CH.c
written by A brazilian, April 04, 2007
So you didn't hear about the blitz the police that arrested thousands of people? So you don't hear about the many operations the federal police does? So you don't know even basic stats about brazilian economy?

Everyone, laugh... laugh... laugh at this retard.
TO: A Brazilian
written by João da Silva, April 04, 2007
So you didn't hear about the blitz the police that arrested thousands of people? So you don't hear about the many operations the federal police does? So you don't know even basic stats about brazilian economy?





This Ch,C is getting into my nerves. He doesnt seem to appreciate anything about Brasil.I bet he is a bank clerk in some obscure bank in Switzerland.He is so bitter about Brasil. A self claiming pseudo economist. If I were you, I would ignore him.
Chuckit Cheezey
written by simpleton, April 04, 2007
chchch - You read all to closely and hear all too little. If you gnu skat you'd not have pushed the FROM issue. I give, I never take. Peculiar things you learn to get along with folks that aren't anything like what you grew up knowing. You say they are all kniving theives corrupt to thier core. Maybe some, certainly you have to watch your wallet and everything else but with a little time to look and listen closely you'll find there is something much more valueable to live and learn.

Heard there are vagas in Rio and Sao Paulo re: controle de voos commercial, Need a new job / new vocation. Ric - any chance you or folks you know can help me link in - like to work about five years more. Perks are I'll try to set up Mode-S equipment aquisitions and do custom integration / installation designs to replace your out dated Mode C's.
Change is good!
written by Professor, April 04, 2007
In my point of view, it is good to see this anarchy! It means that times are changing.
The old elitist empires are falling (Varig for example) and are making way for 20th and 21st century business models. More people are flying these days in Brazil due to lower airfares, the infrastructure needs to catch up to this fast paced change.
Like a domino effect Brazil is becoming more competitive within itself, allowing
other income levels to participate in society.
Perhaps I will soon be able to stand in a line at the bank ATM and not see the frustration of an illiterate person try to figure out how to use the ATM?
Perhaps the elitist era is fading away and soon educating the public to be sucessful will be the next revolution?
Professor
written by A brazilian, April 04, 2007
Not sure what your complaint with ATMs are, they are simple and modern in Brazil. In the other hand the american ones look scarily primitive.
AB normal
written by Professor, April 04, 2007
Professor
written by A brazilian, 2007-04-04 11:20:05

Not sure what your complaint with ATMs are, they are simple and modern in Brazil. In the other hand the american ones look scarily primitive.


In the other hand? You festering twat..In English use: "on the other hand"
Professor
written by A brazilian, April 04, 2007
I guarantee that my portuguese, spanish, german and latin are much better than yours will ever be.
AB normal
written by Professor, April 04, 2007
Professor
written by A brazilian, 2007-04-04 13:28:55

I guarantee that my portuguese, spanish, german and latin are much better than yours will ever be.

I agree with what you said, according to your good name!
The simplicity of the English language, however is another story, ne?
AB normal
written by Professor, April 04, 2007
Found a video of you in your English class..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qCyZV0GZfHU
TO: A Brazilian
written by João da Silva, April 04, 2007
I guarantee that my portuguese, spanish, german and latin are much better than yours will ever be


You just confirmed what I have been suspecting for a long time. Especially about your knowledge of Latin.I bet you speak Italian and French too.BTW, I replied to your question in another theread,if I am in Rio. I said no and explained about my whereabouts!

Herr.Professor,in general, lots of knowledgeable Brazilians are proud of ourselves and our accomplishments. But we do appreciate constructive criticizms. To put up with turkeys like Ch.C is not easy as nothing we do seems to be acceptable to him and people like him are chronic grumblers.On the other hand, people like "A Brazilian" can truly work to build our country. BTW, you promised to better your Portuguese accent and not to imitate Sobel. I hope you are working hard on it smilies/grin.gif
Professor
written by A brazilian, April 04, 2007
I am fluent in english, you aren't fluent in portuguese. I probably know more about english than the majority of americans in here, maybe even more than you.
AB etter tomorrow..
written by Professor, April 04, 2007
I am fluent in english, you aren't fluent in portuguese. I probably know more about english than the majority of americans in here, maybe even more than you.

Nice that you can make statements such as this AB normal. I imagine you speak like Siri on BB7.
"Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak out and remove all doubt"
http://www.imagensdokibe.blogg...aziu67.jpg



On the other hand, people like "A Brazilian" can truly work to build our country. BTW, you promised to better your Portuguese accent and not to imitate Sobel. I hope you are working hard on it

I am not sure what he is building? Maybe this .......http://www.imagensdokibe.blogg...aziu53.jpg

Like AB normal said: "you aren't fluent in portuguese" as if he knew me??
But it is true, but you can be sure, the little I do say in Portuguese does not sound like Mr. Sobel.. For me this an accomplishment! Also for safety reason I do not wear a tie also!
TO: Herr.Professor
written by João da Silva, April 04, 2007
The old elitist empires are falling (Varig for example) and are making way for 20th and 21st century business models. More people are flying these days in Brazil due to lower airfares, the infrastructure needs to catch up to this fast paced change


You are wrong.I presume that you came to Brazil very recently. To call Varig ,Transbrasil,Telebras,etc; as old elitist empires is not correct.Varig was one of the best International (and domestic) Airlines I have flown. Transbrasil is another doemstic airlines that was very good (though I didnt get to fly their international routes).I really didnt care much for VASP. However, all three Airlines used to charge the same or less airfares than GOL (in U$) and still provide top class in flight services.

BTW, Fontana, the founder of Transbrasil and Helio Schmidt of VARIG were great thinkers and contributed a lot to the Commercial Aviation of our country. The same thing applies to our Air Force brass that created Telebras,Embraer,etc;.

Professor, please do not call these companies elistist empires.
Thanksgiving
written by Professor, April 04, 2007
To put up with turkeys like Ch.C is not easy as nothing we do seems to be acceptable to him and people like him are chronic grumblers.

Sounds like a description of my first wife, who is British.
TO:Professor
written by João da Silva, April 04, 2007
Sounds like a description of my first wife, who is British.


Ah, I understand and am happy to know she is now your ex wife. A long time ago, I had a British girl friend.Wasnt easy to deal with her either.Last I heard about her was about 10 years ago and she was still single.
Fly the friendly skies.
written by Professor, April 04, 2007
You are wrong.I presume that you came to Brazil very recently. To call Varig ,Transbrasil,Telebras,etc


Actually I have flown on the above mentioned Airlines and all the rest. I have visited over 70 cities in Brazil since 1998. I have personally booked all my flights, so I am aware of the pricing differences. Varig has always been the highest in price.

