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The Lula Paradox PDF Print E-mail
2011 - January 2011
Written by Ted Goertzel   
Friday, 28 January 2011 02:38

Lula in the arms of the people Eight years ago, Luiz Inácio Lula da Silva was inaugurated president of Brazil with a dramatic pronouncement that "change ... is the dramatic message from Brazilian society... hope has finally conquered fear and Brazilian society has decided it is time to blaze a new path." (1)

Lula has just retired with record popularity. The vast majority of Brazilians are happy with the path he blazed. But, paradoxically, the changes he brought about were modest. Lula seems to have understood that the change Brazilians wanted most was relief from change.

They wanted economic prosperity and were happy to share a bit of it with the poor. Beyond that, there was little demand for the reforms that both the Workers' Party and the Social Democrats had been advocating for decades.

On Sunday, December 19, 2010, the influential newspaper O Globo published a special section called "The Construction of the Lula Myth." (2) Its argument was summarized by one of the writers:

"President Lula ends his eight year mandate with popularity never before obtained by a president of this country despite a contradictory legacy. We did not have advances or improvements in education, health, public security, basic sanitation, infrastructure and reforms. What leaves me incredulous is that the people of a giant nation such as Brazil, the majority of whom are poor, would give up all these improvements in exchange for a basic food basket called the Bolsa Família.

"A government with 37 ministries and various secretariats did not succeed in advancing in anything. If it was a right-wing party that was leaving office, and a left-wing party was taking power, surely they would say that they had received a cursed inheritance..." (3)

O Globo's analysts relentlessly probed the flaws in Lula's claimed accomplishments. If the economy grew phenomenally in 2010, that was only because it had crashed in 2009. If Brazil grew an average of 4% a year during Lula's term, that was less than the average for Latin America during the same economic cycle, 4.64%. Despite his promises, the agrarian reform limped along slowly as it had before. Conflict in the countryside increased.

Lula formed political alliances with oligarchs such as José Sarney, the kind of leader the Workers' Party had always denounced. Despite his talk of building infrastructure, he left the highways, ports and airports close to chaos.

His Zero Hunger program degenerated into a permanent dole leaving the poor no escape from dependence on welfare. Worst of all, O Globo insisted, Lula maintained high interest rates and high taxes that would continue to burden the country for years to come since there was no social security or tax reform.

The Blog do Planalto fired back:

"Anyone who read the special section of the journal O Globo on the Lula Era will have no doubt; the management of the journal, its editors and analysts, are among the 3% to 4% of Brazilians who rate the Lula government as poor or awful.

"For them the approval of more than 80% achieved by president Lula and his government at the end of eight years in office is a mystery. Perhaps an illusion or a collective hypnosis which is keeping the public from perceiving reality. For O Globo and its analysts, Brazil advanced very little in the Lula Era, and the few advances have been in spite of the government and not because of its actions.

"As the president said on the day when he released the documents on his legacy, the press has no interest in the government's constructive actions, preferring to focus on the destructive. It falls to the government to document the positive. (4)

And document it they did. Lula's secretariat of communication released a massive six-volume collection called the Balanço do Governo 2003-2010 and Lula bragged about their accomplishments in a retirement speech on national radio and television. (5)

The list was long. The minimum wage increased 67%. Hydroelectric dams, petroleum refineries and new railway lines were built. Two million people got electricity, one million got new homes. New health programs were established, as were 14 new universities and 126 technical schools. Brazil paid off its debt to the International Monetary Fund and is now lending the fund money.

It was a fine list, but no more impressive than those listed in the similar volume the same bureaucracy prepared at the end of Fernando Henrique Cardoso's eight years in office. (6) Most of the accomplishments were continuous with programs the government had been working on before Lula took office. There was much steady progress, little dramatic change.

It is not only right-wing critics who are surprised by the lack of major structural reform by the Lula government. Leftist scholar Fernando J. Cardin de Carvalho argues that both Lula and former president Fernando Henrique Cardoso were weak leaders:

"There is a significant leadership deficit with respect to both the ability to formulate clear strategies and, consequently, to commit to them. In the case of Cardoso, this anomie seemed to be rooted in his theory of dependence.... In the case of Lula and the Workers' Party, the reasons for the absence of strategic thought are unclear... In the absence of clearly defined strategies, Lula's policies seem to have consisted mostly of surfing on the favorable winds of the international economy..." (7)

Carvalho is right that neither Lula nor Cardoso were the kind of "strong" leader who imposes radical changes on society. But his explanation for their supposed weakness is wrong. Cardoso's academic writings were about how countries could overcome dependency, not apologies for it.

Once in office, Cardoso formulated a clear strategy to end hyperinflation and stuck to it. Lula is a brilliant political strategist and organizer. His Letter to the Brazilian People made his political strategy in 2002 clear and he carried it out brilliantly. It is hard to think of two leaders better able to formulate a strategy and carry it out.

Why then the failure to implement the social security and tax reforms that both Cardoso and Lula believed the country needed? The weakness is not in the leaders but in the democratic system itself. Cardoso and Lula are very different personalities, but they both entered politics as part of a democracy movement and are committed democrats. A democratic leader cannot simply impose dramatic changes.

Cardoso was often stymied by opposition from the Workers' Party and others. Lula tried to implement many of the same reforms in his first two years, but he ran into opposition from public employees and from the left-wing of his own party, among others. He tried to get around legislative roadblocks by buying votes from his so-called allies. After the vote-buying scandal, he largely retreated from controversial reform efforts.

Critics are understandably disappointed that Lula and Cardoso didn't realize their visions. Carvalho is explicit about his expectations from a left-of-center government:

"Even a nominally left-wing government in a developing country should pursue at least four goals: full employment of labor; economic growth; income and wealth redistribution; and the empowerment of dispossessed groups, spreading out citizenship rights. A left-wing administration should not be 'generous'. On the contrary, it should advance a redefinition of duties and rights, redistributing power away from those used to rule towards those in position of subordination." (8)

Lula shares these four goals and made progress on all of them. The progress was not as rapid as he would have liked, but it compares respectably to that made by more dictatorial left-wing governments. The problem seems to be with what Cardin de Carvalho's calls Lula's "generosity." Lula's impulse is to get along with everybody. The radical left wanted him to berate the wealthy and powerful, as Hugo Chávez does. Lula preferred to cajole and persuade them, as Cardoso did.

For Lula, getting along with people from all walks of life is a matter of personality and philosophy of life, not political ideology. Lula's worldview is fundamentally Christian, not Marxist. This is obscured by the fact that he keeps his religious life private and respects the separation of church and state.

A Roman Catholic, he repeatedly emphasizes his appreciation of all Brazil's religious groups, including the evangelicals and the Jews. He chose an evangelical Protestant as his running mate. His is not a narrow, sectarian Christianity; it is a theology of compassion for other human beings. It is a philosophy that resonates strongly with the Brazilian people, and contributes much to his popularity.

Perhaps just as important as Lula's class or religious background is the fact that he was a mother's boy. He refused to model himself on his father who he viewed as a failure. Having a father who is a failure can have advantages in life; research shows that father failure is common in the childhoods of eminent people. (9)

Two American presidents, Barack Obama and Bill Clinton, were also angry and resentful of their fathers (or stepfathers) and had very close relationships with their mothers. Juscelino Kubitschek's father died when he was two, and he was raised by his mother.

Successful mother's boys learn to share their feelings and empathize with others, and develop practical skills in human relations and problem solving. Not having to compete with their fathers for their mothers' attention in childhood may help them build self-confidence. Not having to submit to their fathers' authority, or rebelling against it, may help them to move quickly through adolescence into career paths that suit their own talents and inclinations.

