Brazzil Forum
Message Board
» back to brazzil.com
Register | Profile | Log-in | Lost Password | Active Users | Help | Search

» Welcome Brazzil: Log out | Messenger | Check New Posts | Mark all posts as read

    Brazzil Forum
    General
        Lula, & Brazil's social, political economic issues
Mark all forum posts as read   [ help ]
» Your last visit to this forum was: Mar. 25, 2003 - 6:12pm «

Topic Jump
<< Back Next >>
Multiple pages for this topic [ 1 2 ]
Forum moderated by: No One
 

 
Adrianerik


Newbie
   
Interesting choice of books.  I think the two that I've read leads to discourse...most definitely....but 'informed discourse'.....how so?

Okay....I've read it again.  You don't tag them as THE books to read but 'musts' out of many 'musts'.

@Sick - I was still ready to follow up with you from the OLD FORUM but this is the 2nd or 3rd post from you where I've agreed with you.

I think that the difficulty in correctly defining a problem should not obscure the fact that a serious problem exists.

We have the Southern story about a little boy surrounded by taller boys who would slap him on his head but he could never catch which one was doing it.

The only thing he could explain to his mother was "I ain't  'zactly knows HOW I was gettin' hit but alls I knows is dey wuz beatin' the HELL outta mih"


Total Posts: 50 | Joined Jan. 2003 | Posted on: 9:58 am on Feb. 11, 2003 | IP
erjbcdt


Junior Member
   
can anyone explain to me who Freyre is and what is so important about him!

-----
Viva Brazil

Total Posts: 54 | Joined Feb. 2003 | Posted on: 6:12 pm on Feb. 11, 2003 | IP
Macunaima


Member
   
Gilberto Freyre was Brazil's premeire social scientist, being active from roughly the 1930s to the 1970s. He wrote an extremely influential and widely read book called "Casa Grande e Senzala" (The Masters in the Slaves in English) which analyzed the social and racial formation of Brazil. The book was radical for the time it was written (1936) for two reasons: it was the first attempt by any social scientist, anywhere, to carry out anthropological analysis of a complex soceity (as opposed to largely localized, tribal based societies) and it took the extremely radical position that the African contribution to Brazil's formation was the most important positive of all the groups that went into making up Brazil.

-----
Brazil is the country of the future and always will be!

Total Posts: 147 | Joined Jan. 2003 | Posted on: 2:21 am on Feb. 12, 2003 | IP
erjbcdt


Junior Member
   
does anyone care to tell me about fryre and who he is and why he is important at all in Brazilian history? I really want to know?

-----
Viva Brazil

Total Posts: 54 | Joined Feb. 2003 | Posted on: 6:24 am on Feb. 12, 2003 | IP
erjbcdt


Junior Member
   
Yes,

So what does anyone think about what is occuring to ACM, Anotinio Carlos Maghalaes, who is not being accused of bugging the phones of politicans like Geddel Lima, and other prominent politiicans from the state of Bahia which ACM is known as the king of the state.  

Does anyone see it as a postive movement in Brazil that corruption is finally being investigated.  We have the example that the accounts of the politicans in Rio de Janiero will be forced to revel their account information including how much money they have.  I hope they arrest Silvinho, who was the treasury minister under Garotinho administration, he is the head of this mafia.

What does anyone thing about Ivo Cassol, who is governor of Rodonia and is asking the govt of Lula to do a state intervention because the state politicians are so corrupt the governor has not control over the state.
I hope the PF does something or Lula will have to clean up the state of corrupt politicians who threatned the governor demanding the governor place certain officials in high level postions in the state adminsitration!

-----
Viva Brazil

Total Posts: 54 | Joined Feb. 2003 | Posted on: 3:51 pm on Feb. 12, 2003 | IP
erjbcdt


Junior Member
   
World Bank: Unions Can Improve Economies
Wed Feb 12,12:32 AM ET  Add Business - Reuters to My Yahoo!