Professor, please do not call these companies elistist empires
.
I did not call the companies you mentioned elitist. I only referred to Varig.

The model that Gol/VARIG is now using is what other countries have been using for a long time now, a proven model. A model affordable to larger classes of people.

BTW, Fontana, the founder of Transbrasil and Helio Schmidt of VARIG were great thinkers and contributed a lot to the Commercial Aviation of our country.

No doubt they were great thinkers for their time. However times have been changing.

Excluding portions of the population limits the consumer base. The very idea that GOL is using is to increase it. The elitist prefer to exclude rather than to increase.
Damm...
written by Brasilianischen, April 04, 2007
This A Brasilian guy says good things sometimes, but sometimes he acts like child, that "my english is better than yours" is really something...
Pub Crawling
written by Professor, April 04, 2007
Ah, I understand and am happy to know she is now your ex wife. A long time ago, I had a British girl friend.Wasnt easy to deal with her either.Last I heard about her was about 10 years ago and she was still single.

British women cause British men to spend long hours at the pub! If you marry a British woman it is best to live next to a Pub, if there is not a pub nearby, forget about it! I took mine to the U.S. ,after about 8 years, she had the attitude of an American and a British woman, sort of like brewing Tea with Tequila.
Best to leave them like you found them, single!!!
Brasilianischen
written by A brazilian, April 04, 2007
When that happens I am just following the level of the messages. Professor's message was ridiculous, my reply was at the same level.
In my other hand?
written by Professor, April 04, 2007
When that happens I am just following the level of the messages. Professor's message was ridiculous, my reply was at the same level.

Damn I thought that was what I was doing!
A.Brazilian: Delusions of fluency
written by AES, April 04, 2007
You are not fluent in English (you did not capitalize it) nor did you capitalize Portuguese, as well as Americans: and it is not 'in here', but on here, or just here (as it is self evident that on here is means here). You are a petty pendant.
TO:Professor/Fly the friendly Skies
written by João da Silva, April 05, 2007
Excluding portions of the population limits the consumer base. The very idea that GOL is using is to increase it. The elitist prefer to exclude rather than to increase


Thanks for reminding me of this. Do you think that the reason Swiss Air went kaput was because it was also an elite Airline? May be Che.C was the CEO of that airline.Quite possible that he didnt want to sell tickets to the Brazilians.What surprises me is that with all his cleverness, Che.C couldnt save Swiss Air.

You would be surprised to know that I have heard similar complaints about Lufthansa too.
AES
written by A brazilian, April 05, 2007
1- can you please explain how not capitalizing a word will influence your ability to communicate an idea to another person or to be able to understand it?
2- this is a forum, not a book, so small typos aren't important. In the case of books, the work is reviewed by more than one person in order to guarantee that there won't be gramatical errors.
3- you will find worse errors in the messages of native speakers, such as changing "their" by "there" or "you are" by "your".
AB normal
written by Professor, April 05, 2007
1- can you please explain how not capitalizing a word will influence your ability to communicate an idea to another person or to be able to understand it?

Put it this way, you will not be able to hide the fact that you learned English from
another Brazilian.

3- you will find worse errors in the messages of native speakers, such as changing "their" by "there" or "you are" by "your".

Common mistake made by natives (not paying attention) and rarely made by those using English as a second language.

"In one hand" however is a gross error, because it is a translation from Portuguese to Bantu.

Um chopps, olhos azul, quatro pão etc.
Kaput
written by Professor, April 05, 2007
Thanks for reminding me of this. Do you think that the reason Swiss Air went kaput was because it was also an elite Airline?

From what I just read, no. Looks like they over extended themselves.

The "Hunter Strategy"
In the 1990s Swissair initiated a large expansion program known as the "Hunter Strategy" in which it aimed to grow by buying small airlines instead of forming alliances. It acquired 49.5 percent of Sabena, the Belgian national airline, and bought important stakes in several minor airlines like Air Liberté, AOM, Air Littoral, Volare, LOT, Air Europe, TAP Portugal, Turkish Airlines, South African Airways, Portugalia and the German holiday carrier LTU.

The financing of the Hunter Strategy proved too costly, and coupled with increasing losses in their investments, Swissair parent SAirGroup faced a cashflow crisis. This was partly due to the slump in demand following the terror attacks in the USA on 9/11. On October 2, 2001 the entire Swissair fleet was grounded.[1] Many blamed the largest bank in Switzerland, UBS AG, for the fiasco, because UBS refused to extend Swissair's line of credit. The day after the grounding, demonstrators could be seen carrying reading "Bin Ospel" (referring to Marcel Ospel, the UBS chairman) and "UBS = United Bandits of Switzerland".

TO:Herr.Professor
written by João da Silva, April 05, 2007
"UBS = United Bandits of Switzerland".



You are one hell of a SOB of an American.Unfortunately, the world tends to streotype all the Americans,like they do with we Brazilians. There are good Americans and bad ones too. The same thing applies to the Brazilinas. What really pisses me off m are the people like this idiot Che Guverra from Switzerland who know everything .

BTW, I dont know the real name of "A Brazilian",but he seems to be a patriot and I do appreciate it. I would appreciate if you guys could listen to him more.

Thank you Herr.Professor. Dont talk about those British women. They dont know how to cook nor f...k. They cant even make a decent cuppa of tea.
...
written by bo, April 05, 2007
written by João da Silva, 2007-04-04 22:03:09

"UBS = United Bandits of Switzerland".



You are one hell of a SOB of an American.Unfortunately, the world tends to streotype all the Americans,like they do with we Brazilians. There are good Americans and bad ones too. The same thing applies to the Brazilinas. What really pisses me off m are the people like this idiot Che Guverra from Switzerland who know everything .

BTW, I dont know the real name of "A Brazilian",but he seems to be a patriot and I do appreciate it. I would appreciate if you guys could listen to him more.



Wow Joan, I was giving you respect until that last statement. Abe Razillion Deniar has lied in this forum, time and time again, he has called other people liars repeatedly, but never proved them to be, yet his lies have been pointed out time and time again. He has called americans racist and has said that racism doesn't exist in brazil, and then immediately after he calls a black american a n****r!

Kind of hard to respect a person such as this.