In Lula's case, his father returned to his life when he was nine and he had to deliberately rebel against him, with his mother's support. Lula is quite explicit about adopting a maternal model of leadership. In a 2010 campaign speech he said:

"The best example I can give of the art of governing is the art of being a mother. Governing is nothing more than acting like a mother taking care of her family, assuring everyone the right to have opportunities. Incidentally, the word "govern" is really wrong. I don't know which philosopher invented the word "govern," it should be "to care for" [cuidar]." (10)

According to the dictionaries, the word "govern" implies exercising authority and enforcing rules. This is a stereotypically masculine approach to life, ingrained in the legal and military training of most of Brazil's past presidents. Lula's style is the opposite of the "macho" style. He is a feminist, not just in ideology but in his personal style.

He freely shares tender feelings and is uninhibited about breaking into tears on public occasions. Lula did not get this style from his regional or social class background or from being raised in Brazil. He got it from his mother. He is not so much the son of Brazil as the son of a Brazilian single mother.

Lula promised "change" but he knew that the change Brazilians were tired of being told their institutions needed to be reformed, tired of losing the security of government jobs and early retirements, tired of hectoring from environmentalists and other activists. They wanted a president who was a cheerleader, not a critic.

They liked being paid in money that held its value and they wanted to enjoy spending it. It was Lula's good fortune to be elected at a point in time when the Brazilian economy could provide economic growth with some redistribution of income and without reigniting inflation. He seized the opportunity and took full credit for giving Brazilians what they wanted.

Far from being an agent of radical change, Lula was an agent of continuity with past presidents. As commentator Cesar Sanson observed:

"Lula is a mixture of policies that go from Getúlio Vargas, passing through Juscelino Kubitschek and the military presidents, until arriving at Fernando Henrique Cardoso. His government has developmentalist policies which remind us of Vargas, policies of favoring transnational capital that remind us of Kubitschek, policies that please the military such as rearmament, and the maintenance of Fernando Henrique Cardoso's macroeconomic orthodoxy. What we see are happy businessmen, even happier transnational capital, and the military the same. All of this is viewed by a perplexed political right and a national left without direction. (11)

Sanson was too kind to mention the corruption scandals, but these also remind us of past presidents, especially Collor and Kubitschek.

Almost two decades of effective presidential leadership have made Brazil a much better place, and the overwhelming popular sentiment is for continuity. But politics tends to be cyclical, and Brazil may be approaching a cyclical turning point.

Cristóvam Buarque, one of Brazil's most imaginative left-of-center politicians, believes that Brazil is finishing a cycle and poised to begin another. (12)

He calls the current cycle, which began with the transition to democracy and the stabilization of the currency, one of "timid social democracy."

He argues that the next cycle should be one of more aggressive social democracy to make politics less corrupt, build a high technology economy, promote equality of opportunity, and make the cities safer. If social democracy cannot do this, he believes, the next cycle could be either a swing to the right or a swing to populism.

Brazil has two strong social democratic parties still largely led by a generation of leaders who understand and share these goals. Rather than joining forces, however, these two parties, the Social Democrats and the Workers' Party, have allied with more traditional parties and retreated into what Marina Silva, the Green Party environmentalist, calls "unlimited pragmatism." She argues that:

"It is an irony of history. Two parties born to affirm the diversity of Brazilian society, to break the social duality existing at the time of their formation, have allowed themselves to be captured by the logic of the struggle between themselves...

"By leaving the umbrella of the Brazilian Democratic Movement, these parties enriched the Brazilian political universe by creating democratic alternatives based on strong personal histories [of the leaders] and collective political struggles and public ethics.

"Today, the subversion of these parties in the pragmatism of the old political logic makes it less likely that the country will be able to make the essential policy changes the country demands. (13)

Lula's successor, Dilma Rousseff, has expressed her commitment to leading a more active reform process to make the lasting changes that she agrees Brazil needs. Her party's dependence on the alliance with the Party of the Brazilian Democratic Movement, however, may make this difficult. The Social Democratic Party is reconsidering its strategies after losing the presidential election in 2010, and is also well aware of the needs for reforms.

It may be too much to hope that these two progressive, social democratic parties could join forces, but the Social Democrats in Congress cooperated with the Lula government on many issues, putting the needs of the country ahead of short-term partisan advantage.

Dilma Rousseff was part of this process when she was chief-of-staff, and she should be ready to continue to work with the Social Democrats and other progressive forces.

Oddly enough, it may be the editorial writers from O Globo, who, after reconsidering their own analysis, came up with the best summary of Lula's legacy:

President Lula should leave office satisfied with his legacy. In fact, he may not have done everything he should have done, but what he did qualifies him to enter into history as the president who raised the self-esteem of the Brazilian people. This says it all!...

It is clear that Brazilians of all income and educational levels and age groups massively approved of this government and its president. Considering that the mainstream press was consistently and strongly against him, a question cannot be ignored: can it be that these people have all been fooled and only the 3% or 4% who disagree have a monopoly on the truth? That is very pretentious. (14)

Lula chose to go into retirement with popularity ratings in the 80's rather than use his popularity to pressure for controversial reforms. He chose not to use his popularity to try to get the constitution amended so he could become one of Latin America's "presidents for life."

He realized that his policy legacy was one of continuity more than of change. He observed, realistically, that "the legacy of our government is the consolidation of social policies with economic growth in a solid macroeconomic situation." (15)

He was especially pleased that the country would be hosting both the Olympic Games and the soccer World Cup, and observed that Brazil had discovered that "there is no greater conquest than to recuperate the self-esteem of its people." (16)

Notes:

(1) "Discurso do Senhor Presidente da República, Luiz Inácio Lula da Silva, na cerimônia de posse," Congresso Nacional, 1 January 2003.

(2) "A Construção do Mito Lula," O Globo, Sunday, December 19. http://oglobo.globo.com/pais/mat/2010/12/20/especial-construcao-do-mito-lula-923329740.asp

(3) O Globo, "Era Lula," O Globo (Kindle edition), December 22, 2010.

(4) "Balanço da Era Lula no Globo: Olho torto entorta a vista, Blog do Planalto, December 21, 2010. http://blog.planalto.gov.br/balanco-da-era-lula-no-globo-olho-torto-entorta-a-vista/.

(5) Balanço do Governo 2003|2010. Secretaria de Comunicação Social da Presidência da República, 2010. http://www.secom.gov.br/sobre-a-secom/publicacoes/balanco-de-governo-2003-2010. Lula da Silva, Pronunciamento à nação em cadeia nacional de rádio e TV, por ocasião do final de ano," December 23, 2010. http://www.info.planalto.gov.br/static/inf_briefdiscusos.htm.

(6) Presidency of the Federal Republic of Brazil, Brazil: 1994-2002: The Era of the Real. Secretaria de Estado de Comunicação do Governo, Brasília, 2002.

(7) Fernando J. Cardim de Carvalho, "Lula's Government in Brazil: A New Left or the Old Populism?" in Arestis and Saad-Filho, op cit, p. 33.

(8) Fernando J. Cardim de Carvalho, "Lula's Government in Brazil: A New Left or the Old Populism?" in Arestis and Saad-Filho, op cit, p. 30.

(9) Victor, Mildred and Ted Goertzel and Ariel Hansen, Cradles of Eminence: Second Edition. Scottsdale, Arizona: Great Potential Press, 2003.

(10) Malá Menezes, "Lula fala em Deus e vingança no Piauí," O Globo, October 15, 2010. http://www.senado.gov.br/noticias/OpiniaoPublica/inc/senamidia/notSenamidia.asp?ud=20101015&datNoticia=20101015&codNoticia=481646&nomeOrgao=&nomeJornal=O+Globo&codOrgao=47&tipPagina=1.

(11) Cesar Sanson, "Governo Lula, de Vargas a FHC," Radioagência Notícias do Planalto, November 19, 2007. http://www.radioagencianp.com.br/index.php?Itemid=43&id=3352&option=com_content&task=view.