WASHINGTON (Reuters) - A country's economy may fare better if a large number of its workers belong to trade unions, the World Bank (news - web sites) said in a study that marked a departure from the institution's traditional frosty approach to organized labor.

Related Quotes  
DJIA
NASDAQ
^SPC
7663.82
1266.77
809.85
-94.35
-12.20
-8.82


 
delayed 20 mins - disclaimer
Quote Data provided by Reuters



Tax season to-do list:

1.  Sharpen pencils.
2.  Mark calendar.
3. Panic.


Tax Season Coverage
from Yahoo! News


 

The report, released on Wednesday, found that high unionization rates can lead to lower unemployment and inflation rates, higher productivity and faster adjustment to economic shocks.


"The bank in the past has perhaps been hostile to trade unions, and the thing with this book is that it wants to have a very open and nuanced approach, different from the past," Robert Holzmann, the bank's director of social protection, told Reuters. "So no blank check to trade unions but a major offer to work with them because they're crucial."


The report said union members in rich and poor countries alike get significantly higher average wages than workers who are not affiliated with a trade union.


In the United States, wages can be 15 percent higher for union members while in other industrialized countries, they are between 5 and 10 percent higher. The benefits of union membership can vary in middle-income and developing countries.


The study also found that union participation can reduce wage gaps between skilled and unskilled workers and also between men and women.


UNIONS CAN STILL BE BAD


But unions can also create problems if they are not open and transparent.


"Trade unions can be important agents of change if it is done in a good manner," said Holzmann. "It does not mean they cannot have detrimental effects if the opposite takes place."


Holzmann commissioned the study on "Unions and Collective Bargaining: Economic Effects in a Global Environment" to provide policymakers, unions and employers in developing countries with data on the impact of unions on the economy.


The rapid growth of international trade has stimulated an interest in different labor standards around the world.


There is growing concern that countries that adopt lower labor standards will have unfair advantages in producing internationally traded goods than those with higher standards.


Also, new technology allows jobs to be directly subcontracted to workers in low-standard countries.



-----
Viva Brazil

Total Posts: 54 | Joined Feb. 2003 | Posted on: 9:20 am on Feb. 13, 2003 | IP
erjbcdt


Junior Member
   
I guess since no one has complained about the world bank, I guess this forum likes the World Bank. I am happy to see that people are now beginning to see the benefits the World Bank provides

-----
Viva Brazil

Total Posts: 54 | Joined Feb. 2003 | Posted on: 3:34 pm on Feb. 16, 2003 | IP
krista



Junior Member
   
haha...you never really saw anyone else but you
cheering for the wb either, did you?
I don't know about the others, but I'm just too confused
and have no idea what I think of wb. they're not very
consistent with their activities...

-----
Radio Do Mar: http://www.live365.com/stations/226288

Total Posts: 97 | Joined Jan. 2003 | Posted on: 4:16 pm on Feb. 16, 2003 | IP
krista



Junior Member
   
"Brazil cuts Vivendi off in water deal"
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/2768689.stm

-this piece of news touches upon big corporations and the weaknesses of World bank... Let's get back to touch with reality, theory is this dangerous thing - a formula that works in one place can't be applied everywhere...

-----
Radio Do Mar: http://www.live365.com/stations/226288

Total Posts: 97 | Joined Jan. 2003 | Posted on: 11:16 pm on Feb. 16, 2003 | IP
Jeromy


Junior Member
   
Good for that Southern Brazilian state.

-----
Peace and Justice for all

Total Posts: 55 | Joined Feb. 2003 | Posted on: 11:49 pm on Feb. 16, 2003 | IP
erjbcdt


Junior Member
   
I am lazy today so I decided to post an article I found on new agency about Brazil:
If you dont read portuguese I am sorry

Cotas para negros não resolvem a desigualdade, diz ministro da Educação

"Cotas ajudam a mudar a cor da universidade, mas não a classe social. Os pobres continuarão excluídos", disse Cristovam Buarque

Brasília - O ministro da Educação, Cristovam Buarque, afirmou nesta terça-feira que cota para negros nas universidades não resolve a desiguladade social no País."Cotas ajudam a mudar a cor da universidade, mas não a classe. Os pobres continuarão excluídos", disse o ministro. Ele argumenta que a população de baixa renda, em geral, não passa da quarta série do ensino fundamental, bem longe da porta da universidade.