More reality denying idiots not accepting responsibility for anything and blinded by patriotism is the last thing brazil needs.
Uma coisa é uma coisa, outra coisa e outra coisa
written by MS, April 05, 2007
To defend Brazil against morons like Ch.c I can understand, but....
a) the air controllers acted as criminals
b) VARIG caused a lot of damage to Brazil and to brazilians
Professor
written by A brazilian, April 05, 2007
I think I have spoken more english with natives than with other brazilians. But you know what, you are the monolingual here so I am sure your opinion is higher than anybody else's, isn't it? You know everything about languages, so much that you know that you don't need to know them.
A.Brazilian: FLUENCY and temerity.
written by AES, April 05, 2007
It was you that conjectured that you were 'fluent' in English. One of the effects of fluency is that the reader does not think you to be, or your ideas to be without merit. You are judged by your mastery, or fluency of the language. It is multi dimensional. At certain levels you and your opinion will be dismissed as irrelevant as a consequence to fail to Capitalize (having that knowledge) or using an incorrect pronoun ie. 'I put it ON the refridgerator instead of IN the
refridgerator. There errors you make in English determine your LEVEL OF FLUENCY. To state that you are FLUENT in English is presumptuous. You are between 2 and 3 in your fluency.

To make four errors, three in capitalization, and one in infinitive useage in 27 words is hardly FLUENCY. It is a second or third degree of fluency. Then to have the presumtion, the temerity to flaunt that you are FLUENT is nothing but ignorance masquerading as arrogancy. "I am fluent in english, you aren't fluent in portuguese. I probably know more about english than the majority of americans in here, maybe even more than you." The errors that you make make the statement inherently false.


It you were writing to an academic ie. graduate or post graduates you would be thought a fool, by the errors that you made, regardless of the content. You would be dismissed as irrelevent regardless of the thought. So if you wish to be regarded as credible, all of the elements of grammar (spelling, punctuation, grammar, etc) become part of the meaning of your meaning. And the determining factors of your degree of FLUENCY in English.


SCORING RUBRIC FOR WRITING: TheTeachersCafe.com
Conventions and fluency: Grading
1.There are few or no errors in punctuation, capitalization, grammar & spelling.

2.There are a few errors in grammar, spelling, punctuation, and capitalization.

3.Errors in grammar, capitalization, punctuation & spelling are more frequent.

4.There are many errors in grammar, spelling, capitalization, and punctuation.

5.The errors in grammar, capitalization, spelling punctuation & interfere with understanding.

TheTeachersCafe.com
AB normal
written by Professor, April 05, 2007
I think I have spoken more english with natives than with other brazilians.

"I think" is the keyword here, as you have transposed many of your thoughts hither and fro, however you still have not come to many conclusions based on facts. You show a diminished capacity to come conclusions based on your own experience.
But you know what, you are the monolingual here

Since we are writing on this site in English, we are for the most part being monolingual. However, I have included links to Brazilian sites on this site, if you had the capacity of reason, you would note what is not apparent to you now.
so I am sure your opinion is higher than anybody else's, isn't it?

This is a tag question being that you included a tag question at the end of sentence.
My answer is: no. But I do suggest the inferior feeling that you posses would have
found solace if I were to have answered, yes. If I was to conclude, which I will not, that you formed this question beforehand, assuming that my answer would be: yes, then you would have found solace in your demential reasoning.
You know everything about languages,

Here you attempt without success to project on me, what you earlier attempted to convince others concerning yourself.
so much that you know that you don't need to know them.

In your conclusion here, you reflect what a learned reader would understand as more to being a truth related to the writer. However the substance of your inference reflects that the writer strives to be preeminent in languages and in being so would mask his inadequacies.
Ab Normal Modus Operandi
written by Professor, April 05, 2007
Your intellect is like a mouse in the maze of your brain, after exhaustively attempting to reach the end and in your exhaustion, you pause to reflect and you realize that you have always known where the end lies. Boldly you then go direct to the cheese as your reward, and then enter your rest.
A.Brazilian: I meant 'preposition' not 'pronoun' desculpa
written by AES, April 05, 2007

FLUENCY: to understand and be able to use the following you could be said to be fluent. Ironically even if one were fluent it wouldn't mean they had anything to say.
1.
a. The study of how words and their component parts combine to form sentences.
b. The study of structural relationships in language or in a language, sometimes including pronunciation, meaning, and linguistic history.
2.
a. The system of inflections, syntax, and word formation of a language.
b. The system of rules implicit in a language, viewed as a mechanism for generating all sentences possible in that language.
3.
a. A normative or prescriptive set of rules setting forth the current standard of usage for pedagogical or reference purposes.
b. Writing or speech judged with regard to such a set of rules.
4. A book containing the morphologic, syntactic, and semantic rules for a specific language


1. grammar - studies of the formation of basic linguistic units
2.syntax - studies of the rules for forming admissible sentences
3.morphology - studies of the rules for forming admissible words
4.descriptive linguistics, synchronic linguistics - an explanation of a person's mastery of the native language
5.head word, head - (grammar) the word in a grammatical constituent that plays the same grammatical role as the whole constituent
6.quantifier - (grammar) a word that expresses a quantity (as `fifteen' or `many')
7.grammatical category, syntactic category - (grammar) a category of words having the same grammatical properties
8.subject - (grammar) one of the two main constituents of a sentence; the grammatical constituent about which something is predicated
9.object - (grammar) a constituent that is acted upon; "the object of the verb"
grammatical constituent, constituent - (grammar) a word or phrase or clause forming part of a larger grammatical construction
10.clause - (grammar) an expression including a subject and predicate but not constituting a complete sentence
11.article - (grammar) a determiner that may indicate the specificity of reference of a noun phrase
12.modify, qualify - add a modifier to a constituent
13.parse - analyze syntactically by assigning a constituent structure to (a sentence)
14.agree - show grammatical agreement; "Subjects and verbs must always agree in English"
15.dynamic, active - expressing action rather than a state of being; used of verbs (e.g. `to run') and participial adjectives (e.g. `running' in `running water')
16.stative - expressing existence or a state rather than an action; used of verbs (e.g. `be' or `own') and most participial adjectives
17.active - expressing that the subject of the sentence has the semantic function of actor: "Hemingway favors active constructions"
18.passive - expressing thatthe subject of the sentence is the patient of the action denoted by the verb; "academics seem to favor passive sentences"
19.attributive, prenominal - of adjectives; placed before the nouns they modify; "`red' is an attributive adjective in `a red apple'"
20.predicative - of adjectives; relating to or occurring within the predicate of a sentence; "`red' is a predicative adjective in `the apple is red'"
21.coordinating, coordinative - serving to connect two grammatical constituents of identical construction; "`and' in `John and Mary' or in `John walked and Mary rode' is a coordinating 22.conjunction; and so is `or' in `will you go or stay?'"
23.subordinating, subordinative - serving to connect a subordinate clause to a main clause; "`when' in `I will come when I can' is a subordinating conjunction"
24.main, independent - of a clause; able to stand alone syntactically as a complete sentence; "the main (or independent) clause in a complex sentence has at least a subject and a verb"
25.dependent, subordinate - of a clause; unable to stand alone syntactically as a complete sentence; "a subordinate (or dependent) clause functions as a noun or adjective or adverb within a sentence"
26.descriptive - describing the structure of a language; "descriptive linguistics simply describes language"
27.prescriptive, normative - giving directives or rules; "prescriptive grammar is concerned with norms of or rules for correct usage