(12) Cristóvam Buarque, "O Ciclo Dilma," Blog do Noblat, O Globo, December 23, 2010. http://oglobo.globo.com/pais/noblat/posts/2010/12/18/o-ciclo-dilma-350289.asp.

(13) Bernardo Mello Franco, "Em carta, Marina acusa PT e PSDB de 'pragmatismo sem limites'," Folha.com, October 17, 2010. http://www1.folha.uol.com.br/poder/815926-em-carta-marina-acusa-pt-e-psdb-de-pragmatismo-sem-limites.shtml.

(14) O Globo, "Era Lula," December 22, 2010 (Kindle edition).

(15) Tiago Pariz and Alexandro Martello, "Só vou ser comparado a Vargas, diz Lula," globo.com, August 30, 2007. http://g1.globo.com/Noticias/Politica/0,,MUL96520-5601,00.html.

(16) Lula da Silva, Pronunciamento à nação em cadeia nacional de rádio e TV, por ocasião do final de ano," December 23, 2010. http://www.info.planalto.gov.br/static/inf_briefdiscusos.htm.

Ted G. Goertzel, Ph.D. is Professor of Sociology at Rutgers University in Camden, New Jersey. He published a biography of Fernando Henrique Cardoso, and is collaborating with Denise Paraná on a biography of Luiz Inácio Lula da Silva. His web page is at http://crab.rutgers.edu/~goertzel/. He can be reached at goertzel@camden.rutgers.edu.



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Comments (66)Add Comment
...
written by cúzão, January 28, 2011
This article is to high level, missing important facts on the ground:

1) The two biggest problems in this country are the 60% tax on imports which is 3x higher than the Europe's VAT - and the Firma. The latter means its hard to get a license to do business and nearly _impossible_ to close, allowing the government to collect a monthly stipend essentially forever, whether its still needed or not. Both FHC and Lula did nothing to fix that.

Everything is made in China now, but you can look at amazon.com in the USA for the same product on americanas.com.br and it will be triple in price, even after currency adjustments. This hurts the poor more than the rich since they bring back suitcases full of compras from the USA.

2) The biggest difference between Lula, FHC, and for that matter a Serra presidency is international relations. Under Serra we could have expected international policy to look largely like Columbia's, imho not something I would like.

I liked Lula because while the Bolsa Familia has its problems, that's not the fault of the kids. When politics isn't an option for the marginalized, well, look at Egypt today. I've been there and that is a messed up country. I also liked his international policy as a complete contrast to the USA's.

Under FHC, there were 25% interest rates, 10% unemployment, R$3.8 per dollar, and people in general were a lot more poor. Was Lula lucky? Well his critics can't have it both ways as they predicted complete catastrophe.

And of course, in 8 years well hear the same thing from those same %4 mentioned in this article: Dilma owes all of her success to FHC, lol. And I could care less, PSDB is a lot like the republicans in the USA, and as long as they don't have any power, let them complain all they want.

Should Lula have done more. Should Dilma? Do no harm is all I really want. Progress is slow, but its not going backwards like the USA.
Great analysis
written by Maximiliano Gonetecki de Oliveira, January 28, 2011
I supose it's well known that the best possible way to understand and solve a problem is look at it from outsite. Looking at it with clear eyes empower the observer to have a better undestanding of it. I am saying that because it is what you did in your article.

Best of all you revealed a point that I have never realized how it can be powerfull for a nation: pride! We, the Brazilians, have lost long ago anything that could remember pride of being Brazilian and recovering it can be a special ingredient to change a nation.

Surely Lula made less than what he should had done, but certainly he gave the Brazilian citizens a special power that can change a nation. Self esteem can change one lives, imagine what it can do for a country!!!
Viva o Lula....Viva o Lula!
written by addadAD, January 28, 2011
I like my lula deep fried, thank you!

Mr. Severino (former Costinha)
To Maximiliano
written by José Samaro, January 29, 2011
but certainly he gave the Brazilian citizens a special power that can change a nation. Self esteem can change one lives, imagine what it can do for a country!!!


What exactly is this "power" and "self-esteem" that Lula gave us? The only thing that Lula gave us, at least the remaining brazilians with a sense of moral and ethics and the respect for human rights, is a deep shame to be under the rule of a president who harbors international criminals and worships psychopathic dictators around the globe. Good going, Lula. I could not have been more ashamed of entering a civilized country with a Brazilian passport...
...
written by João da Silva, January 30, 2011

What exactly is this "power" and "self-esteem" that Lula gave us?


Good question!!!!!

I could not have been more ashamed of entering a civilized country with a Brazilian passport...


The "remaining Brasilians" with a sense of moral and ethics and the respect for human rights, never lost their "self esteem" and still are welcomed in any civilized country. Certainly they don't need "diplomatic" passports obtained by being relatives of their elected and selected political leaders.smilies/sad.gif
...
written by Rafael, January 30, 2011
Cúzão - or perhaps burrão would have been better.

Considering how strong the real is, if Brazil considerably reduces import tariffs, then one expect the following to happen in a real short amount of time:
1) Layoffs in the manufacturing sector;
2) Exporters, both Brazilian and foreign, opening bases in countries with more competitive exporting conditions and closing operations in Brazil;
3) Massive current account deficit;
4) Balance of payments crisis;
5) As a result of the crisis, very quick currency devaluation, which will result in companies with foreign debts declaring bankrupcy;
6) And, as a result of the the currency devaluation, double-digit inflation.

Be careful what you wish for, burrão.
...
written by Rafael, January 30, 2011
@José Saramago

God bless the US, Israel and Guantánamo! Now, THAT's respect for human right! God bless the 1964 revolution, too, and its dear, dearest gringo enabler, the great... Lincoln Gordon!
...
written by cúzão, January 31, 2011
Rafael, thank you so much for your comments as its very inspiring when the opposition can only respond with such extreme ignorance.

1) Protecting ineffecient markets with high tarrifs has failed worldwide every time its been tried. And how does high tarrifs on Electronics that Brazil doesn't even manufacture prove your point?

2) Please write in coherent English. Best I can tell you are only proving my point. Unless you are advocating that Brazil cannot be competitive without tarrifs, which is contrary to basic economics.

3) Stop carteira assinada for Concursos Públicos and there will be no need for high tarrifs and no deficit. These people become worthless velinos that are dead weight. Hire terceirizados if you need them.

4) You seem to think its the governments money, not ours. If the government has less, it needs to spend less.

5) China and the USA are both in a race to the bottom by devaluing its currency. They do that because its in their best interest. Likewise, the Real is at an historic high now and has plenty of room to fall.

6) The high interest rates are caused because the banks are subsidizing an extremely inefficient and bloated government. More pension reform and less government hiring are the solution. And then there's the banks "spread", charging 13% per month for cheque especial, and giving 1% per month juros on deposits. Both the PSDB and PT will do nothing about this.
...
written by cúzão, January 31, 2011
On 6 I meant to say that interest rates can help control inflation, but as I said they are high already. And they will go as high as need be, like % under FHC.
...
written by cúzão, January 31, 2011
Um, your point 5 is contradictory. If the Real falls, and you have foreign debt, you have more of the foreign currency and its actually easier to pay off your debt. Despite you yourself not knowing this, I'm sure the Brazilian government does and is robbing you blind.
For João da Silva
written by ch.c., February 01, 2011
Kind regards from ch.c.
Hope you are doing well as I do.
Life is great.

Concerning Brazil :
if you recall I sold all my brazilians stocks in Oct./Nov. 2009.
The Bovespa was at about 64'000.
TODAY, 15 months later, it is at 66'600
China stock market was down for 2010 by about 11 %

Stupid question now :

What are the BRIC countries doing ? SLEEPING WITH LAZINESS ?

Ricardo Amaral was wrong....once again, as usual !