Cristovam considera uma vergonha a elite brasileira ser composta apenas por brancos e não ter afro-descendentes entre embaixadores e turistas brasileiros no exterior. Na cerimônia de instalação do Fórum Brasil de Educação do Conselho Nacional de Educação, na terça-feira, ele observou que o ministro da Cultura, Gilberto Gil, era o único negro presente no auditório com capacidade para 500 pessoas, onde estavam representantes de universidades públicas e privadas, de secretarias estaduais e de entidades de classes. Depois avistou mais três pessoas na platéia.

Apesar das críticas, o ministro diz ser, pessoalmente, favorável às cotas. Nos Estados Unidos, exemplifica, serviu para garantir o acesso dos hispanos-americanos às universidades. Mas é contra a imposição deste regime para a sociedade inteira - "não seria bom para os negros". Para ele, o melhor é testar antes de adotar uma regra geral. No ministério, o assunto ainda está em discussão, principalmente pela polêmica gerada diante da dificuldade de se definir quem são os negros e pardos num País com o grau de miscigenação do Brasil.

Para o representante da Unesco No Brasil, Jorge Werthein, a falta de critérios bem definidos não invalida a importância de se ter cota para reduzir a desigualdade. "O sistema de cotas permite ir equilibrando a desigualdade, enquanto se busca melhoria substancial do ensino público brasileiro", defendeu.

Werthein disse que nos Estados Unidos também foi complicado definir critérios, mas durante muitos anos ajudou a integrar o setor da população postergada. Cristovam ressalta que a desigualdade entre as classes só se resolverá com "uma tremenda de uma escola pública, gratuita, de qualidade, para todas as crianças". Em 15 anos, esse problema estaria sanado e a discussão de cotas perderia o sentido. "Quando se faz uma revolução não é o fuzil dos revolucionários que traz igualdade é o lápis do professor que constrói a igualdade."

Cristovam diz que manter a desigualdade é "uma burrice" que acabará gerando dois tipos de brasileiros. E insiste que o preconceito mais forte no Brasil não é o de raça, é o de classe. Com base em números do Institituto Nacional de Pesquisas Educacionais (Inep) do MEC, o ministro comenta que uma pessoa pobre no Brasil recebe ao longo de toda a sua vida R$ 3.200,00 de investimento educacional, porque permanece apenas quatro anos na escola e o Fundef garante o repasse de R$ 800,00 ao ano por aluno para os Estados.

Já um filho de classe média recebe R$ 250 mil de investimento porque fica 20 anos na escola, gasta R$ 1 mil mensal com escola, ginástica, balé, inglês. "Um país que gasta R$ 3.200,00 para uns e R$ 250 mil para outros não é uma República ainda", conclui o ministro que defendeu os aumentos do valor do Fundef e da permanência do aluno pobre na escola.

Na instalação do fórum, mais uma instância consultiva no CNE, Cristovam lembrou que o Brasil tem 20 milhões de analfabetos. Entre eles, pobres e negros. Lançou um desafio para os participantes do fórum para que pensem em como reduzir a desigualdade no Brasil e advertiu para o perigo de as entidades representarem mais os interesses dos seus segmentos do que os da coletividade dentro do novo fórum do CNE.

"Pedi para que lembrassem da criança, do jovem e do analfabeto e buscassem medidas que reduzissem a desigualdade entre homens e mullheres, pobres e ricos, negros, indios e brancos, e entre o Nordeste e o Norte e o Sul e Sudeste."