A.Brazilian: Fluency cont.
written by AES, April 05, 2007
27.prescriptive, normative - giving directives or rules; "prescriptive grammar is concerned with norms of or rules for correct usage"
28,endocentric - fulfilling the grammatical role of one of its constituents; "when `three blind mice' serves as a noun it is an endocentric construction"
29.exocentric - not fulfilling the same grammatical role of any of its constituents; "when `until last Easter' serves as an adverb it is an exocentric construction"
30.finite - of verbs; relating to forms of the verb that are limited in time by a tense and (usually) show agreement with number and person
31.non-finite, infinite - of verbs; having neither person nor number nor mood (as a participle or gerund or infinitive); "infinite verb form"
32.syndetic - connected by a conjunction
33.asyndetic - lacking conjunctions
34.transitive - designating a verb that requires a direct object to complete the meaning
35.intransitive - designating a verb that does not require or cannot take a direct object
36.aoristic - of or relating to the aorist tense
37.nominal - pertaining to a noun or to a word group that functions as a noun; "nominal 39.phrase"; "noun phrase"
40.nominative - serving as or indicating the subject of a verb and words identified with the subject of a copular verb; "nominative noun endings"; "predicate nominative"

To:Bo
written by João da Silva, April 05, 2007
Wow Joan, I was giving you respect until that last statement


Thank you Bo for giving me respect until my last statement!

Regarding your views on " A Brazilian", I wouldnt go that far to classify him the way you all do. I would rather blame it on the "generation gap" between ours (at least mine) and his. I think our friend AES tried to explain this in one of his posts with the Freudian theory. I suspect that he likes to argue with you all for the sake of arguing!. I do not doubt that he knows several languages,especially Latin.

As for his using the N word to describe the blacks, he and AES helped me to clarify the issue. I am not very good in other languages,but let me try to explain in my own simple way. The word "N....r" is extemely pejorative in American English, but I think the word originally came from Latin and the Americans added another "G" to the word and over the years deemed it derogatory. Niger=Black , Nigeria=Blackland,The river Niger= Black River,etc;The word Niger is pronounced as "Nyger" in Englsih,while we say "Nijer". Of course, people like AES,Professor,you can add more clarifications on my interpretations. I think that the right way to refer to the black people in U.S and Brazil is to use the word "Afro-Americans" and Afro-Brazilians".

As for his claim that racisim does not exist in Brazil, I would rather contest and not agree with him. It does and the current high unemployment rate in Brazil has made it worse.I know how it is in the part of Brazil you live nor the refgion where "A Brazilan" lives.In the South it does exist and a few years ago, when I was running a company, I had to confront this among my emplyoees. A white supervisor chose a Black computer programmeron her merits and she immediately became the target for jokes of her colleagues.It came to a point that the working environment was becoming intolerble.When I came to know this, I had to intervene and threatened to fire a couple of people. The happy ending was that after a few months, the black kid got an offer from another company that doubled her salary.Before she left she made it a point to thank her supervisor and me for being "color blind".Another point of interest to note is that there were not any senior executives in any companies that I used to visit.Of course the situation may be different in the part of the country where "A Brazilian" lives.
To:Bo/Sorry
written by João da Silva, April 05, 2007
I know how it is in the part of Brazil you live nor the refgion where "A Brazilan" lives
.

Sorry,it should read "I DONT know how it is in the part of Brazil you live nor the region where "A Brazilan" lives"
...
written by simpleton, April 06, 2007
The (in)credible A brasilian IS "dismissed as irrelevent regardless of the thought" most often. There's not much contributed other than refuting, denying, unfounded accusations fired off in retrobutive rebuttal to what other's have pointed out as observed from thier own perspectives and experiences there. A little less tendancy to fight with fire due ones personal perception of being fired upon first is in order. (But AB can neither take nor give orders lest he fall lower and take that job at the McD's to have his fanny chased about all shift long by the superior manager.)
okay
written by forrest allen brown, April 06, 2007


Technorati Tags: institutionalised irrationalities coincidentally disintegrating infrastructure transformation 'regularising' characterized circumstances contraception

are all to be see on thies forms so if all you have to complain about is spelling and grammer , and word usage than you have a very good life ,

A.Brazilian and the origins of A.B. Normal
written by AES, April 06, 2007
A B Normal is a joke from the movie comedy 'Young Frankenstein'. Igor is sent to acquire a brain for the 'Monster' and when the 'Monster' begins to act irrationally Frankenstein asks Igor what did it say on the glass that contained the brain. Igor responds A.B. NORMAL not realizing that it had indeed said ABNORMAL, thus the joke. Mel Brooks is a very funny writer/director.

See 'Blazing Saddles', it is a lesson in understanding the American psyche. The town needs a new sheriff, turns out the sheriff is Black and the town somewhat biased, cannot believe that the sheriff is a 'Niiiiiii' they never finish the word. Then the yiddish speaking Indians attack the sheriff and speaking yiddish, subtitled, the chief says to his braves 'there blacker than us' and tells him to 'cop a walk'.
AES
written by Professor, April 06, 2007
A B Normal is a joke from the movie comedy 'Young Frankenstein'

And I was wondering all this time if I was the only one laughing about this.
Nothing like eating beans with friends around the campfire!
Forrest: No its not about grammar it about pretentious people
written by AES, April 06, 2007
I dont care about how you write, but the content of what you are writing. I find pretention annoying, people calling other people names, bragging about how they are more fluent in English than some one else, 'nit pickers', 'put down artists'. This is a forum written in English for the most part by non native speakers. That in itself is extraordinary, who can write to any degree in a second language? It must be respected, the extraordinary effort that has been taken. It is the pseudo-intellectual arrogance, that I find obnoxious.
This forum has provided me with an opportunity to see inside Brazil, my Portuguese is essentially 'obrigado or desculpe'. 'And Skol por favor.'