The only Brazilian stock I bought, late in 2010, was BP.... for Brazil Petrobras.
A few weeks after their mega secondary shares issue of 70 billion dollars.
Why ?
Because Brazil Petrobras was down more than British Petroleum on the then year to date performance.
Some profits since then.
Ohhhh Have you had a Tupi field mega disaster in 2010 ? Ohhhh yessssssss....the 70 billion dollars.... shares dilution ! smilies/grin.gifsmilies/grin.gifsmilies/grin.gif

Please tell this idiot Ricardo to continue writing his bullishness on Brazil. He loves to write how Brazil is good at or near the peak, as he did so many times in the years past.

Enjoy !

smilies/cool.gifsmilies/cool.gifsmilies/grin.gifsmilies/grin.gifsmilies/wink.gifsmilies/wink.gifsmilies/grin.gifsmilies/grin.gif
"Eight years ago, Luiz Inácio Lula da Silva was inaugurated president of Brazil with a dramatic pronouncement that "change ... is the dramatic message from Brazilian society..."
written by ch.c., February 01, 2011
ohhhh yessssssssss !

The dramatic change was......FOR ALL OF ROBBING HOOK REIGN
- Braz-zeroes had the lowest GDP economic growth rate of the Mercosur
- Braz-zeroes had the lowest GDP economic growth rate of the BRIC
- Braz-zeroes had one the lowest GDP economic growth rate of ALL world emerging nations.



And this despite Robbing Hook, early in 2007. changed the methodology to figure the GDP growth rate (FOR PAST YEARS)....IN HIS FAVOR for his first presidential term.

Effectively a DRAMATIC message from the Brazilian SOCIETY !

Thus your nickname of BRAZ-ZEROES, IS WELL DESERVED !

Because to make an appearance of doing good......you just compare yourselves against the developed nations....that you are NOT.

But when compared to your true PEERS, the emerging nations, you are the worst or very close to the worst.....until proven otherwise....with facts and figures.

Thus caressing your navel will not change one centavo...THE COMPARATIVE STATS !


Ohhhhh my....ohhhh my !

Keep your inflation up. That is good for you the citizens for your mortgages rates at about 10 % interests rates, buying cars with 25 % rates, appliances at 3 percent PER MONTH, overdrafts at well over 130 %, etc etc.

Your motto is BUY ONE, PAY TWO...OR THREE !

No doubt Robbing Hook was good. Good to talk to the poors and work for the rich.
...
written by cúzão, February 01, 2011
ch.c, your comments would have credibility if you didn't come from the most unremarkable country on the planet! Such incoherent thoughts surely are caused by such an extreme inferiority complex. The best known quote about your pathetic country is highly appropriate here:

“In Italy, for 30 years under the Borgias, they had warfare, murder and bloodshed, but they produced Michangelo, Leonardo da Vinci and the Renaissance. In Switzerland, they had brotherly love; and they had 500 years of democracy and peace — and what did they produce? The cuckoo clock.”
Answer to a scandalous troll.
written by Rafael, February 01, 2011
"Braz-zeroes had the lowest GDP economic growth rate of the Mercosur"


For what year and in comparison with whom? With two tiny states, Paraguay and Uruguay, whose economies are as dependent on Brazil as Mexico's is on the US? Or perhaps in comparison with Argentina, which manipulates its GDP and inflation numbers?

"Braz-zeroes had the lowest GDP economic growth rate of the BRIC"


For what year? In 2009 and 2010 Brazil surpassed Russia.

"Braz-zeroes had one the lowest GDP economic growth rate of ALL world emerging nations"

Again dumbass, for what year? Since 2007 Brazil's GDP growth rate has surpassed that of Latin America. So obviously that can't be true.

And this despite Robbing Hook, early in 2007. changed the methodology to figure the GDP growth rate (FOR PAST YEARS)....IN HIS FAVOR for his first presidential term.


Never heard of any criticism regarding the GDP methodology. I mean, serious criticism, not criticism by some internet troll. And that GDP has indeed picked up since 2007 is proven by two facts: 1 - that unemployment has been waning since 2007 (before that year, it tended to average 10% of the workforce); 2 - that his popularity has begun to increase in 2007 and 2008. A government's popularity increases when the population perceives its economic prospects are improving. And to this effect, distorting numbers won't do, for numbers do not affect anyone's life standards. And most of the population isn't even acquainted with GDP numbers.

P.S.: You need to learn to write more clearly. And not only that, you should try to write like a man instead of a deranged troll.
ch.c
written by João da Silva, February 01, 2011

Kind regards from ch.c.
Hope you are doing well as I do.
Life is great.


ch.c, it is so great to hear from you and my equally warm greetings to you too.

I am not doing as well as you are. You see, when the old age hits you, it gets ya for real good. But...but...but...one has to keep stiff upper lip in spite of the adverse health conditions.

Happy to note that the life is great at your end. It must be, for finally you managed to overthrow the illegitimately selected government of Tunisia and install your own clan in its place. Any cushy government jobs for your daughters?

The Brasilian economy is doing as usual. Ups, downs,etc; according to the weather pattern and the mood of our elected and selected officials. But....but...but... you might be happy to know that your good ole buddy A.P. is now the Chief of the Planalto and close adviser to our newly elected President. So I expect the economy to take off after the Carnival. I suggest you buy up all the stocks that are low in value now to sell it high in March.

In the meantime, you "relax and enjoy" your stay in Tunis.
Cuzão's platitudes.
written by Rafael, February 01, 2011
1) Protecting ineffecient markets with high tarrifs (sic) has failed worldwide every time its been tried. And how does high tarrifs on Electronics that Brazil doesn't even manufacture prove your point?


Where did you learn that? From The Economist or the Wall Street Journal? Look, in 90s Brazil did precisely that which you're asking for: it reduced tariffs in a context of strong currency. And what happened, then? National businesses, including the only automobile industry native to the country, filed for bankrupcy en masse. And they did so because they couldn't compete with wave of cheap imports flooding the country's market. As a result, Brazil experienced a decade of slow growth, very high unemployment levels - higher than in the 80s - and two balance of payments crises (1999 and 2002).

And who told you that protecting industries has always failed? Do you have any idea how dependent all the major aircrafts manufacturers - Boeing, Bombardier, Dassault, Embraer etc. - are on government help to, for instance, get funds otheriwse hard to acquire and obtain exports advantages? Didn't you know that all industrial powers of nowadays have passed through a period of protectionism, that is, of government intervention in favour of national industries? Dirty trade policies are a common denominator in the economic histories of the most developed East Asian powers: Japan, Singapore, South Korea, and Taiwan. And China is walking the same path. Dirty trade policies mean government intervention in the name of national production. Such intervention can take the form of: imports tariffs; furnishing subsidized credit to national businesses (which in practice does the same as imposing import tariffs); or manipulating currencies so as to make foreign goods look expensive. Even the US itself, the preacher of the pleasures of free markets, was not very different from East Asian countries in a more distant past. The Financial Times says of past US trade policies:

George Washington, America’s first president, favoured protectionism to help infant industries gain a foothold, declaring he would consume no ale or cheese “but such as is made in America”. From the civil war until the first world war, by which time US economic success was sealed, average tariffs never fell below 40 per cent, according to Clyde Prestowitz, a former US trade representative. Theodore Roosevelt, 26th president, said: “Thank God I am not a free trader.”


No emerging country has ever become a developed one by completely opening its markets.

2) Please write in coherent English. Best I can tell you are only proving my point. Unless you are advocating that Brazil cannot be competitive without tarrifs, which is contrary to basic economics.


What I had said was this: that if imports tariffs are to be reduced in a context of strong currency, businesses in Brazil would feel compelled to close their bases in here and open other in countries with a more favourable climate for exports. And they would do so even if they intend to keep selling to the Brazilian markets - that is, Brazilian companies would start operations in foreign countries in order to keep selling products to Brazil! Azaléia, a shoes maker, did that. And so did Marcopolo, the bus manufacturer.