-----
Viva Brazil

Total Posts: 54 | Joined Feb. 2003 | Posted on: 4:58 pm on Feb. 18, 2003 | IP
Macunaima


Member
   
Burrice é Cristovam não saber que as cotas raciais não existem e nunca existiam em escala grande nas universidades americanas...

-----
Brazil is the country of the future and always will be!

Total Posts: 147 | Joined Jan. 2003 | Posted on: 5:03 pm on Feb. 18, 2003 | IP
krista



Junior Member
   
If there's any politician at all who I really admire, it must be Cristovam Buarque. Nobody's perfect, but he's definitely way above any other politician I know.

"o ministro da Cultura, Gilberto Gil"
oh please tell me i'm juss misunderstanding the language here. otherwise i will feel so stupid for not even noticing. I knew he was a quite important piece of politics, this man, but...wow. I really need to start reading newspapers more often.


-----
Radio Do Mar: http://www.live365.com/stations/226288

Total Posts: 97 | Joined Jan. 2003 | Posted on: 6:09 pm on Feb. 18, 2003 | IP
erjbcdt


Junior Member
   
Marucaima, I dont agree with you that nao existiam escala grande in the Universities:
I bought this article from the globe, 2.95 and I think its worth wild to read!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

COLLEGES HOPING TO SWAY COURT WITH BRIEFS
Author(s):    Jenna Russell, Globe Staff Date: February 15, 2003 Page: B1 Section: Metro/Region
Harvard, MIT, and dozens of other top colleges and universities - along with Fortune 500 companies - are vigorously defending affirmative action in college admissions, and plan to file an avalanche of briefs with the Supreme Court by Tuesday in support of the University of Michigan.

The court is set to deliberate in April on the constitutionality of affirmative action in college admissions, following lawsuits filed against the University of Michigan by white applicants who were denied admission. A few large groups of colleges are collaborating on briefs, while others, such as Northeastern University, are filing individual briefs.

The Massachusetts Institute of Technology announced yesterday it will file a brief with several far-flung and influential partners, including Stanford University, the National Academy of Sciences, and two major corporations, IBM and Du Pont.

By Tuesday's filing deadline, the number of friend-of-the-court briefs submitted on behalf of the University of Michigan could reach 100, among the most ever on one side of a Supreme Court case, observers said.

"There's a desire for entities to be seen as participating, there's pressure from their constituencies, and there are those who feel this is their time to say something," said Sheldon Steinbach, a lawyer for the Washington-based American Council on Education, which filed a joint brief in the case yesterday with 53 other higher-education organizations.

About a dozen parties had filed briefs against Michigan's admissions system last week, including Florida Governor Jeb Bush, the Center for the Advancement of Capitalism, the Cato Institute, and the Center for Equal Opportunity, a conservative advocacy group that filed a complaint against MIT two years ago over the school's summer programs for minorities. (MIT announced this week it will open the programs to white students.)

President Bush said last month that Michigan's policies are unfair and filed a brief urging the court to rule against them.

At Michigan, as at the University of Massachusetts at Amherst, applications from minorities receive extra points in admissions, after grades and test scores are considered.

MIT president Charles M. Vest announced the completion of the joint brief yesterday at the school's annual Martin Luther King Jr. breakfast. The school's legal argument will focus on the importance of building a diverse national work force in science and engineering.

"We wanted to say that it isn't only about liberal arts and political science," Vest said.

The invitation to corporations to join the filing was meant to give the brief weight, he said. An IBM spokesman said the company supports Michigan's policy because it leads to a diverse pool of employees, "and that helps us compete better worldwide." IBM has about 320,000 employees in more than 70 countries. Microsoft, Procter & Gamble, and others have also filed briefs supporting Michigan, as have more than 100 members of Congress.

Harvard plans to file a brief next week, supporting Michigan with partners likely to include other Ivy League universities. Officials at Dartmouth College and Princeton University said they are still deciding whether to sign on.