...
written by simpleton, April 06, 2007
Don't be complaining about Forrest. He's dead on most of the time and clearly understood for those that haven't a care whether his caps lock key is stocked anywhere in any hemisphere.
A.Brasilian aka simpleton
written by AES, April 06, 2007
Au contraire, monsieur. I like Forest, I found him honest, genuine and without pretense. How you concluded from what I wrote that I did not is incomprehensible.
...
written by bo, April 06, 2007
As for his using the N word to describe the blacks, he and AES helped me to clarify the issue. I am not very good in other languages,but let me try to explain in my own simple way. The word "N....r" is extemely pejorative in American English, but I think the word originally came from Latin and the Americans added another "G" to the word and over the years deemed it derogatory. Niger=Black , Nigeria=Blackland,The river Niger= Black River,etc;The word Niger is pronounced as "Nyger" in Englsih,while we say "Nijer". Of course, people like AES,Professor,you can add more clarifications on my interpretations. I think that the right way to refer to the black people in U.S and Brazil is to use the word "Afro-Americans" and Afro-Brazilians".


Well, for anyone that has any significant knowledge of english whatsoever, as Abe Razillion certainly claims to have, even more knowledge than many native speakers according to him, then he should well know that calling a black person the "N" word in english is one of the most discriminatory and hate-filled words in the english language in which an excuse in its use simply doesn't exist.

Regarding your views on " A Brazilian", I wouldnt go that far to classify him the way you all do. I would rather blame it on the "generation gap" between ours (at least mine) and his. I think our friend AES tried to explain this in one of his posts with the Freudian theory. I suspect that he likes to argue with you all for the sake of arguing!.


I know numerous agrumentative people, both brazilians and americans, but the type of person Abe Razillion is a one of complete hypocrisy. He calls other liars, doesn't prove them to be, and then he blatently lies and it is proven. He calls other countries racists and then calls someone a n-i-g-g-e-r? He twists, he torts, and he lies. But I can understand why he has to resort to these types of measures, afterall, most of the time he's trying to justify or defend the unjustifiable or the indefensible, terrible realities that exist in brazil or the immoral behavior of many, in particular the leaders, in brazil.

Whatever happens, don't accept responsibility, don't apologize for anything. Blame it on the U.S., the E.U., or the portuguese and the way brazil was settled half a millenium ago. Lie, twist and tort, as long as you're denying and pointing a finger, or two or three.
AB normal
written by Professor, April 06, 2007
Origin of AB normal...

URL to 14 sec. sound clip..........
http://phattie.net/dawg_wavs/youngf/abbynrml.wav
"Would you mind telling me whose brain I did put in? And you would be angry? I would not be angry! Abby someone. Abby who? Abby normal. "


URL to 2nd 14 sec. sound clip..........
http://phattie.net/dawg_wavs/youngf/telling.wav
"Are you saying that I put an abnormal brain into a seven and a half foot long, fifty-four inch wide, gorilla? Is that what you're telling me? "
"Professor, AES and the rest of the gang of losers" and a note to João da Silva
written by A brazilian, April 06, 2007
I feel flattered that you are so worried in convincing the readers of this forum that I am not as good as I think I am. What I have written must have affected you somehow.

Thanks João da Silva. I never said racism doesn't exist, I only said this is not a racist society. Our values are not derived from some obsolete theories as it is the case in the US and Europe. We don't bother knowing "what someone is or is not" in our daily lives, nor accurately describing and creating divisions between the many definitions. We don't carry flags around and pretend to be "proud" of anything. The attempt of labeling Brazil as racist is an indication of some of their beliefs, not ours.

For example, most americans (and europeans) are unable to recognize anything good in Brazil or latin america in general, either out of patriotism (theirs is always better) or due to sheer ignorance. Latin america, and especially Brazil, is supposed to be the "bad example", something they can use to feel better about themselves. To say that Brazil is not a racist society is to recognize that this society is more advanced than theirs.

Another example is the "racial values" according to the US and Europe that are prevalent in their societies. Mexicans, brazilians, and latin americans in general are second class citizens in the US, retricted to a ghetto and expected to think and act in a certain way. It would be nice for the white supremacist mentality of some (or black supremacist, depending on the case) if latin americans "recognized" their "second class" status for the world also. Brazilians aren't limited in the matters of culture, if they could stop this "cultural orgy" and could define what belongs to you and what does not, wouldn't this be better?

This talk about "pride of one's origins" is a trap, because it destroys our national identity by segregating us and at the same time replaces our current values for international ones, where we will be eternally second class. Perhaps some americans get shocked when they discover brazilians don't act as victims the same way "other peoples" do in the US. Their position as "the perpetrator" is endangered.

You can notice the tone of respect for the might of "the perpetrator" in the many posts from self-declared black americans and in other articles written by activists on this site. It's something almost supernatural, with a mix of hate and love, the perpetrators have the power "to make black americans and other minorities to feel bad", but it doesn't work the other way around.

This is not a complaint, I am just stating the truth. It's necessary to understand how their minds work in order to know what not to eat. My origin is only one, I am brazilian. And as such it is my right to eat whatever culture I please!

But will you see cases of racism? Yes. But that's not enough to classify the entire society as racist. I have witnessed obese people being discriminated as well, and I bet homosexuals have a harder time than blacks in this country. The code "good appearance" for jobs automatically excludes obese people, not sure what kind of demented individual associated it with "no blacks". It means that the person must be "not poor, not fat, not ugly, without acne, not shy, etc".

And about the "niger" latin word, you are right. I am glad someone was capable of understanding it, the american word "n-i-g-g-e-r" is "niger" but mispelled, which is funny because it looks like someone trying to look cultured by using words from classical languages, but then they fail and end up looking less cultured than if they hadn't tried at all. Intelligent people is clear and simple in what they mean, after all simplicity is the ultimate sophistication.
...
written by Ric, April 06, 2007
The above writer doesn´t know what he is talking about. I would never attempt to lecture Brazilians on Rui Barbosa, and having some English as a Second Language person tell me about American English etmology doesn´t go down well.

The word referred to is a play on words involving the word for an African and the word "niggard" which means miserly. Also, before fiat currency, gold or silver coins were debased by scraping or shaving the metal, and the person that did that was a "niggard". There is an opprobrious connotation in the word itself.
...
written by bo, April 06, 2007
written by A brazilian, 2007-04-06 13:18:44

I feel flattered that you are so worried in convincing the readers of this forum that I am not as good as I think I am. What I have written must have affected you somehow.

Thanks João da Silva. I never said racism doesn't exist, I only said this is not a racist society.



OMG, you muther f**king liar!!! Do you want me to prove it?? You not only stated that racism doesn't exist in brazil, you stated it approximately 10 different f-u-c-k-i-n-g times!!!

Listen Abe Razillion liar piece of s**t, it's been crystal clear, for all to see, that there are at a minimum two people posting under the username "a brazilian", or is it "A brazilian"?

Do you want the quotes? They're on this site, it won't take much searching.



It's no use even responding to you, you've got some serious mental and emotional problems.
And...
written by bo, April 06, 2007
it doesn't matter the history of the word n-i-g-g-er! It's use, particularly calling a black person by this name, is one of the most predjudiced and hate-filled words that exist in the english language!!! And that's exactly what you did! You are no better than a card carrying member of the Ku Klux Klan!


