Back to our cover

Subject: PROPERTY IN BRAZIL


Posted by Ade
On Tuesday, August 20, 2002 at 05:12:42

Message:
I am looking to buy a house in Brazil early next year (2003). I am especially looking in and around the state of Minas Gerais and it would be very helpful if I could find an Internet site for property in Brazil. There is a site listed on one of the postings here, but they require a yearly subscription up front, which I considered to be rather steep, particularly if they did not have any suitable properties for sale. If anybody knows of any such sites that could be of help to me, I would be most grateful.
RE: PROPERTY IN BRAZIL
Posted by Fernando
On Tuesday, August 20, 2002 at 15:23:26

Message:
Hi Ade,
I will try to help, but it is very difficult without knowing exactly the city and "Bairro" which we can translate as neighborhood. Here are some sites that might be helpful.
http://www.nvmundo.com/brazil/
http://www.imobiliario-cia.com.br/
http://www.balcaomg.com.br/imovf.htm
http://www.anunciosbrasil.com.br/bancosdedados/bancos_imoveis_balcao.html

some have the option of the english language

Good luck

RE: PROPERTY IN BRAZIL
Posted by braslvr
On Tuesday, August 20, 2002 at 18:42:51

Message:
A word of advice....
NEVER NEVER NEVER even consider buying property in Brazil without having a REPUTABLE Brazilian real estate attorney on your side. You would not believe what can happen otherwise.
RE: PROPERTY IN BRAZIL
Posted by Boris
On Friday, August 23, 2002 at 04:23:41

Message:
Ade,

There are no RE listings on Lifestyles Brazil because we are not a commercial site living off commission and advertisement fees. Our mission is provide practical, hands-on, no-nonsense information about the Real Estate Law and practices in Brazil. I am sorry that we can't be of assistance in locating a property you might wish to buy, but do not discard us in as a high-priced, no-good, useless site. We'd saved our members tens of thousands of dollars and mountains of otherwise unavaidable headache through information and individual services provided on the site.

Regards,
Boris
RE: PROPERTY IN BRAZIL
Posted by Boris
On Friday, August 23, 2002 at 04:29:27

Message:
braslvr,

Attorneys are mostly useless in Real Estate transactions in Brazil. Brazil's legal system is more resembling of French and German ones and both rely primarily on Paralegal Services procided by the Public Registry Offices. While, I can't stress enough the need for thorough review of the property documents and background research on the owners and their relatives and spouses (just to name of few), you are more likely to live to tell a horror story and pay outragous unnecessary fees if you are using an attorney then if you are not.


RE: PROPERTY IN BRAZIL
Posted by Gene
On Sunday, August 25, 2002 at 15:54:33

Message:
Boris,
I am a newbie here and haven't gone through most of the posts so maybe I could be repeating same old questions. I am interested in retiring at least part of the time in Brazil and maybe buy an apartment in Rio late next year or in 2004. I'd like to know the current going price for a nice 2-bdr penthouse apartment in Copa, Ipanema and Leblon. Of coures prices would depend on many other factors, but just want to have a ball park figure. I've been to Rio before so I know more or less the bairros.
RE: PROPERTY IN BRAZIL
Posted by Boris
On Sunday, August 25, 2002 at 21:25:02

Message:
Gene,

No problem, answering the same questions over and over is an occupacional hazard I am well aware of and used to :)

You are correct about the many factors that go into the asking price determination, but here are a few rules of thumb you can apply across the board:

Copa is about 40% cheaper then Ipanema and about 50% less expensive then Leblon.

There are not that many 2 bedroom Penthouses around, most of them are three-bedrooms +

80% of Penthouses in Zona Sul do not meet building and zoning regulation standards and there is currently a crack down going on.

I'd say that the number you are looking for is somewhere around R$600,000.00.
RE: PROPERTY IN BRAZIL
Posted by braslvr
On Sunday, August 25, 2002 at 23:37:48

Message:
Boris, you seem to be well informed and knowledgable, but I have to disagree. Any person who does not speak FLUENT Brazilian Portuguese AND have experience with dealing with real estate transactions in Brazil, would be very foolish to try and buy property independantly in Brazil. I'm not suggesting calling an attorney out of the phone book either.

Gringos are a PRIME target for real estate scams in Brazil. I have personal knowledge of several. Once you sign, as a gringo not living in Brazil, you can be totally screwed in many ways. Not only do you need a real estate attorney, you also need a reputable property manager if you don't live there. The cost for the attorney is not high.. average 5% of sale price, and all you need is a good Brazilian friend to steer you to a good one. Good insurance in my book.
RE: PROPERTY IN BRAZIL
Posted by Boris
On Monday, August 26, 2002 at 05:48:05

Message:
Fair and imparitial council, research, caution, common sense, and constant vigilance are a must in any Real Estate transactions, triple so in Brazil, quadruple so for a foreigner in Brazil.

Unfortunatly, good council is very hard to come by. To give you an example to illustrate my scepticism about obtaining impartial professional legal council in Brazil, consider the fact that in Brazil many lawyers moonlight as Real Estate brokers. You are very likely to find one that specializes in Real Estate transactions, who would try to render services that in most cases would not have client's best interest in mind. I speak from experience and can tell you that it is the case in about 70% of RE deals.

You are very lucky if you have friends who can refer you to an honest and professional attorney, but even then I can bet you that you will get ripped off on the fee. Some of the very good attorneys down here that I know, are not above charging their clients for paperwork that is the responsibility of and is paid for by the seller (an equivalent of title search). I personally had to fire two attorneys recommended by a very good friend, just to complete transaction on my own at 90% lower cost.

I don;t mean to make this look like an infomercial for my site, but this is exactly the type of issues that we are addressing. On our site (currently in maintenance, to be re-launched on September 1st). We are putting together a complete legal library in English (from highlighting constitutional rights of foreigners and property ownership through detailed examination of Brazilian Civil Code, Real Estate Law, Statute of Foreigners, Real Estate transactions procedures, taxation, Estate Law...) as well as practical first hand information from people who bought, rented, sold, leased, or brokered Real Estate transactions in Brazil.

While, I partially agree with you, that legal council is of great importance in Real Estate, there is also a huge need for a practical reference, and access to the core legislation and information that would allow a person to cross-check anything and everything that a lawyer or an advisor is saying. In my opinion access to the information and transparency of the process and procedures are of crucial importance. Availability of opinion or advice from impartial source or someone with a priori can make the difference between a smooth transaction or a legal and financial nightmare.

www.lifestylesbrazil.com

Name:
Email:
Notify me when I get a reply to my message:Yes  No
Subject:
Message:

Back to our cover