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11/23/2002
01:55:34
Subject: Mechanical Translators
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Notice a lot of talk lately about mechanical translators and do find them to be a little off center. Mainly because they all seem to target Portugal Portuguese instead of Brazilian Portuguese. Which of course, doesn't 'quite' work.

Now I know that there are about 175 million people in Brazil, and just barely 10 million in Portugal. So it seems a little odd to me that the translators use Portugal Portuguese as a base language rather than Brazilian.

In fact, I could not find one single translator based upon Brazilian Portuguese in spite of the far greater Brazilian usage.

Does anyone know if there is a Brazilian Portuguese mechanical translator? If so, which and how is it accessed? If not, what is your take on why these companies that sell translators use Portuguese from a country with only a fraction of the population as the other.


mooseboy84
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11/23/2002
02:21:01
RE: Mechanical Translators
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http://www.bristol-link.co.uk/tools/translator.htm


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11/23/2002
02:31:31
RE: Mechanical Translators
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Hmmm. Well thanks Mooseboy, but that link seems to be dead. At least I couldn't get it. Might try again later. Appreciate effort however.


Z
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11/23/2002
09:48:08
RE: Mechanical Translators
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It wouldn't make much of a difference, the language structure is very different, that's why most mechanical translators screw badly when translating.


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11/23/2002
19:21:11
RE: Mechanical Translators
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Not sure I understand that Z. The English has nouns, verbs, adverbs etc., present, past and so on. Portuguese has the same. Brazilian or that from Portugal. With a computer being able to take any word and place it anywhere in a sentence, taking a noun and moving it to the proper place for Portuguese (or English) communication shouldn't be much different than M/S Word pointing out a grammatical error. It 'could' be done. I just wondered if any had done it that I didn't already know about.


Z
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11/24/2002
00:17:28
RE: Mechanical Translators
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Well, an example:

Adjectives in portuguese are gender specific, whereas in english you say "he/she is beautifull" we say "ele bonito" or "ela bonita".

And so goes on, we have declinations, I think we have one more past tense...


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11/24/2002
05:52:58
RE: Mechanical Translators
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Guess I'm still not keeping up, Z. Ele bonito = he is beautiful. Ele bonita = she is beautiful. What's so difficult about translating that? Or do I have that wrong?

As to adverbs, list every adverb in the Brazilian language, and there's sure to be an English counterpart. And vice versa. If not, take the word closest in meaning and use that. Its what a person has to do if they're speaking the languages anyway. To me the only problem would be for the writer of the program to be familiar enough with both languages to do it properly. Surely, someone, somewhere.....?

At any rate, the main question is whether or not someone hasn't already done it? If so, whom?

Also, as a point of curiosity, I wondered why those translators that do exist use Portuguese from Portugal with a population of only about 10 millions of people as a base language instead of Brazil with a population of around 175 millions of people? Are there other twists in the Brazilian Portuguese language (as opposed to Portugal Portuguese) that make it much more difficult to translate? Is it a political thing?


Z
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11/24/2002
16:39:27
RE: Mechanical Translators
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If things where so easy the translations would not be the horrible things that are witnessed today. So far, I've actually seen most translators using brazilian portuguese, and not portugal's, and even then they leave a mockery of the message when used.

Please, believe me, try to study some portuguese and you will see why it is considered by some, one of the hardest modern languages to learn.


USCIT
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11/24/2002
21:29:34
RE: Mechanical Translators
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Z, I AM studying Portuguese. I printed out all of Potty Mouths words and am learning those. <g> However, I am also deeply into working with history, botany, spirituality and humanitarianism. I have further assisted with the editing of a couple of books, in English, that are targeted to appear on Brazilian shelves in the near future. (English writer, Brazilian publisher -- the first entitled 'Brazil, 500 years of Facination.) And only have so much time to offer. I was hoping to not have to reinvent the wheel regarding language translations. Ergo, the post.


Z
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11/25/2002
04:53:16
RE: Mechanical Translators
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??Uhn?


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11/25/2002
05:08:15
RE: Mechanical Translators
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Mooseboy84, was finally able to access the bristol-link site. Thanks for posting.


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