3) Stop carteira assinada for Concursos Públicos and there will be no need for high tarrifs and no deficit. These people become worthless velinos that are dead weight. Hire terceirizados if you need them.


What kind of extravagent bêtise is that? That must be the most stupid thing I've read on this issue, and that's saying something.

4) You seem to think its the governments money, not ours. If the government has less, it needs to spend less.


Oh, I see. You don't know what a balance of payments crisis is. And yet, you try to discuss with me in such petulant language.
...
written by Rafael, February 01, 2011
Cuzão,

I was replying you with a very answer. But I lost my post. In some hours, I'll try again. Now I don't have the patience.
...
written by cúzão, February 01, 2011
Rafael, looking forward to you explaining why you justify theft by the government in the form of the worlds highest tarrifs, on products it doesn't even produce. And how higher prices make Brazil more competitive. And if you believe that by justifying that theft, you still condemn corruption - a hypocritical position imho since both forms hurt the poor more than anyone else. Stop calling people names as you previously did and we may even have a constructive discussion about it.
Rafael the idiot "in 90s Brazil did precisely that which you're asking for: it reduced tariffs in a context of strong currency."
written by ch.c., February 02, 2011
Ohhhhh my..... ohhhhh my....
In the 90s Brazil had hyperinflation and erased 3 ZEROES in its currency in 1994.
What a strong currency....as you said. Hmmmm ...hmmmmmm....!
Idiots are idiots. And idiots are 10000000 % sure that right they are.
Suffice to read your comments.....Rafael !

And for Joao :
You have noooo idea how I could care less for Tunisia. In fact just as much as...Egyypt !

About your age, quite strange. You are not so old after all. I will be 61 this year and feel terrific. I am travelling the world over....but not North Africa where religion weights way too much on quality life.

Looks like that Swiss Cheeses, fresh air, LOW interests rates, low inflation, cities not too much polluted are better than your beans and rice, dirty and smelly cities streets.


Back to the idiot Rafael and his " No emerging country has ever become a developed one by completely opening its markets."
Fact being that no developed country has ever completely opened its markets.
Full Proof that idiot You are.

Furthermore on Brazil competitiveness :
Ohhhhhh yessssssssss so competitive that it is NOT well ranked for sure. Check by yourself the rankings....if you can do that.
And if you think that higher commodities prices makes Brazil more competitive....you are the inverse of common sense, by definition.
When prices are high......then even non competitive countries can make money....in farming for example.

Where did you get your Brazilian University licence ? In a detergent pack you bought at a brazilian discount store ?
Have you had to buy the detergent or you bought directly the U.licence without buying the detergent ?

Not surprising the country is so backward. Suffice to read your comments as well as those of Ricardo Amaral !
Rest of my answer to Cuzão.
written by Rafael, February 02, 2011
quote]5) China and the USA are both in a race to the bottom by devaluing its currency. They do that because its in their best interest. Likewise, the Real is at an historic high now and has plenty of room to fall.

This is irrelavant to my argument. Learn what a balance of payments crisis is. When a country is affected by that kind of crisis, there occurs a major currency devaluation in a very short amount of time. Such devaluation is caused by capital flight from foreign investors, not by government interference as is the case in China and the US. It's because of the quick currency devaluation that high inflation tends to follow balance payments crisis. Again, this has nothing to do with what we're seeing in the US and China.

6) The high interest rates are caused because the banks are subsidizing an extremely inefficient and bloated government. More pension reform and less government hiring are the solution. And then there's the banks "spread", charging 13% per month for cheque especial, and giving 1% per month juros on deposits. Both the PSDB and PT will do nothing about this.


I won't discuss that. I wasn't even talking about interests rates. I was only saying that inflation tends to follow a balance of payments crisis.

Um, your point 5 is contradictory. If the Real falls, and you have foreign debt, you have more of the foreign currency and its actually easier to pay off your debt. Despite you yourself not knowing this, I'm sure the Brazilian government does and is robbing you blind.


What an expression of crass ignorance!

Let's suppose a Brazilian company borrows 2 million dollars when the real-to-dollar exchange rate is of 1.65. Let's suppose that a massive currency devaluation occurs before said company can pay off the debt. Now the dollar is worthy 2.3 reais. Supposing the Brazilian companies' revenues are in reais, it would be harder to get rid of the debt, don't you agree? Do not try to distort the issue, here. That currency devaluations have a terrible effect on companies that are indebted in foreign currencies is beyond dispute - it was something observed repeatedly during the Asian Crisis. It was also something the current Brazilian CB governor said in January: that companies should be careful not to contract debt with foreign banks, for the real might wound up losing value against the dollar.
Answer to the embarrassingly stupid rants of a deranged Swiss.
written by Rafael, February 02, 2011
In the 90s Brazil had hyperinflation and erased 3 ZEROES in its currency in 1994.
What a strong currency....as you said. Hmmmm ...hmmmmmm....!


Dumbass. Hyperinflation in the 90s preceded the establishment of the real as the national currency. As a matter of fact, the new currency was part of a plan to bring inflation to moderate levels. And the real could be called a strong currency for, throughout the first 5 years of its existence, it was tied to the dollar at a same rate: 1:1.

Back to the idiot Rafael and his " No emerging country has ever become a developed one by completely opening its markets."
Fact being that no developed country has ever completely opened its markets.
Full Proof that idiot You are.


Really, dumbass? So, from my argument - that no emerged country has ever completely opened its markets in its development into a fully industrialized one - you conclude that I was saying developed countries have completely free markets? Is that the Deranged Troll University version of logics?

Ohhhhhh yessssssssss so competitive that it is NOT well ranked for sure. Check by yourself the rankings....if you can do that.


Well-ranked where, dumbass? As I said before, you need to write more clearly. And more like a normal person, too.

And if you think that higher commodities prices makes Brazil more competitive....you are the inverse of common sense, by definition.


OMG, one has to teach the troll how to read. The Deranged Troll University's reading classes are not what they used to be, it seems.

Hey troll, my argument was this: that, when currency in a certain country is strong, companies installed in there might be forced to close their operations in said country and open bases in other nations with a more competitive, more favourable export climate. I was not saying that commodities prices make the country competitive, and you have to be dumb to believe so. That's it.

When prices are high......then even non competitive countries can make money....in farming for example.


So, when commodity prices are high, commodities exports become more profitable? Who would've though that, that's earth-shattering wisdom!

P.S.: Are you angry with me because I called you on your previous assertions and you've been unable to answer me?
...
written by cúzão, February 02, 2011
To Rafael:

"Let's suppose a Brazilian company borrows 2 million dollars when the real-to-dollar exchange rate is of 1.65. Let's suppose that a massive currency devaluation occurs before said company can pay off the debt. Now the dollar is worthy 2.3 reais. Supposing the Brazilian companies' revenues are in reais, it would be harder to get rid of the debt, don't you agree? Do not try to distort the issue, here. That currency devaluations have a terrible effect on companies that are indebted in foreign currencies is beyond dispute - it was something observed repeatedly during the Asian Crisis. It was also something the current Brazilian CB governor said in January: that companies should be careful not to contract debt with foreign banks, for the real might wound up losing value against the dollar. "

Let me try to smack you with a "clue by 4": you only borrow money in a foreign currency when your native currency is low. The Real is at an historic high, so it would need to get weaker to make it work for you. Since the Real going below R$1.6 per dollar is not very likely, it therefore is not possible to borrow foreign money now. Which makes your argument moot about more foreign loans, since there can be no further growth by them with a value of R$1.6.

On the contrary, when they went to R$2.4 in early 2009, it was quite obvious that it was momentary spike and an opportunity.