A Harvard brief played an important role before the Supreme Court in 1978, when the justices outlawed racial quotas in the case of California Regents v. Bakke, but said schools could consider race as a factor when admitting students. At most of the schools filing briefs, race is used as a "plus factor" in admissions.

Another brief will be filed by 37 schools, led by Carnegie Mellon University, and including Boston College, the College of the Holy Cross in Worcester, Rhode Island School of Design, and Brandeis University.

Pittsburgh attorney Ed Stoner, who wrote the brief for the coalition of schools, said administrators voiced no worries about risking federal funding by opposing Bush.

"I don't think that entered into people's math," he said.

"What's really risky is if they didn't say anything, and the Supreme Court says they can't use race in admissions."

Amherst College was the driving force behind another large group brief, to be filed next week, and expected to include Bates, Bowdoin, Colby, Hampshire, Middlebury, Mount Holyoke, Smith, Tufts, Wesleyan, and Williams as cosigners.

Amherst president Tom Gerety said the brief expresses the preference of selective liberal arts colleges for the "simple, honest, and direct approach" of affirmative action in building enrollments.

"Any other method will be less successful and less honest," he said.

The sheer volume of briefs could work in the colleges' favor, said Harvard Law School professor Charles Fried; if a slew of well-known institutions line up on one side, "It is the kind of evidence that could be a factor in the case," he said.

But Steinbach expressed some concern that the growing numbers of briefs could overwhelm the court and defeat the colleges' purpose.

"Individuals who have clerked there say that volume tends to be irksome to the justices and tends to obscure the main points," he said.

The goal should be finding something unique to say.

"It's not the weight of the paper," he said, "it's the intellectual heft of the argument."

Jenna Russell can be reached at jrussell@globe.com.

-----
Viva Brazil

Total Posts: 54 | Joined Feb. 2003 | Posted on: 1:09 am on Feb. 19, 2003 | IP
Macunaima


Member
   
Uh, Erjbcdt, you seem to be confusing quotas with affirmative action.

Here's the only part of that article that's relevant to quotas: "A Harvard brief played an important role before the Supreme Court in 1978, when the justices outlawed racial quotas in the case of California Regents v. Bakke."

25 years ago, quotas were sumarily banned by the supreme court in this case and that was before they entered into large-scale use. A relative few universities had been experimenting with them and Bakke determined that they couldn't.

Since 1978, Affirmative Action in the U.S. has meant that race can be used as a criterion for entry BUT that race specific slots can not be set asside by universities. Furthermore, a school can't choose a student EXCLUSIVELY based on race.

This is quite fair IMHO and it stuns me that most Americans -especially white Americans - have no idea that this is how their system works. I bet if you asked, 8 out of 10 white Americans would tell you AA means quotas, pure and simple. That, my friend, is an argument of the racist right and the fact that so many white folks believe it DESPITE THE PROOF that's laying right in front of their eyes (in this very article, for instance) shows you how deep racism is still ingrained in the U.S.

Krista, I like Cristovam, too. I was particularly impressed with the little symbolic manuever he pulled at the signing ceremony during the inauguration (he signed his contract with a 30 cent Bic and not with a 2000 dollar Cross pen like the other ministers). That's why it's so disheartening to hear him parrot uninformed information like this. It will just muddy the waters even further.

-----
Brazil is the country of the future and always will be!

Total Posts: 147 | Joined Jan. 2003 | Posted on: 4:07 am on Feb. 19, 2003 | IP
Jeromy


Junior Member
   
What does a 2000 dollar pen do. Is it magical? Does it give you an orgasmic experince when you use it?

Sorry I got off the subject.

Total Posts: 55 | Joined Feb. 2003 | Posted on: 11:00 pm on Feb. 19, 2003 | IP
krista



Junior Member
   
haha...the 2000-dollar pen makes you IMPORTANT!! It makes you feel that you're better than all those who don't have the pen. It converys tis image - "i'm rich and powerful, very important; thus, you have to respect me"
Didn't you have this thing in primary school?...not with pens, but who has got the coolest sneakers or whatever...
Well, the people needing the $2000 pen are still in this kindergarden stage where owning a cooler toy makes you the boss of the gang.