And racism doesn't exist in brazil??? Oh, yeah, sorry, almost forgot. Now you're saying that it exits, but we can't "generalize" brazil as a racist country.


You m'fing piece of lying trash.
Bo
written by A brazilian, April 07, 2007
I must probably have said that saying that a country is free of racists is like saying that the country is free of a*****es. It's impossible. You will always find a*****es, the same way you will always find racists, but the question is if "race" is at the core values of this country, and the answer for that is "no". Brazil is not a racist country. Saying that there's no racism here could be the equivalent of saying what I have stated previously, if you had the mind opened enough. I think any intelligent person can understand that the way I wrote things doesn't mean that you won't find a single case of racism among 180 million people, but that this is not an issue in this country.
...
written by Ric, April 07, 2007
Cagou o pau, abestado azuado.
...
written by bo, April 07, 2007
written by A brazilian, 2007-04-06 22:18:30

I must probably have said that saying that a country is free of racists is like saying that the country is free of a*****es. It's impossible. You will always find a*****es, the same way you will always find racists, but the question is if "race" is at the core values of this country, and the answer for that is "no". Brazil is not a racist country. Saying that there's no racism here could be the equivalent of saying what I have stated previously, if you had the mind opened enough. I think any intelligent person can understand that the way I wrote things doesn't mean that you won't find a single case of racism among 180 million people, but that this is not an issue in this country.



Listen jackass, I realize that you are A Brazilian II, but you need to get your facts straight with A Brazilian I, in which he said that "racism doesn't exist in brazil", not once, not twice, but time after time. As far as having an open mind, I try my best, I attempt to give the benefit of the doubt to everyone I encounter. When people here in the northeast of brazil do or say things that are utterly and completely, 1000% ignorant, immoral, disrespectful, etc, etc., I search for excuses as to why they have said or done those things, for justifications, maybe it is something cultural. But unfortunately, in my experience, it just comes down to a lack of education, or ignorance, or just a plain lack of respect for anyone or anything that is so common in this region of brazil where I live. So please, don't give me this "open mind" horses**t. When someone states in writing time after time, that "racism doesn't exist in brazil", that is exactly what we understand him to mean. That racism simply doesn't exist in brazil. Now you attempt to say that you meant something else, now you're generalizing your statement, you could've done that originally at least once in the at least 15-20 previous statements you made.

BTW, still trying to justify calling Historian a n****r?
Bo's right even if offensive to some
written by simpleton, April 08, 2007
AES - you will forgive me. It's only a subtle probattive tactic I learned from others I've seen practice it in here. Yes, I stated what you indicated or meant exactly in opposition (but not in opposition to some other im posters). Anyway, now at least I'm sure you are not Ab III. Sorry if you found the test method uncomfortable or disconcerting.

Being that we appear to have totally lost focus on the article and have gotten down to the bo, bo, abe, PT, abe, bo phase, let's hope some other non-tragic but newsworthy article comes out on the site soon.
@ bo
written by Dana, April 08, 2007
Personally it is irritating the treatment Brazil receives through generalizations (stereotyping) as a Brazilian. Amazing all the discussion on the racism topic and all some (or many) people conclude here is that Brazilians state Brazil does not have racism and that A Brazilian did that. Duh!!! What do you think? No, individuals in Brazil are highly evolved and people do not use color as an excuse for their lack of accomplishment!! This is meant to be ironic; nobody ever said that on this site. I’ve read some interesting past discussions and not once A Brazilians states there is no racism in Brazil. I did read many posters attacking him arguing that with his answers and argumentation he was declaring that there is no racism in Brazil. People need to stop distorting meanings and reading what is not written there. Cultural baggage should mean a lot to people who deal in international contexts! The expression cultural baggage in English means a tendency for one’s culture to pervade the thinking according to wikipedia. So I would say that much of the interpretation made here about A Brazilian’s statement is completely wrong. I picked quickly an excerpt that can work as a backup to what I’ve just said.

...
written by A brazilian, 2007-01-11 10:58:49


I can tell you that the average white family is as racist or more racist then here in the USA.


This is like saying "In France there are many a*****es, I have been there for 39 years". Of course you will find such things, but it's a completely different matter than say that the country is full of it.

By my experience the people that are like that are either underachievers or empty minded people that look ugly, and none of those ever posed a threat to me, I just avoid them. People with little to be proud in life grab themselves to such stupid things because they have nothing else.

Why would anyone bother about that instead of having a successful life it's beyond comprehension, unless the person that is bothered about it is also underachiever or empty minded.



continues
written by Dana, April 08, 2007
written by jabmalassie, 2006-12-25 19:26:10
Brazil has alot of racism. The general black population do not have the self pride in their African Roots as say the U.S.A. or Jamaica. I don't think blacks want anything for free in these countries any more than whites. The colonizers have been taking the labor of the people for free for hundreds of years. The industries want cheap labour from the underclass. If they don't have anything to offer they the government fails to recognize them. I wonder if those poor favelas have internet connections in their schools. They now find it impossible to get the skills and resources because they are out of the starting block a couple of hundreds of years late. You have the Oprah Winfrey's and other black millionaires in the U.S.A. Brazil doesn't have that. No self awareness. This guy who wrote this story probably bought his P.H.D. off the internet

Personal attacks
written by A brazilian, 2006-12-26 10:11:10
It's sickening to hear people that probably never set foot in Brazil to promote this hatred view of the world, of racial segregation. I think the brazilian population is being underestimated in its ability to think, this week I saw on TV a black girl saying that she doesn't want to fight anybody and that we are all brazilians! Thank God the population is not taking this crap seriously


Here, when A Brazilian say the black girl states ‘we are all Brazilian” he, and she as well, don’t mean by that there is no racism in Brazil, it means we, white, black, yellow, brown, cafezinho, indians, etc, etc, Brazilians are all Brazilians and one shouldn’t need a greater intellect to know that this is true and that this statement does not eliminate racism in Brazil
...
written by Dana, April 08, 2007
I don’t know about the black descents which come to this site and say most mulattos are not proud of their color because of all the expressions it is used to refer to their shades, such as moreno or pardo. So, it is a case of product of racism one refer to himself/herself as moreno, pardo, bonbon black, milk with coffee instead of only mulatto? Previously, someone stated that that are 300 descriptions of skin color in Brazil as if this was a sign of racism. I ask if languages must be confined benefiting utilitarian uses in bureaucratic environments. Brazilians are very spirited, love to laugh. Bo completely misses here cultural features of Brazil which makes him conclude it is a racist country. For example, the expression “ter um pé na cozinha” (to have a foot in the kitchen). Does this sound racist? Maybe depending on your cultural background. Brazilians grow up knowing one way or another that blacks were enslaved in the past. They learn through one single history class at school or through music, novelas, Brazilian movies, a children seriado ‘sitio do pica pau amarelo’ displaying an old black woman cooker in the house. One way or another they know blacks once worked in the sugar cane fields and inside the master’s casa grande (mansions) as servants. That’s an explanation to the expression. Do the black descents in Brazil use this expression to refer to their own mixed race? Yes, and it is a spirited expression. Someone else also stated that Brazil posses racial harmony as long blacks remain in their places, it is statements like this that cause confusion because they are dishonest; if it’s an opinion it should be stated as an opinion not as a fact or else this person should have prove jis/her point.