In other words, only a weak Real can make foreign loans a viable option. Hint: people make money by fluctuations, not stability.

"I won't discuss that. I wasn't even talking about interests rates. I was only saying that inflation tends to follow a balance of payments crisis."

You should stop posting on forums about inflation if you refuse to talk about interest rates, since both are directly related. You obviously don't even read your own media like globo, otherwise you'd know that interest rates were raised last week to fight inflation.

I noticed you didn't even respond to the high tarrifs argument, I can only guess you agree that the government theft by them is just as damaging to the poor as the corruption you probably condemn?
...
written by cúzão, February 02, 2011
To Rafael:

"This is irrelavant to my argument. Learn what a balance of payments crisis is. When a country is affected by that kind of crisis, there occurs a major currency devaluation in a very short amount of time. Such devaluation is caused by capital flight from foreign investors, not by government interference as is the case in China and the US. It's because of the quick currency devaluation that high inflation tends to follow balance payments crisis. Again, this has nothing to do with what we're seeing in the US and China. "

A balance-of-payments crisis is merely a speculative attack on a countries currency. Maybe you should learn what it is, and why neither are possible in the USA or China and hence it has everything to do with them.

In the USA's case, their debt is in their own currency, dollars. So they can devalue as much as they want, they could even inflate their way out of debt if they choose to do so.

China has such a large amount of reserves of dollars that it can peg its Yuan 1 to 1 to the dollar for our lifetimes if it wishes. And it has no debt. While there is a _small_ problem with inflation in China currently, its very manageable now since all it needs to do is let the Yuan increase in value - which it has enormous room to do.

What you may be referring to is Argentina in 2003, but again that's against your argument of a strong currency because its 1 to 1 value to the dollar is what caused the crisis. It didn't have China like reserves of course.

What does this have to do with Brazil? There was this type of attack in 2002, and Brazil benefited when its national banks cashed out their foreign investors. Its a low risk currently. The larger risk is that the worlds highest interest rates as of today, will double to their value under FHC.
...
written by cúzão, February 02, 2011
I forgot to mention that even though both China and the USA have devalued their currency, both have low deflation. In fact, in the USA case, their bigger risk is deflation. Conversely, Japan has a very high yen now and is pretty much in a permanent deflation crisis.

The point here is that devaluing a currency is not necessarily a bad thing. It can be quite dangerous though when you have debt in a foreign currency and no reserves, ie your balance of payments comment. Or as in the Greece case, debt in Euros but no way to devalue out of the crisis. In the USA case, it just shows that devaluation is a viable solution.

Another USA case is the last decade, by Soros shorting the dollar. No inflation there at all. Hence Rafael, while the risk you speak of is real, my recommendation is to read more on what it really is since you have an interest in it,
To Rafael the dumbass "Dumbass. Hyperinflation in the 90s preceded the establishment of the real as the national currency. As a matter of fact, the new currency was part of a plan to bring inflation t
written by ch.c., February 03, 2011
Fact is that in 1994 you - the Braz-zeroes - erased 3 zeroes, for the 4th time in 60 years or so. A World record surpassed only by..... ZIMBABWE.
furthermore the currency was then pegged to the dollar at 1 to 1.
17 years later, today, your currency is still at 1,66.
Is this what you call a STRONG CURRENCY ????????

I suggest you to buy some toilet paper rolls. Eventually you will also receive free a University Doctorate from Rio.

And to Cuzao "I forgot to mention that even though both China and the USA have devalued their currency, both have low deflation"

What a great news that china has devalued its currency. WHEN ?
Please be more specific and provide your sources....if you can.

Funny too when you say "both have low deflation"
Reality being that China are raising their interests rates to contain THEIR INFLATION.....NOT DEFLATION, until proven otherwise !

Stupid question to both of you :
Do you even know what you are talking about ?

You are as educated as Lula, and just as idiot as he is !

Last but not least to the idiot who said China has such a large amount of reserves of dollars that it can peg its Yuan 1 to 1 to the dollar for our lifetimes if it wishes."
Now the yuan is about 6,53 to the dollar. Pegging it at 1 to 1 means it would go up by about 700 %.
Doubtful China will remain competitive, in my humble view.

As I stated idiots are always 1000000000 % sure that right they are, knowledgable they are and clever they are.
Suffice to read your comments.
Normal then than Brazil citizens are nicknamed BRAZ-ZEROES.

And for Joao and your "buy Brazil now".
Not so, not so.
The World stock markets are stretched on the upside. Way overbought.
So in the months ahead I expect a nasty correction.
Time to reduce positions during present strength, not increasing them for now.

smilies/grin.gifsmilies/grin.gifsmilies/cheesy.gifsmilies/cheesy.gifsmilies/wink.gifsmilies/wink.gif
furthermore to Rafael the junkie " Hyperinflation in the 90s preceded the establishment of the real as the national currency. "
written by ch.c., February 03, 2011
Was is not the NATIONAL CURRENCY BEFORE YOU ERASED 4 times 3 zeroes ?

Ohhhhhh my.....ohhhhhh my !

I have pain in my STOMACH, so much I LAUGH...LAUGH....LAUGH....LAUGH !
"You seem to think its the governments money, not ours. If the government has less, it needs to spend less."
written by ch.c., February 03, 2011
Of course it is the government money. THEY SPEND IT. And since they spend more than they collect in overall taxes, this create budget deficits, paid with more DEBTS ISSUED, thus with more printed money.

Simple as that ?

And no one, except governments can print money. Thus believing that it is with our money governments OVER SPEND is laughable.
The government debts and deficits are for their citizens.
They over spend and leave the bill for tomorrow....tomorrow....tomorrow. Sadly !
...
written by cúzão, February 03, 2011
Wow ch.c, such a immense inferiority complex. I wasn't aware it was so embarrassing to be Swiss that you need to ramble so incoherently. Now I understand though, being that your country has never accomplished anything more than the cuckoo clock.

China's currency == undervalued. Relatively low inflation. Its not being allowed to valuate with a floating currency exchange. That's a fact. I remembered incorrectly on the yuan being 1 -1 , but there is no question its undervalued.

USA's currency == 50 year lows compared to other currencies. Also at a 50 year inflation low. That's a fact.

But of course, arguing with some one who is clearly insane is a waste of time. Last post, the quality of conversation just isn't here.
...
written by Triple-Dot, February 03, 2011

What a boring article from Ted! Equally boring comments from ch.c!!!!!!!! Both should coauthor a book titled "How to bore people to death".
What a boring article from Ted! Equally boring comments from ch.c!!!!!!!!
written by Tripple Dott, February 03, 2011
Yes, boring article from Ted. Not boring comments from ch.c...he is correct.


...
written by Triple-Dot, February 03, 2011

Not boring comments from ch.c...he is correct.


Obviously you are a German-Swiss. Fine. The book will be renamed "How to bore people to death and resuscitate them with 1.7% interest rate". You write the prologue, they their respective monologues and I the epilogue. The work will be #1 in the Best sellers list in Tibune de Geneve for eternity.smilies/wink.gif
ch.c
written by Tripple Dott, February 03, 2011
S'il vous plaît continuer à éduquer ces réfugiés culturels. Je ne possède pas la patience nécessaire pour le faire. smilies/cheesy.gifsmilies/cheesy.gifsmilies/cheesy.gif
...
written by Triple-Dot, February 04, 2011

S'il vous plaît continuer à éduquer ces réfugiés culturels. Je ne possède pas la patience nécessaire pour le faire.


Sounds more like an obituary note for their book.smilies/wink.gifsmilies/cheesy.gifsmilies/grin.gif
...
written by jon, February 04, 2011
Progress of a country is measured by a ratio of university graduates to detergent packs!
...
written by Triple-Dot, February 04, 2011

Progress of a country is measured by a ratio of university graduates to detergent packs!