...or, it could be just that the $2000 pen does have magical power and it's just that we, the lower species (aka the general crowd), do not understand that magic that some politicians do. Actually, when you think of it - the whole system of politics often consists of nothing but big magic.

-----
Radio Do Mar: http://www.live365.com/stations/226288

Total Posts: 97 | Joined Jan. 2003 | Posted on: 11:15 pm on Feb. 19, 2003 | IP
Jeromy


Junior Member
   
Sad and pathetic.

-----
Peace and Justice for all

Total Posts: 55 | Joined Feb. 2003 | Posted on: 11:21 pm on Feb. 19, 2003 | IP
krista



Junior Member
   
you know what's even more sad+pathetic? A politician who only picks up the 20-cent pen in order to be more popular with the people, not because he understands how useless is the $2000 one... and believe me, there's enough of those too.
(happily keeping the discussion off-the-topic. been reading up for my latin american class these past few days...hundreds of pages of writings kind of like "...and in Haiti 87% of people are destitute; and in X that may people are way below any poverty line; and in Y this s*** is happening; and the conclusion in the end of each paper is a pretty pessimistic one - they all talk how unfair and crappy the system is and then say that there isn't much that can be done. Damn useless depressing theorists!!! So by now I'm in a sarcastic mood enough...want to avoid useless poverty talk and make fun of politicians...
But more seriously speaking - I'm depressed. I see people posting some statistics here too, so I will ask them for a favor now: Could someone please post some happy statistics too? (and please, not football...be more original) If someone could post a piece of data that shows that at least something is getting better, you will make my day.
(i know you can; i know there's good stuff all over the place)

-----
Radio Do Mar: http://www.live365.com/stations/226288

Total Posts: 97 | Joined Jan. 2003 | Posted on: 11:37 pm on Feb. 19, 2003 | IP
Jeromy


Junior Member
   
I heard somebody say the other day that Bush asked the Brazilian (Cordosa, not Lula) president if there were blacks in Brasil. My God! What the **** Don't even get me started!
I can understand your feelings. Paying attention to politics and social conditions demands an iron clad stomach. Listening to politicians sometimes is enough to gag a maggot!
 

-----
Peace and Justice for all

Total Posts: 55 | Joined Feb. 2003 | Posted on: 12:01 am on Feb. 20, 2003 | IP
Jeromy


Junior Member
   
How about the 6 to 10 million people who protested against the war. 2 million in Spain alone. Close to 500,000 in New York. It broke records in several cities as far the most for a political protest.
This and the war hasn't even started. It wasn't until years into the Vietnam War that protests begun, and it never reached these kind of numbers. This movement will only increase.
What about the recent World Social Forum in Porto Allegre, Brazil. This brought out over close to 100,000 as social justice groups from around the world met to strategize.

-----
Peace and Justice for all

Total Posts: 55 | Joined Feb. 2003 | Posted on: 12:19 am on Feb. 20, 2003 | IP
Macunaima


Member
   
We had 10-20,000 here in Rio, including many Americans. It was a good rally, but spoiled at the end, as usual, by the usual socialist speakers who couldn't argue their way out of a paper bag and who think screaming is a substitute for logic. Y'know the type:

"Blwahbleahbleahbleahblea, companheiros e companheiras...."

-----
Brazil is the country of the future and always will be!

Total Posts: 147 | Joined Jan. 2003 | Posted on: 3:34 am on Feb. 20, 2003 | IP
 

Topic Jump
<< Back Next >>
Multiple pages for this topic [ 1 2 ]

Topic Options: Lock topic | Edit topic | Unlock topic | Delete topic | Move topic

© 2003 Brazzil | Our Privacy Statement

Powered by Ikonboard 2.1.9 Beta
© 2001 Ikonboard.com