I’ve also seen that a Janer Cristaldo’s article entitled: The Mulatto is proof Brazil Has No Racism provoked much confusion. It was stated here before that the headlines heat the discussions. It would be interesting to talk to the site’s owner when one find the headlines having correlation with the article or even if it is the author’s opinion, in Cristovam Buarque texts the headlines are not original but edited.
...
written by Dana, April 08, 2007
Ph.d my a.ss!
written by Eliza Cabreira, 2006-12-23 22:17:06
For a supposedly educated man he holds very little forsight.He's views are outrightly prejudice!His very reasoning is the very reason Brazil has a black conscience day!Ask him how many black people you evers ee on TV in Brazil or why so many black people live below the povery line,or better yet why most of the street children slaughtered every year are of obvious black descent...bet he wouldn't have an answer


I would ask anyone who thinks just like this poster to stop and think a little if the non appearance of blacks in the Brazilian TV could be a case of social exclusion, i.e., many blacks don’t have an artistic education or even some formation to act on TV.


It seems to me A Brazilian understands racism as segregation, isolation, separation.
...
...
written by A brazilian, 2007-02-07 15:39:45And yes, the idea from american blacks is segregation, they would like blacks in Brazil to be considered completely separated from the brazilian culture. So they could have someone to demonize as the cause of their problems, label things like afro-this or afro-that, give identities and stereotypes people could use (taking away their responsability from building up themselves).

No, I think you are confused. I call racism the very action of believing in races and promoting a racialized culture.


I do find that a Brazilian is fair. He’s truly admirable and many foreigners are losing a great opportunity to understand a culture such as the Brazilian through this English speaking link that also is knowledgeable on the cultural differences between both Brazilian and American cultures.
...
written by bo, April 08, 2007
written by Dana, 2007-04-08 01:50:13
This is meant to be ironic; nobody ever said that on this site. I’ve read some interesting past discussions and not once A Brazilians states there is no racism in Brazil. I did read many posters attacking him arguing that with his answers and argumentation he was declaring that there is no racism in Brazil. People need to stop distorting meanings and reading what is not written there.



Damn Dana, the only ones that are distorting anything here are YOU and A brazilian! EVERYONE here that has been posting consistantly over the last couple of months has seen A brazilian makes not one, not two, but at least 10-20 posts stating, and let me quote, "racism does not exist in brazil"! Or, "we do not have racism in brazil"!

I could go back through the articles and easily find at least several occassions where he stated this, quote them and post the url. Now the question is, do you want to continue denying this so I can prove you to be a liar also? Everyone here knows, everyone here read what he wrote, time after time, and then in short order calls Historian a ni-gg-er.....nothing more needs to be said for him and his type. And it appears that you are trying to not only distort what occurred, but attempting to justify his behavior. Dana, if you know the meaning and history of that word and it's usage, particularly in north america, if you are familiar with the english language, then you well know that there is no excuse for that type of behavior.
Went halfway through...
written by bo, April 08, 2007
one thread and found him stating it twice, and that was in only one thread, the very first one I looked at concerning race. Do you know how many articles were posted on this site about race written primarily by Mark Wells within a 4-6 week period?? If I went through them all I'm quite certain I could quote at least 15 different occasions, if not 30, where Abe Razillion Liar stated that racism doesn't exist in brazil.


http://www.brazzil.com/content/view/9805/1/


We are?
written by Ric, 2007-03-01 13:49:11

Who´s "we"? ANd if as you affirm, there is no racism in Brazil, that would include myself as well, since I am in Brazil. By your definition, we expat Americans cannot be racist since there is no racism IN BRAZIL. Man, getting some things into your skull would probably take a marreta e talhadeira.

Funny Thing
written by Ric, 2007-03-01 12:15:19

That blacks themselves almost invariably confirm the fact that racial prejudice exists in Brazil. The ones denying it are not those actually being discriminated against.

...
written by Thaddeus Blanchette, 2007-02-22 15:29:18

A recent Veja poll clocks in 87% of respondents agreeing with the statement that Brazil is a very racist country.

I have lived in the U.S. and Europe, Brazilian. I'm wondering what, exactly, your definition of "racism" could possibly be for you to claim that it doesn't exist in Brazil...?


Racism is in the US, not here
written by A brazilian, 2007-02-20 21:08:22


Brazilians don't know what racism is. If they knew anything about all the racial myths and racial culture of the US and Europe, of really taking seriously the Aryan tale plus lots of other pseudo-scientific ways of exclusion (Italians aren't white because are mixed, portuguese aren't white, spanish aren't white, etc) they wouldn't say so.

The first time I saw racism with my own eyes was the first time I went to the US, it's really shocking.

written by A brazilian, 2007-02-15 18:42:59
There's no racism in Brazil.
You were the one that called the rest of this country vicious, and that Sao Paulo was better than anyone else, and still want to call others racist? I think you are the one that is racist, it's in your mind.



smilies/sad.gif
...
written by Dana, April 08, 2007
written by bo, 2007-04-08 05:01:37


written by Dana, 2007-04-08 01:50:13
This is meant to be ironic; nobody ever said that on this site. I’ve read some interesting past discussions and not once A Brazilians states there is no racism in Brazil. I did read many posters attacking him arguing that with his answers and argumentation he was declaring that there is no racism in Brazil. People need to stop distorting meanings and reading what is not written there.



Damn Dana, the only ones that are distorting anything here are YOU and A brazilian! EVERYONE here that has been posting consistantly over the last couple of months has seen A brazilian makes not one, not two, but at least 10-20 posts stating, and let me quote, "racism does not exist in brazil"! Or, "we do not have racism in brazil"!