Does that young fool in Geneve know this ratio?smilies/wink.gif
Tri-Dotando
written by Simpleton, February 04, 2011
You won't have much luck in baiting our resident statician (who is older than snot like most of the rest of us), he'll just tell you anybody with any intelligence at all can just go look it up on the web for themselves if they are interested. Even if he coughs up a fairly reliable estimate for the numbers to be used, you'll have to erase quite a few zeros from the divisor in order to use the run of the mill calculator to get an answer. (Old farts rule ne' Joao?)
Canucks
written by Simpleton, February 04, 2011
By the way, since Canadians like Jon just put the clothes outside after wetting them and freeze-dry the filth off of them. Thus there are much much fewer detergent packs needed so of course the measure of progress in that country is going to come out to be much much higher in comparison.

Tempo por minha Vodka com Guarana.
...
written by Triple-Dot, February 04, 2011

By the way, since Canadians like Jon just put the clothes outside after wetting them


Don´t the Canadians use diapers?smilies/shocked.gif
...
written by jon, February 04, 2011
Just the French sidesmilies/wink.gif
poifect
written by Simpleton, February 04, 2011
You caught what I was saying perfectly dotty but of course I wasn't really thinking of Jon as an average joe up yonder. He's prone to using top shelf / higher octane blood thinner which tends not to produce the source of the problem quite as readily. smilies/grin.gif
jon
written by João da Silva, February 05, 2011

Great to hear from you. Even more pleased to note that your boss Stephan is also involved in bringing a "regime change" in Cairo.smilies/wink.gif
Simpleton
written by Triple-Dot, February 06, 2011

You caught what I was saying perfectly dotty but of course I wasn't really thinking of Jon as an average joe up yonder.


Did you find your college degree in a diaper pack?smilies/wink.gif
Didn't even look
written by Simpleton, February 06, 2011
Unlike the archetypical brasileira / brasileiro, brasileira / estrangeiro temporary unions, we had no experience with diaper packs until eight years after I earned my degree.
Ohhhhhh my .... ohhhhh my.......
written by ch.c., February 08, 2011
Chwis-zerland has been named THE WORLD MOST COMPETITIVE COUNTRY.

Sorry for you....idiots of braz-zeroes.

And this WETHER you like it or not.

And we had no need to devalue our currency, also wether you like or not.


Ohhhhhhh and if braz-zeroes enjoy HIGH INTERESTS RATES, dont worry you have them.
That is good for businesses to borrow at the world highest rates....after inflation, reading your comments.

Thus enjoy your 9-10 % mortgages rates, 25-30 % car leasing rates, 3 % MONTHLY rates to buy appliances, and well over 120 % for your overdrafts !


And sorry for you that we have the lowest unemployment rate of all Europe. 3,4 % against 9 % in the USA, 8-10 % in most of Europe and 20,3 % in Spain.


Ohhhhhh and sorry too that without government subsidies we have 2 % for 5 years mortgages.

Last but not least in my state, Geneva, our non skilled workers earn US dollars 3800-3900 PER MONTH x 13.
And not 7,25 HOURLY as in the USA or even much less in the Braz-zeroes country.


LAUGHS...LAUGHS...LAUGHS...LAUGHS !

smilies/grin.gifsmilies/grin.gifsmilies/grin.gifsmilies/grin.gifsmilies/grin.gifsmilies/grin.gifsmilies/grin.gifsmilies/shocked.gifsmilies/shocked.gifsmilies/shocked.gif
And to cuzao "Now I understand though, being that your country has never accomplished anything more than the cuckoo clock. "
written by ch.c., February 08, 2011
Reading your comments I suppose this is how my country has one of the world highest GDP per capita.
50 % more than the USA, and about 8 times Brazil.

Ohhhh and I suppose also that Chwis-zerland export as much as Brazil, only by exporting mainly cukoo clocks.

Furthermore our exports per capita is at about 25'000 dollars, against 6000 for the USA and sniffff....sniffff.....1000 dollars in Brazil.

I suggest that the United States of Anarchy and the braz-zeroes start to manufacture and export.....your own....cukoo clocks.


Ohhhhhh my....ohhhhh my.

When do you expect the braz-zeroes to export as much as WE the idiots Chwiss...on a per capita basis ?
Suffice to multiply your exports by 25 times. And provided we dont grow until then, of course !


Ohhhhhhh my....ohhhhhh my.


Idiots are always sure that right they are. Suffice to read braz-zeroes and yankees comments.

I also recall that many idiots wrote 2 years ago that Switzerland is the next Iceland !
Wellll....still waiting. Because since then our currency went up sharply, not down.
These same idiots had seen nothing then for Greece, Ireland, Spain and Portugal.

NEXT COUNTRY ?
Belgium ! They have EUROPE SECOND HIGHEST DEBTS TO GDP !

And Chwis-zerland has by far....THE LOWEST !


smilies/grin.gifsmilies/grin.gifsmilies/grin.gifsmilies/grin.gifsmilies/grin.gifsmilies/grin.gifsmilies/cheesy.gifsmilies/cheesy.gifsmilies/cheesy.gifsmilies/cheesy.gifsmilies/shocked.gifsmilies/shocked.gifsmilies/shocked.gif
...
written by Triple-Dot, February 08, 2011

Chwis-zerland has been named THE WORLD MOST COMPETITIVE COUNTRY.


Does this country manufacture diapers at all?
ch.c
written by Double-Dot, February 08, 2011

Idiots are always sure that right they are. Suffice to read braz-zeroes and yankees comments.


If I were you, I wouldn't piss the Yankees off, dude. We might be tempted to bring on a regime change in your country.

God bless America.
No Change in Regime
written by Simpleton, February 09, 2011
We just want to get free room and board in the gold bar barracks at the top of the hill when the rest of eurotrashland sinks. Remember switzerlandia is so much more open to foreigners of dubious repute than brasil. We will be highly dependant on the float of the Chwiss navy to be sure we arrive safely.

BTW old pal ch.c, what do you think of NCR. Just hit a 52 week high. Good bet for the future or no?
double id-iot, "God bless America"
written by ch.c., February 10, 2011
Which America ? Is Canada or Panama or Venezuela not in America ?
The USA ? Meaning the United States of Anarchy ?

Facts are that YOU LOST your own war in Vietnam and Somalia.
And....and....and You are humiliated in Iraq and Afghanistan.

Hip...hip hurrah for the World Best Army on earth ! Hmmm...hmmmmm !

Facts are that You are the only large "developed" nation without High Speed Train.
You dont have the technology and dont have the money....unless you print some more !!!
Now you are waiting to chose the foreign country that will build THEIR HST in America, with their financing....not yours !

And you are such a Democracy that 300 million people have only TWO political parties. Hmmmm....hmmmmm !
Facts are that you are a Banana Republic....disguised in an apparent Democracy. Even in Venezuela they have more political parties THAN IN THE UNITED STATES OF ANACHRONISM !!


Ohhhhhh please keep YOUR ANNUAL BUDGET spending at 3,6 trillion dollars....while collecting 2,1 trillion ONLY !
For every dollar you spend.....You collect Only 60 cents and borrow 40 cents.

And to Simpleton "BTW old pal ch.c, what do you think of NCR. Just hit a 52 week high"
Thus time to reduce your position, in my view !
The stock market had an impressive run up, without a pause, over the past 4-5 months.
I am not bearish, just more conservative the higher we go.
Better to raise some cash when the market is high that raising cash when the market is low.
In my view we will have plenty of opportunities in the Sept/October time window, or earlier if it comes !

Simpleton "Remember switzerlandia is so much more open to foreigners of dubious repute than brasil."
written by ch.c., February 10, 2011
Easier said than spelling names !
Please spell names.
Many nazis ended up in the Americas, South, Center or North, NOT IN CH(W)EESE-ZERLAND !
In North america you have given refuge to many DICTATORS !
ACTUALLY YOU PROVIDE REFUGE TO 2 PREVIOUS EX BOLIVIAN PRESIDENTS.
WHERE IMELDA MARCOS DID FOUND REFUGE, years ago ? IN MY COUNTRY OR...YOURS ?

Who is providing refuge to the Italian Terrorist and Murderer Battista ?
Braz-zeroes or we the Chwiss ?

Who is providing refuge to Baby Doc ? My country or France ?
And to Aristide ? South Africa or my country ?
And to Ben Ali ? Saudi Arabia or my country ?
And the list goes on and on ! You will have a hard time finding dubious refugees in my country !

A little easy & empty your statement ! Suffice to add facts and names...if you have them !
my advice.....
written by asp, February 10, 2011
buy low, sell high....
selective selling
written by Simpleton, February 10, 2011
Already selectively selling high so looking for some quick short term plays. I don't bet on the traditional sept / oct lull, haven't for years. Except for 2007 the one round about july has been rewarding.
asp
written by João da Silva, February 10, 2011

my advice.....
written by asp, February 10, 2011
buy low, sell high....


Finally our Komrad-in-arms, the real "ch.c" is here among our midst. Sound advice to our Simpleton and a thorough "mijada" to all those who are not from Geneve. A bit of a "bairrista", but...but...but.. never mind.

While you boys are arguing with each other about the world economy, stock markets,etc;, let me go back into my cabana and have some cold ones in your honor.smilies/wink.gifsmilies/cheesy.gif

In the meantime, you have some Tea and Crumpets in honor of Ederson.smilies/smiley.gifsmilies/cool.gif
oh yeah , joao....the cabana...what beach ? shopping iguatami ?
written by asp, February 10, 2011
joao, i guess it is ch c, with his referance of "blackhawk down" as actual history....

well, i tell you , ch c almost has me convinced to drop everything im doing, stop carnival, stop beach action , stop getting waves....and run directly to switzerland to live...

then i saw this girl's fine ass about one meter from my nose .....and i thought "naw...forget about it...."

http://gatasdorkutconvidadas.blogspot.com/2010/05/fotos-e-video-babi-panicat.html

you dig what im saying ?
ok lets try this linc again...
written by asp, February 10, 2011
careful you older guys to not skip a beat there....
written by asp, February 10, 2011
yeah, i mean one meter from my nose, in a teeny weeny little tiny pink bikini....i had to hold myself back from crawling over on my knees and take a little nible on her inner symetry cheek crease...but, i knew i would probably be deported , so, i just enjoyed the veiw...
ch.c
written by João da Silva, February 10, 2011

Who is providing refuge to Baby Doc ? My country or France ?
And to Aristide ? South Africa or my country ?
And to Ben Ali ? Saudi Arabia or my country ?


ch.c, my dear fellow, it is easy for you to bash (your) Mother France, South Africa, Saudi Arabia, Brasil, U.S.of A, etc; for harboring dictators. But what about you the Swiss (and the Brits) who are know towing before your good buddy Col. Gaddaffi and say "yes sir", every time he gives orders? You have mentioned several times in the past that you close your shopping malls to your natives, when the Sheiks from the desert condescend to visit your country to buy a couple of overly priced plastic buckets and counterfeit Rolex watches all made in PRC. Please don't pretend that we don't know about that "crisis" you had with the good Colonel from Tripoli!

Sorry, buddy. I am extremely disappointed with the submissive attitude of your country.smilies/sad.gifsmilies/cool.gif
Please don't pretend that we don't know about that "crisis" you had with the good Colonel from Tripoli!
written by ch.c., February 15, 2011
Sorry sorry we have certainly not bended to him.

And your "you have mentioned several times in the past that you close your shopping malls to your natives, when the Sheiks from the desert condescend to visit your country to buy a couple of overly priced plastic buckets and counterfeit Rolex watches all made in PRC."

I never ever said so. You probably sniffed and drank a barrel of sugarcane ethanol.
And what they buy is overly priced FOR YOU, not for them !
smilies/grin.gifsmilies/grin.gifsmilies/grin.gifsmilies/grin.gifsmilies/grin.gifsmilies/grin.gif
Sorry, buddy. I am extremely disappointed with the submissive attitude of your country.
written by ch.c., February 15, 2011
So keep the terrorists and provide them with refuge.

And ask Simple-tongue to turn his tongue 7 times before saying things that is the inverse of the truth !
Furthermore on Joao "your good buddy Col. Gaddaffi and say "yes sir"
written by ch.c., February 15, 2011
Doubtful we said Yes.


This said, Lybia could as well be one of the next Tunisia or Egypt.

Ahhhh...ahhhhhhh !

And on your "You have mentioned several times in the past that you close your shopping malls to your natives, when the Sheiks from the desert condescend to visit your country to buy a couple of overly priced plastic buckets and counterfeit Rolex watches all made in PRC."

Doubrful I ever ever said this. You probably sniffed some sugarcane ethanol.
This said.....their purchase of overly priced plastic buckets and counterfeit Rolex watches all made in PRC....ARE TOO EXPENSIVE...FOR YOU....NOT FOR THEM.

Sorry for you to struggle so much.

Keep producing grains, sugar, and iron ore !

One Rolex against 10 tons of Soyabeans. Good barter trade....FOR US !
And guess who pollutes the most !
And guess who makes the most money.

smilies/grin.gifsmilies/grin.gifsmilies/grin.gifsmilies/grin.gif
Options
written by Simpleton, February 15, 2011
Easier to stand on my head than to go through all those mind boggling repeative motion injury causing machinations like ch.c can't stop himself from doing. Donno, maybe all chwiss are like that. Probably explains how they got to making such precision cuckoo glocks.

Dumping a little today at a little over 30 percent profit in seven months. Cash will be king, always happens at some point.
ch.c
written by João da Silva, February 16, 2011


This said, Lybia could as well be one of the next Tunisia or Egypt.


Looks so. If it does turn out to be like Egypt, you think you guys are going to give asylum to the good Colonel? You can house him in your basement and charge exorbitant rates for bed and breakfast. smilies/wink.gifsmilies/cheesy.gifsmilies/grin.gif
Simpleton
written by João da Silva, February 16, 2011

Donno, maybe all chwiss are like that.


Donno either, Simpleton. Komrad ch.c is the first chwiss I have come to know. He sounds more of a "technocrat" like me than the "politicos" we run into in the Americas.smilies/wink.gifsmilies/cheesy.gif

but..but..but.. if you are making money based on his advice, continue listening to him and make more money.

Further but..but...but... for he made a curious statement:

And ask Simple-tongue to turn his tongue 7 times before saying things that is the inverse of the truth !


Is turning ones tongue 7 times is a kind of daily ritual in Chiwssland?smilies/wink.gif
Like a stopped watch
written by Simpleton, February 17, 2011
but turning it seven times each day means it will only be correct once every other day instead of correct once every day. That's the swiss for ya. ALWAYS flip floping.
ch.c's advice
written by Simpleton, February 18, 2011
Oh Yesssssssssssss, ch.c has always given actionable advice (NOT). Dr. Oz says "people with high levels of beta carotene have a 40 percent lower risk of death". Now there's something I would deem to be of value far and away better than anything ch.c has ever offered. One's money does not matter relative to one's health and after you die who's going to care anyway.
não odeio o brasil...ele não tem culpa dos filhos que tem
written by demonio do espaço, April 01, 2011
"I could not have been more ashamed of entering a civilized country with a Brazilian passport..."

indeed our goverments and their stupid ideias, fu###d the whole contry by centuries, our live we improved only by education for the future in our todays children so they won´t vote for stupid(and sell out) workers parties, right wing "tucanos"...
DON´T HATE BRASIL...DON´T BLAME HIM FOR ALL HIS CHILDREN WORK

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