I could go back through the articles and easily find at least several occassions where he stated this, quote them and post the url. Now the question is, do you want to continue denying this so I can prove you to be a liar also? Everyone here knows, everyone here read what he wrote, time after time, and then in short order calls Historian a ni-gg-er.....nothing more needs to be said for him and his type. And it appears that you are trying to not only distort what occurred, but attempting to justify his behavior. Dana, if you know the meaning and history of that word and it's usage, particularly in north america, if you are familiar with the english language, then you well know that there is no excuse for that type of behavior.


I see nothing of what you stated proving me as distorting things here. I’ve seen the discussions about the n****r word, and if the guy says he did not intend to offend I take his word. It is highly ironic you accusing him when yourself called me an ignorant slut. When questioned, you excuse yourself saying it is joke from Saturday Night Live program in the 60s’, 70s’ When I ask, how was I supposed to know it is a joke towards me without having the same cultural background than you, you simply state I am not supposed to know. If I am not supposed to know then it is not meant to be a joke to me, therefore what you called me was exactly what you said. You don’t know who I am, even if you know my IP number or my email address, or maybe you have met me due to work relations. Even if you have heard of me, still you don’t know me. Now, I would like to know your real identity. Giving me your personal phone number doesn’t explain much, now does it? How about your full name?
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written by Dana, April 08, 2007
I’ve seen you don’t want to accept what A Brazilian understands as racism. It is well explained on the threads we both placed here.

1)Someone says:
“I can tell you that the average white family is as racist or more racist then here in the USA.”

A Brazilian replies:

“This is like saying "In France there are many a*****es, I have been there for 39 years". Of course you will find such things, but it's a completely different matter than say that the country is full of it.”

2)“Brazilians don't know what racism is. If they knew anything about all the racial myths and racial culture of the US and Europe, of really taking seriously the Aryan tale plus lots of other pseudo-scientific ways of exclusion (Italians aren't white because are mixed, portuguese aren't white, spanish aren't white, etc) they wouldn't say so.”

3)written by A brazilian, 2007-02-15 18:42:59
There's no racism in Brazil.

It is clear from the excerpts you picked up what A Brazilian considers racism. And he states, “Brazilians don’t know what racism is”.
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written by Dana, April 08, 2007
It is interesting go back to the racism issue. I was taking a look at Veja’s magazine last week’s issue, and found 3 articles/columns about racism in Brazil. One news on the African students in Brasilia capital who had their apartment doors burned in the student dormitory of the Brasilia University. I had the opportunity to hear about this incident here at this site first. Accusations of racism regarding the incident were made. I’ve got the magazine and I found out the vandalism was a result of a fight between 2 neighbors, an African student who used to hear zouk in the middle of the night and who won a fight against the other, and the Brazilian student, his neighbor who were annoyed by his music.

...
written by Dana, April 08, 2007
The other two articles refer to a recent polemic, the controversial statement made by Ministry Matilda Ribeiro for Promotion of Racial Equality in Brazil. She is responsible for the PT policy to implement the racial differentiation in Brazil under the explanation of reinforcing cultural identity of black communities and repair historical injustices. The magazine says that in a country with a strong mixed background it is very difficult to define which individuals integrate which race. In good moment, it is interesting read A Brazilian’s and Insight’s comments on racism under this light of current events in Brazil. Anyways, the polemic is determined by a statement made by the ministry to a BBC interview in the occasion of the 200 years of prohibition of black people traffic by England. She was asked if in Brazil, taking USA as example, black people are racists against white people: “It is natural when this happens. (…) It is not racism when a black person rebels against a white person. The reaction of a black not wanting to invite a white, or not enjoying a white, I find it a normal reaction, although I am not inciting this. But it’s a natural reaction because those who were whipped their whole lives are not obligated to like their whipper.” Andre Petry comments in his column: “(…) The ministry’s statement is absurd but at the bottom it’s understandable. Because everything links perfectly well within the racial program of Lula’s government. With its racial equality guidelines scandalously discriminatory, with its racial surveys in the schools, with the racial quotes in the universities, the government project is to force Brazil to renounce its pride of miscegenation –source of our entire creativity – to adopt an Americanized version of a bi colored country, black and white (…)” Veja April 4 2007.

To:Dana
written by João da Silva, April 09, 2007
I do find that a Brazilian is fair. He’s truly admirable and many foreigners are losing a great opportunity to understand a culture such as the Brazilian through this English speaking link that also is knowledgeable on the cultural differences between both Brazilian and American cultures.


I totally agree with you.I noticed that "A Brazilian" (if at all he is a Brazilian-because he reminds me of a Texan friend) knows several languages and the history of numerals. Sometime ago, he asked a relevant question: Could the people have gone to the moon by using just the Roman numerals?^. I went to Easter Sunday lunch today to socialize with lots of maths professors (including some gringos). I put forth the same question to them and they all said "NO". This guy is extremely inteligent,though I dont know which state he comes from or where he lives.

BTW, I dont think "A Brazilian" is xenophobic.He seems to be a nice and hospitable guy;You are right.The foreigners are missing a great opportunity to know him better.

As for Bo, I think he is another great character.He is merely expressing the frustrations of all the middle class Brazilians at the state of affairs in our country.Just remember that he has a business in Brazil and contributing to the welfare of his employees and hsi Brazilian family.You know as well as I do, it is very difficult to survive as a businessman in Brazil, with the government on top of you.

One foreigner that I cant stand in this forum is that idiot Ch.c. He has nothing good to say. I think you should target on that SOB.
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written by bo, April 09, 2007
...
written by Dana, 2007-04-08 16:12:54
Now, I would like to know your real identity. Giving me your personal phone number doesn’t explain much, now does it? How about your full name?



Dana, I've provided much more personal information on this site than anyone else here, certainly more than yourself. I gave you my phone number because you asked for it, then you didn't call. Figures.

If you want my name give me a call, I'll be glad to speak to you in an honest and frank manner.
...
written by bo, April 09, 2007
I see nothing of what you stated proving me as distorting things here. I’ve seen the discussions about the n****r word, and if the guy says he did not intend to offend I take his word. It is highly ironic you accusing him when yourself called me an ignorant slut. When questioned, you excuse yourself saying it is joke from Saturday Night Live program in the 60s’, 70s’ When I ask, how was I supposed to know it is a joke towards me without having the same cultural background than you, you simply state I am not supposed to know.


First, get your facts straight, I never stated that "you weren't supposed to know'. It was a joke, once again, matter of fact I even believe I stated, "Jane, you ignorant slut...", and I said "Jane", because when Dan Aykroyd did this weekly skit it was with Jane Curtain in which he was responding. Also, during that time period, you were "buddying up" with our ole pal "Anna", the brazilian stripper in Arizona. Real contribution to american morality that one.
DTHGJDGHJ
written by FHKHJK, May 01, 2007
i love canada. BRAZIL SUXXX!

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